Where is Aircastle?

[Blue Lightning]

[quote name='lonewolfe2015' date='21 May 2010 - 09:26 PM' timestamp='1274473596' post='2307208']
Well you guys fought them, why don't you compile evidence of their fighting ability for all of us to see then?

There are other alliances which have similar growth, build and guides and do everything unified and are not doing anything wrong as you appear to trying to smear their name further.

Come on, get your war records and prove to us once and for all the claims TOP has been laying down. I'm tired of seeing you guys bring up threads about a dead alliance and further trying to hurt their already dead reputation. It's not right.
[/quote]
If we do any of that we'll get warned. We're not allowed to point out blatant cheating, even though we have heaps of evidence, because the admin/mod team forbid it. We suggested Aircastle were multies to moderation, provided evidence and they found no foul play. We remain convinced, but there is nothing more we can do.

I'm glad to see the back of him.

[commander thrawn]

[quote name='Blue Lightning' date='22 May 2010 - 01:20 AM' timestamp='1274487590' post='2307443']
If we do any of that we'll get warned. We're not allowed to point out blatant cheating, even though we have heaps of evidence, because the admin/mod team forbid it. We suggested Aircastle were multies to moderation, provided evidence and they found no foul play. We remain convinced, but there is nothing more we can do.

I'm glad to see the back of him.
[/quote]

LW didn't ask you to point out evidence of cheating, he asked you to point out their lack of effectiveness/skill at playing the game. Comepile your war stats and show why they were overrated etc.

As to your complaining about cheating, well the result is the same isn't it? Aircastle is gone, so why do you care so much? Perhaps you should just listen to the mod team in the future and not whine about it.

[Blue Lightning]

We have all the data on our boards but I'm not going to bother compiling it into a post just to please you (it would take me hours). Anyone who watched the war saw that he was just turtling against us. He declared war, nuked us a few times to keep us in anarchy and did literally nothing else.

The damage we took as a result of this alleged cheating is what makes us "whine". If you were playing chess and found your opponent had been sneaking your pieces off the board when you weren't looking, you'd probably consider yourself fairly hard done by within the context of the game. Our nations were damaged, our war effort was sabotaged and if it was the result of cheating then I think we have every right to be upset about it.

[SiCkO]

[quote name='Tromp' date='21 May 2010 - 02:42 PM' timestamp='1274478113' post='2307284']
Fixed.
[/quote]

As the President of FOK, you speak for the alliance. If you don't want your alliance to be judged on what you say, don't say it.

[tekken]

lol multis

Yeah I said it.

[commander thrawn]

[quote name='Blue Lightning' date='22 May 2010 - 02:01 AM' timestamp='1274490097' post='2307475']
We have all the data on our boards but I'm not going to bother compiling it into a post just to please you (it would take me hours). Anyone who watched the war saw that he was just turtling against us. He declared war, nuked us a few times to keep us in anarchy and did literally nothing else.

The damage we took as a result of this alleged cheating is what makes us "whine". If you were playing chess and found your opponent had been sneaking your pieces off the board when you weren't looking, you'd probably consider yourself fairly hard done by within the context of the game. Our nations were damaged, our war effort was sabotaged and if it was the result of cheating then I think we have every right to be upset about it.
[/quote]


You really shouldn't do this. Just a suggestion.

If you don't want to compile stats that's fine, but it certainly vindicates some of your detractors, and weakens your argument. But stay on topic and don't break rules please.

[Tromp]

[quote name='SiCkO' date='22 May 2010 - 03:02 AM' timestamp='1274490155' post='2307477']
As the President of FOK, you speak for the alliance. If you don't want your alliance to be judged on what you say, don't say it.
[/quote]
This is an OOC forum.

Read the rules of this board, SiCkO.

[flak attack]

[quote name='Bob Janova' date='21 May 2010 - 05:21 PM' timestamp='1274476882' post='2307261']
Did anyone ever see any of them except John? I know he was the only one that posted here. I don't have access to the Citadel boards any more to see what was going on back then.
[/quote]
I talked to two of them and neither one was John Ron. Some of us actually do bother to thank the people that are helping us out.

[Neo Uruk]

[quote name='Blue Lightning' date='21 May 2010 - 08:01 PM' timestamp='1274490097' post='2307475']
We have all the data on our boards but I'm not going to bother compiling it into a post just to please you (it would take me hours). Anyone who watched the war saw that he was just turtling against us. He declared war, nuked us a few times to keep us in anarchy and did literally nothing else.[/quote]
Your constant use of "him" doesn't show anything but bias, which indicates that Aircastle wasn't as bad as you say.

