Sengoku, have some honor.

[Mogar]

 

Isn't goading people to get swords to fall what Mi6 has done pretty much for the past year? It's pretty much been an endless circle-jerk of "we're so awesome at war, nobody can touch us - oh, but they all want to roll us because we're awesome - oh, but they won't do it because they are scared of how awesome we are". 

Pull the trigger then, unless you actually want a war you might have to try at.

[IYIyTh]

 

Isn't goading people to get swords to fall what Mi6 has done pretty much for the past year? It's pretty much been an endless circle-jerk of "we're so awesome at war, nobody can touch us - oh, but they all want to roll us because we're awesome - oh, but they won't do it because they are scared of how awesome we are". 

 

I'm pretty sure your well documented efforts to start a war with MI6 were done entirely on your own. I appreciate trying to deflect it on your target, because it's easy and probably embarrassing in retrospect, but let's not kid anyone.

 

While we're on the subject, who are we trying to kid here? You're allied to everyone else.

 

Pretty !@#$@#$ hilarious that having 10+ spy attacks on an alliance and one of them ends up failing as a government member of Sengoku and you still callously have the audacity to blame MI6.

Edited September 27, 2015 by IYIyTh

[Letum]

Pull the trigger then, unless you actually want a war you might have to try at.

 

I should point out your sentence structure implies that if I *did* want a war I'd have to try at, then MI6 wouldn't be able to provide that level of challenge. Given your other comments in this thread, I think you have made a poor choice of words here.

 

 

I'm pretty sure your well documented efforts to start a war with MI6 were done entirely on your own. I appreciate trying to deflect it on your target, because it's easy and probably embarrassing in retrospect, but let's not kid anyone.

 

While we're on the subject, who are we trying to kid here? You're allied to everyone else.

 

Pretty !@#$@#$ hilarious that having 10+ spy attacks on an alliance and one of them ends up failing as a government member of Sengoku and you still callously have the audacity to blame MI6.

 

If MI6 feels they have some documentation of myself trying to start a war with them, I would be interested in seeing it. They are always welcome to approach me on IRC too. 

 

My comment was aimed more at the idea that MI6 pursuing a highly abrasive and combative behavioral stance being due to the prospect of an imminent attack is a bit nonsensical because they have had this same behavior for a very long time. It has in fact been this same abrasive behavior that has led to their current political situation, so the causal chain is somewhat reversed. It's a bit like a self-fulfilling prophecy. 

Edited September 27, 2015 by Letum

[IYIyTh]

 

If MI6 feels they have some documentation of myself trying to start a war with them, I would be interested in seeing it. They are always welcome to approach me on IRC too. 

 

My comment was aimed more at the idea that MI6 pursuing a highly abrasive and combative behavioral stance being due to the prospect of an imminent attack is a bit nonsensical because they have had this same behavior for a very long time. It has in fact been this same abrasive behavior that has led to their current political situation, so the causal chain is somewhat reversed. It's a bit like a self-fulfilling prophecy. 

 

Right, blame MI6 for being intentionally isolated by your alliance and Umbrella, and for Sengoku's government getting caught spying on MI6.

 

What would the point of documentation be -- this game is a sieve. Your failed intentions are well known, and despite that -- they still tried to create better relations. Sent some of the nicest people this game has to offer over to your boards. Instead they were met with condescension and insults from a  band of sophmoric wannabes.

 

I'm not in  MI6 anymore, but they deserve a better quality opponent. Don't piss on their leg and tell them it's raining.

 

Shut up and declare war or leave them the $%&@ alone.

Edited September 27, 2015 by IYIyTh

[Letum]

 

Right, blame MI6 for being intentionally isolated by your alliance and Umbrella, and for Sengoku's government getting caught spying on MI6.

 

What would the point of documentation be -- this game is a sieve. Your failed intentions are well known, and despite that -- they tried to create better relations. Instead they were met with condescension and insults.

 

The point of documentation is to prevent people from using the label "well-documented" to lend their accusations a veneer of authority if said documentation does not exist. 

 

As for being met with "condescension and insults", the last diplomatic attempt I saw between NPO and MI6 involved us inviting them back to our joint IRC channel (whose existence I'll assume they forgot), which was immediately met by a screaming match about how we were back in our pre-Karma ways and pulling them into a smoky backroom to intimidate them by weight of numbers (given that most of our gov lurks on IRC/uses bouncers, we also tend to have lots of gov in most joint channels).

 

That is the point I gave up on MI6.

[IYIyTh]

 

The point of documentation is to prevent people from using the label "well-documented" to lend their accusations a veneer of authority if said documentation does not exist. 

 

As for being met with "condescension and insults", the last diplomatic attempt I saw between NPO and MI6 involved us inviting them back to our joint IRC channel (whose existence I'll assume they forgot), which was immediately met by a screaming match about how we were back in our pre-Karma ways and pulling them into a smoky backroom to intimidate them by weight of numbers (given that most of our gov lurks on IRC/uses bouncers, we also tend to have lots of gov in most joint channels).

