Announcement from the Grand Global Alliance

[Andre27]

Andre, is there any chance you could answer those questions for me? If not, please let me know who could.

I missed the follow-up post. Allow me to answer them.

I don't see anything saying that an Elder Statesman needs to have a nation - perhaps some clarification on that could be added . Allow me to rephrase this question: assuming Derek Jones was to return again, would he again be denied re-entry to the GGA and attacked, as he was by the old government, or would he be recognized as an Elder Statesman and allowed entry?

Let me first state that even with all that has happened with DJ i hold no grudge against him.

Attacking DJ after he created a nation again would be PZI in which we will not engage. As for allowing DJ back into the alliance as an elder, considering the history surrounding DJ however i believe it would be unwise to let him return directly as an elder. He would be welcome as a member, but not in an advisory role.

When you say damaging, do you mean, specifically, damage done in a quantitative, in game fashion? Or could this cover damage to your reputation, your forums, etc?

With the exception of reputation yes. Although a good reputation amongst other alliances is a precious thing, i believe that if we stay true to the values for which the GGA stands our reputation will be restored.

It is also realistic that for an alliance with the history of the GGA, both good and bad, there will always be those with a negative opinion towards us.

Just to clarify - GGA allows no raiding on alliances that have an AA set, then?

Correct

In what situations will the GGA sanction a nation, aside from cases of nuclear rogues?

A sanction is a heavy instrument to use and as such we shall only use this instrument when other options have been exhausted. So aside from nuclear rogues, aid thiefs who have fled to peace mode and requests from alliances for a sanction the GGA will not use sanctions. To add to this, the GGA will not use sanctions during alliance wars.

Does the GGA consider something that a member of another alliance says to be representative of the other alliances official opinion?

A rather odd question, does any alliance consider the opinion of a member to be representative of the other alliances official opinion?

So the answer to that is no. Official opinion are only to be made by government officials.

[Delta1212]

The reaction to the policy of "asking permission to leave" is somewhat surprising.

In my time in the GGA i don't recall that anyone who wanted to leave, was denied.

Then why this policy. There is both a practical and philosophical reason.

Practical because by departing from the alliance means losing access to "Members only" sections and the triumvirate needs to change the mask of the departed member.

Philosophical because we care about each and every member. When someone decides to leave the alliance and abandon those who were his/her brothers/sisters for so long we like to know why.

This way we know the reasons for leaving and this helps in identifying potential problems in the alliance.

That isn't really the problem though. There are alliances that require/request that you inform them when resigning for all of those reasons. The problem is that you reserve the right to deny people the right to leave the alliance if you don't think they have a good enough reason for doing so. It's one of the more widely held beliefs that in CN that all alliances are democracies on a basic level by virtue of the membership's ability to vote with their feet and leave if they don't like the way an alliance is being run. This policy is akin to saying that each member has to give the government a reason why they should be allowed to vote before they can enter the voting booth and if they don't give a good enough reason they will be shot.

Even if you never shoot anyone, just having the policy isn't going to reflect well upon you.

[Beauty]

Yay to improved GGA

[Laserwolf]

We believe that by privately contacting a Triumvir the departing member has more freedom to express why he/she wishes to depart then in a public demasking thread.

Makes sense to me.

[Ephriam Grey]

Let me first state that even with all that has happened with DJ i hold no grudge against him.

Attacking DJ after he created a nation again would be PZI in which we will not engage. As for allowing DJ back into the alliance as an elder, considering the history surrounding DJ however i believe it would be unwise to let him return directly as an elder. He would be welcome as a member, but not in an advisory role.

Please elaborate on what crime DJ committed, aside from attempting to rejoin the GGA and attempting to act with the authority granted to him by the GGA charter. Please elaborate on why more than 60% of Elder Statesmen were not given the chance to vote on the removal of Degenrates two fellow Trivum, which led to him gaining complete control of the GGA.

