On Civility

[Marneus Calgar]

Themis, don't make a thread where you're trying to be holier than thou and then start doing the exact opposite of what you're [i]trying[/i] to stop in the exact same thread.

Get off of your high horse, you're no better than any one of us.

[WorldConqueror]

So what's the actual problem? Was it the posts, the attacks, the AA worn during the attacks, or referencing the whole Hoo/Kait/biodad saga? Because everyone seems to be objecting to something different here.

[Ardus]

[quote name='Hime Themis' timestamp='1327645111' post='2908020']
Good Ardus

Since I have always posted against OOC attacks and crossing that IC/OOC line your admonition is somewhat late in coming. I notice you did not bother to heed your own words and chose to attack me and the way I conduct my play. I find it amazing that give that I did not list a single name nor post but spoke out against the practice of OOC attacks that so many of you take umbrage at this particular post. It was an remains a call to regain some degree of civility particularly OOC. If this offends those who cross that line or those who think its fine then that is fine with me. AS this type of poster is fond of saying grow a thicker skin or stop the practice. Do not expect that all will sit by an watch poor behavior without comment. I want nothing from others I would not expect from myself. I did not demand an apology. In fact I did not demand anything. I ASKED please to refrain from OOC insults and attacks REGARDLESS or perceived slight. It is a principle not directly related to this or any other specific incident. I am uncertain why people believe they have a right to this form of personal attack in a PUBLIC forum. If you all wish to express your anger directly IN private I applaud your actions. I expressed my reservations two weeks ago IN PRIVATE so it may just be that I know a little as well. Since the wars were launched on KaitlinK in the last 24 hours any nonsense of them being unrelated to the OOC incident is both hysterical and utter nonsense and equally disturbing as the posts.

Respectfully
Dame Hime Themis
[/quote]

Dearest Dame,

You admonished my associates, through a thin veil, to ascend from the ditch of foul conduct to the mountain of good manner, all the while splashing in the mud. When you cast such sludge at us, we will return the favor ten-fold. The thickness of one's skin has no bearing on that response.

Not everybody is privy to the "public" portion of our forums, but nonetheless have a right to know, at the very least, that there is a terrible stain on this whole matter. I would rather see cold posting indicating such to be the case than the full airing of laundry here. That said, this is the central forum of our world. All news, pleasant and unpleasant, good and bad, once flowed through here. It should flow through here. The alternative is to abandon this dessicated nexus altogether.

If you knew much of anything on the subject, you would be aware that the propriety of the wars is already a subject of conversation on our own boards, visible to all who register, and carried out in a more thoughtful manner than your original post here. If you knew much of anything at all, you'd understand that to bring the matter here is to defeat your own desire.

Sincerely,
Ardus Cadogan, Supahfly

[Beefspari]

[quote name='Hime Themis' timestamp='1327646161' post='2908043']
Good Beefspari

Really I insulted everyone. No just those who think making fun of the real life people with OOC insults is cool. It is impossible to talk up to people who go that low. If they are insulted then they need to grow thicker skins or so I have heard all to often from those very same people. I have not seen you post in that fashion so frankly I am surprised you are upset.

Respectfully
Dame Hime Themis
[/quote]
Yes, you insulted everyone. Your insults started with your very first post, and have continued through every post afterward, including this one. And you don't have to talk up to people, just on the same level. Which you never do simply because of the way you address people and speak. You're right that I haven't posted on the topic. That doesn't stop me from seeing that you're stepping into a situation you clearly understand nothing about and are only making matters worse. If your goal is to placate the masses and defuse the situation then you have failed completely. Primarily due to the fact that you are only attacking people yourself.
[img]http://meru.xfury.net/images/aeris/aerisdisL8.jpg[/img]

[Ryuzaki]

[quote name='Hime Themis' timestamp='1327642681' post='2907972']
Do you all really wish to discuss the level of posting that embassies are subject too on the MK forums.
[/quote]

Nobody is forced to sign up, view or post in threads on our boards. If you don't like it, then don't go there.

[LordDarknessOfLight]

[quote name='WorldConqueror' timestamp='1327646624' post='2908051']
So what's the actual problem? Was it the posts, the attacks, the AA worn during the attacks, or referencing the whole Hoo/Kait/biodad saga? Because everyone seems to be objecting to something different here.
[/quote]

That's what I am saying WC..

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='WorldConqueror' timestamp='1327646624' post='2908051']
So what's the actual problem? Was it the posts, the attacks, the AA worn during the attacks, or referencing the whole Hoo/Kait/biodad saga? Because everyone seems to be objecting to something different here.
[/quote][quote name='LordDarknessOfLight' timestamp='1327647097' post='2908057']
That's what I am saying WC..
[/quote]
Mushroom Kingdom doesn't like their understanding of the way Kait and Hoo handled the disappearance of their daughter, so certain members of MK attacked KaitlinK with the blessing of Bob Ilyani.

