Imperial Decree - New Polar Order

[Lord Curzon]

Except that RoK *also* has a tie to NpO. So....

I'd like to address this cause I don't think that really changes anything. Correct me if I am wrong, but RoK has a MDoAP with both, which means in a treaty conflict there are a couple of options

1) Stay neutral and not define an aggressor or defender, perfectly acceptable given the friendships, ect.

2) Define NpO as the aggressor, neglect to activate the optional part of the treaty, while defining \m/ as the Defender thus mandating defense.

3) Do #2 reversed

So the concept that RoK is somehow not to be involved is I think a bit of a narrow conception of treaties. RoK should be under just as much scrutiny as PC with respect to how they should respond.

[F15pilotX]

So you're saying that Polar is basically the same as the Unjust Path? That's not exactly stellar praise coming from you.

Rather, he finds it ironic that \m/ is all pissed about it being turned around on them, I do believe.

[Wizardess]

Arguably, that's the only CB that's ever existed.

Yes and thats a CB that \M/ always excelled at giving people, personally I've always considered \M/ to be the Jackel's of CN. They were extinguished the first time for perpetuating atrocities unequaled on planet Bob, up to and including demanding "Real World" monetary pay offs for "In Game" protection. All the while hiding behind Initiative and later Unjust backing. Now there back, and people in good faith give them space to be, and to become something better. But so far they only used their renewed life, to again bring misery to others, and to once again spread the stink of their "Bling" arrogance, as only they are capable.

You do what you always did, you get what you always got, and though it probably wont be this time, mark that it comes.

And surely it comes quickly.

Edited January 21, 2010 by Wizardess

[WarriorConcept]

My argument is that it doesn't matter.

I guess logic needs a citation now?

No, arguments need proof to back them up. And you don't have any.

Clearly whatever was done was not enough.

I haven't seen anyone claim that \m/'s apology wasn't sincere enough

No, what I'm saying is that you're all over the place trying to find any nook and cranny to argue your position of "Omg Grub = Walford, hypocritical villain, etc" from. And it's showing.

No, you're just mad you have nothing to back up your claims when called out on them.

[Earogema]

I'd like to address this cause I don't think that really changes anything. Correct me if I am wrong, but RoK has a MDoAP with both, which means in a treaty conflict there are a couple of options

1) Stay neutral and not define an aggressor or defender, perfectly acceptable given the friendships, ect.

2) Define NpO as the aggressor, neglect to activate the optional part of the treaty, while defining \m/ as the Defender thus mandating defense.

3) Do #2 reversed

So the concept that RoK is somehow not to be involved is I think a bit of a narrow conception of treaties. RoK should be under just as much scrutiny as PC with respect to how they should respond.

This is usually my opinion on these issues as well. The defense is mandatory, or the aggression.

But that never seems to be the case, and I'm fine with Rok staying out.

[Dochartaigh]

So you're saying that Polar is basically the same as the Unjust Path? That's not exactly stellar praise coming from you.

no that is not what i said though thanks for trying. i stated that \m/ should not cry since they backed this very CB during the UjW. Polaris did not cry, whine, moan, nor complain about the CB. we just put on our boots and went to war.

but again, thanks for trying to twist what i said into something i did not say. it almost worked.

[TehChron]

No, arguments need proof to back them up. And you don't have any.

I havn't been making an argument, I've been railing against yours.

You should really learn to pay attention.

I haven't seen anyone claim that \m/'s apology wasn't sincere enough

Er, you need to pay attention to this thread then.

No, you're just mad you have nothing to back up your claims when called out on them.

Clearly \m/ did something to piss Grub off. I mean, he's clearly declared war on them, right?

Have I claimed anything else? At least Im not making up a timeline, or implying false connections based on shallow recollections of days gone by.

[arch3004]

IMO, NpO didn't Declared on PC because they didnt want to invite FOK! and Umbrella to come to PC'S aid on an instant..if that's happen, Polar will be bleeding all over they're body..

that's why they want to play safe just by Declaring On \m/, indeed by declaring on \m/ they might invite PC to the battle too, but then again i doubt that PC will bring FOK! and Umbrella on an instant...

am i right daddy ??

Nope, not it at all. It had to do with PC/NpO diplomacy that kept them from attacki.....owai, keep forgetting they never talked to us.

Seriously, if your going to use diplomacy as the reason to attack one alliance and not the other then at least talk with all alliances involved. Until then, stop using it as an excuse and just admit that you didn't want a certain alliances friends to get involved.

[nippy]

personally I've always considered \M/ to be the Jackel's of CN.

That makes GOONS the hyenas of Bob.

[Caliph]

it worked for Genmay in declaring on BotS to get the UjW started. seems that GOONS and \m/, at least their former incarnations, did not mind that CB so much when they used it last.

That war would have occured wether or not Genmay used that CB or if GGA used their "CB" on GOONS.

Hell if we want to brign up history, we can claim that GGA sees protecting random unaligns who just happen to be on their "roster" against their enemies, because, you know, thats how GGA entered that war.

If you want to bring up ancient history and all ...

[F15pilotX]

Nope, not it at all. It had to do with PC/NpO diplomacy that kept them from attacki.....owai, keep forgetting they never talked to us.

Seriously, if your going to use diplomacy as the reason to attack one alliance and not the other then at least talk with all alliances involved. Until then, stop using it as an excuse and just admit that you didn't want a certain alliances friends to get involved.

So anyway, when are ya'll planning on backing up your treaty? I hear a lot of talking and no action.

[Wizardess]

That makes GOONS the hyenas of Bob.

Well if you say so.

My advice then would be to keep on laughing.

[erikz]

Using fake morality to create a CB for a situation that was actually resolved stinks.