Please, shed some light on the incident which I am alluding to - I ask this in all seriousness, and with the hope that someone in GGA can be put my mind at ease. I'm not asking these things to make fun of you. GGA is on the green sphere, and I want nothing more than to see GGA continue to grow at a healthy rate and be an active participant in the green sphere. I want you guys to earn a new name for yourselves, I want you guys to become an alliance that attracts players to the green sphere. I know that you guys are making steps in the right direction, but the coup of the GGA Trivum and the Elder Statesman that occurred a few months ago has largely been ignored, merely because shaneprice has managed to come out in the top.

Don't forget, I was once an ally to GGA. I went to war for your alliance. You once called me a close friend and ally. I don't hate you guys - nor do I want to see you fail, because GGAs success is linked to the green sphere's success, which is linked to the success of my alliance.

Don't try to feed me a story, andre - I know exactly what went down during that coup. Have you even heard the full story, from both sides, my friend?

Finally:

F2. Elder Statesmen of the Grand Global Alliance: Elders are former members of the council who have retired, resigned, or have been removed. The position and title are honorific, signifying our appreciation for their efforts and sacrifices for the GGA. This position has no power or say within government. Elders may act in an advisory capacity to current government, but have no final say in decisions made by the council or any other government member. Privileges and powers of the Elders on the forums and IRC shall be determined by the council.

Please point me to the part of that paragraph that gives GGA the right to take the title of Elder Statesman away from Derek Jones.

Also, did you miss my question about Sognatore? I edited it in after my initial post. I wish to know if she is still considered an Elder Statesman. Actually - a list of the Elder Statesmen would be greatly appreciated.

A sanction is a heavy instrument to use and as such we shall only use this instrument when other options have been exhausted. So aside from nuclear rogues, aid thiefs who have fled to peace mode and requests from alliances for a sanction the GGA will not use sanctions. To add to this, the GGA will not use sanctions during alliance wars.

When I was EZIed by your alliance, you attempted to have me sanctioned. I did not use nuclear weapons against your nations. Due to the number of team senators in my trade ring at the time, I was not sanctioned - but I am curious as to why this course of action was pursued against me.

A rather odd question, does any alliance consider the opinion of a member to be representative of the other alliances official opinion?

So the answer to that is no. Official opinion are only to be made by government officials.

I am glad to hear this.

[Bilrow]

F2. Elder Statesmen of the Grand Global Alliance: Elders are former members of the council who have retired, resigned, or have been removed. The position and title are honorific, signifying our appreciation for their efforts and sacrifices for the GGA. This position has no power or say within government. Elders may act in an advisory capacity to current government, but have no final say in decisions made by the council or any other government member. Privileges and powers of the Elders on the forums and IRC shall be determined by the council.

To echo Ephraim, that is so vague enough that I could go claim my right as Elder Statesman.

[Andre27]

Please elaborate on what crime DJ committed, aside from attempting to rejoin the GGA and attempting to act with the authority granted to him by the GGA charter. Please elaborate on why more than 60% of Elder Statesmen were not given the chance to vote on the removal of Degenrates two fellow Trivum, which led to him gaining complete control of the GGA.

As for DJ rejoining and "attempting to act with the authority granted to him by the GGA charter" can you tell me where it says that an elder has authority in the old charter?

Elder Statesmen is made up of ex-Triumvirate members who stepped down in good standing and other members of the alliance by invite, they do not have any political power, however, do serve as advisors to the Holy Triumvirate.

Please, shed some light on the incident which I am alluding to - I ask this in all seriousness, and with the hope that someone in GGA can be put my mind at ease. I'm not asking these things to make fun of you. GGA is on the green sphere, and I want nothing more than to see GGA continue to grow at a healthy rate and be an active participant in the green sphere. I want you guys to earn a new name for yourselves, I want you guys to become an alliance that attracts players to the green sphere. I know that you guys are making steps in the right direction, but the coup of the GGA Trivum and the Elder Statesman that occurred a few months ago has largely been ignored, merely because shaneprice has managed to come out in the top.