[quote]The damage we took as a result of this alleged cheating is what makes us "whine". If you were playing chess and found your opponent had been sneaking your pieces off the board when you weren't looking, you'd probably consider yourself fairly hard done by within the context of the game. Our nations were damaged, our war effort was sabotaged and if it was the result of cheating then I think we have every right to be upset about it.
[/quote]
Your war effort wasn't sabotaged by Aircastle. It was your inefficient planning that did you in. How could you not notice that practically everyone important was aligned in some way to CnG.
[quote name='Blue Lightning' date='21 May 2010 - 07:20 PM' timestamp='1274487590' post='2307443']
I'm glad to see the back of him.
[/quote]
I'm sure I speak for a lot of people when I say I'll be glad to see the back of TOP.

[lonewolfe2015]

Look, have issues all you want with them, but stop bringing it to the peanut gallery. The debate is tireless, pointless, and frankly reflecting poorly on TOP for their apparent whining over a long past war.

I don't care if you think Aircastle was a bunch of creampuffs or a single creampuff, but why do you need to continue a debate on an alliance now gone?

Do we put up discussions on other alliances which go the way of the dodo bird, or should I be expecting TOP to in the future?

If you won't put up any sort of stats or a few clips of stats, that's fine, but don't expect us to care or believe you at face value.

As for the "Leaders speak for their alliances in all manners" thrown into this thread, why? When I speak for Asgaard, I say I am, as do many other leaders. When we're speaking personally, objectively or putting our opinions out we shouldn't have to emphasize that every single time.

[Feanor Noldorin]

[quote name='Rey the Great' date='21 May 2010 - 08:57 PM' timestamp='1274493424' post='2307517']
I'm sure I speak for a lot of people when I say I'll be glad to see the back of TOP.
[/quote]
Indeed.

Now, it seems some people are confusing the opinions of a few TOP members in an OOC forum for the official opinion of the alliance as a whole. If you want our official opinion on the matter (the destruction/disbandment/whatever of Aircastle) I would be glad to give it to you. Until then please make sure to remember the difference between our members opinions and that of the alliance's.

Edited May 22, 2010 by Feanor Noldorin

[commander thrawn]

[quote name='Feanor Noldorin' date='22 May 2010 - 03:10 AM' timestamp='1274494200' post='2307533']
Indeed.

Now, it seems some people are confusing the opinions of a few TOP members in an OOC forum for the official opinion of the alliance as a whole. If you want our official opinion on the matter (the destruction/disbandment/whatever of Aircastle) I would be glad to give it to you. Until then please make sure to remember the difference between our members opinions and that of the alliance's.
[/quote]


We only want the official stance if it has any bearing, but I think many would find your official stance a political hypocrisy at best.

But please, enlighten us.

[Yevgeni Luchenkov]

I kinda appreciate the double standard: if the President of FOK (using you as an example, Tromp) speaks here, he's but a member. A few of us speak their mind and it's suddenly "TOP making a thread", "TOP whining", etc.

[quote]The debate is tireless, pointless, and frankly reflecting poorly on TOP for their apparent whining over a long past war.[/quote]
The war has been over for six weeks, going into the seventh. Let's not get ahead of ourselves.

[quote]We only want the official stance if it has any bearing, but I think many would find your official stance a political hypocrisy at best. [/quote]
Nothing official but I'd say that OOC, I'm neutral to their disparition. IC, I'm rejoicing. I don't think our official stance - IC wise - would be hypocrit in any way.

[commander thrawn]

[quote name='Yevgeni Luchenkov' date='22 May 2010 - 03:47 AM' timestamp='1274496427' post='2307582']
I kinda appreciate the double standard: if the President of FOK (using you as an example, Tromp) speaks here, he's but a member. A few of us speak their mind and it's suddenly "TOP making a thread", "TOP whining", etc.


The war has been over for six weeks, going into the seventh. Let's not get ahead of ourselves.


Nothing official but I'd say that OOC, I'm neutral to their disparition. IC, I'm rejoicing. I don't think our official stance - IC wise - would be hypocrit in any way.
[/quote]


I think that its idiotic to assume that an alliance is not judged based on the statements of its members, govt or otherwise, FOK's president's views are factored into the general views of FOK as an alliance, whether IC or OOC. I fully expect people to judge Asgaard based on what I say or LW or any of our govt or members. That is why I speak carefully. Thus I see the common ploy of saying "it isn't our official stance, just the views of our members" to be highly hypocritical. There is certain leeway of course, but consistent disparity between official and unofficial stances leads to problems.

[Believland]

I'm glad someone made the trip to mount doom.

