Statement from Nusantara Elite Warriors

[The MVP]

[quote name='Dochartaigh' timestamp='1292825792' post='2546003']
wait- i spent 2+ years in Polaris, 8 or so months in Gremlins, around a year in IAA and just recently moved to DT. yup, most definitely am an alliance hopper without a purpose. you sure got me man.
[/quote]

I seem to remember you jumping between Gremlins and Polaris quite frequently during those days, maaaaaaaaan.

[Land of True Israel]

[quote name='Yankees Empire' timestamp='1292825017' post='2545971']
If you're so upset about this, do something about it.
[/quote]

Well aren't you a big man lol. I call it like I see it, emotions have no place in logic.
And just for the record, no, I'm not upset about any of this.

[Land of True Israel]

[quote name='nutkase' timestamp='1292825414' post='2545988']
The Onus has always been on the tech raider to find out the information about the target. Does not matter if it was in the same thread or a new one. The fact remains it was made and either NEW was too lazy to have quick look through the thread to find out or not also history shows that if you screw up by hitting a protected nation...you pay up its always been a standard and will continue to do so.

If you are too stupid to read, it's not our problem, plain and simple.
[/quote]

Yes, I am well aware that it has always been the responsibility of the raider to check for protection before raiding. With this whole can of worms opened up, one could technically and theoretically 'announce' protection on page 13 of a thread, and then demand reps if it gets overlooked. The 'bigger dogs' can do whatever they want, regardless of how ridiculous a few of us think it is.

With that said, I've never been one to stick around and kick a dead horse when debating on an issue, and this horse is as dead as a door-nail. We'll just have to agree to disagree.

[hellsign]

[b][size="7"]NEW YEAR!!!! NEW WAR!!!![/size][/b]

[Dochartaigh]

[quote name='The MVP' timestamp='1292826112' post='2546019']
I seem to remember you jumping between Gremlins and Polaris quite frequently during those days, maaaaaaaaan.
[/quote]

well then it is obvious your memory is crap or you are just trying to look cool. i only joined Gremlins once and only left Gremlins once. maaaaaaaaaaaaan.

[SynthFG]

The Dumb is strong in this thread

[LittleRena]

[quote name='Melutar' timestamp='1292820988' post='2545562']
The aggressiveness of DF's protectors, while admirable and understandable, is unwarranted in our view.
[/quote]

I believe that NEW where given a chance to back down from what I understand, diplomacy was attempted.

Or am I to believe that WFF approve of mass raiding a recently disbanded alliance?

[Dochartaigh]

[quote name='LittleRena' timestamp='1292864603' post='2546655']
I believe that NEW where given a chance to back down from what I understand, diplomacy was attempted.

Or am I to believe that WFF approve of mass raiding a recently disbanded alliance?
[/quote]

i am wondering if WFF will actually defend NEW or was it all just a bunch of talk.

[Whitney]

NEW - Not afraid to do what alliances won't and shouldn't

[Karl I]

Not really interested in reading 20 pages worth, but really... how can you miss the post below that was posted in the disbandment thread?! and then you go off raiding them! suits you well.

[quote name='Finnish Commie' timestamp='1292632710' post='2542151']
...Oh and raiding them would be most badly done, regards their (now former) MDoAP partner.
[/quote]

[Yankees Empire]

[quote name='Land of True Israel' timestamp='1292832551' post='2546228']
Well aren't you a big man lol. I call it like I see it, emotions have no place in logic.
And just for the record, no, I'm not upset about any of this.
[/quote]

That is what the ladies say

But seriously, if you have an issue with how NEW was treated, then declare war.

[zzzptm]

WFF should go ahead and jump in the fire. I think the current combatants could handle 24 small nations without too much trouble. If they call in allies over WFF involvement, I'll be officially disgusted with them. WFF has only one nation with over 40K NS and two-thirds of their membership is under 15K NS.

Join in by all means, WFF. The world will remember your bravery.

