Revelations of the Book of Fungicide

[Monster]

[quote name='Canik' timestamp='1339884754' post='2985998']
Does it really make a difference when you consider that our big nations won't be hurt either? It's not like the big nations they're hiding from are nuking each other in the meantime.

I can see some merit in it, but hasn't it been tried before? Wasn't it tried it the last war? Has it ever really worked?
[/quote]


It's better than having them completely slaughtered.

It's been tried before and severely damaged a larger MK and the Mushroom Kingdom cannot tolerate much damage especially when war fatigue sets in and their auxiliaries will not be as eager to keep declaring wars. Other alliances not taking as much damage as them consumes them deep inside.

SF/XX has no reason to accept any peace deal since MK is a mortal enemy to them and no incentive and they have no intentions of working with MK in the future, nor can any scenario be imagined where they would not be opposed. So grinding it out until they are no longer statistically able is the best course of action. It all depends on the expectations you have going in.

[Ogaden]

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1339892050' post='2986065']
It's better than having them completely slaughtered.

It's been tried before and severely damaged a larger MK and the Mushroom Kingdom cannot tolerate much damage especially when war fatigue sets in and their auxiliaries will not be as eager to keep declaring wars. Other alliances not taking as much damage as them consumes them deep inside.

SF/XX has no reason to accept any peace deal since MK is a mortal enemy to them and no incentive and they have no intentions of working with MK in the future, nor can any scenario be imagined where they would not be opposed. So grinding it out until they are no longer statistically able is the best course of action. It all depends on the expectations you have going in.
[/quote]

I like the way you think. People would sob though and then start calling us monsters.

Edited June 17, 2012 by James Dahl

[Monster]

[quote name='James Dahl' timestamp='1339892651' post='2986072']
I like the way you think. People would sob though and then start calling us monsters.
[/quote]

Meh, I don't know. I've been in this kind of war before and the mentalities were potentially similar. I do know the psyche of the Mushroom Kingdom is highly traumatized by taking damage, especially when they're losing more NS than allies. I also know most alliances can't sustain offensives for months on end without getting bored. With NPO, there existed some reason for them to agree to terms, and they even got a guarantee but it doesn't exist with SF.

[tamerlane]

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1339893757' post='2986080']
Meh, I don't know. I've been in this kind of war before and the mentalities were potentially similar. I do know the psyche of the Mushroom Kingdom is highly traumatized by taking damage, especially when they're losing more NS than allies. I also know most alliances can't sustain offensives for months on end without getting bored. With NPO, there existed some reason for them to agree to terms, and they even got a guarantee but it doesn't exist with SF.
[/quote]

This is rather hilarious coming from you especially when you consider the reputation Umbrella earned under your tutelage.

[Canik]

So far MK is not losing much. You'd have to pile on at least one more SF alliance to make them sweat. Also, we all know the first alliances it the roughest. Those on the outskirts of the war have it easy. MK had to have known this going in. I'm not quite convinced they're as squishy as you'd like to us to believe. I suppose time will tell though, eh?

[Monster]

[quote name='tamerlane' timestamp='1339894721' post='2986091']
This is rather hilarious coming from you especially when you consider the reputation Umbrella earned under your tutelage.
[/quote]

It's exactly the point and it didn't change at all without me. I don't really recall going out of my way to conserve stats at any point, but the reputation is there due to stat envy from people like you. I mean you can spread the rumor as much as you'd like. I know another alliance liked to say it because they didn't get unconditional support on everything they wanted and expected me to just use my alliance as their personal wrecking ball, but lol.

One of the principle whiners is Prince of the Mushroom Kingdom at the present time.

I mean, you're one of the key whiners in MK as well, so I don't get why you're out here. Being a little girl in backchannels for months and bawwing hard about Umbrella just shows they're rather idiotic for remaining allied to people like you. I mean, you guys even do it in public channels now. It's pretty pathetic.

BUT OOC BEST FRIENDS!!!

