MHA Announcement

[Ziperia]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooooooooooo.....!

Why didn't ya just wait for Gre to disband >_>

[Crymson]

[quote name='janax' timestamp='1280760658' post='2398392']
Which of the 12 members of Gremlins (9 who aren't the current trium) are going to "seek a new path"? Give me a break, they had 3 months to seek said path, and guzzled down the kool-aid.
[/quote]

More like nine months. Ramirus has been doing his damage for far longer than three months.

[quote name='HellAngel' timestamp='1280760554' post='2398390']
Only someone who has never dealt with Ramirus Maximus can say something like this. There is no recovery, there is just blind aggressiveness against those who dared to cross him.[/quote]

Agreed. And the alliance retained him in government time and time again. I don't think anyone (besides Ertyy, in his attempts to avoid responsibility) even bothers trying to deny that he was the primary power in the alliance for the last nine months or so.

Edited August 2, 2010 by Crymson

[Horatio Longworth]

The moral is: don't sign "eternal treaties." MHA is just a victim of it's own bad timing. I understand it was a hard decision. But regardless of your intentions, it appears that MHA drops treaties when it's inconvenient.

*I eagerly await the new pip btw.
**can't spell to save my loaf

Edited August 2, 2010 by Horatio Longworth

[Crymson]

[quote name='iamthey' timestamp='1280737224' post='2398169']
Most people offering criticism are not doing so in the defense of Gre, or Ramirus. It is more focused on MHA's general history of treaty violations.
[/quote]

In that event, I agree; MHA is a useless alliance generally led by spineless, nonsensical individuals. I can't really hate on them for canceling this treaty, though.

Edited August 2, 2010 by Crymson

[Taget]

This is silly. You should've asked IRON/DAWN to demand your old friends waive any cancellation clauses like last time. As you well know it's always essential to keep an e-lawyer on standby for these types of situations.

[Crymson]

[quote name='Timberland' timestamp='1280743652' post='2398228']
So MHA, who are you going to follow around mindlessly now ?
[/quote]

Well-spoken, sir!

[Il Impero Romano]

As I said in that other long thread many months ago, MHA is damed if they do and damned if they don't here. Both damnings do have merit though...

[Lord Boris]

[quote name='Mentor' timestamp='1280769196' post='2398498']
this is the right decision, to be honest i thought Gremlins disbanded, cannot find them on the alliance list
[/quote]

The list scryable directly on planet Bob only displays alliances of 20 or more members.

Edited August 2, 2010 by Lord Boris

[Consul of Monkeys]

Rather a catch 22 situation eh MHA? However in this case, anything that gives the proverbial middle finger to Ramirus is a positive move in my opinion.

Good luck and all that jazz.

[eejack]

[quote name='Fernando12' timestamp='1280759452' post='2398375']
Let he who is without sin, cast the first stone.
If you or your alliance has never had to cancel a treaty on an ally then by all means criticize MHA.
Not many here can rightfully do so.
[/quote]

Kzoppistan knows a thing or two about honoring treaties even at the expense of a nation and an alliance, even when there is an out, even when the only thing that made sense made no sense at all.

You may question others...but not this one.

EEjack

/Sad to see this accord end - but truly it was till death and grämlins is indeed dead.

[Comrade Goby]

\m/, in honor of MHA will only sign unbreakable treaties.

They can be canceled though if we don't like them anymore.

[ironchef]

[quote name='Jocko Homo' timestamp='1280726557' post='2397991']

Lets be honest here, They didn't support Gra's continuing actions in the war but they were treaty bound to support them. [b]So they did, while they were working in the background to end the war. [u]Once peace was had they ended the treaty.[/u][/b] This thread is a perfect example of "haters gonna hate".
[/quote]

Or did they?? I have asked this question onec already in this thread but it must have got lost in all the !@#$%^&*.
This is a question to MHA
[b]Did you cancel the treaty after Gre took white peace? Or did Gre take white peace because MHA told them they intended to cancel?[/b]

[size="2"]edit: quote tags[/size]

Edited August 2, 2010 by ironchef

[Charles the Great]

[quote name='SirWilliam' timestamp='1280706056' post='2397547']
Stay away vultures, Parasol Buddies is henceforth protecting Grämlins.

edit: indefinititely
[/quote]

Awww I dont like theives....err tech raiders but had the microwave and several boxes of popcorn ready to go for the end of the week there are a few nations with some piles of tech and no ifras and money to protect it.
Was wonder who would be the first alliance to plow thru them.....

[majorddf]

[quote]Did you cancel the treaty after Gre took white peace? Or did Gre take white peace because MHA told them they intended to cancel?[/quote]

There was no ultimatum, we indeed cancelled once and only once White Peace was achieved.

Edited August 2, 2010 by majorddf

[ironchef]

[quote name='ironchef' timestamp='1280782027' post='2398767']
[b]Did you cancel the treaty after Gre took white peace? Or did Gre take white peace because MHA told them they intended to cancel?[/b]

[size="2"]edit: quote tags[/size]
[/quote]


[quote name='majorddf' timestamp='1280785477' post='2398814']
There was no ultimatum, we indeed cancelled once and only once White Peace was achieved.
[/quote]

Ok maybe it’s my fault and I just don’t make myself clear. I never said there was an ultimatum and I know you canceled after white peace I can tell that by the date of the op.
What I would like to know is this,
Did MHA tell Gre about their intention to cancel before Gre took white peace?

