MHA Announcement

[Grendel]

A treaty between alliances is but another name for a contract.

There are many ways to terminate the obligations of a contract. Hopefully most of the time, parties conclude their contract obligations by performing them, and/or maintaining them as in one of our treaties. However, sometimes problems arise and parties cannot or will not complete their obligations under the contract [treaty for the slow]. Therefore, contracts may be terminated by reasons of rescission, breach, or impossibility of performance.

[b]Rescission: [/b]Rescission may terminate the obligations of a contract in a variety of circumstances. One party may have the legal right to rescind the contract, or the parties together agree to terminate the contract. For example, a minor has the right to rescind contracts because a minor lacks competence to make them.

[b]Breach of Contract: [/b]Breach of a contract may terminate the obligations of the contract. Either [b]one party or both parties[/b] have failed to perform an obligation as expected under the contract. A breach may occur when a party:

[i]* Refuses to perform the contract
* Does something that the contract prohibits, or
* Prevents the other party from performing its obligations [/i]

There is no such thing as an Eternity Clause in reality. Remember in marriage the "until death do us part"?? Yet in real life we allow and accept many of these verbal contracts to be canceled [divorce]. In the real world contracts without termination clauses are canceled all the time, so why would anyone expect that it would be any different here. Writing and accepting a contract without termination or cancellation clauses might not be the smartest move but I am sure if you speak to anyone involved in contract law they will tell you there are more badly worded contracts then there are good ones. So give the right to terminate argument a rest.

Note: I really do not care what MHA or Gramlins do or even why they do it I just detest all the sanctimonious preaching about 'well they can't cancel because there is no cancellation clause" discussion. Good luck to all the players directly involved in this and poor luck to the Trolls.

[leprecon]

[quote name='Ramirus Maximus' timestamp='1280865962' post='2399837']
You can rest assured, I had nothing to do with the so-called "white peace", and did not authorize my signature being used by Peron.
[/quote]

It is white peace. I know, your ego can't allow you to utter those words since you need to be a winner so badly that white peace is unacceptable to the point that you would rather destroy your alliance than swallow your pride.
Seriously though, do you really want to stir up even more drama? Everybody thinks you are some sort of crazy or at least very stubborn.


You do realize you are part of Grämlins government, right?
Maybe you would want to keep this drama internally?
When making that post you had two choices;

One: Be vocal about your refusal to get peace, confirming to everybody that you are still the same and that the Grämlins is weaker for it. But you still get to keep your stubborn pride.
Two: Accept that it is over, accept that you can't change your so called defeat (it's not defeat, it's white peace) and learn to live with it for the sake of your alliance.

Edited August 5, 2010 by leprecon

[trance addict]

[quote name='Matthew PK' timestamp='1280958517' post='2401018']
I agree. The signature issue is between Ram and Peron.
[/quote]

A few questions if I may...

1. Whom within gRAMlins communicated acceptance of white peace to IRON?
2. Whom did they communicate it to (within IRON)?
3. Why did they communicate acceptance of white peace?
4. Did they communicate that Ramirus' signature should be excluded?

Also,

"3.1 Executive PowersThe Conclave is the political and representative government of the Grämlins. A 2:1 Decision is required to make a Conclave decision, if not specified otherwise.

The Conclave, consisting of:

The Judicator (Internal Overseer & Minister of Growth)
The Praetor (Chief Diplomat & Minister of foreign Affairs)
The Executor (Head of Military & Minister of Defence)

The Conclave has the right to:

1. sign treaties on behalf the alliance
2. declare war, peace or surrender on behalf the alliance
3. negotiate peace terms on behalf the alliance"

If those rights have been given to Ramirus (and the rest of the Conclave) should his signature not be necessary to any contract/treaty which your alliance is approving for public knowledge?

[leprecon]

[quote name='trance addict' timestamp='1281016591' post='2401638']
A 2:1 Decision is required to make a Conclave decision

If those rights have been given to Ramirus (and the rest of the Conclave) should his signature not be necessary to any contract/treaty which your alliance is approving for public knowledge?
[/quote]

He voted against peace, the others voted for it.

[Damaen]

Last night I voted against Boston pizza while my wife voted for it. On my way to Boston pizza I could help but realize GRE government functions better than my marriage.

[Edifice]

Solution: Ram can stay at war if he wishes?

But really this signature issue is so stupid, IRON probably should just remove it lest Gramlins start arguing that this is an example of IRON's evil imperialism

[Gamemaster1]

Well, Ram and MPK have to have [i]something[/i] to complain about.

Don't try and blame it on Peron, Matthew.

[Lackistan]

Just noticed this. A few points:

1) Sad day, though it has been inevitable for a long time.

2) Harmlins was not a vow of commitment. Harmlins was a statement of commitment between two friends. One of those friends has since changed so drastically, there is literally nothing remaining of the connection. Not only was MHA correct in canceling, they should have done so as soon as it was evident that there was no coming back for the gRamlins.

3) So Ram didn't want his signature on the white peace? Tough luck, he lost the vote.

4) Best wishes to MHA

5) Gramlins, please pull the plug. Sooner the better, let Gramlins die with some semblance of dignity remaining.

[hilowe]

I agree with all of the points written by Lackistan, just gotta take a small exception with one.