[Hime Themis]

[quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1327646732' post='2908053']
Dearest Dame,

You admonished my associates, through a thin veil, to ascend from the ditch of foul conduct to the mountain of good manner, all the while splashing in the mud. When you cast such sludge at us, we will return the favor ten-fold. The thickness of one's skin has no bearing on that response.

Not everybody is privy to the "public" portion of our forums, but nonetheless have a right to know, at the very least, that there is a terrible stain on this whole matter. I would rather see cold posting indicating such to be the case than the full airing of laundry here. That said, this is the central forum of our world. All news, pleasant and unpleasant, good and bad, once flowed through here. It should flow through here. The alternative is to abandon this dessicated nexus altogether.

If you knew much of anything on the subject, you would be aware that the propriety of the wars is already a subject of conversation on our own boards, visible to all who register, and carried out in a more thoughtful manner than your original post here. If you knew much of anything at all, you'd understand that to bring the matter here is to defeat your own desire.

Sincerely,
Ardus Cadogan, Supahfly
[/quote]

Good Ardus

First the post as previous posts on this subjest was aimed not at any particular alliance despite what you may wish it to be. It was to decry the general style of OOC attacks. As to my knowledge level I suggest that Blacky shares his private PM that I sent to him. I think you will find my knowledge level at least on par with that of MK.

Respectfully
Dame Hime Themis

[Crymson]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1327645890' post='2908038']
Nor have Hoo or Kait. You have failed to address my point. As a former GOONS, I have the phone numbers, email addresses, etc etc for WarriorConcept, Jason8, Bilrow, and gov of NPO, GGA, Polaris, CIS, VE, and misc other WUT signatory government in 2007. If I start making their lives miserable tomorrow, it is their fault?

Again, whether or not the mods dealt with it does not address the point. Does it belong in the game? I do not consider the mods forcing your immature ass to change something as the situation having been "resolved" precisely because if the mods had not become involved, you'd still be wearing that AA.
[/quote]

Hey, look, it's Schattenman taking the contrary viewpoint in order to garner attention. How very new. Wait, is it 2008?

[Artigo]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1327647419' post='2908063']
Mushroom Kingdom doesn't like their understanding of the way Kait and Hoo handled the disappearance of their daughter, so certain members of MK attacked KaitlinK with the blessing of Biodad.
[/quote]

fixed that for you

[Ardus]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1327645890' post='2908038']
Nor have Hoo or Kait. You have failed to address my point. As a former GOONS, I have the phone numbers, email addresses, etc etc for WarriorConcept, Jason8, Bilrow, and gov of NPO, GGA, Polaris, CIS, VE, and misc other WUT signatory government in 2007. If I start making their lives miserable tomorrow, it is their fault?[/quote]
I think a more pertinent question would be why do you still have them?

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='Crymson' timestamp='1327648759' post='2908069']
Hey, look, it's Schattenman taking the contrary viewpoint in order to garner attention. How very new. Wait, is it 2008?
[/quote]
~Hey look, it's Crymson kissing dominant alliance ass, wait, is it 2008?~
Again I say: I've got Bodvar Jarl's phone number right here courtesy of Bodvar Jarl circa 2007, if I decide to go ballistic and mess with him tonight, is that Bodvar's fault for posting his phone number to the WUT forum, GOONSs fault for posting it on the OWF, or my fault for calling him? You can be cute all week long, but at the end of the day that's it: You're just being cute.
[quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1327649284' post='2908071']
I think a more pertinent question would be why do you still have them?
[/quote]
Perhaps you might dare delineate the difference between a 5-year-old SS and your personal enthusiasm for OOC attacks today.

Edited January 27, 2012 by Schattenmann

[WorldConqueror]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1327647419' post='2908063']
Mushroom Kingdom doesn't like their understanding of the way Kait and Hoo handled the disappearance of their daughter, so certain members of MK attacked KaitlinK with the blessing of Bob Ilyani.
[/quote]
I get that, my post was more about trying to ascertain exactly what part Hime Themis was protesting against. Because she seems to alter her stance depending on who she is replying to, and it's kind of hard to make a case against something when someone keeps changing the terms of their argument.

[Charles Stuart]

Might this be a lesson to us all. Ask for help from the community and the helpful members of MK will investigate the matter.

Edited January 27, 2012 by Charles Stuart

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='Charles Stuart' timestamp='1327649479' post='2908075']
Might this be a lesson to us all. Ask for help from the community and the helpful members of MK will investigate the matter.
[/quote]
If "contacting jilted ex-husband" counts in your book as "investigating" sure.

