European War OOC Thread

[Maelstrom Vortex]

Given Mogar has outlined what weapons platforms were carrying the weapons and where they would be fired from, I'm not certain this is going to go how you think Triyun. But, best wishes with the gm court.

Edited October 6, 2014 by Maelstrom Vortex

[Shave N Haircut]

For FHIC

 

FHIC's Perseus Missile.  Based on what FHIC has written she uses the missile based on the Brahmos.  The Brahmos cannot be launched from the Rafale, and building hypersonic missiles in smaller configuration which is what the proposed next Brahmos does is not built yet.

 

Brahmos missiles also are not land attack so hitting targets seems, hard to see.

 

What 300 unmanned aerial vehicles is FHIC referring to?  As far as I know all the ones in service don't carry any heavy ordinance.  

Also as just a general note the British went on alert, so the idea of surprise isn't really applicable but that's an adjective choice.

 

No one said they were launched from Rafale.

Whoever told you it wasn't land attack was lying to you.

Assume Predator until I come up with a better name and make it French.
Surprise was never mentioned.

 

Hope this helps! :D

[spoiler]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BrahMos#Variants[/spoiler]

Edited October 6, 2014 by Shave N Haircut

[Triyun]

I missed the land attack variant.  That's fair.  Where are you deploying them/ firing at given their very limited range?

 

Thanks for specifying the predator.

[Shave N Haircut]

I missed the land attack variant.  That's fair.  Where are you deploying them/ firing at given their very limited range?

 

Thanks for specifying the predator.

 

In and around Normandy and Flanders to maximize possible targets.

[Horo the Wise Wolf]

You did not wish to trade with me on any level, reading over the diplomatic thread Uber started, in fact you refused every single major industry I would have in a 2014 time scale, as such GLR, Tikal/NA, and SEATO are my only markets, which means I am still lacking on the two largest.

That is not how trade works. It is an endeavour made by any corporation, be they public or private. Private corporations will buy your goods if they want them and they are being sold at an affordable price; that's it. I read that thread - Cent never said he didn't want trade with you. He said he didn't want to lower barriers of trade with Japan, which is a totally separate matter entirely. Unlike that most people in this RP seem to think, trade agreements can damage your nation. Just because the barriers haven't been lowered doesn't mean that you suddenly can't trade with them any more - it just means that it would cost more to export goods to him, which your corporations can deal with in any manner they wish. There isn't some lack of foreign markets or people who refuse to trade with you. It's basic supply and demand.

On wartime economy: the issue people are having with the the amount of missiles etc. you are firing is not that you couldn't have made them (given your war economy, sure you could've), but that that wartime economy would have come with significant drawbacks themselves that were not addressed. This means that you are now reaping the military benefits of something that most people ignored (seeing as economic RP has been considered a flavour thing and have no quantitative effect on the nation itself) and ignoring the downsides. In the two decades you have been mass producing arms, you have also claimed to be the biggest exporter of advanced electronics yet somehow still sustained your nation with both those going on and your apparent lack of access to foreign markets. The trade deficit you'd be running would be absolutely horrendous and your budget deficit that you keep saying is being supported by Tikal depends on them running a budget surplus before loaning to the EAI, which is a pretty tenuous claim.

[Mogar]

I have claimed it, but since nobody wants to RP trade with me or acknowledge that I am exporting said goods besides those listed, gotta keep the factories open! There'd be downsides but so long as there's threats to EAI, the population doesn't mind it, as I've said multiple times on IRC, if I ever got the chance to be left alone and in a secure position with no threats for more than a month, most of the EAI would rebel.

Edited October 6, 2014 by Mogar

[Maelstrom Vortex]

That is not how trade works. It is an endeavour made by any corporation, be they public or private. Private corporations will buy your goods if they want them and they are being sold at an affordable price; that's it. I read that thread - Cent never said he didn't want trade with you. He said he didn't want to lower barriers of trade with Japan, which is a totally separate matter entirely. Unlike that most people in this RP seem to think, trade agreements can damage your nation. Just because the barriers haven't been lowered doesn't mean that you suddenly can't trade with them any more - it just means that it would cost more to export goods to him, which your corporations can deal with in any manner they wish. There isn't some lack of foreign markets or people who refuse to trade with you. It's basic supply and demand.

On wartime economy: the issue people are having with the the amount of missiles etc. you are firing is not that you couldn't have made them (given your war economy, sure you could've), but that that wartime economy would have come with significant drawbacks themselves that were not addressed. This means that you are now reaping the military benefits of something that most people ignored (seeing as economic RP has been considered a flavour thing and have no quantitative effect on the nation itself) and ignoring the downsides. In the two decades you have been mass producing arms, you have also claimed to be the biggest exporter of advanced electronics yet somehow still sustained your nation with both those going on and your apparent lack of access to foreign markets. The trade deficit you'd be running would be absolutely horrendous and your budget deficit that you keep saying is being supported by Tikal depends on them running a budget surplus before loaning to the EAI, which is a pretty tenuous claim.

 

You assume people aren't just shoveling them resources to build up their stockpiles. You're also assuming a commercial economy and not a centralized command economy which would not notice any of the side effects other than that people'd have a lower quality of life and be miserable since in a such an economy the orders of the government take precedence over deriving a profit.

 

The only problem with being blockaded is you have to deal with what you got, not what's in the world. Thing is Japan has plenty of allies willing to make up for what it does not have access to.

 

Lets take income for example. Income is a localized event. It is almost irrelevant in the world economy, especially if under blockade. Because most of the prices of a nation are local/internal. If the currencies are not in balance then the best thing you can do is not trade abroad. Why for example, would people worry about buying a tv from the us that they don't have access to and that costs a ton of money, if they can buy one locally that is of approximate quality or at least sufficiently effective to satisfy them?

