Imperial Decree from the New Pacific Order

[Augustus Autumn]

Oh man TSI's terms were brutal, they had to sell tech!!! at market rates!!.

TSI is being paid for the tech they are giving. The TFO and IS are helping them rebuild with that money.

Point of fact, a signficant portion of the reparations being paid to The Forsaken Ones are not at market rates but at rates preferential to them (purchasing from them at 3mil/50 and selling to them at 3mil/150). Yes, the funds received during these preferential tech deals will be used for the purposes of rebuilding.

Again, I'll note the disregarding of Seerow's counterproprosal by the participants of this conversation in the interest of continued attempts to score points over one another.

[James Wilson]

That's just because they had someone get it locked for them by posting nude pictures. I think the NPO is much more noble then GGA and noble enough NOT to do that

Actually, that was Hell Scream. He isn't GGA...he just acts like them.

[MisterShadow]

Cause you spent 5 days in war mode and then ran right back into hippy mode. Forgive us for missing a nation or two when we have to focus on your more numerous smaller nations.

With so much emphasis on the top nations, the fact that you missed the largest nation is something else entirely. Especially after they had declared an offensive war. Also war doesnt last for 5 days.

[Haflinger]

I list the word below which implies things I did not say nor mean.

"rebuilds"

Remove the word rebuilds from that summary and you'll come closer to a true understanding. Then again, understanding what I'm talking about would probably require you to have a freaking clue about the events that led to this war, and it's become pretty clear that most of Karma doesn't.

edit: I am good grammarian

Edited June 14, 2009 by Haflinger

[King DrunkWino]

That's just because they had someone get it locked for them by posting nude pictures. I think the NPO is much more noble then GGA and noble enough NOT to do that

PACFICANS!!! Show your nobility and fall on your sword for your Emperor! Post nudes!

/think any of them will buy that?

[delendum]

I list the word below which implies things I did not say nor mean.

"rebuilds"

Remove the word rebuilds from that summary and you'll come closer to a true understanding. Then again, understanding what I'm talking about would probably require you to have a freaking clue about the events that led to this war, and it's become pretty clear that most of Karma doesn't.

edit: I am good grammarian

What led to this war has been the subject of countless debate. What has this got to do with the terms that have been offered, and the fact that they were rejected? Does the NPO feel the way war started was too unjust to warrant such huge reparations?

[Haflinger]

What led to this war has been the subject of countless debate. What has this got to do with the terms that have been offered, and the fact that they were rejected? Does the NPO feel the way war started was too unjust to warrant such huge reparations?

My comment wasn't about the terms themselves, per se.

My comment was concerning the amount of time that the NPO spends before it is released from terms.

The length of time it takes the NPO to become free from terms matters.

[King DrunkWino]

My comment wasn't about the terms themselves, per se.

My comment was concerning the amount of time that the NPO spends before it is released from terms.

The length of time it takes the NPO to become free from terms matters.

How does the length of time NPO spends in terms effect Invitca's foreign policy or other treaty obligations?

[James Wilson]

With so much emphasis on the top nations, the fact that you missed the largest nation is something else entirely. Especially after they had declared an offensive war. Also war doesnt last for 5 days.

No, but I was assuming that the nation just came out of peace mode to get a higher collection for 5 days then jump back in. Declaring a war and not getting jumped is another story altogether. Thats just stupidity on that alliances behalf. Then again, have your number 1 nation come out to fight 1 round isn't something to bragg about when like a third of your alliance hides in peace mode.

[Seerow]

1) Haflinger says putting the political game on hold for a year would be a bad idea, indiciating we do not intend to jus "wait for NPO to come back"

If you take him out of context then yes, it COULD mean that. But let's look at what he said just before that (to which someone asked him if it was a threat):

That's terms until February.

You willing to wait that long to see what NPO's allies do diplomatically?

Clearly indicating that Invicta would not be acting until after NPO is released from terms. In the quote you are saying that you would be moving on, what it seems pretty clear to me he is saying is that it would be a bad idea to have terms that last until February, as you'd be putting the game on pause and making NPO's ally's (namely Invicta) wait until February to show their hand.

2) When Karma starts biting at eachother, we'll be happy to watch from the outside.

Except he said that you'd be -forced- to be watchers due to NPO's peace and Invictas apparent lack of outside ties to anybody else.

Please, keep digging. I'm willing to accept your apology for needlessly insulting my intelligence and turning your own inability to express yourself clearly into an extended public issue at any time.

[scythegfx]

One track minds.

The length of time NPO remains under terms affects our FA in regards to pacifica, not in regards to other alliances.

While we will wait for NPO, this does not mean that we will put outr other treaty partners on hold.

[Ragashingo]

My comment wasn't about the terms themselves, per se.

My comment was concerning the amount of time that the NPO spends before it is released from terms.

The length of time it takes the NPO to become free from terms matters.

