Dooku Lost His Head and All He Got Was Eight More

[Ivan Moldavi]

Heh. That's a good one really.

I did have a hand. I fought in the war like many other nations. A war is not won by leaders but by the common member, and every nation who fought a war in that battle helped take you down. I've learned over the years to value every contribution no matter how small, maybe you too, should learn that, being the leader of a moderately large alliance. Besides, I was in charge of GGA's military, one of the largest alliances fighting the NPO. You won a moral victory in the war by not having to pay any reperations, but your alliance was utterly beaten on the battlefield, and you weren't able to "circumvent" any of that damage. From what you're saying, you're basically claiming you won the war and apologized because you have no ego. Really, I know it was in the past and most of us these days weren't here for it, but you can't rewrite history so ridiculously like you are attempting. The only reason I still mention it though, is because that was the only time we ever faced off on the battlefield.

Finally, I never did receive a Pacifican "jackboot" until way after GW3. I won GW2, then was soundly defeated by the forces of Nordreich and VE in GW3. You guys (Heh, I should say Moo. Afterall you were long gone by this time) merely held me down once your allies knocked me down, after I honored a MADP in what I knew would be a losing effort. So, really that comment was stupid.

Umm. No.

The NPO statistically lost equivalent amounts of what the rest of the world lost and the aims of the war were many. One, have Polar disband. Two, have me removed. Three, have us pay $20 million in reps (very high amount at the time). Four, have us demilitarize and remove military improvements. All of those failed. All of them. I didn't apologize because I have no ego. I apologized because my ego was equivalent to the entirety of your war effort. The only victory your side could claim was having my ego succumb to self sacrifice on a minor scale. Again, good job.

As far as being long gone, I served as Commandante of the NPO during GW2 and GW3, I was nominally in control of the Order during times of declared war, and Anthony did all the actual work, regardless of who was on the throne at the time. And even after that I was around behind the scenes a lot. Regardless, when I spoke of "you" earlier, concerning the jackboot, I didn't mean you specifically, I don't even remember you from back then, you weren't important enough then or now. It was a general "you" to all those that were addressed for their betrayals and actions at that time.

Anyway, congratulations again to us and Hydra.

[TehChron]

You won a moral victory in the war by not having to pay any reperations, but your alliance was utterly beaten on the battlefield, and you weren't able to "circumvent" any of that damage.

...

Wut? A nuclear cheap shot is "utterly beaten"? Well, anyway, congrats on the introduction to the OWF, FCC!

I look forward to further shenans as NSO celebrates more milestones in the future!

[Sephiroth]

I discovered there's an alliance called FCC in this thread.

At least this thread served one purpose, FCC got lots of free publicity. B)

[TehChron]

At least this thread served one purpose, FCC got lots of free publicity. B)

As Dopp loves to say "Any publicity is good publicity".

See? Another Sith innovation being copied by the masses.

[Sephiroth]

As Dopp loves to say "Any publicity is good publicity".

See? Another Sith innovation being copied by the masses.

I don't disagree with Sith on most issues, such as alliance sovereignty to declare for any reason, just how you guys present your views that can be annoying, such as the Moldavi Doctrine which makes it out like the doctrine is what gives pre-existing rights, as well as how you guys claim to invent everything.

[TehChron]

I don't disagree with Sith on most issues, such as alliance sovereignty to declare for any reason, just how you guys present your views that can be annoying, such as the Moldavi Doctrine which makes it out like the doctrine is what gives pre-existing rights, as well as how you guys claim to invent everything.

Well, when you are essentially copying us it does kind of lend credence to our claims.

[Sephiroth]

Well, when you are essentially copying us it does kind of lend credence to our claims.

The phrase "Any publicity is good publicity" has been around long before NSO, and many alliances have done things in the past only for publicity. I don't see how I've copied you guys, causing a ruckus in another alliance's treaty thread is NSO behavior?

Edit: Almost forgot I decided to stop posting in here, so this shall be my last post. If anyone wants to discuss further you can contact me via PM.

Edited November 13, 2009 by Methrage

[Deadshot]

I don't disagree with Sith on most issues, such as alliance sovereignty to declare for any reason, just how you guys present your views that can be annoying, such as the Moldavi Doctrine which makes it out like the doctrine is what gives pre-existing rights, as well as how you guys claim to invent everything.

It's my understanding that the Doctrine will cease to exist once the world realizes that it is a pre-existing right and actually uses it.

[RandomInterrupt]

At least this thread served one purpose, FCC got lots of free publicity. B)

When your alliance is only brought up once every six months, you should probably try and make it look decent. This has been sort of the opposite. It was certainly enjoyable to read through though. Let this be a lesson to anyone else who decides that the NSO is "irrelevant".