[quote name='Canik' timestamp='1339894930' post='2986093']
So far MK is not losing much. You'd have to pile on at least one more SF alliance to make them sweat. Also, we all know the first alliances it the roughest. Those on the outskirts of the war have it easy. MK had to have known this going in. I'm not quite convinced they're as squishy as you'd like to us to believe. I suppose time will tell though, eh?
[/quote]


Canik: I am referring to when SF/XX gets involved. Escalation is being delayed for a specific reason.

In terms of squishiness, they haven't fought a losing war in almost four years. Most of them are jaded with this world and the last time around where they were engaged heavily in mid tiers, 70 members deleted. A good chunk of their 145 is from people who joined after that, so their rate of attrition is actually incredibly high.

edit: Don't have to take my word for it, though. People in other alliances who fought MK during that war will tell you they weren't really there. I think Vol Navy has gone on record with his experiences.

Edited June 17, 2012 by Roquentin

[tamerlane]

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1339896474' post='2986105']
It's exactly the point and it didn't change at all without me. I don't really recall going out of my way to conserve stats at any point, but the reputation is there due to stat envy from people like you. I mean you can spread the rumor as much as you'd like. I know another alliance liked to say it because they didn't get unconditional support on everything they wanted and expected me to just use my alliance as their personal wrecking ball, but lol.

One of the principle whiners is Prince of the Mushroom Kingdom at the present time.

I mean, you're one of the key whiners in MK as well, so I don't get why you're out here. Being a little girl in backchannels for months and bawwing hard about Umbrella just shows they're rather idiotic for remaining allied to people like you. I mean, you guys even do it in public channels now. It's pretty pathetic.


[/quote]

yeah, i totally salty all over the umbrella stuff, Mr. Ombuds.

[Alterego]

[quote name='Owned-You' timestamp='1339843793' post='2985735']
While I did exaggerate your personal hand in OWF postings. It is no secret that BAPS hasn't viewed MK in a good light for months now or been the quietest in voicing that opinion. I'm almost positive the fact that we're so close to them drives you all crazy... I'd argue that is the main issue, no? If you want to talk about your displeasure with our actions or affiliations then it would be easier accomplished by ending the OWF theatrics and engaging us on IRC or our forums or just about any other place then here... But I don't think it was ever your interest to engage us in any particular way, beyond slinging some mud and moving on.
[/quote]

Besides myself no one has mentioned them in over a year, possibly longer. I dont think anyone has mentioned you guys since even before that let alone fret about who your friends are. You are as irrelevant to us as we are to you. Now lets go back to ignoring each other.

[Canik]

Aye, they've had attrition issues for a while now. I'm still confident MK will fare decently against the [b]also[/b] weaker than usual forces of XX/SF. Your side has no secret forces MK was unaware of before attacking. You can't do any more damage to MK than MK was already willing to take. They will endure, they will trust in their coalition's superior forces, and they will win the day.

[Roadie]

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1339896474' post='2986105']
It's exactly the point and it didn't change at all without me. I don't really recall going out of my way to conserve stats at any point, but the reputation is there due to stat envy from people like you. I mean you can spread the rumor as much as you'd like. I know another alliance liked to say it because they didn't get unconditional support on everything they wanted and expected me to just use my alliance as their personal wrecking ball, but lol.

One of the principle whiners is Prince of the Mushroom Kingdom at the present time.

I mean, you're one of the key whiners in MK as well, so I don't get why you're out here. Being a little girl in backchannels for months and bawwing hard about Umbrella just shows they're rather idiotic for remaining allied to people like you. I mean, you guys even do it in public channels now. It's pretty pathetic.

BUT OOC BEST FRIENDS!!!




Canik: I am referring to when SF/XX gets involved. Escalation is being delayed for a specific reason.

