A Kaskus Announcement

[Dilber]

[quote name='Avakael' timestamp='1355378693' post='3063246']
My understanding of the announcement is that states that NSO will allow ZI listed people into their alliance. I'm just amused that you have a problem with Kaskus letting someone from your ZI list into their alliance. Although even within that announcement, it is stated that ZI listed people are allowed in, and then not allowed in, and the announcement is about letting people in again. So I'll totally understand if the policy has changed again since then or is being changed for this particular circumstance.
[/quote]

If you read it, you'd note that the bolded part stated that while they were allowed in, they still had to deal with the ZI !@#$, and work it out on their own. They would receive no support until they handled their own prior issues.

[Omniscient1]

[quote name='Dilber' timestamp='1355380365' post='3063258']
If you read it, you'd note that the bolded part stated that while they were allowed in, they still had to deal with the ZI !@#$, and work it out on their own. They would receive no support until they handled their own prior issues.
[/quote]

To be fair, that's not how that played out. Anyway, I think this thread is dumb. I'm going to shrug and hope it dies pretty soon.

[blackorchid]

[quote name='Cairna' timestamp='1355372675' post='3063200']
Ex-CD merger members could wipe the floor with Kaskus, jus sayin'.


<3 blackorchid
[/quote]


Well hello there Cairna... Long time no see

[Lord Caparo]

All i see is NSO going through Isaac to talk to Kaskus.

We have leaders as you can obviously see by this announcement, so why not chuck Tan, Me or Lord Bitburg a PM and go from their instead of posting all of this on the forum?

I dont care what your values or charter or whatever the hell you want to bring into this are until one of us three is formally approached about this situation.

[Hereno]

[quote name='Lord Caparo' timestamp='1355386274' post='3063292']
All i see is NSO going through Isaac to talk to Kaskus.

We have leaders as you can obviously see by this announcement, so why not chuck Tan, Me or Lord Bitburg a PM and go from their instead of posting all of this on the forum?

I dont care what your values or charter or whatever the hell you want to bring into this are until one of us three is formally approached about this situation.
[/quote]

Your minister of foreign affairs isn't capable of handling your foreign affairs? This just keeps getting better and better.

[Lord Caparo]

[quote name='Hereno' timestamp='1355386628' post='3063293']
Your minister of foreign affairs isn't capable of handling your foreign affairs? This just keeps getting better and better.
[/quote]

He is perfectly capable, yet he isnt the one leading the alliance.

At this time, the treatment we have received on behalf of NSO, regardless of Rayvons drinking issues have been taken with a grain of salt by us.

If they want war, then they can bring it to our front door, if they dont, then treat us like nicely instead of like your enemies.


[quote]
[b]To:[/b] [url="http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=415097"]Lord Caparo[/url] [b] From:[/b] [url="http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=337135"]Judge X[/url] [b] Date:[/b] 12/11/2012 6:29:24 PM

[b]Subject: [/b]RE: hey Razor

[b]Message:[/b] No NSO war bro. I talked to Rayvon. He was upset at Unkownsmurf and drunk. He sent his apologies begrudgingly as U.S. was flaming him. You should never make some gov to piss ppl off. It should be by their merits. My opinion at least.
[/quote]

Edited December 13, 2012 by Lord Caparo

[Unknown Smurf]

[quote name='Lord Caparo' timestamp='1355386874' post='3063295']
[b]To:[/b][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=3][background=rgb(247, 247, 247)] [/background][/size][/font][/color][url="http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=415097"]Lord Caparo[/url][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=3][background=rgb(247, 247, 247)] [/background][/size][/font][/color][b] From:[/b][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=3][background=rgb(247, 247, 247)] [/background][/size][/font][/color][url="http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=337135"]Judge X[/url][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=3][background=rgb(247, 247, 247)] [/background][/size][/font][/color][b] Date:[/b][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=3][background=rgb(247, 247, 247)] 12/11/2012 6:29:24 PM[/background][/size][/font][/color]

[b]Subject: [/b][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=3][background=rgb(247, 247, 247)]RE: hey Razor[/background][/size][/font][/color]

[b]Message:[/b][color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif][size=3][background=rgb(247, 247, 247)] No NSO war bro. I talked to Rayvon. He was upset at Unkownsmurf and drunk. He sent his apologies begrudgingly as U.S. was flaming him. You should never make some gov to piss ppl off. [b]It should be by their merits.[/b] My opinion at least.[/background][/size][/font][/color]
[/quote]

Contrary to popular belief I do good IA work.