[DarkEra97]

After allllllll of that being said, I wish to say again to my new allies that I am looking forward to working with them, as believe it or not this announcement is actually about the treaty we signed, not ancient history or the internal issues FCC may have.

Edited November 13, 2009 by DarkEra97

[Lucas Perry]

I don't know many people from NSO. However, if they've become friends with Hydra they must be cool cats.

Good luck in the future, NSO and Hydra.

[Rich333]

if you want to challenge my leadership lets not make a display of it on OWF

Where's the fun in that? This thread got so much more interesting.

[Sephiroth]

Where's the fun in that? This thread got so much more interesting.

If you want to play a game how about each additional post you make in this thread you go down a rank, starting now! B)

[Neuromancer7]

New topic...

This thread is now about NSO and Hydra's MDP!

Did I mention that the flag's are great? Cause they are. Also Congrats again on the treaty.

Tum te tum tum tum...

[Rich333]

If you want to play a game how about each additional post you make in this thread you go down a rank, starting now! B)

This thread just got more awesome.

[Ramirus Maximus]

However, the Moldavi Doctrine states that any alliance has the sovereign right to interject against injustice, treaty or no treaty.

Then why do you sign treaties? I only ask because I personally think all treaties are pretty retarded.

By the way, love the new sig. Not -quite- as cool as mine but adequate, adequate.

[Ivan Moldavi]

Then why do you sign treaties? I only ask because I personally think all treaties are pretty retarded.

By the way, love the new sig. Not -quite- as cool as mine but adequate, adequate.

While I have direct control over how the NSO acts in regards to injustice I have no such control over other alliances and allowing my membership to be wholly at the mercy of the world's good graces, even among those we call friends and allies who I trust implicitly, would be foolish and inexcusable as a leader.

Until such time as the Doctrine is universally accepted (and therefore made defunct) the NSO will seek out a limited number of treaty partners. Not to perpetuate the Great Lie, but to ensure that opposition to same is at least at some level on our own terms.

[Näktergal]

While I have direct control over how the NSO acts in regards to injustice I have no such control over other alliances and allowing my membership to be wholly at the mercy of the world's good graces, even among those we call friends and allies who I trust implicitly, would be foolish and inexcusable as a leader.

Until such time as the Doctrine is universally accepted (and therefore made defunct) the NSO will seek out a limited number of treaty partners. Not to perpetuate the Great Lie, but to ensure that opposition to same is at least at some level on our own terms.

Or to put it another way, the Doctrine describes how they think the world SHOULD be, while their behavior is forced to reflect the way the world currently IS.

Which describes most politics in CN, really - morality and idealism in general tend to take a back-seat to practicality.

[HellAngel]

Or to put it another way, the Doctrine describes how they think the world SHOULD be, while their behavior is forced to reflect the way the world currently IS.

Which describes most politics in CN, really - morality and idealism in general tend to take a back-seat to practicality.

Actually i am missing the good old "Screw it, we'll do what is right!" attitude from back in the days.

But yeah, you're right of course.

[Näktergal]

Hate to say it, but I've been playing since mid-2006 and I don't ever remember that ever being the dominant paradigm.

Sure, there were always lone individuals and alliances that proclaimed that "Might Should Serve Right" rather than "Might Makes Right", but ultimately, CN politics have almost always been a case of the Strong preying upon the Weak, and then re-writing history after the fact to "prove" that they were right all along.

I don't really see it changing any time soon, either. Now we'll just get to see it play out with a whole new cast of characters instead of the old villains.

[Ivan Moldavi]

Hate to say it, but I've been playing since mid-2006 and I don't ever remember that ever being the dominant paradigm.

Sure, there were always lone individuals and alliances that proclaimed that "Might Should Serve Right" rather than "Might Makes Right", but ultimately, CN politics have almost always been a case of the Strong preying upon the Weak, and then re-writing history after the fact to "prove" that they were right all along.

I don't really see it changing any time soon, either. Now we'll just get to see it play out with a whole new cast of characters instead of the old villains.

Might Makes Right works when the power is in the hands of the Just.

As to your comment earlier, the NSO holding treaties in no way prevents us from acting on what is right. We codified that with the Moldavi Doctrine just to make that point. Obviously, it would be grand if everyone did what was just and right and "everyone is a pony, and they all eat rainbows, and poop butterflies" but it just doesn't work that way.

I am a pragmatist. I know that I can choose to act a certain way but that others will just as easily not act because they either don't hold a signed piece of paper telling them that they can or they have another one telling them that they can not. The Cyberverse is composed of all sorts. The NSO will act in accordance with what it feels is right and we only seek out treaties with those that we feel are just as honorable as an outward expression of an internal ideal.