[quote name='Lackistan' timestamp='1281021194' post='2401679']
...let Gramlins die with some semblance of dignity remaining.
[/quote]

They lost any and all dignity they had with their "unconditional surrender or die" bit.

[Cable77]

[quote name='Damaen' timestamp='1281018952' post='2401658']
Last night I voted against Boston pizza while my wife voted for it. On my way to Boston pizza I could help but realize GRE government functions better than my marriage.[/quote]

I hope that it didn't have a red sauce so you could have a white piece.

Thank you to those of you who have been understanding regarding this difficult situation. We believe MHA will emerge from this stronger than ever, despite the words of the naysayers.

[Necromancer V4L]

Good luck moving on from this MHA. I know the controversy surrounding this form of treaty is high, and I know also that you will raise above it.

[Damaen]

Cable,

She forced me to sit there and eat and eat even tho dinner was clearly over. All my friends had finished, everyone said to just leave BP. Bolognese sauce, everywhere! Finally i signed the bill (she wouldn't sign- huge drama in the house now) and we left. That's all that matters i guess. I know, this marriage was supposed to be forever...

[Zangmonkey]

[quote name='Gamemaster1' timestamp='1281021128' post='2401678']
Well, Ram and MPK have to have [i]something[/i] to complain about.

Don't try and blame it on Peron, Matthew.
[/quote]

I really don't care how it happened; if it was Mike/Ertyy who authorized the signature then Ram should take it up with them.
The point isn't who said what about signatures; I was merely pointing out that the unauthorized use of signatures can be frowned upon.

EDIT: Changed some content

Edited August 5, 2010 by Matthew PK

[Haflinger]

[quote name='Matthew PK' timestamp='1281047624' post='2402072']
The point isn't who said what about signatures; I was merely pointing out that the unauthorized use of signatures is typically frowned upon.
[/quote]
Actually, no it's not. I think it should be, but lots of alliances do this.

[Gamemaster1]

[quote name='Matthew PK' timestamp='1281047624' post='2402072']
I really don't care how it happened; if it was Mike/Ertyy who authorized the signature then Ram should take it up with them.
The point isn't who said what about signatures; I was merely pointing out that the unauthorized use of signatures can be frowned upon.

EDIT: Changed some content
[/quote]
If it was Mike and Ertyy, Ram should take it up with them and you [i]shouldn't[/i] be taking it up with us all over the forums.

[AAAAAAAAAAGGGG]

Good decision doing this, MHA. Hey, at least Gramlins are paperless now!

[madspartus]

[quote name='Damaen' timestamp='1281018952' post='2401658']
Last night I voted against Boston pizza while my wife voted for it. On my way to Boston pizza I could help but realize GRE government functions better than my marriage.
[/quote]


i bet you still signed in the end too

[mythicknight]

[quote name='Lackistan' timestamp='1281021194']
3) So Ram didn't want his signature on the white peace? Tough luck, he lost the vote.
[/quote]

This. My names been on a few things I didn't like, I'm sure the same for other people/alliances. Protip RAM: stop crying and dealwithit.gif

Edit:

[quote name='Damaen' timestamp='1280954883' post='2400972']
Sorry, apparently iPhones don't allow me to quote or edit.
[/quote]

With the mobile skin you have to tap the post to quote or edit it, like I'm doing now >_>

Edited August 6, 2010 by mythicknight

[shilo]

[quote name='Gamemaster1' timestamp='1281050668' post='2402107']
If it was Mike and Ertyy, Ram should take it up with them and you [i]shouldn't[/i] be taking it up with us all over the forums.
[/quote]
This. But considering the posting style in the other much larger thread, the subtle hints that someone may have done something wrong with the backtracking in the next post is the usual posting pattern. Not subtle enough though...

[Moridin]

[quote name='mythicknight' timestamp='1281068533' post='2402412']
This. My names been on a few things I didn't like, I'm sure the same for other people/alliances. Protip RAM: stop crying and dealwithit.gif
[/quote]

I believe this varies from alliance to alliance. When I was in Polar, anyone in government who wanted to sign a treaty could, and likewise anyone who didn't want to sign was in no way obligated to. The only signature that was required was the Emperor's. For less autocratic alliances this might not be possible, and not knowing how what Grämlins' policy is about this (if there even is a policy, given they've gone 'paperless') I can't say whether putting Ramirus' signature on there was the correct move. However, one shouldn't assume someone in another government is signing a document.

Edited August 6, 2010 by Moridin

[Alexander Napoleon]

So if i post here will i get into trouble?

[hizzy]

[quote name='Alexander Napoleon' timestamp='1311614728' post='2763479']
So if i post here will i get into trouble?
[/quote]

i'd say your chances are pretty fair.

[trance addict]

[quote name='Alexander Napoleon' timestamp='1311614728' post='2763479']
So if i post here will i get into trouble?
[/quote]


Only if you're caught.

Edited July 25, 2011 by trance addict

[Buds The Man]

WOW grave dig here i though Gramlins and MHA were signing again.

[Ashoka the Great]

[quote name='trance addict' timestamp='1311615618' post='2763487']
Only if your caught.
[/quote]

His caught....what?

Don't keep me in suspense like that.