I don't believe my placement into govt had anything to do with NSO. It wasn't an attempt to piss them off.

[Longshadow]

[quote name='Unknown Smurf' timestamp='1355388463' post='3063299']
Contrary to popular belief I do good IA work.

I don't believe my placement into govt had anything to do with NSO. It wasn't an attempt to piss them off.
[/quote]

I do believe the real issue is that you are on their ZI list and are hiding behind your new Alliance to "protect" you from the troubles you've brought upon yourself.

Secondly it doesn't matter what kind of level of work you do, if you are on a ZI list then you will be ZI'd or the Alliance that is harboring you (And not giving you up to deal with your issues) will be forced to deal with such actions as well.

tl;dr: Man up and take the consequences of your actions.


[quote name='Hereno' timestamp='1355386628' post='3063293']
Your minister of foreign affairs isn't capable of handling your foreign affairs? This just keeps getting better and better.
[/quote]

You know I really do like how they run things! It makes things so much easier to play off"!
"Hey guys! Let's go and bug NSO and get them all riled up!"
Some time later
"Uh no we never knew about this or had any dealings with NSO about this!"

It just gets better and better

[quote name='Lord Caparo' timestamp='1355386874' post='3063295']
He is perfectly capable, yet he isnt the one leading the alliance.

At this time, the treatment we have received on behalf of NSO, regardless of Rayvons drinking issues have been taken with a grain of salt by us.

If they want war, then they can bring it to our front door, if they dont, then treat us like nicely instead of like your enemies.
[/quote]

I really want to know where you people get off on blaming NSO as the problem here, quite frankly I've never seen a more blatant disregard to how diplomacy works. You should learn to reign in your ministers before you come to the OWF. All these double messages keep us laughing! Now go play in your sandbox and don't throw a tantrum when mommy catches you with your hand in the cookie jar!

P.S. Obligatory o/ NSO
Love my old Alliance!

[Unknown Smurf]

[quote name='Longshadow' timestamp='1355392447' post='3063317']
I do believe the real issue is that you are on their ZI list and are hiding behind your new Alliance to "protect" you from the troubles you've brought upon yourself.

Secondly it doesn't matter what kind of level of work you do, if you are on a ZI list then you will be ZI'd or the Alliance that is harboring you (And not giving you up to deal with your issues) will be forced to deal with such actions as well.[/quote]


My IA comment was regarding the [font="helvetica, arial, sans-serif"][color="#282828"][size=3]"[govt position] should be given based on a persons merits" line of thought. [/size][/color][/font]

[quote]tl;dr: Man up and take the consequences of your actions.[/quote]
Rayvon said that he had intention of hitting me as of a few days ago (blanking on the exact date but shortly after joining kaskus and before I knew I was on a ZI list officially -- as explained above I knew people wanted to hit me but I did not know I was on a ZI list).

I'm not sure why this is still an issue/we are wasting time with it. If theres something I'm missing I would welcome NSO govt to come talk to me -- thoughout this whole thing noone has attempted to contact me to even ask if the logs were legit or anything.

[Longshadow]

[quote name='Unknown Smurf' timestamp='1355393106' post='3063320']
Rayvon said that he had intention of hitting me as of a few days ago (blanking on the exact date but shortly after joining kaskus and before I knew I was on a ZI list officially -- as explained above I knew people wanted to hit me but I did not know I was on a ZI list).

I'm not sure why this is still an issue/we are wasting time with it. If theres something I'm missing I would welcome NSO govt to come talk to me -- thoughout this whole thing noone has attempted to contact me to even ask if the logs were legit or anything.
[/quote]

The issue rests with the fact that your Alliance and you personally lack the motivation or the desire to actually step up and deal with the issues at hand. NSO has already stated they aren't going to war with Kaskus over this but at the same time you and your alliance (while not "officially") continue to spout vitriol at the NSO (and others) with lines that remind me a lot of when Pandora's Box first came into existence a long time ago when the motto of "Do something about it." was at its peak (unless my old rusty bones are missing that it is still a big deal).

