VE congratulates im317 and Eledan!

[Corinan]

So VE is guilty of the heinous crime of not advising their members to be more careful when titling their threads? Mercy.

You know, I don't see how this is a whole lot different from when atrophis made that thread about Arcades and Crohl jumping ship. He didn't like them, and these guys in VE don't like Fran and HellScream. Now obviously atrophis gets bonus points for style and for Crohl's impeccable timing, but it was hilarious then...

You know how some people are with that whole morality bit, Doitzel.

Personally, I thought it was kinda funny but I can see how it could also be considered hypocritical coming from VE.

Edit: Oh and for the record, I find the subject of alliance disbandment hilarious. If they don't have the will/ability to stick around then they don't deserve to exist. There honestly needs to be less alliances anyway.

Edited August 26, 2009 by Corinan

[Logan]

You know how some people are with that whole morality bit, Doitzel.

Personally, I thought it was kinda funny but I can see how it could also be considered hypocritical coming from VE.

Its not really hypocritical, I'm sure they wouldn't mind if you made a death pool for when VE is disbanding again.

[Bill Wallace]

Its not really hypocritical, I'm sure they wouldn't mind if you made a death pool for when VE is disbanding again.

I agree. By the way, I have $15 million that says it won't be anytime soon.

[Corinan]

Its not really hypocritical, I'm sure they wouldn't mind if you made a death pool for when VE is disbanding again.

Well I don't know, I'm hearing a lot about how VE disbanded some time back and then went on for several months afterward about what an injustice it was or something. Now here they are making a betting pool on when another alliance will disband and posting the results in public. Seems like that could be considered hypocritical. Not that I really care, I mean they can do what they want. They should just expect that people may call them on it.

[Daimos]

How insightful. Care to share why you feel this was a bad move?

Thought it was obvious.

OP thought posting this in the public forum would be funny. It did not pose the desired results he was looking for.

[Hell Scream]

the people in npo and others who are really crying about this miss the point. i was apathetic toward CG. i wanted to keep them at arms length at best, but i am not happy to see them disband. but thats not what this bet was about.

please listen to me when i say this, because there are a lot of people expressing outrage at something that has nothing to do with this thread.

the thread was about that this disbandment was easily predicted, the second they formed. its because people like fran (and to a much lesser extent hellscream) hop alliances, and the guess was that she would hop this one before 2 months were behind them.

she of course did, and this thread isnt to poke fun at those who are now homeless/had to move on elsewhere, its to show the sheer hypocrisy coming out of fran and hs (two outspoken anti npo people leaving their alliance to join... npo) and to show that there are some people who like to join an alliance that they feel they personally align with, and then grow roots in it and embrace the alliance, and stay around for months and then years. those are the people that you grow to trust and respect. then there are the people who have a personality that just doesnt mesh with alliance politics and they are always looking for the flaws in their alliance either to exploit for their own personal advancement to satiate some kind of power drive, or to use them as an excuse that maybe the grass is greener on the other side.

the point of this thread was to show that a person of the latter group, fran, thought the grass would be greenest in their own alliance. this person, a vox spy in mcxa, who joined ve without telling us that she was a spy when she was in mcxa until she was outed, then proceeded to fight a round of war, then aid the enemy, and then desert during the heavy operations part of the war. im sorry if i have no respect for this person, and no respect for her attempts to find the greenest grass out there, because sadly she will never find it, as npo will soon find out.

Hell Scream? Hop alliances? The only alliance I left was ODN, and I joined ODN to figure out what I wanted to do in CN.

Atlantis disbanded. I got damasked for having no nation in VE. I never wore the wF AA. What are you talking about? So you got no respect for Francesca because she called VE out on their hypocrisy?

You're poking fun at me for joining NPO? If you remember, I was the most vocal anti-NPO voice, even when I was Govt, within the Viridian Entente. Why? Because they attacked us. I no longer side with The Entente, you denied me membership after I came back to Planet Bob after the years of work and undying loyalty I have given to you.

This is false.

If you would like to be educated on this matter you can send a PM to Kybernetes. I'm sure that he would be happy to enlighten you on the project that he spent a great deal of his time on.

It is not false. Egore never intended to even have a fraction of VE on green when he started talking to Bilrow about re-creating it.

[22:31] <Bilrow[GGA]> oh yeah...

[22:32] <Bilrow[GGA]> Egore wants to come back and make VE

[22:32] <Bilrow[GGA]> not on green

Don't have any more logs I can find atm.