[Finnish Commie]

[quote name='zzzptm' timestamp='1292874506' post='2546874']
WFF should go ahead and jump in the fire. I think the current combatants could handle 24 small nations without too much trouble. If they call in allies over WFF involvement, I'll be officially disgusted with them. WFF has only one nation with over 40K NS and two-thirds of their membership is under 15K NS.

Join in by all means, WFF. The world will remember your bravery.
[/quote]
I think we'll call on someone of the calibre of ODN to save us from WFF aggression

[zzzptm]

[quote name='Finnish Commie' timestamp='1292875703' post='2546910']
I think we'll call on someone of the calibre of ODN to save us from WFF aggression
[/quote]

I see what you did there.

Miss one war, and they label you for life...

But if ODN got called in, that would trigger, uh... VA... Don't see anyone else...

The chaining could take WEEKS in this war.

[Twizzler]

[quote name='Land of True Israel' timestamp='1292824903' post='2545964']
No, they buried a quick one liner somewhere on the second page. Whether or not it was a valid announcement is not what my debate is based on. Anything can be "valid" if the one making it declares it so, and has the power to do so. My point is, they should have accepted responsibility as well considering how obviously easy to over-look this "announcement" was. Accepting NEW's peace offer and forgetting about reps would of been a fair compromise. It was quite lazy and careless. One could even argue that it seemed intentional, hoping somebody would "slip up" and think that an alliance would actually take the time and effort to clearly announce their intent to protect their friends, instead of mumble it among a bunch of unimportant drivel.

Let's face it. OWF consists of announcements followed by numerous boring, stupid, irrelevant etc.. replies (with the exception of a few entertaining posters), so not everybody is going to choose to read through the mess. However, I'm sure this will change now, and alliances will be reading through every reply on nearly every topic, in case another alliance decided to post an "announcement" somewhere in there.
[/quote]

No actually. FC posted a threat/promise of protection on the first page (which was in fact, the first of the INT/TPE government to post), gantanX questioned what it meant and why, and had the meaning explained to him. How everyone is ignoring this fact continues to baffle me. gantanX is clearly an idiot and completely wrong in this case. The meaning of the "little one liner" was personally explained to him. Your argument that this was a set-up is completely idiotic.

[sir pwnage]

Also, the fact that other raiding alliances like GOONS didn't raid the DF AA seems to indicate that, for many people, the warnings in the disbandment thread were enough.

[Baldr]

[quote name='Land of True Israel' timestamp='1292833600' post='2546253']
The 'bigger dogs' can do whatever they want, regardless of how ridiculous a few of us think it is. [/quote]

That more or less sums up tech raiding in general. Raiders try to raid targets that can't effectively fight back and who don't have enough protection to make them high risk. They get away with it because they are mostly picking on the smaller, weaker, unaligned nations.

In this case, NEW bit off more than they could chew, and so they are getting chewed up. They thought they were the bigger dog, and that they could attack DF without risk. It turns out that they were wrong.

(edit : Originally written as if you were in NEW.)

Edited December 20, 2010 by Baldr

[Duncan King]

NEW's usually pretty bright, I can't believe you guys didn't see this beatdown coming. Unless you wanted to get rolled for being stupid.

[KingEd]

[quote name='Land of True Israel' timestamp='1292824903' post='2545964']
No, they buried a quick one liner somewhere on the second page. Whether or not it was a valid announcement is not what my debate is based on. Anything can be "valid" if the one making it declares it so, and has the power to do so. My point is, they should have accepted responsibility as well considering how obviously [b]easy to over-look this "announcement" was.[/b] Accepting NEW's peace offer and forgetting about reps would of been a fair compromise. It was quite lazy and careless. One could even argue that it seemed intentional, hoping somebody would "slip up" and think that an alliance would actually take the time and effort to clearly announce their intent to protect their friends, instead of mumble it among a bunch of unimportant drivel.