Why is it so hard/difficult for you to just give up this charade and deal with your issues instead of avoiding the question.

[Unknown Smurf]

[quote name='Longshadow' timestamp='1355393490' post='3063321']
The issue rests with the fact that your Alliance and you personally lack the motivation or the desire to actually step up and deal with the issues at hand. NSO has already stated they aren't going to war with Kaskus over this but at the same time you and your alliance (while not "officially") [b]continue to spout vitriol at the NSO[/b] (and others) with lines that remind me a lot of when Pandora's Box first came into existence a long time ago when the motto of "Do something about it." was at its peak (unless my old rusty bones are missing that it is still a big deal).
[/quote]

Kaskus has never said "do something about" or anything along those lines. You have 0 idea of what you are talking about. We are not playing hardball here.

Also as for 'dealing with the issue' -- kaskus representatives have initiated conversation with NSO multiple times.

As for the bolded comment, again all that does is reiterate you have no idea what you are talking about. There is no point where Kaskus has brought this up. There are however many examples of NSO not letting this die, for example:

[url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=114283&#entry3061903"]Here[/url] you see Rayvon bring up the matter in an unrelated topic AFTER it was resolved on iRC
[url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=114322&#entry3062653"]Here[/url] you also see Rayvon take a matter publicly that had already been handled in private (or could have been with a simple query)
[url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=114322&#entry3062694"]Here[/url] you see Kain threaten a kaskus ally.

All of which happened in their respective threads before any kaskus member posted anything about NSO or the situation at all.

EDIT: Infact the only time I spoke about NSO without being verbally attacked first is [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=114337&#entry3063308"]here [/url]and that is in an attempt to smooth things over.

[quote]
Why is it so hard/difficult for you to just give up this charade and deal with your issues instead of avoiding the question.
[/quote]

What is the question?

Edited December 13, 2012 by Unknown Smurf

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='Rayvon' timestamp='1355357218' post='3063092']
I just might - although getting enough giggles just from watching him.
[/quote]


Actually I had a good giggle myself, I had a few pints last night and came in for some banter.


[quote name='Umar ibn Abd al-Aziz' timestamp='1355370373' post='3063186']
Oh, I dunno, Hiro may've got it right with his little [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=113904&st=40&p=3050826&#entry3050826"]rant[/url] or he may not have - regardless, it's quite entertaining all the same.

e:

Why it was high-brow humour of course!

"Know fear", I'm still chuckling about that one.
[/quote]

There is no maybe about it, I was right then and I'll stand by they comments now.

Edited December 13, 2012 by Hiro Nakara

[Hiro Nakara]

Doubler, sorry folks

Edited December 13, 2012 by Hiro Nakara

[Judge X]

Ha! As soon as I get to a PC & not my phone I will post razor's message previous to that one. If my attempts tu scuttle the situation will be aired to bob we can air the whole conversation. I'm not some 12 year old to be twisted.

[Swatch0]

Disappointed to see Kaskus accepting UnknownSmurf and sticking him in gov while he is under a ZI sentence and they know what he did was wrong. Definetly not the alliance I once fought proudly for. Poor show K </3

Good luck to both alliances in getting this matter resolved.

Edited December 13, 2012 by Swatch0

[Haraldson]

[quote name='Lord Caparo' timestamp='1355386274' post='3063292']
All i see is NSO going through Isaac to talk to Kaskus.

We have leaders as you can obviously see by this announcement, so why not chuck Tan, Me or Lord Bitburg a PM and go from their instead of posting all of this on the forum?

I dont care what your values or charter or whatever the hell you want to bring into this are until one of us three is formally approached about this situation.
[/quote]

Unknown Smurf is a legit target.
All your lot need to do is stand aside while he gets trashed - and goes into Bil-lock.
'Course, if he doesn't go into bill-lock, the world will know that his uninvolved Alliance [i]is involved.[/i]
Don't see what kind of PM is needed for that.

[Burnsey]

My condolences to Kaskus. Work on electing better representatives next time.