Well.... have fun fighting each other.

[omfghi2u2]

So anyway, when are ya'll planning on backing up your treaty? I hear a lot of talking and no action.

Probably waiting 6 days for enough allies.

-omfg

[WarriorConcept]

I havn't been making an argument, I've been railing against yours.

You should really learn to pay attention.

You've been railing against my argument to try and point out this magical "reason" to need to talk to \m/ while not being able to provide a reason.

Er, you need to pay attention to this thread then.

I'm paying plenty attention.

Clearly \m/ did something to piss Grub off. I mean, he's clearly declared war on them, right?

Have I claimed anything else? At least Im not making up a timeline, or implying false connections based on shallow recollections of days gone by.

What timeline have I made up? Feel free to back that up.

[Fantastico]

I don't know your ways and I won't pretend to. I can't comment on the past this community has shared, because I don't even completely understand it's present, but I promise if you want there to be a future standards must be set. This conflict has many chapters and many more pages missing that I will probably never understand, but what I don't understand is why? Why are so many so eager to support \m/. Bigotry, racism, the holocaust are not things to be made jokes of. Some have claimed that if you don't want to hear it don't be around it, but why? Why is it so acceptable to you as individuals that instead of calling a spade, spade. You parade around it like a medal to be shown proudly. Even within the attempted apology there was no sincerity, the whole thing was made out to be a joke and those who were hurt by it were the ones being persecuted. You don't find it offensive when racist words are used, when others make jokes at the expense of one racial group, but it hurt somebody. I don't mean a physical pain, no your words won't cause blood, but sometimes the tongue is mightier than the sword. Instead of asking yourself does this offend me, ask yourself at who's expense am I having this cheap laugh. I don't understand this game yet, but I am learning to. I don't know your culture and with what I have read about alliances like \m/. I am not sure I want to. I suppose I should consider myself lucky to have joined an alliance that has morals and a back bone. I am proud that my alliance has such a knowledgeable members that have flooded to praise our allies in Polaris, but I think tonight I am most honored that the people of the New Polar Order have marched to war for a cause and a just one at that.

Hail my allies, New Polar Order.

Very nicely stated.

May our crazy little world here benefit from more of your sensibility and decency.

[arch3004]

So anyway, when are ya'll planning on backing up your treaty? I hear a lot of talking and no action.

You're new here aren't you?

[Wizardess]

Probably waiting 6 days for enough allies.

-omfg

Well I hope they don't analyze it to death, I grow impatient very easily.

[TehChron]

You've been railing against my argument to try and point out this magical "reason" to need to talk to \m/ while not being able to provide a reason.

I don't need to. What happened is what happened, why would I speculate on something I don't know about?

I'm paying plenty attention.

Then you'd notice the sincerity of that apology has been called into question several times.

What timeline have I made up? Feel free to back that up.

So you admit to implying false connections intentionally?

[F15pilotX]

You're new here aren't you?

You know how to read dates, correct?

[Dochartaigh]

So you're not gonna say it instead you're going to make some witty comment about this being repetitive just because you don't want to say what you want to say?

actually, while the actions are somewhat similar, they cannot be called one in the same. Polaris has yet to try to act like the world police despite all the crying they have done so.

for one, if they were the world police, as CNARF was attempting to do, they would have declared on Athens and FoB but instead, CnG handled that situation in house. they would have gone after GOONS but that was also handled through diplomacy. PC, honestly i have no clue about this one so i cannot comment on it.

but fact is, they did not go after the other alliances who have tech-raided micro-alliances. thus, the whole "world police" argument fails right there. it seems many cannot follow this logic. that is the first way that Polaris cannot be compared to CNARF.

the second way is that Polaris has never, nor do they here, attempt to state that all tech raiding will be met with force. thus, again it cannot be compared to CNARF.

three, Polaris is an alliance and CNARF hid amongst none and one man AAs as well as (possibly) other alliances in order to ensure that no one knew who they were and thus, they could remain hidden. Polaris is not attempting to hide from anyone. so a third way your comparing them to CNARF fails.

fourth, CNARF/Walford made thread after thread and post after post declaring the evils of tech raiding. Polaris has only done that on two occasions. The KoN raid and the FoA raid. Polaris is not attempting to change anyone's mind on tech raiding unaligned just on tech raiding alliances. so again, this one is more similar but in the end still fails when you compare the goals of CNARF and the goals of Polaris.

so that is four ways that your comparison of Polaris and CNARF fails WC. can this useless argument be dropped now?

[AlmightyGrub]

Im n ot complaining about him attacking, I am great with it, but I will call it out when someone trys to make it into some devine crusade for the betterment of Planet Bob, it was merely so Grub could save face.

I actually find you to be a very intelligent and perceptive person... but my face was all okay by itself. You want to call me out then act surprised when I answer? Not my face that needs saving. You say I am bluffing, I say I am not and here we are. But thanks for the concern about my image, when I need advice on such I won't be coming to \m/ for the advice.

I have seen your references to my massive ego etc etc, I can deal with it, maybe I am a conceited self righteous knob, but I am still right.

[arch3004]

You know how to read dates, correct?

Good, then you should already know the answer.

[SpiderJerusalem]

I hope this will end swiftly. Good luck to both our allies

[Wizardess]

I actually find you to be a very intelligent and perceptive person... but my face was all okay by itself. You want to call me out then act surprised when I answer? Not my face that needs saving. You say I am bluffing, I say I am not and here we are. But thanks for the concern about my image, when I need advice on such I won't be coming to \m/ for the advice.

I have seen your references to my massive ego etc etc, I can deal with it, maybe I am a conceited self righteous knob, but I am still right.

Indeed you are.