King Timmy Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='Maelstrom Vortex' timestamp='1295231671' post='2578078'] There is no military in the world that links the launch of its submarine's nuclear arsenal to a central command. The Subs are fully capable of independent launch. [/quote] HE. IS. NOT. TRYING. TO. STOP. SUBS. LAUNCHING. NUKES. SIMPLE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaiser Martens Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 Yeah, she just thought Martenshaven=Trieste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael McBride Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='King Timmy' timestamp='1295231769' post='2578081'] HE. IS. NOT. TRYING. TO. STOP. SUBS. LAUNCHING. NUKES. SIMPLE. [/quote] This man is correct. Everyone else who keeps trying to say I am trying to hack the subs should listen to this man, for he is smarter than all of you put together. Multiplied by 100. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizzydog Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 I have four land based nuclear missiles, and all of them are currently owned by some starving spec ops soldiers. Yes, you can disable the missiles but then they'll just be sitting in some abandoned frozen military base surrounded by frozen bodies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AironthFlamewing Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 OOC: just launch the sea based ones fizzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael McBride Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='Fizzydog' timestamp='1295232134' post='2578086'] I have four land based nuclear missiles, and all of them are currently owned by some starving spec ops soldiers. Yes, you can disable the missiles but then they'll just be sitting in some abandoned frozen military base surrounded by frozen bodies. [/quote] Works for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king of cochin Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='Pravus Ingruo' timestamp='1295232005' post='2578084'] This man is correct. Everyone else who keeps trying to say I am trying to hack the subs should listen to this man, for he is smarter than all of you put together. Multiplied by 100. [/quote] You would not be able to prevent the land based nukes from launching either. Read the reasons I presented in the earlier post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kankou Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='Maelstrom Vortex' timestamp='1295231609' post='2578077'] You're dreaming. Out of the amount of missiles that were sent against you you could at tops.. kill 30%. No more. That is all your nation's setup allows for. Get over being North Korea. You are not it. Geographically yes. Militarily, no. [/quote] Excuse me, but I'm not sure who you are to just say what my nation's setup is. From my readings, Malaose has thousands of AA MISSILES in his land. What would his IG setup be that allows him to have that while not for me? Anyway, I'll wait for Malatose's post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maelstrom Vortex Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Kankou' timestamp='1295232579' post='2578099'] Excuse me, but I'm not sure who you are to just say what my nation's setup is. From my readings, Malaose has thousands of AA MISSILES in his land. What would his IG setup be that allows him to have that while not for me? Anyway, I'll wait for Malatose's post. [/quote] *goes to evaluate Malatose's nation and will be back with the appropriate response* Malatose should be able to intercept 50% of all missiles fired at him. And with his satellites, his missiles should be 50% more effective. Your network allows you to shoot down 30% of all missiles shot at you and to make all your missiles 30% more effective. There you go. He has an edge on you in a missile war of a 20% margin of effectiveness roughly.. 40% if you include missile enhancements by satellite guidance. If I had thought to include his satellites previously you actually should only shoot about 10% of his missiles.. with maybe another 5-10% for using excessive amounts of flak.. while suffering slight to moderate ground damage from substantial shrapnel fallout. As for who I am to tell you what your nation is or is not.. well. I read your IG possessions like any one else.. and thus can make the same assessments. A 30% shoot down rate for your nation is.. in fact.. [u][i]generous.[/i][/u] I also think the IG system is very representative of how this should work as to shoot down a greater % of missiles you will need exponentially larger defense systems against them. That said, each additional set of missile defenses or satellites represents a significant unit increase over the prior one. To get ten percent you might need a handful of defense points.. 20% about 4 hand fulls.. 30% 16 hand fulls.. and so on. Do to the fact you're covering a 3 dimensional and radial area.. you're going to need exponentially larger defense quantities to get greater and greater % deductions. That said, I expect that Malatose would have effectively around your quantity raised to the 4th power in air defense weapons because of his difference of 2 missile batteries IG with an increase of a 20% hit rate over your 3 batteries to his 5. Edited January 17, 2011 by Maelstrom Vortex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Executive Minister Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='Zoot Zoot' timestamp='1295200628' post='2577314'] Then the GM's should commit to the jobs empowered to them by the Admins instead of not doing rolls for obvious reasons, and point blank refusing to to them. [/quote] Forgive me if I have misconstrued your words and now have a bit of egg on my face, but are you a !