Do you think the length of the suggested terms is too long?

[scythegfx]

If you take him out of context then yes, it COULD mean that. But let's look at what he said just before that (to which someone asked him if it was a threat):

Clearly indicating that Invicta would not be acting until after NPO is released from terms. In the quote you are saying that you would be moving on, what it seems pretty clear to me he is saying is that it would be a bad idea to have terms that last until February, as you'd be putting the game on pause and making NPO's ally's (namely Invicta) wait until February to show their hand.

Show their hand in regards to the NPO... After all, this topic is about the NPO...isn't it?

Except he said that you'd be -forced- to be watchers due to NPO's peace and Invictas apparent lack of outside ties to anybody else.

Again, check the !@#$@#$ treaty web.

He didnt say force... "if you want to make us the watchers" - If you want to keep us out of it when you start clawing at eachother, then thats fine with us.

Please, keep digging. I'm willing to accept your apology for needlessly insulting my intelligence and turning your own inability to express yourself clearly into an extended public issue at any time.

Thick heads =)

You're seeing what you want to see. Must be cool. Bet its served you well in the past

[Haflinger]

How does the length of time NPO spends in terms effect Invitca's foreign policy or other treaty obligations?

I've already said I won't tell you that.

[scythegfx]

Just for you Seerow, since apparently looking things up takes to much effort

http://cybernations.wikia.com/wiki/Invicta

[Bob]

I've already said I won't tell you that.

Is this highly amusing to anyone else?

I'm sorry, but it just is to me.

[Ghostlin]

tl; dr: Karma and NPO still hate each other, and perhaps the terms shouldn't have been offered in the first place.

Seriously, folks, if we're going to go on and on about these being the most heinous terms in history, and considering the past, who's surprised at it, maybe we shouldn't simply be having this discussion. I don't see an adequate counter offer from NPO, nor a simple admission that they might be defeated in this case.

[Seerow]

You're seeing what you want to see. Must be cool. Bet its served you well in the past

It's obviously not just what I see given that out of everyone who's posted only you and halfinger have seen what you claim was meant.

Perhaps you should just give up? I mean really far fewer people would have seen the lapse had you not brought it up 10 pages later to begin with, and the longer you carry on the worse you make yourself look. At any time you can apologize and go home to save at least some face.

Just for you Seerow, since apparently looking things up takes to much effort

http://cybernations.wikia.com/wiki/Invicta

Nice Wiki page. Is there something there I'm supposed to see? I guess that you have treaty partners that aren't NPO is what you're trying to get at? *yawns*

Edited June 14, 2009 by Seerow

[Tom Litler]

I think the NPO has made it clear that they were defeated by requesting terms of surrender that they could accept. NPO and Karma do hate eachother, what's you point? It's not like people need to become best friends to end a war.

[janax]

Wiki needs updating. Lux Aeterna disbanded.

Hail the Purple Colony anyway

[scythegfx]

Why apologize for clarifying my alliances foreign policy?

uh-durr.

You're the one who has been telling me that I'm wrong about my own alliances viewpoints.

[Doitzel]

Oh, oh I know!

MCXA's terms are harsh because they had to stop ZIing their own members. How dare Karma stop their purges.

I wonder why this isn't in NPO's terms considering intelligence from the outset was that they'd been threatening every one of their members with PZI if they left.

Or maybe I'm misinformed (happens a lot lately ) and it is?

[Ghostlin]

I think the NPO has made it clear that they were defeated by requesting terms of surrender that they could accept. NPO and Karma do hate eachother, what's you point? It's not like people need to become best friends to end a war.

My point is that I don't think we're at the point where communication will help with surrender terms. It's not like they redressed this to Karma, they redressed it to the entire world like it's some kind of opinion poll. This breeds bad feelings. Bad feelings breed hate, which apparently breeds NSO members making comments like this in a twisted variant of the Dark Side of the Force.

There's saying one thing and doing another. NPO is still playing the same PR game: 'Look, we've done what the world's wanted. Aren't our opponents EVIL now?!' It's like the monster argument writ larger.

[scythegfx]

Wiki needs updating. Lux Aeterna disbanded.

Hail the Purple Colony anyway

we're also over 15 score, but just havent gotten around to changing it

[Aurion]

I think the NPO has made it clear that they were defeated by requesting terms of surrender that they could accept. NPO and Karma do hate eachother, what's you point? It's not like people need to become best friends to end a war.

Well, I heard that if you remove certain key members, you can make your alliance and the defeated alliance like each other again. Take out the troublemakers and all that. They won't be missed at all by the alliance in question and certainly won't make them hate your guts and want to rip them out with a pike.

Admittedly, I heard that from MCXA and NPO so I dunno how reliable it is

My own experiences contradict it, but far be it from me to correct such august personages.

Edited June 14, 2009 by Aurion