[kitex]

@ MHA:

As a former member I am sorry to see this happen, but it seemed like you guys did the right thing. Don't worry about the peanut gallery, as in a couple of months, people will have either forgotten it or moved onto something else. Trust me.




Best of luck MHA,

-Kitex

[Qazzian]

[quote name='Jocko Homo' timestamp='1280726557' post='2397991']
The mistake MHA made was in signing a treaty [u]without a cancellation clause[/u]. [b]That was made long ago by different leadership[/b] and I assume their thoughts on that type of treaty have changed since then.

Lets be honest here, They didn't support Gra's continuing actions in the war but [u]they were treaty bound to support them[/u]. So they did, while they were working in the background to end the war. [u]Once peace was had they ended the treaty[/u]. This thread is a perfect example of "haters gonna hate".
[/quote]

Those three points I underlined don't match up. If they're bound by the treaty to support Gramlins, then they're bound by the treaty not to cancel the treaty. It was written to be uncancelable. They can't really use the argument "We had to support them due to the treaty" and then cancel the treaty.

Also, it's not just the leadership (bolded section). MHA's membership votes on the treaties. Unless they had a complete purge and refill of their membership, that's not a good excuse.

I do agree with you though, their mistake was not holding the treaty through the war or canceling after peace was agreed upon. It was in signing something "eternal", and assuming everything will work out.

[JmanofAus]

This was obviously a very hard decision to make.

I'm glad to see you guys were able to make the best decision for the future of your alliance.

MHA

[mad mike]

[quote name='ironchef' timestamp='1280786786' post='2398833']
Ok maybe it’s my fault and I just don’t make myself clear. I never said there was an ultimatum and I know you canceled after white peace I can tell that by the date of the op.
What I would like to know is this,
Did MHA tell Gre about their intention to cancel before Gre took white peace?
[/quote]


MHA did not know of gremlins intentions on white peace.
once achieved:
MHA was nice enough to post there cancellation of the accords on the gremlins forums 10 minutes before posting it to the OWF. They at least posted a link to the forums post in our joint irc channel.

Gremlins did not know of an intention to cancel the accords before white peace was achieved. It was a total surprise to Gremlins.

[Qazzian]

[quote name='Mad Mike' timestamp='1280789637' post='2398883']
MHA did not know of gremlins intentions on white peace.
once achieved:
MHA was nice enough to post there cancellation of the accords on the gremlins forums 10 minutes before posting it to the OWF. They at least posted a link to the forums post in our joint irc channel.

Gremlins did not know of an intention to cancel the accords before white peace was achieved. It was a total surprise to Gremlins.
[/quote]

10 minutes notice before going public? May as well have just posted here first and given you the link. Doubtful anyone would see it on the private forums in that time.

[Bob Janova]

That same argument can be applied to you not giving notice of your intention to peace out, as well, mind.

[Crymson]

[quote name='Mad Mike' timestamp='1280789637' post='2398883']
MHA did not know of gremlins intentions on white peace.
once achieved:
MHA was nice enough to post there cancellation of the accords on the gremlins forums 10 minutes before posting it to the OWF. They at least posted a link to the forums post in our joint irc channel.

Gremlins did not know of an intention to cancel the accords before white peace was achieved. It was a total surprise to Gremlins.
[/quote]

Who are these Grämlins you speak of? I know only of the Rämlins, an unimportant and insignificant micro-alliance led by deluded megalomaniacs.

Edited August 2, 2010 by Crymson

[Bob Janova]

Also, the precedent of giving notice to your treaty partner before cancelling the treaty is largely down to the explicit cancellation period in most treaties. Now, I don't think that 10 minutes is terribly polite, but I'm not sure what you wanted ... it's just as legal (or not) to cancel with no notice as to cancel with 2 days' notice when the treaty has no cancellation period.

It's clear that MHA wanted to be shot of you when you stopped being a sane alliance and started being 'Ramlins', and instead of complaining about them not giving much notice of the cancellation, you should be grateful that they kept that treaty for as long as they did and made sure that you weren't legally unprotected.

[rapmanej]

In not so surprising news, MHA is scum of an alliance.

[Jocko Homo]

[quote name='Qazzian' timestamp='1280787060' post='2398844']
Those three points I underlined don't match up. If they're bound by the treaty to support Gramlins, then they're bound by the treaty not to cancel the treaty. It was written to be uncancelable. They can't really use the argument "We had to support them due to the treaty" and then cancel the treaty.

Also, it's not just the leadership (bolded section). MHA's membership votes on the treaties. Unless they had a complete purge and refill of their membership, that's not a good excuse.

I do agree with you though, their mistake was not holding the treaty through the war or canceling after peace was agreed upon. It was in signing something "eternal", and assuming everything will work out.
[/quote]

Holy crap, you've got a point there. Quick, fill out the e-lawyer forms and get it to the clerk of the court immediately! We can put a stop to this!