[Starfox101]

Umm. No.

The NPO statistically lost equivalent amounts of what the rest of the world lost and the aims of the war were many. One, have Polar disband. Two, have me removed. Three, have us pay $20 million in reps (very high amount at the time). Four, have us demilitarize and remove military improvements. All of those failed. All of them. I didn't apologize because I have no ego. I apologized because my ego was equivalent to the entirety of your war effort. The only victory your side could claim was having my ego succumb to self sacrifice on a minor scale. Again, good job.

As far as being long gone, I served as Commandante of the NPO during GW2 and GW3, I was nominally in control of the Order during times of declared war, and Anthony did all the actual work, regardless of who was on the throne at the time. And even after that I was around behind the scenes a lot. Regardless, when I spoke of "you" earlier, concerning the jackboot, I didn't mean you specifically, I don't even remember you from back then, you weren't important enough then or now. It was a general "you" to all those that were addressed for their betrayals and actions at that time.

Anyway, congratulations again to us and Hydra.

You as a single alliance losing combined what the rest of the world lost is utterly beaten. You alienated your allies and had nobody to take the damage for you, while your damage was spread out. War isn't decided by who does more damage, because in a nuclear war it's easy to hurt people. It's decided by who keeps their NS, which you didn't. Whose goal was it to have Polar disband? Who asked for reps? Who wanted you demilitarized? Who asked for your removal? It wasn't a unified effort, and that's why you escaped without any terms. LUE and GGA called for harsh terms, but beyond that, everyone else was near universally against it. You mistake mercy for your own personal strength. I attended the peace terms, I'm really the wrong guy to try and rewrite history on.

And I really don't care if you remember me. Besides, you've already displayed a poor memory of world history, so I expect nothing else.

...

Wut? A nuclear cheap shot is "utterly beaten"? Well, anyway, congrats on the introduction to the OWF, FCC!

I look forward to further shenans as NSO celebrates more milestones in the future!

A nuclear cheap shot? I hope you aren't calling the CoaLUEtions nuclear response cheap.

Edited November 14, 2009 by Starfox101

[Corinan]

You as a single alliance losing combined what the rest of the world lost is utterly beaten. You alienated your allies and had nobody to take the damage for you, while your damage was spread out. War isn't decided by who does more damage, because in a nuclear war it's easy to hurt people. It's decided by who keeps their NS, which you didn't. Whose goal was it to have Polar disband? Who asked for reps? Who wanted you demilitarized? Who asked for your removal? It wasn't a unified effort, and that's why you escaped without any terms. LUE and GGA called for harsh terms, but beyond that, everyone else was near universally against it. You mistake mercy for your own personal strength. I attended the peace terms, I'm really the wrong guy to try and rewrite history on.

Your version of history sucks and is wrong. First, logically the NPO had the most NS to lose during the GPW, therefore they lost the most. You also say the NPO didn't keep their NS? Starfox, we were back to being the #1 ranked alliance 2-3 weeks after the war ended!

Yay, this thread is now about how the NPO won the Great Patriotic War! One of my favorite subjects!

[Ivan Moldavi]

You as a single alliance losing combined what the rest of the world lost is utterly beaten. You alienated your allies and had nobody to take the damage for you, while your damage was spread out. War isn't decided by who does more damage, because in a nuclear war it's easy to hurt people. It's decided by who keeps their NS, which you didn't. Whose goal was it to have Polar disband? Who asked for reps? Who wanted you demilitarized? Who asked for your removal? It wasn't a unified effort, and that's why you escaped without any terms. LUE and GGA called for harsh terms, but beyond that, everyone else was near universally against it. You mistake mercy for your own personal strength. I attended the peace terms, I'm really the wrong guy to try and rewrite history on.

Sigh. Obviously you are delusional. I believe a lot of the logs are posted in various places where the demands were clearly made and very clearly refused by myself. I "escaped" without terms because your side didn't have the resolve or strength to finish the job. The coalition was faltering, some alliances were already seeking individual peace with us, and we were willing to fight on, where we were giving as good as we got on all fronts.

Your claiming that those goals were immaterial or unreal only highlights the fact that you were not in any position to actually have a say in them and shows a lake of intelligence in regards to what actually took place. You may have attended the final peace terms but that doesn't mean you actually had a say or were party to the several ongoing nights of negotiation. Regardless you being "really the wrong guy to try to rewrite history on" is one of the most laughable things I have read in a while. Thanks for the laugh. That is all you are good for. Keep up the good work.

[andyt2k]

The NSO is completely pointless, unknown and lame.

None of their threads get to 14 pages long

They don't have any decent allies

And their leader is some guy no ones seen before

NSO = laaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaame

PS congrats on the treaty