The Unjust War

[Terry Howard]

Sad that most opinions now seem to be based on \m/ last 2 months alive, when most of its original leadership was gone (myself included). It is also sad that those opinions are blown so far out of proportion, but that's beside the point. \m/ was going through a transition period where it was very vulnerable, which just happened to be when the UJW struck. The timing was awful. Given another month, I believe things would have been a lot different. But that's what people remember, and one short period in \m/'s history is what dozens of people base their entire opinion of the alliance on. Ridiculous.

\M/ and GOONS where like the playground bullies lol Not saying thats a bad thing really. They made the game fun and interesting.

I See 2007 as the golden age of CN.

[Starfox101]

>_< was better.

[Essenia]

\M/ and GOONS where like the playground bullies lol Not saying thats a bad thing really. They made the game fun and interesting.

I See 2007 as the golden age of CN.

Golden ages are subjective. 2007 was pretty awesome in some ways and pretty darn bad in others.

[Caliph]

In my opinion, it was from the time LE and Zam joined, through LE/R's bannings. That was an epic period.

Before then, we were a struggling small alliance with an epic name; afterward, we were s massive sanctioned alliance with no clear direction or solid leadership.

We could be honest with ourselves here. \m/ was awesome, but we lacked organization, which didnt really hurt us until our best leaders were banned.

Our banks were non existent. Our wartime strategy consisted of "find someone attacking our allies and attack them".

The attitude was great, but there were a lot of problems from \m/ members who were let in when we became sanctioned and a household name, who joined for the fame and the ability to be asshats to everyone they wanted.

We had good members, but they were overshadowed by a few of the outspoken asshats we allowed in.

[Heft]

There wasn't anything incredibly special about \m/, positive or negative, that no other alliance could claim. Obviously those who were members and enjoyed the community remember it fondly. The main issue is that the memories of \m/ (and this is probably true of most former and well known alliances, but \m/ gets brought up more than most) have been exaggerated and stretched, both the good and bad. Those who were there remember it through subjective hindsight and such things, and those who weren't only know it through the inflated discussions and associations about it. I never particularly liked the alliance, but they weren't the spawn of satan or whatever.

[ChairmanHal]

To be fair, it has been noted that \m/ might well have gotten real terms if it had continued to fight; I am frankly not qualified to judge that statement though I certainly have an opinion on it.

If I thought that had been true for even a milisecond, I would have let Legion finish ZIing me.

I know that fiction has been circulating for a while--that "real" terms were forthcoming. That is historical revisionism, pure and simple.

It should be also noted that I urged Sponge to reconsider his stand based on the billions in cash and tech his alliance would lose in rebuilding assets by not allowing us to have legitimate terms. Instead, he stuck with the b.s. over the top roleplay evil overlord act. He simply would rather his alliance take significantly longer rebuilding than consider it. So that is what he got and what the members of Polaris got.

EDIT: Lord Swampy stood by and watched all this take place, saying nothing. He had it in his power to make a suggestion, offer to mediate, hell even blink yes or no and instead he sat silently through almost the entire proceedings. If I have issue to Sponge over the events of Sept. 2007, I have just as many with Lord Swampy.

Edited August 6, 2009 by ChairmanHal

[ChairmanHal]

There wasn't anything incredibly special about \m/, positive or negative, that no other alliance could claim. Obviously those who were members and enjoyed the community remember it fondly. The main issue is that the memories of \m/ (and this is probably true of most former and well known alliances, but \m/ gets brought up more than most) have been exaggerated and stretched, both the good and bad. Those who were there remember it through subjective hindsight and such things, and those who weren't only know it through the inflated discussions and associations about it. I never particularly liked the alliance, but they weren't the spawn of satan or whatever.

Oh...we rolled. \m/>_<\m/

Make no mistake we were right fine pirates and gangstas and warriors and proud of it. But indeed, we also had our faults as does every alliance that deserves to be called one.

At one time I would have moved heaven and earth for a reunion. It became pretty clear however that even things that merely resembled \m/ were subject to plots being made against them (including Browncoats, which was kinda weird...). It was understood when I got to Ragnarok that Polaris wanted us dead, or at least Sponge did anyway. Truth be told that was part of why Hoo was always on top of foreign affairs and made it his personal duty. There would simply be no reunion, not for a very, very very long time.

Could it still happen? Problem is that so many of us have left the game it would be a challenge even to bring enough people together from the "old gang" to reform. Even those that may be willing to leave where they are now were divided during the Karma War and I would envision any number of arguments breaking out even before a revised charter could be written. That said...I can't rule it out anymore. It's been long enough now.