[/quote]

01[11:33] <KingEd[TPE]> Who authorized the raid?
[11:34] <sangar[NEW]> new govt has authorized the raids

01[11:34] <KingEd[TPE]> Sangar, did "NEW Govt" read the disbandment thread?
[11:35] <sangar[NEW]> yes

Not to mention NEW changed its position about 5 times during the course of the talks. [b]BUT since everyone here thinks they know EVERYTHING - since you were all there, you know...Ill let you keep blurting out facts![/b]

Edited December 20, 2010 by KingEd

[joracy]

[quote name='KingEd' timestamp='1292885289' post='2547107']
01[11:33] <KingEd[TPE]> Who authorized the raid?
[11:34] <sangar[NEW]> new govt has authorized the raids

01[11:34] <KingEd[TPE]> Sangar, did "NEW Govt" read the disbandment thread?
[11:35] <sangar[NEW]> yes

Not to mention NEW changed its position about 5 times during the course of the talks. [b]BUT since everyone here thinks they know EVERYTHING - since you were all there, you know...Ill let you keep blurting out facts![/b]
[/quote]

Man, I really wish I could know all the fancy facts those people who had no involvement in the talks(and honestly probably don't even know anybody involved in the talks) know!

[The MVP]

[quote name='LittleRena' timestamp='1292864603' post='2546655']
I believe that NEW where given a chance to back down from what I understand, diplomacy was attempted.

Or am I to believe that WFF approve of mass raiding a recently disbanded alliance?
[/quote]

You're grasping at straws and it appears you have an affinity for stupidity.

WFF does not approve of attacking recently disbanding alliances but they will protect an alliance that has been allied to them for so long because they know if they were put in a similar situation, no matter how dumb the decision was, NEW would do the same for them. Perhaps it's a foreign concept to you never being able to do anything interesting but hey, when being put in a rough situation you have two options which is fight or flight. Some of us would choose the first, the likes of you and others would simply choose the latter.

[quote]i am wondering if WFF will actually defend NEW or was it all just a bunch of talk. [/quote]

At first you wanted them to go in and disband and now you're saying you don't even know if we're going in. Which is it tough guy?

Edited December 21, 2010 by The MVP

[Rheebrosinc_1337]

NEW, are you serious?

[R3nowned]

[quote name='rheebrosinc_1337' timestamp='1292896150' post='2547340']
NEW, are you serious?
[/quote]

I believe they kNEW what they were going into.

[LittleRena]

[quote name='The MVP' timestamp='1292895522' post='2547328']
but hey, when being put in a rough situation you have two options which is fight or flight. Some of us would choose the first, the likes of you and others would simply choose the latter.
[/quote]

I've never abanonded an alliance I am with in the face of war so that statement is utter rubbish.
Unless you know my history better than I do but I'm pretty sure I never left TFD because they entered a losing battle.

My point is, you have to draw the line somewhere, why would you defend your ally over a stupid move? They could have ended it before it started by appologising or finding an agreement but they didn't and that's their fault, although the protection might not have been as official or obvious as some would like but from what I have read, they where told about the risks.

All you seem to be intrested in is seeing alliances "defend" NEW so other alliances get involved, I doubt you really care about the outcome so long as you get your fun.

[merdesa]

[quote name='LittleRena' timestamp='1292864603' post='2546655']
I believe that NEW where given a chance to back down from what I understand, diplomacy was attempted.

Or am I to believe that WFF approve of mass raiding a recently disbanded alliance?
[/quote]

I like to think of it as not if WFF approves of mass raiding (we do allow raiding, although personally I'm not into it) but if your brother called you at say, 1am from jail looking for bail, you'd post it. WFF may only be able to pay it in pennies, but we'll always post that bail.



[quote name='Dochartaigh' timestamp='1292865016' post='2546662']
i am wondering if WFF will actually defend NEW or was it all just a bunch of talk.
[/quote]

We don't talk much.