[Zoomzoomzoom]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1327649365' post='2908073']
~Hey look, it's Crymson kissing dominant alliance ass, wait, is it 2008?~
Again I say: I've got Bodvar Jarl's phone number right here courtesy of Bodvar Jarl circa 2007, if I decide to go ballistic and mess with him tonight, is that Bodvar's fault for posting his phone number to the WUT forum, GOONSs fault for posting it on the OWF, or my fault for calling him? You can be cute all week long, but at the end of the day that's it: You're just being cute.
[/quote]

Why exactly do you still have those numbers?

[Voytek]

if you dont like mk ic you dont like what we're doing ooc

if you like mk ic you like what we're doing ooc

the fact that this argument is so neatly split along "ic" lines is really just making it obvious how flimsy the whole concept of ic is in the first place

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='Zoomzoomzoom' timestamp='1327649737' post='2908077']
Why exactly do you still have those numbers?
[/quote]
See above. They're your allies, after all.

[Crymson]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1327649365' post='2908073']
~Hey look, it's Crymson kissing dominant alliance ass, wait, is it 2008?~
[/quote]

Is that really the best you can come up with?

[quote]
Again I say: I've got Bodvar Jarl's phone number right here courtesy of Bodvar Jarl circa 2007, if I decide to go ballistic and mess with him tonight, is that Bodvar's fault for posting his phone number to the WUT forum, GOONSs fault for posting it on the OWF, or my fault for calling him? You can be cute all week long, but at the end of the day that's it: You're just being cute.[/quote]

Do you really expect anyone to consider this argument as having any substance? You basically saw this thread, saw the opportunity for attention, and came up with the best contrary argument you could on short notice. And so we stand with your pathetically-bad argument.

[Charles Stuart]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1327649555' post='2908076']
If "contacting jilted ex-husband" counts in your book as "investigating" sure.
[/quote]

I really do need to start adding these sarcasm tags don't I?

[Ardus]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1327649365' post='2908073']
Perhaps you might dare delineate the difference between a 5-year-old SS and your personal enthusiasm for OOC attacks today.
[/quote]
[quote name='Ardus, MK Boards, this morning']In the interest of being consistent, I have to voice displeasure with attacking people in-game over RL !@#$tiness. No matter how !@#$%*.[/quote]

I've been criticizing Hime for being holier-than-thou more than anything, and defending the posting here at most. You're talking about something altogether more insidious. That you still have contact information from five years ago is a point aside from everything in this thread: [b]that's goddamn wierd[/b].

[Avakael]

[quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1327650284' post='2908085']
I've been criticizing Hime for being holier-than-thou more than anything, and defending the posting here at most. You're talking about something altogether more insidious. That you still have contact information from five years ago is a point aside from everything in this thread: [b]that's goddamn wierd[/b].
[/quote]
At a guess, that contact information is either no longer valid, or Schatt has actually still been using it to make legitimate contact with the people in question, leaving me to wonder- how is that weird?

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='Ardus' timestamp='1327650284' post='2908085']
I've been criticizing Hime for being holier-than-thou more than anything, and defending the posting here at most. You're talking about something altogether more insidious. That you still have contact information from five years ago is a point aside from everything in this thread: that's goddamn wierd.
[/quote]
I have logs to 2007, it's a function of e-mail and IRC; I haven't gone back and deleted any of it.
I think it's goddamned weird that MK and [b]you personally[/b] are going out of your way to contact Christine's family extraneous to CyberNations and to pass judgement on how Kait and Hoo should raise their daughter, and then taking that out in a MMORPG. bros, on CN Radio, has time and time again hunted down CN players.
What business is it of yours--a kid in college--how anyone raises their child?

Edited January 27, 2012 by Schattenmann

[Jacapo Saladin]

[quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1327650562' post='2908088']
I have logs to 2007, it's a function of e-mail and IRC; I haven't gone back and deleted any of it.
I think it's goddamned weird that MK and [b]you personally[/b] are going out of your way to contact Christine's family extraneous to CyberNations and to pass judgement on how Kait and Hoo should raise their daughter, and then taking that out in a MMORPG. bros, on CN Radio, has time and time again hunted down CN players.
What business is it of yours--a kid in college--how anyone raises their child?
[/quote]

I think you are forgetting that it [b]IS[/b] our business when they [b]CHOOSE[/b] to include us and [b]REQUEST[/b] assistance in the matter. Bolded for easy comprehension.

[Schattenmann]

[quote name='Jacapo Saladin' timestamp='1327651093' post='2908090']
I think you are forgetting that it [b]IS[/b] our business when they [b]CHOOSE[/b] to include us and [b]REQUEST[/b] assistance in the matter. Bolded for easy comprehension.
[/quote]
Show us the post from Hoo or Kait. And once again: Christine is found and safe. It is none of your business how they parent Christine unless they're breaking the law--which they are not--and even then it has nothing to do with attacking anyone in-game.

Edited January 27, 2012 by Schattenmann