Edited August 6, 2009 by ChairmanHal

[nicktheww2fanatic]

I was Atlantis gov at the time

[Comrade Goby]

>_< was better.

>_< doesn't have that name brand recognition like \m/ though....

[Beauty]

I was in GOONS, Just a member though. I still wish we would of won . It was sad leaving the GOONS AA.

[Heft]

If I thought that had been true for even a milisecond, I would have let Legion finish ZIing me.

I know that fiction has been circulating for a while--that "real" terms were forthcoming. That is historical revisionism, pure and simple.

It should be also noted that I urged Sponge to reconsider his stand based on the billions in cash and tech his alliance would lose in rebuilding assets by not allowing us to have legitimate terms. Instead, he stuck with the b.s. over the top roleplay evil overlord act. He simply would rather his alliance take significantly longer rebuilding than consider it. So that is what he got and what the members of Polaris got.

EDIT: Lord Swampy stood by and watched all this take place, saying nothing. He had it in his power to make a suggestion, offer to mediate, hell even blink yes or no and instead he sat silently through almost the entire proceedings. If I have issue to Sponge over the events of Sept. 2007, I have just as many with Lord Swampy.

Yea, it's a good thing NPO accepted terms right away, because there's no way Karma would have lifted that two week Peace Mode attack clause.

Oh...we rolled. \m/>_<\m/

Make no mistake we were right fine pirates and gangstas and warriors and proud of it. But indeed, we also had our faults as does every alliance that deserves to be called one.

At one time I would have moved heaven and earth for a reunion. It became pretty clear however that even things that merely resembled \m/ were subject to plots being made against them (including Browncoats, which was kinda weird...). It was understood when I got to Ragnarok that Polaris wanted us dead, or at least Sponge did anyway. Truth be told that was part of why Hoo was always on top of foreign affairs and made it his personal duty. There would simply be no reunion, not for a very, very very long time.

Could it still happen? Problem is that so many of us have left the game it would be a challenge even to bring enough people together from the "old gang" to reform. Even those that may be willing to leave where they are now were divided during the Karma War and I would envision any number of arguments breaking out even before a revised charter could be written. That said...I can't rule it out anymore. It's been long enough now.

To be fair plenty of people dislike(d) RoK for reasons completely unrelated to \m/. Browncoats too. In any case, I'm sure \m/ had it's strengths, but it wasn't some magical alliance, just another face in the Initiative/UJP crowd.

[Master Hakai]

To be fair plenty of people dislike(d) RoK for reasons completely unrelated to \m/. Browncoats too. In any case, I'm sure \m/ had it's strengths, but it wasn't some magical alliance, just another face in the Initiative/UJP crowd.

I disagree, it was magical in a lot of ways.

[ChairmanHal]

Yea, it's a good thing NPO accepted terms right away, because there's no way Karma would have lifted that two week Peace Mode attack clause.

Not really comparable situations though I can see where you think they might be. Only a very small minority of individuals involved with Karma wanted NPO dead as an alliance. Sponge's pronouncement of capital punishment for \m/ on the other hand was barely protested. It was only in light of subsequent events and with a mellowing of attitudes that public opinion changed to be more favorable to \m/.

To be fair plenty of people dislike(d) RoK for reasons completely unrelated to \m/. Browncoats too. In any case, I'm sure \m/ had it's strengths, but it wasn't some magical alliance, just another face in the Initiative/UJP crowd.

Oh I am under no delusions that either Rok or BC were universally loved by all or that those that dislike(d) them did so for the same reasons. However, pre-Coalition War Polaris hated Rok mostly because it had "too many people from \m/ in it" and Sponge himself was quoted as calling Rok "\m/ 2.0". The joke around Browncoats was that we were \m/ 3.109389383. BC was counted as part of the list simply because we had a few former \m/ members (present company included) and that I as a former Triumvir of \m/ was in charge. The reality prior to the arrival of Schatt and some of the other infamous characters at BC was that it was run more like the ship "Firefly" from the TV series and it took a bit of getting used to.

[Seerow]

Sad that most opinions now seem to be based on \m/ last 2 months alive, when most of its original leadership was gone (myself included). It is also sad that those opinions are blown so far out of proportion, but that's beside the point. \m/ was going through a transition period where it was very vulnerable, which just happened to be when the UJW struck. The timing was awful. Given another month, I believe things would have been a lot different. But that's what people remember, and one short period in \m/'s history is what dozens of people base their entire opinion of the alliance on. Ridiculous.