Lonewolf, AC sucked at war. If you want proof go to the propaganda thread and it states that AC's members had 0 soldiers. They were just a bunch of turtles who like to brag about slots filled in war. And quit that pro gamer crap, IIRC AC came from an economic forum. And please don't say BN's are like them. That's an insult to them.

[commander thrawn]

[quote name='Believland' date='22 May 2010 - 05:16 AM' timestamp='1274501748' post='2307689']
I'm glad someone made the trip to mount doom.

Lonewolf, AC sucked at war. If you want proof go to the propaganda thread and it states that AC's members had 0 soldiers. They were just a bunch of turtles who like to brag about slots filled in war. And quit that pro gamer crap, IIRC AC came from an economic forum. And please don't say BN's are like them. That's an insult to them.
[/quote]


Asgaard and BN are very close friends, yes BN are much more effective at war but they do have similar traits in many ways to AC, very planned and similar building for one. Turtling can be an effective strategy, but LW was merely asking for some statistics to back up the claims. That's fair isn't it?

[Esquire]

[quote name='tekken' date='21 May 2010 - 09:13 PM' timestamp='1274490771' post='2307481']
lol multis

Yeah I said it.
[/quote]

And a full warning you - as well as any others that go there - get.

Last reminder: http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=86259&view=findpost&p=2307051

[shahenshah]

Aircastle fades away, TOP prevails, Gratz to our allies o\ TOP SPEED.

[JackSkellington]

[quote name='shahenshah' date='22 May 2010 - 04:06 AM' timestamp='1274515595' post='2307845']
Aircastle fades away, TOP prevails, Gratz to our allies o\ TOP SPEED.
[/quote]

Congrats are in order I suppose?

[shahenshah]

[quote name='JackSkellington' date='22 May 2010 - 01:33 PM' timestamp='1274517173' post='2307853']
Congrats are in order I suppose?
[/quote]

Its sad when so many extremely competent members suddenly leave bob, but gratz to allies are necessary.

[JackSkellington]

[quote name='shahenshah' date='22 May 2010 - 04:35 AM' timestamp='1274517333' post='2307854']
Its sad when so many extremely competent members suddenly leave bob, but gratz to allies are necessary.
[/quote]

I'm asking why you find congrats are in order

Edited May 22, 2010 by JackSkellington

[Tromp]

[quote name='Yevgeni Luchenkov' date='22 May 2010 - 04:47 AM' timestamp='1274496427' post='2307582']
I kinda appreciate the double standard: if the President of FOK (using you as an example, Tromp) speaks here, he's but a member. A few of us speak their mind and it's suddenly "TOP making a thread", "TOP whining", etc.
[/quote]
I agree with you Yev. It is stupid to take the opinion of individual members as that of the whole alliance. Just as it is stupid to say I'm speaking as my IC character in an OOC forum.

[Believland]

[quote name='commander thrawn' date='22 May 2010 - 12:24 AM' timestamp='1274502262' post='2307697']
Asgaard and BN are very close friends, yes BN are much more effective at war but they do have similar traits in many ways to AC, very planned and similar building for one. Turtling can be an effective strategy, but LW was merely asking for some statistics to back up the claims. That's fair isn't it?
[/quote]
Ah yeah. I remembered that after posting and was on my itouch so, I really didn't want to go through the hassle of editing it. And yes, BN is very organized and some p. cool folks. Turtling is only an effective strategy when you are at a disadvantage due to size of nation/warxhest and what not. Also I gave him a place where he can find some of the stats. Sure it's not much, but it's something.

[quote name='Tromp' date='22 May 2010 - 06:09 AM' timestamp='1274522954' post='2307876']
I agree with you Yev. It is stupid to take the opinion of individual members as that of the whole alliance. Just as it is stupid to say I'm speaking as my IC character in an OOC forum.
[/quote]
You always speak for yourself ic unless you're in the water cooler. This is ooc discussionabout ic things. You take the same views as you do ic as you do here.

[Tromp]

[quote name='Believland' date='22 May 2010 - 02:29 PM' timestamp='1274531375' post='2307914']
You always speak [b]for yourself[/b] ic unless you're in the water cooler. This is ooc discussionabout ic things. You take the same views as you do ic as you do here.
[/quote]
I think that was the point.

[Believland]

[quote name='Tromp' date='22 May 2010 - 08:38 AM' timestamp='1274531881' post='2307919']
I think that was the point.
[/quote]
I think you should read the whole post, duder. And yes leadership, especially elected leaders, speak for their alliance. The people elect you to make the right choices and to speak for them.