 

The upper class won't be happy, but if the upper class is part of the government they're the ones willingly making the sacrifices so it becomes irrelevant.

Edited October 7, 2014 by Maelstrom Vortex

[Centurius]

I'm also going to need to know the compositions of the fleets actually in the Atlantic to write out a proper response.

Repeating this request as I do need it for my war post.

[Mogar]

RP some surveillance.

[Centurius]

RP some surveillance.

Gonna cite Ty's ruling here.

[Mogar]

for myself:

Abukuma Destroyer Escort 15
Hyūga-class helicopter destroyer 3
Takeshima Amphibious Assault Ship 3
Amagi Battlecruiser 6
upgraded with RIM-162 ESSM batteries, TLAM-Ds, RGM-84s, 6 firing positions for FIM-92 Stingers, Modern firing control systems, 4 Phalanx CIWS, AN/SLQ-25 Nixie(B), AN/SLQ-32(V)5, Mark 36 SRBOC, and various other technologies to ensure the Amagi Class remains relevant and defensible in a modern combat environment.[
Kongō Cruiser 8
Asagiri Frigate 12
Takanami Destroyer 9
Shōkaku Class Carriers 3
Haruna Helicopter Carrier 3

 

Hershey:

 

Skjold-class Corvette x 19
Wasp Class Landing Ship x9
Modernized Iowa-class Battleship x8
Mk 41 Ticonderoga-class Cruiser x7
Oliver Hazzard Perry Class Frigate x13
Arleigh Burke Class Destroyer x14
Nimitz Class Aircraft Carrier x 5

 

FHIC Lynneth and Mara will have to post their own as I am unsure personally.

[Mara Lithaen]

As for me, look at my factbook. It's there. Whole fleet moved out.

Edited October 7, 2014 by Mara Lithaen

[Mogar]

I'd say the same story for Lynneth, simply divided onto either side of your fleet Cent.

[Shave N Haircut]

The Entirety of the French Atlantic and Mediterranean fleets are with the combined force, which is minus the Pacific fleet, which is one battlegroup. Look in my forces page for details on what that is. Name of that thread is La Grande Armee.

[Californian]

Regarding war economy/production:

 

Nations do not get an inherent advantage based on where they are located (Other things being equal, someone in Swaziland is not at a disadvantage from someone in the USA). Nations do get an advantage through roleplay, which could include the previous extensive roleplay of production/storage of military goods.  You are certainly not required to read someone's posts, but if they are posting in a public thread, willing to provide you a link if requested, and if you have had the opportunity to interact/interfere with the roleplay then you cannot ignore it when confronted with a situation like this.

 

Therefore, it is reasonable that Mogar would have a large stockpile of military goods. That being said, some common sense has to be used, and 40K of one type of missile seems excessive. Limiting the number of Mogar's Block 2s in question to 15K, and I expect other models to be scaled accordingly.

__________________________________________________________________

 

Regarding civilian infrastructure:

 

Large public works projects can be canon if made with today's technology. This can have military implications, and likewise can be targeted by other nations and possibly destroyed. A canal widening project is certainly a large, but not impossible task given enough time and resources and appropriate roleplay.

[Maelstrom Vortex]

My thailand canal is going to take a rediculous amount of time to complete.

[Malatose]

Is it possible to get Japan's HomeFleet composition, Mogar?

 

Thanks

[Mogar]

Based off your wording I'm assuming you mean ships currently near the home islands, for IG ships the list would be....

 

5 Abukuma

3 Takeshima

4 Asagiri

1 Amagi

1 Takanami

1 Hyūga

1 Kongō

1 Haruna

Edited October 7, 2014 by Mogar

[Triyun]

Ty what of the transport of that many heavy vehicles (remember a missile system requires both huge trucks and huge control trucks) from Japan to France via the long way.  That question was also included in my original post.

Edited October 7, 2014 by Triyun

[Mogar]

You'd be amazed what you can fit in 18,340 TEU, and I have dozens of the things.

[Lysergide]

Less Crying, More Killing.

[Evangeline Anovilis]

Eva: I'll edit my fleet numbers into my post in the thread.

 

Still waiting for clarifications from you. And Rudy still has not specified type and location of his fortifications, nor the amount of troops fighting me.

[Centurius]

Judging from Lynneth's news post not his entire fleet in the Atlantic so I'm still going to need him to post just what he has located in the Atlantic

[Lynneth]

Before I answer that in detail, I'd like to know from Ty/Californian whether I have to give my fleet-composition in detail (x destroyers, x carriers, etc), or if giving size (x large, x medium, x small) would be sufficient for the purposes of

>Large troop/naval locations and compositions (such as armies and fleets) should be disclosed when requested.<

considering that to my knowledge Cent didn't RP satellite intel capacities and whatnot in any serious capacity.

Edited October 7, 2014 by Lynneth

[Centurius]

Before I answer that in detail, I'd like to know from Ty/Californian whether I have to give my fleet-composition in detail (x destroyers, x carriers, etc), or if giving size (x large, x medium, x small) would be sufficient for the purposes of

>Large troop/naval locations and compositions (such as armies and fleets) should be disclosed when requested.<

considering that to my knowledge Cent didn't RP satellite intel capacities and whatnot in any serious capacity.

Neither did most of your coalition, it's the kind of stuff that is assumed everyone has a reasonable amount of and once you have pictures it's pretty easy to identify whether something is a destroyer or a frigate.