Yes how ridiculous of me to make a judgement based on past experience and say that a horribly inefficient alliance whose attitude rubbed most of the game the wrong way wasn't the best thing to ever bless planet bob. Just ridiculous of me.

Honestly if you aren't a former member how can you know for sure? You may not like the attitude, but when \m/ was at its height it was run just as well as any other alliance, if not better.

As someone who was in military command during the UJW, I can say for 100% sure how unorganized they were during that conflict, and how badly they were $%&@ed for a long term war had it come to that.

Now, with the 'OOC attacks' thing that came up, and several key alliances pulling out, it wound up not mattering in the end. Everyone was left screwed and to try to find peace as quickly as possible as best they could. However had \m/ tried to continue fighting to get better terms, we would have seen them bleed far faster proportionally than the NPO did in this most recent war. They had no reserves. Not one member seemed to understand what a stagger was. Where the rest of us were preparing for a long drawn out nuclear war \m/ was going full on berserker with no warchests, reserves, or banks. It was an utter mess.

Really, even the \m/ members admit that their organization was subpar. How do you figure you can call me out just because I am not an ex \m/ member on something that is pretty much widely accepted as true?

If I had said something about not liking their attitude, their member base, or their habits, you might have a point. But you want to argue about one of the least structured war-centric alliances in history and claim they were as well run as anybody else? Don't make me laugh.

[Logan]

I fought for MK in that war from the initial wave. Still had a couple thousand infra to lose, shame everyone decided to pull out.

[Comrade Goby]

Really, even the \m/ members admit that their organization was subpar. How do you figure you can call me out just because I am not an ex \m/ member on something that is pretty much widely accepted as true?

If I had said something about not liking their attitude, their member base, or their habits, you might have a point. But you want to argue about one of the least structured war-centric alliances in history and claim they were as well run as anybody else? Don't make me laugh.

Nice job ignoring what you said bro. The post you quoted was bringing down all parts of \m/ including the community, attitude, and organization and you agreed with all of it. Don't make me laugh.

[linkkjm]

I was in \m/ at the time

Edited August 6, 2009 by linkkjm

[Chief Savage Man]

\m/ has gone down the tubes by that point. Our numbers spiked after GW3 and a lot of those newbies thought that \m/ was a place with no rules, a lulz alliance if you will. I can rattle off the names of stupid asses who plagued us during those months. The tech raiding thing became an attitude of hubris and stubbornness. The alliance was leaking decent people as the old guard got fed up with the !@#$%^&*. By the time the UJW came around, \m/ was a wreck. It was run by too few decent leaders and by too many retards. We even had banned member as MoFA for a little bit. Alliance members didn't follow orders and our war strategy was hardly even there.

[LOLtex]

UjP here. The only thing I really miss about UjP was the wit and Shark Week.

[Josh the Great]

I was in \m/ during the War and wished that we could of at least made it out alive.

[muffasamini]

Even though I am continually happy ~ won, and think it was the correct thing to occur. I think this game would be more interesting if the Unjust Highway alliances could have made it out alive.

I mean, many of them were asshats, but if they had been curbed, but not curbstomped by it, it might have been very interesting for this game

Edited August 7, 2009 by muffasamini

[Homura]

I was in NPO at the time. I'm not sure if we were on any one side or both sides, to be honest, although I was 100% for the Polar/GGA side from the start.

[Seerow]

Nice job ignoring what you said bro. The post you quoted was bringing down all parts of \m/ including the community, attitude, and organization and you agreed with all of it. Don't make me laugh.

The first post I quoted said it was ridiculous for me to make a judgement based on their last months of existence. I responded to that accordingly.

The part of my post you quoted was responding to someone telling me I had no right to judge \m/'s organization because I am not ex-\m/

But nice try.

[WarriorConcept]

I do not mind a little light-hearted shenanigans provided it is all in fun.

But it must not go too far this time.

The occasional semi-serious/semi-joke topic or alliance war surrender terms with a funny clause like post a picture of three lamps in your surrender post for example were some of the good lulz.

I like lulz when they are good clean fun that everyone can have a good laugh about and it enhances the game for all.

All things are good in moderation and lulz are no exception.

It's all subjective, don't impose your standards on the rest of the world thanks.

[James I]

I announced WAPA's withdrawal from BLEU - surely the turning point of the Unjust War?