@#$@#$ moron? I have been empowered by the Moderators to act as impartially as possible in regards to issues brought up by CNRPers. I categorically refuse to roll my own nuclear attacks on Keshav out of that principal and that principal alone. That should be enough of an obvious reason for even you, Zoot and yes, i am point blank refusing to do them myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maelstrom Vortex Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 If EM does not object, I could do the rolls for him. He could appoint me as a 3rd party non-participatory and objective person to make the rolls.. as I could really care less who gets flattened and who does not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Executive Minister Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='Maelstrom Vortex' timestamp='1295234752' post='2578135'] If EM does not object, I could do the rolls for him. He could appoint me as a 3rd party non-participatory and objective person to make the rolls.. as I could really care less who gets flattened and who does not. [/quote] Sargun is currently the only person, save for a GM the Moderators appoint now or in the near future, who is eligible to do GM nuke rolls. I have not been given permission by the mods to appoint anyone. I cannot do these rolls myself. Sargun, this war is waiting only on your four rolls for keshav before we can proceed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoot Zoot Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 EM re read what I said. ***Then the GM's should commit to the jobs empowered to them by the Admins instead of not doing rolls for obvious reasons, and point blank refusing to to them.*** I quote " instead of not doing rolls for obvious reason" It was sargun point blank refusing to do them, if you had read cents post properly you would know that. Reading comprehension ftw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sargun II Posted January 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 EM, you are capable of doing them. You simply don't want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Executive Minister Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='Sargun' timestamp='1295236145' post='2578181'] EM, you are capable of doing them. You simply don't want to. [/quote] Err... has everyone gone mad? I've previously been unable to rule on issues where I was directly involved, how is a nuke roll initiated by myself any different? I suppose no one would complain should i have 4 successful detonations then? Just do the rolls for chrissake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sargun II Posted January 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='Executive Minister' timestamp='1295237724' post='2578210'] Err... has everyone gone mad? I've previously been unable to rule on issues where I was directly involved, how is a nuke roll initiated by myself any different? I suppose no one would complain should i have 4 successful detonations then? Just do the rolls for chrissake. [/quote] I can just keep doing rolls until I find rolls that I believe are pleasing. I can edit the roll pages to whatever numbers I want to. That doesn't mean I can nor does it mean I will. Likewise, you can do the same thing. What's the difference between me and you doing it? You were, as a player, picked by the mods because in part of your impartiality. You have, as a GM, showed your impartiality on numerous occasions. There is no difference between me and you doing this roll other than the name on the post, because the entire result depends on a Scout's Honour type of deal in the first place. Do the damn rolls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kankou Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 If we translate Sargun's words: There's no reason for GMs not to do rolls even when they're involved. This isn't accounting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael McBride Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 I need three SDI rolls for the nukes Fizzy launched at me in this thread: http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=97210 However, I need a ruling from a GM as well. I believe we have a clear-cut case of metagaming here. Earlier in this thread, Fizzy said his nuke targets were NYC and DC. He was informed that he needed to RP out his attack first. During that time, I mentioned on IRC that I had evacuated my citizens out of all major cities during the Monaco crisis, and actually discussed the very scenario of him changing his targets based on this OOC knowledge, which would be metagaming. As you can see in [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=96575&view=findpost&p=2567350"]this post[/url], I told my citizens to evacuate through a public broadcast. This broadcast would have been in the Empire only, and there is no way that Fizzy could have picked up the transmission (something he never RP'd) nor would he have seen my civilians leaving (as he never RP'd sats observing this fact). Therefore, this is a case of metagaming using OOC knowledge for IC purposes. I ask that the GMs call out this metagaming, force the targets back to the originals (two for NYC, one for DC), and do the SDI roll. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizzydog Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 That says "Public Broadcast". Not "Broadcasted To Citizens of The Empire" or sanything like that. I don't want to try too hard here, but honestly a major evacuation from all of the Empire's cities? That would stay secret for a couple of hours at MOST. This stuff does not go unnnoticed and it does not take a satellite to spot it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael McBride Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='Fizzydog' timestamp='1295241058' post='2578284'] That says "Public Broadcast". Not "Broadcasted To Citizens of The Empire" or sanything like that. I don't want to try too hard here, but honestly a major evacuation from all of the Empire's cities? That would stay secret for a couple of hours at MOST. This stuff does not go unnnoticed and it does not take a satellite to spot