In terms of squishiness, they haven't fought a losing war in almost four years. Most of them are jaded with this world and the last time around where they were engaged heavily in mid tiers, 70 members deleted. A good chunk of their 145 is from people who joined after that, so their rate of attrition is actually incredibly high.

edit: Don't have to take my word for it, though. People in other alliances who fought MK during that war will tell you they weren't really there. I think Vol Navy has gone on record with his experiences.
[/quote]

Confirmed. There was nothing godly about the MK military during DH-NPO. They could well be much better now though if their contention that they've shed a lot of dead weight is true.

[Monster]

[quote name='Canik' timestamp='1339900639' post='2986168']
Aye, they've had attrition issues for a while now. I'm still confident MK will fare decently against the [b]also[/b] weaker than usual forces of XX/SF. Your side has no secret forces MK was unaware of before attacking. You can't do any more damage to MK than MK was already willing to take. They will endure, they will trust in their coalition's superior forces, and they will win the day.
[/quote]

Secret forces don't really matter, it's the will to extend the war and whose willing to go directly to bat for MK. It's not my side and I already said I don't see this MK-CSN thing as a real global war. It's like 1V-GATO at best and not an actual large scale conflict because of overall NS differential. It's not the main show, either. Them winning the "day" isn't in question even if it's a less easy victory than they want. I already said, "think beyond today," for a real reason. I do not see SF/XX being the base of a real opposition force simply due to them not being connected more into the treaty web. The issue is, plenty of people within the power structure don't like each other and it's going to keep getting worse and worse.

Peripheral alliances a few chains down aren't necessarily going to defend MK directly either.

No one wanted to help GOONS against the mass of alliances that attacked them. Outside of C&G I don't see anyone caring their water or them if the counters are done appropriately.

Edited June 17, 2012 by Roquentin

[Canik]

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1339901052' post='2986178']
Secret forces don't really matter, it's the will to extend the war and whose willing to go directly to bat for MK. It's not my side and I already said I don't see this MK-CSN thing as a real global war. It's like 1V-GATO at best and not an actual large scale conflict because of overall NS differential. It's not the main show, either. Them winning the "day" isn't in question even if it's a less easy victory than they want. I already said, "think beyond today," for a real reason. I do not see SF/XX being the base of a real opposition force simply due to them not being connected more into the treaty web. The issue is, plenty of people within the power structure don't like each other and it's going to keep getting worse and worse.

Peripheral alliances a few chains down aren't necessarily going to defend MK directly either.

No one wanted to help GOONS against the mass of alliances that attacked them. Outside of C&G I don't see anyone caring their water or them if the counters are done appropriately.
[/quote]

Yes, after the war there could potentially be hard times for MK & the current Hegemony. I just don't think MK's enemies fighting from PM will have much effect one way or another on that. The geopolitical issues are already there. MK's attrition issue is already there.

[Believland]

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1339896474' post='2986105']
It's exactly the point and it didn't change at all without me. I don't really recall going out of my way to conserve stats at any point, but the reputation is there due to stat envy from people like you. I mean you can spread the rumor as much as you'd like. I know another alliance liked to say it because they didn't get unconditional support on everything they wanted and expected me to just use my alliance as their personal wrecking ball, but lol.

One of the principle whiners is Prince of the Mushroom Kingdom at the present time.

I mean, you're one of the key whiners in MK as well, so I don't get why you're out here. Being a little girl in backchannels for months and bawwing hard about Umbrella just shows they're rather idiotic for remaining allied to people like you. I mean, you guys even do it in public channels now. It's pretty pathetic.

BUT OOC BEST FRIENDS!!!
[/quote]

I'm pretty sure no one is jealous about Umbrella's stats because you guys have been so useless in past wars in part due to your nation size, and your inability to support any wars, but try to stagnate politics so you could continue to outgrow everyone.


They're probably jealous that you matured early, and all the guys were paying extra special attention to you instead of them.

[Ogaden]

[quote name='Canik' timestamp='1339906789' post='2986249']
Yes, after the war there could potentially be hard times for MK & the current Hegemony. I just don't think MK's enemies fighting from PM will have much effect one way or another on that. The geopolitical issues are already there. MK's attrition issue is already there.
[/quote]

MK has almost as many nations in peacemode as all of SF combined.