 

That is the point I gave up on MI6.

 

Whether it had " your supreme authority, "  doesn't concern me. It's a bit like saying that my VP made some rather embarrassing decisions but because I didn't make them they never happened.

 

As for the rest, I think we're not in agreement as I highly disagree with your interpretation. You focusing on this bit as opposed to your intentional isolation of MI6 is telling, though.

 

All I know is you just said Sengoku's government getting caught spying on MI6 is actually MI6's fault, and there is no amount of prose you can hide behind when making a comment like that.

 

I personally don't care about your opinion and treatment of MI6, but they certainly deserve better than the filth I've witnessed.

Edited September 27, 2015 by IYIyTh

[Master Hakai]

So what alliance are you in myth?

[Van Hoo III]

 

 

As for being met with "condescension and insults", the last diplomatic attempt I saw between NPO and MI6 .

 

That is the point I gave up on MI6.

 

But ... Shuru, Kerschbs, and myself have put a LOT of effort into our embassy over there. Come on, man! :P

[The Warrior]

 

And his title?  "Non-Member".  He has no forum or IRC access, and is basically on the AA because he's got no interest in going elsewhere.

 

Who MI6 keeps on its AA is none of your concern.  And, just for clarity's sake, neither are our warchests.

Who MI6 allows on their AA isn't anyone else's business.. until it is. Allowing someone to sit on your AA as an approved member unfortunately means that their actions reflect on your alliance as long as they are there. It is what it is and as far as everyone else is concerned, myth is a member of MI6.

 

 

I am simply pointing out that there seems to be a pattern of Sengoku attempting to push its position using the strength of others. If I was a serious alliance like NPO I would be looking at whether such people might be political liabilities in a stability-based bloc. But maybe you guys offer something in backrooms that us commoners can't see.

NPO appreciates your concern about their allies I'm sure. They are probably very glad to know that you are watching out for them.

 

 

Isn't goading people to get swords to fall what Mi6 has done pretty much for the past year? It's pretty much been an endless circle-jerk of "we're so awesome at war, nobody can touch us - oh, but they all want to roll us because we're awesome - oh, but they won't do it because they are scared of how awesome we are". 

Come on man. Nothing is their fault.

[IYIyTh]

Who MI6 allows on their AA isn't anyone else's business.. until it is. Allowing someone to sit on your AA as an approved member unfortunately means that their actions reflect on your alliance as long as they are there. It is what it is and as far as everyone else is concerned, myth is a member of MI6.

 

 

What actions are those, exactly?

 

Calling you out for being a bunch of daisies?

 

Grow up.

[IYIyTh]

So what alliance are you in myth?

 

Not in one.

 

Not really interested in one, either.

[Van Hoo III]

 

Not in one.

 

Not really interested in one, either.

 

 

Join ... MI6? ... :X

 

 

That's how we do it, right?

[IYIyTh]

 

 

Join ... MI6? ... :X

 

 

That's how we do it, right?

 

 

Technically it wouldn't be poaching!

[Van Hoo III]

 

 

Technically it wouldn't be poaching!

 

Drat.

 

I'm never going to get the hang of this.

[IYIyTh]

 

Drat.

 

I'm never going to get the hang of this.

 

That's why they'll make you M :D

[Van Hoo III]

 

That's why they'll make you M :D

 

Hoo for M is real.

[Letum]

Whether it had " your supreme authority, "  doesn't concern me. It's a bit like saying that my VP made some rather embarrassing decisions but because I didn't make them they never happened.

So we began with you accusing me of making some "well-documented" attempts to start a war, but when pressed on it suddenly you declare the documentation to not be important, and then it's not even me?

Regardless, still interested.


 

As for the rest, I think we're not in agreement as I highly disagree with your interpretation. You focusing on this bit as opposed to your intentional isolation of MI6 is telling, though.

I know you might find this hard to fit in your worldview, but I don't flip a coin to find a random alliance to isolate for fun or something. MI6 has managed to isolate itself by being annoying and aggravating to the extreme in every opportunity.
 

All I know is you just said Sengoku's government getting caught spying on MI6 is actually MI6's fault, and there is no amount of prose you can hide behind when making a comment like that.

I haven't made any comments about Sengoku whatsover in this thread.

I think you're making stuff up again.

 

But ... Shuru, Kerschbs, and myself have put a LOT of effort into our embassy over there. Come on, man! :P

I was referring more to the gov-to-gov kind, but your efforts are appreciated! But as admirable as they are, at the end of the day any progress in the NPO-MI6 relationship will require me being able to have a conversation with your government without getting a headache from frustration. Edited September 27, 2015 by Letum

[Mogar]

 

I should point out your sentence structure implies that if I *did* want a war I'd have to try at, then MI6 wouldn't be able to provide that level of challenge. Given your other comments in this thread, I think you have made a poor choice of words here.