[Varianz]

I mean Kaskus, cmon. We'd done a gather intel op on him while he was in PM, clearly he was in some !@#$ with us. What did you expect?

Ray's infinitely more patient than most of us, so he's letting it go. Oh well.

[Isaac MatthewII]

[quote name='Umar ibn Abd al-Aziz' timestamp='1355370373' post='3063186']
Oh, I dunno, Hiro may've got it right with his little [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=113904&st=40&p=3050826&#entry3050826"]rant[/url] or he may not have - regardless, it's quite entertaining all the same.


[/quote]
Man, you posted that rant twice and I still don't give a !@#$, it happened, we have had disagreements thats about all I have to say about that.





Hell you people are acting like we let him in knowing about the ZI list. He was a full member when we were aproached, we tried diplomacy. When we tried diplomacy Ray made that impossible. As a result we let him stay.

Edited December 13, 2012 by Isaac MatthewII

[Haraldson]

[quote name='Isaac MatthewII' timestamp='1355405657' post='3063366']
Man, you posted that rant twice and I still don't give a !@#$, it happened, we have had disagreements thats about all I have to say about that.





Hell you people are acting like we let him in knowing about the ZI list. He was a full member when we were aproached, we tried diplomacy. When we tried diplomacy Ray made that impossible. As a result we let him stay.
[/quote]
What need diplomacy? That's just prevarication. Just stand aside while he gets it.

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='Haraldson' timestamp='1355406503' post='3063368']
What need diplomacy? That's just prevarication. Just stand aside while he gets it.
[/quote]

You should stop asking for them to Stand aside. You clearly do not understand how Kaskus works. They won't, so banging on about it will not make it happen, especially after your leader has stated it has been dealt with.

Edited December 13, 2012 by Hiro Nakara

[Isaac MatthewII]

[quote name='Haraldson' timestamp='1355406503' post='3063368']
What need diplomacy? That's just prevarication. Just stand aside while he gets it.
[/quote]
Well I don't know if "standing aside" and letting your members "take it" is common practice in NSO but in Kaskus we give our members a chance to explain them selves. Smurf explained him self to me and I went to Razor about it, once I went to Razor about it I went to Rayvon to see how the situation could be settled. When Ravon representing his alliance insulted the government, the membership, and the alliance as a whole we said basically "$%&@ you too" and accepted Smurf as a full member. Due to the work he has put in he was thrown into government. If we did this to piss off NSO we would tell NSO. I will say right now, we are not afraid of pissing off NSO, however that was not our goal. So NSO if you want to act like adults now and have a civilized conversation with me and my government then we can do that. Without the peanut gallery and armchair knowledge coming from your membership in this thread. This is the last official response from Kaskus in this thread.

Edited December 13, 2012 by Isaac MatthewII

[Dilber]

Our members have armchair knowledge because smurf posted his !@#$ for everyone to see.

Hope that helps!

[Haraldson]

[quote name='Isaac MatthewII' timestamp='1355407033' post='3063372']
Well I don't know if "standing aside" and letting your members "take it" is common practice in NSO but in Kaskus we give our members a chance to explain them selves.[/quote]
Your practise is irrelevant and beside the point. His destruction is the only relevant matter and it is quite the point.

[quote]Smurf explained him self to me [/quote]
That is an internal affair of Kaskus and of a matter of no consequence whatsoever. Why you should bring it up I do not see or care for.




[quote]"$%&@ you too"[/quote]
May all your offspring have excess chromosomes too.


[quote] If we did this to piss off NSO we would tell NSO.[/quote]
So in one post you say that you did it and that you didn't do it. Amnesia, much? At any rate, consider us [i]told.[/i]

[quote]
This is the last official response from Kaskus in this thread.

[/quote]

Good and stick with that line while Unknown Smurf gets it. If he does not got into bill-lock the whole world will [i]know[/i] the value of your word.

[Rayvon]

[quote name='Isaac MatthewII' timestamp='1355407033' post='3063372']
This is the last official response from Kaskus in this thread.
[/quote]

I don't believe you have this authority. You are not leader of Kaskus.

[url=http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=114322&st=100#entry3063292]Kaskus has leaders you see. Until one of these three is formally approached about this situation, nothing else matters.[/url]

Edited December 13, 2012 by Rayvon