it. [/quote] It said it was broadcast to the citizens of the Empire. Further, it doesn't matter IF it would go unnoticed, you never RP'd anything where you WOULD notice it. Your nation wasn't close enough to mine to see that, there were no news reports about it. As far as you know, with what you RP'd, nothing would have been out of the ordinary. Have a way to prove me wrong? Link it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HHAYD Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Pravus Ingruo' timestamp='1295240835' post='2578275'] I need three SDI rolls for the nukes Fizzy launched at me in this thread: http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=97210 However, I need a ruling from a GM as well. I believe we have a clear-cut case of metagaming here. Earlier in this thread, Fizzy said his nuke targets were NYC and DC. He was informed that he needed to RP out his attack first. During that time, I mentioned on IRC that I had evacuated my citizens out of all major cities during the Monaco crisis, and actually discussed the very scenario of him changing his targets based on this OOC knowledge, which would be metagaming. As you can see in [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=96575&view=findpost&p=2567350"]this post[/url], [b]I told my citizens to evacuate through a public broadcast. This broadcast would have been in the Empire only, and there is no way that Fizzy could have picked up the transmission (something he never RP'd)[/b] nor would he have seen my civilians leaving (as he never RP'd sats observing this fact). Therefore, this is a case of metagaming using OOC knowledge for IC purposes. I ask that the GMs call out this metagaming, force the targets back to the originals (two for NYC, one for DC), and do the SDI roll. Thank you. [/quote] If its public and regular radio can pick up, then its fair games as AM radio broadcasts are usually used for emergency broadcast due to their long range and it is very possible its signal had spread beyond your borders. If you used FM radio broadcasts, you would need additional stations since FM has a smaller range, though the southern half of Labrador could have picked up your radio broadcast. Also, since you made it public, at least one of your citizens would have directly or indirectly spread the news to Labrador. This is no longer the 20th century, this is the 21st century where anything that is public can end up on the internet, and information spreads real fast on the internet. Edited January 17, 2011 by HHAYD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael McBride Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='HHAYD' timestamp='1295241282' post='2578293'] If its public and regular radio can pick up, then its fair games as AM radio broadcasts are usually used for emergency broadcast due to their long range and it is very possible its signal had spread beyond your borders. If you used FM radio broadcasts, you would need additional stations since FM has a smaller range, though the southern half of Labrador could have picked up your radio broadcast. Also, since you made it public, at least one of your citizens would have directly or indirectly spread the news to Labrador. This is no longer the 20th century, this is the 21st century where anything that is public can end up on the internet, and information spreads real fast on the internet. [/quote] It was broadcast on television. I never said anything about the radio. Further, he never RP'd that happening. Meaning it didn't. Meaning he metagamed. Period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizzydog Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='Pravus Ingruo' timestamp='1295241272' post='2578291'] It said it was broadcast to the citizens of the Empire. Further, it doesn't matter IF it would go unnoticed, you never RP'd anything where you WOULD notice it. Your nation wasn't close enough to mine to see that, there were no news reports about it. As far as you know, with what you RP'd, nothing would have been out of the ordinary. Have a way to prove me wrong? Link it. [/quote] Communications. Unless citizens decide that moving out of their home wouldnt be a total shock and they wouldn't post on social websites and that not ONE person would have let this leak is bull$#@^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael McBride Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 [quote name='Fizzydog' timestamp='1295241428' post='2578300'] Communications. Unless citizens decide that moving out of their home wouldnt be a total shock and they wouldn't post on social websites and that not ONE person would have let this leak is bull$#@^ [/quote] Did I RP my citizens posting about it on social media? Nope. I RP'd them following orders and leaving. So unless you're controlling my citizens now, which is also against the rules, you don't have a leg to stand on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HHAYD Posted January 17, 2011 Report Share Posted January 17, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Pravus Ingruo' timestamp='1295241395' post='2578299'] It was broadcast on television. I never said anything about the radio. Further, he never RP'd that happening. Meaning it didn't. Meaning he metagamed. Period. [/quote] My point still stands, if its public, then it [i]will[/i] end up on the internet, and at least one person in Labrador [i]will[/i] notice it and [i]will[/i] spread the news to the government. [quote name='Pravus Ingruo' timestamp='1295241524' post='2578304'] Did I RP my citizens posting about it on social media? Nope. I RP'd them following orders and leaving. So unless you're controlling my citizens now, which is also against the rules, you don't have a leg to stand on. [/quote] I take it that your citizens are ultra obedient and are not affected by human nature. Good to see. Edited January 17, 2011 by HHAYD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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