Also peacemode jokes, lol

Edited June 17, 2012 by James Dahl

[Canik]

[quote name='James Dahl' timestamp='1339912041' post='2986324']
MK has almost as many nations in peacemode as all of SF combined.

Also peacemode jokes, lol
[/quote]


Glad to hear it. Can we haz proper war now?

[Monster]

Canik: it's just doing damage where they can and if it's a good amount, it makes the geopolitical futures more likely to blow up unfavorably. A weakened alliance can't project as much power.


[quote name='Believland' timestamp='1339911123' post='2986318']
I'm pretty sure no one is jealous about Umbrella's stats because you guys have been so useless in past wars in part due to your nation size, and your inability to support any wars, but try to stagnate politics so you could continue to outgrow everyone.


They're probably jealous that you matured early, and all the guys were paying extra special attention to you instead of them.
[/quote]

It's not "my guys" and the jealousy is always there for them when someone has more. I dunno given people on your side of the war have pushed to stagnate politics in a much more real sense than I could be said to have ever done like waiting months for this war, for instance or pursuing a group of alliances who can only fight in the lower tiers.

The other side of the coin is Umbrella is like a big wall to anyone who might want to go after MK due to perceived invincibility.

[Johnny Apocalypse]

[quote name='James Dahl' timestamp='1339892651' post='2986072']
I like the way you think. People would sob though and then start calling us monsters.
[/quote]

That doesn't bother us so why should it bother you? Something I've learned is that you'll get more done if you care less about what people call you or think of you

[Monster]

It's not really true since an effective propaganda campaign combined with SF shooting itself in the foot on various occasions has led to them being stigmatized enough where they can be rolled for being SF.

If you don't care about what people think about you and they make it clear they'll $%&@ you up when they get the chance or they won't care if you get attacked for little reason, you're in a lot of trouble.

However, holding out when you get attacked isn't really a bad guy thing to do.

Edited June 17, 2012 by Roquentin

[Johnny Apocalypse]

[quote name='Roquentin' timestamp='1339934865' post='2986407']
It's not really true since an effective propaganda campaign combined with SF shooting itself in the foot on various occasions has led to them being stigmatized enough where they can be rolled for being SF.

If you don't care about what people think about you and they make it clear they'll $%&@ you up when they get the chance or they won't care if you get attacked for little reason, you're in a lot of trouble.

However, holding out when you get attacked isn't really a bad guy thing to do.
[/quote]

Clearly the stigma is already that bad so what do they have to lose exactly?

[Delta1212]

[quote name='Johnny Apocalypse' timestamp='1339934644' post='2986406']
That doesn't bother us so why should it bother you? Something I've learned is that you'll get more done if you care less about what people call you or think of you
[/quote]
No, you should care, you just shouldn't be afraid of it. When people mistake not caring for not being afraid, you get, well, you get the world we're currently living in.

[Johnny Apocalypse]

[quote name='Delta1212' timestamp='1339941385' post='2986427']
No, you should care, you just shouldn't be afraid of it. When people mistake not caring for not being afraid, you get, well, you get the world we're currently living in.
[/quote]


Valid point.

[lebubu]

are we dead yet

[Melancholy Culkin]

[quote name='James Dahl' timestamp='1339912041' post='2986324']
MK has almost as many nations in peacemode as all of SF combined.

Also peacemode jokes, lol
[/quote]

Update! SF is now [s][b]22[/b][/s] 8 nations away from having as many nations in peace mode as MK has nations period!

Edit: Haha forgot about NPL

Edited June 19, 2012 by Melancholy Culkin

[Feanor Noldorin]

The whole fungicide thing isnt going to well.

Edited June 19, 2012 by Feanor Noldorin

[Ogaden]

[quote name='Feanor Noldorin' timestamp='1340134950' post='2989096']
The whole fungicide thing isnt going to well.
[/quote]
Nonsense, it's going gloriously