I've yet to say that MI6 would provide a challenge, merely that curbstomps are fucking retarded and killing our world slowly, if global conflicts were more like the Great Wars levels of evenness(which even then still weren't 50/50 NS splits, but 60/40 is better than 90/10), you'd find people actually having trouble making a decision on which side to ignore treaties with, or even better, perhaps people would follow their treaties to the letter and create absolute chaos.

[IYIyTh]

 
I know you might find this hard to fit in your worldview, but I don't flip a coin to find a random alliance to isolate for fun or something. MI6 has managed to isolate itself by being annoying and aggravating to the extreme in every opportunity.

 

 

Are you denying that any government member of NPO has ever pressured other alliances against signing with MI6 or prepared to declare war by soliciting interest on the subject?

 

(This could be fun!)

 

Also, well done on the backpedalling of the comment that Sengoku's .gov spying on MI6 is some sort of self fulfilling prophecy.

 

I've never seen someone do that so fast.

Edited September 27, 2015 by IYIyTh

[Letum]

I've yet to say that MI6 would provide a challenge, merely that curbstomps are !@#$@#$ retarded and killing our world slowly, if global conflicts were more like the Great Wars levels of evenness(which even then still weren't 50/50 NS splits, but 60/40 is better than 90/10), you'd find people actually having trouble making a decision on which side to ignore treaties with, or even better, perhaps people would follow their treaties to the letter and create absolute chaos.

Interesting thing about the Great Wars, it was the only time when the 40% side is the one who won.

[Mogar]

Interesting thing about the Great Wars, it was the only time when the 40% side is the one who won.

It was also the only time period when nuclear weapons were considered an evil we shouldn't use, now we've killed off 10 billion people and not given a !@#$.
Edit: I'd also argue Umbrella won Equilibrium, they may not get to write it down on the wiki that way, but nearly everyone the "winning" side paid for their part on that war.

Edited September 27, 2015 by Mogar

[IYIyTh]

Equilibrium was a failure because at the point of doing determinable damage the plot was abandoned due to infighting and the usual jostling post-war before the current war ends.

 

AI also imploded shortly thereafter, which in its partnership with NPO and help from AZTEC proved to be the only threat Umbrella has ever faced in its history. 

[Letum]

Are you denying that any government member of NPO has ever pressured other alliances against signing with MI6 or prepared to declare war on it?

No? I am not sure where you are getting all these wild statements from? That's me claiming that MI6 has been jackasses to almost everyone, and that's why diplomatic moves get a frosty reception.

I've been in a position where NPO has been isolated multiple times, and we know a thing or two about getting a frosty reception. Basic Diplomacy 101 here: if you try to improve relations with one alliance whilst being hostile to all their allies, those allies will raise hell. You need a basic relationship with them too, which might mean a long process of groundwork. It's not a complicated lesson, and one we even told MI6 directly. I am not sure why there's such a lack of diplomatic competence there. MI6 has certainly proved capable of putting in long and hard work in other endeavors, they should have been able to do it in this one.

I am, of course, always happy to provide my diplomatic consulting services to them at any time they so desire. Free of charge. (Seriously) Edited September 27, 2015 by Letum

[IYIyTh]

No? I am not sure where you are getting all these wild statements from? That's me claiming that MI6 has been jackasses to almost everyone, and that's why diplomatic moves get a frosty reception.

I've been in a position where NPO has been isolated multiple times, and we know a thing or two about getting a frosty reception. Basic Diplomacy 101 here: if you try to improve relations with one alliance whilst being hostile to all their allies, those allies will raise hell. You need a basic relationship with them too, which might mean a long process of groundwork. It's not a complicated lesson, and one we even told MI6 directly. I am not sure why there's such a lack of diplomatic competence there. MI6 has certainly proved capable of putting in long and hard work in other endeavors, they should have been able to do it in this one.

I am, of course, always happy to provide my diplomatic consulting services to them at any time they so desire. Free of charge.

 

Maybe you can consult your allies on how to not utilize the spy operation feature on non allies if you have no intent of committing yourselves to a war, and being less of a condescending prick in trying to claim that the target of the Op's brought it upon themselves as some sort of self fulfilling prophecy.

 

I'll offer that one to you free of charge.

[The Warrior]

 

What actions are those, exactly?

 

Calling you out for being a bunch of daisies?

 

Grow up.

Yeah, that's what I was talking about..  :rolleyes:

 

To my knowledge, nobody within MI6 has performed spy attacks on anyone.  Myth is not a member of MI6.  To be blunt, knowing Sengoku's warchests is a hell of a lot less relevant for us than knowing MI6's appears to be for them. 

 

http://s4.zetaboards.com/CNtel/topic/10366795/1/#new