Don't try to feed me a story, andre - I know exactly what went down during that coup. Have you even heard the full story, from both sides, my friend?

I don't feed stories. Although i have to read up on the how and what of that time. I'll try to post an answer when i return from work tomorrow.

Please point me to the part of that paragraph that gives GGA the right to take the title of Elder Statesman away from Derek Jones.

Actually if you check the last sentence of your quote it says "Privileges and powers of the Elders on the forums and IRC shall be determined by the council.". IMO this answers your question.

Also, did you miss my question about Sognatore? I edited it in after my initial post. I wish to know if she is still considered an Elder Statesman. Actually - a list of the Elder Statesmen would be greatly appreciated.

I did miss that. An elder statesmen is a rank title within the GGA. Sognatore is currently not a member of the GGA and therefor no longer an elder statesmen.

If she ever wishes to return to the GGA, she will receive her title once again.

When I was EZIed by your alliance, you attempted to have me sanctioned. I did not use nuclear weapons against your nations. Due to the number of team senators in my trade ring at the time, I was not sanctioned - but I am curious as to why this course of action was pursued against me.

Let me read up on that first.

@Bilrow: Already answered in this post. No member of the GGA, no elder statemen

Edited September 27, 2009 by andre27

[Bob Janova]

Nice to see the no PZI – a welcome sight from an alliance which was once one of the main users of that practice. You still have that weird 'you can't leave unless we say so', though.

[Ephriam Grey]

As for DJ rejoining and "attempting to act with the authority granted to him by the GGA charter" can you tell me where it says that an elder has authority in the old charter?

That, in a way, is part of my point, though unintentionally expressed. Why was Ironchef, an Elder Statesman, able to do so much in GGA while she was a member of Valhalla? And by authority granted to him by the GGA charter, I apologize - I meant, would GGA allow Derek Jones to rejoin GGA and maintain the honorific title Elder Statesman?

I don't feed stories. Although i have to read up on the how and what of that time. I'll try to post an answer when i return from work tomorrow.

Thank you, much appreciated. I hope you will shed light on the majority of my questions skipped over . I appreciate your willingness to search for the facts before making a post.

Actually if you check the last sentence of your quote it says "Privileges and powers of the Elders on the forums and IRC shall be determined by the council.". IMO this answers your question.

I did miss that. An elder statesmen is a rank title within the GGA. Sognatore is currently not a member of the GGA and therefor no longer an elder statesmen.

If she ever wishes to return to the GGA, she will receive her title once again.

@Bilrow: Already answered in this post. No member of the GGA, no elder statemen

Your charter states that the powers of Elder Statesman may be regulated. It does not state that your Council may regulate who is an Elder Statesman. It does not state they have to be a member of your alliance.

There is nothing in your charter prohibiting Bilrow from claiming the title Elder Statesman, at the end of the day.

Is Ironchef an Elder Statesman?

Edited September 27, 2009 by Ephriam Grey

[Lucas Perry]

Looks good, GGA. Hope everything goes smoothly in your future.

[im317]

i am happy to see improvement, you guys still have a lot of work to do but this is a step in the right direction.

[ModusOperandi]

I am very, very impressed; I love your charter, there are no other words with which I can say it.

[Pingu]

Looking good there, friends. May the charter help you build the success you seek and deserve.

[Dujek Onearm]

Good to see you guys back on track. Admitting something is wrong and having the will to change it are qualities few posses. I'm happy to see that GGA is part of this small group. I wish you good luck with the new charter.

To a long and prosper future!

[OverCaffeinated]

Nice to see our allies working on moving forward.

/hail GGA

[mydogti]

its a start, i guess. best of luck

[Il Impero Romano]

Like everyone has said, this is a step in the right direction.

o/ Green

[Ben Linus]

Glad to see the removal of Chancellor.

Its a start, good luck.

Edited September 28, 2009 by Ben Linus