Hey, little sister. Here's something from the Charter of the alliance you once were a member of

----

II – ESTABLISHMENT OF RIGHTS

Article I. Every nation within The Entente holds the right to free speech within the alliance. A forum of the people will be provided so that each nation may freely air its grievances, suggest improvements, propose legislation to be voted on by the Parliament, and generally speak its mind. However, the Lord and Secretaries, or any appointed moderators, retain the right to edit any posts made by members for the sake of clarity and organization, not censorship (save in instances as required by greater law), as well as the right to restrict conversing publicly on specific sensitive issues and during crises in order to ensure a unified and clear message.

---

Yes.

Cool revisionism, bro. Sour grapes?

We came back on blue and green. Guns blazing.

You misintrepeted our intentions there, buddy.

For someone who was there, you seem awfully blind. I guess that's understandable at this hour. Rage and tears, they can be blinding.

Best of luck to all former members of the Crimson Guard. I hope you find solace in whatever new homes you choose to pursuit. Sorry if the goofing around has hurt your feelings, and you're all correct in blaming me for allowing it. Just blame Sol.

)): VE )):

I am starting a crusade against you o.O

Aren't you the same dude that calls for other alliances disbandment when it suits you? Just during the war you suggested that we need to disband the NPO. You are the dude who laughs about stuff in RL that hardly anyone else would. But you know damn well I don't take any of that seriously, just as I cannot take your outrage serious right now. Because I know that you will post what you need to to get attention, even if you don't believe in it. You don't think VE is scoundrels, just from the fact that you don't believe in morals unless you can corrupt other peoples to suit your needs.

You couldn't be any more wrong. It was a Blue and Green alliance at the time of DoE, and had always intended to go back to Green. I don't even know how you can say this seriously. Never intended to go back to Green... right...

I didn't bet money on having NPO disbanded. I viewed NPO as nothing more than an enemy at the time, enemies need to be neutralized. Either neutralize your enemies or they come back to haunt you, like what's going to happen soon enough.

I think the 15 Viridians in the OP are scoundrels, that is for sure, Logan. Alliance's members represent the alliance.

Like you said, I am politically incorrect, so? People take life too seriously.

Egore agreed with GGA and specifically Bilrow that VE was not going to come back to Green, that is a fact.

[President Kuse]

So you can cast judgment on VE as a whole based on an OOC thread about something that many in VE did not participate in but you expect not to be judged by the actions of your alliance? Interesting.

That line is getting really old really fast. This is not new, although things like this aren't usually very public they have been going on for as long as I can remember.

As KingSrgt stated above, This is not the consensus of all Viridians. This is just a few who decided to act in a very interesting manner towards CG, I had an issue with CG when it first formed briefly but changed my thoughts after I talked to some of their .Gov. I never agreed with this being brought forward for all to see. So in a way I can see why some are aggravated at some flaunting the fall of an Empire...No matter how small that Empire is.

Nevertheless the Kuse does not support the op in this case and I've been a proud Viridian for over a year.

[TypoNinja]

You do not need to educate me on history I was part of. About 25 percent of VE was green, and it was officially a BLUE alliance at the time of the DoE, and was never intended to go back to green.

You are full of !@#$.

There is just no other way to say it.

Well I don't know, I'm hearing a lot about how VE disbanded some time back and then went on for several months afterward about what an injustice it was or something. Now here they are making a betting pool on when another alliance will disband and posting the results in public. Seems like that could be considered hypocritical. Not that I really care, I mean they can do what they want. They should just expect that people may call them on it.

The differnce was circumstances, VE got attacked by its old allies, for a reason that amounted to "Bilrow wants control of green" and told to move off green under threat of overwhelming force. An alliance with Green in its name (Viridian is a shade of green for those who somehow might have missed that) told to leave green, yea that was happening.

CG was disbanded voluntarily by its leaders, for god knows why, after they just finished WINNING a war, and were awarded reparations following a truly impressive display of public support, which presumably could have been turned into treaties in short order. CG was on the rise, not under attack.

Its very old history to most at this point so I understand people forgetting, but theres a big differnce between what CG did, and what was forced upon VE.

[King Srqt]

Well I don't know, I'm hearing a lot about how VE disbanded some time back and then went on for several months afterward about what an injustice it was or something. Now here they are making a betting pool on when another alliance will disband and posting the results in public. Seems like that could be considered hypocritical. Not that I really care, I mean they can do what they want. They should just expect that people may call them on it.

So because they think disbandment under some circumstances is an injustice that means they must think that all disbandments are unjust or they are hypocrites?

[Goldie]

Its the wording: "VE congratulates,...."

Those members should have been more careful in the wording as they do not speak for VE, but made it out that they do.

the best point made in this thread for sure. i kind of acted on a spur of the moment and figured that would be the catchiest title. if i had to do it all over again, id have just said 'congratulations im317 and eledan' or possibly not posted it at all, because clearly there are people in here just looking to make a stink for attention, when in reality all this post did was show something that myself and a few others found funny, and obviously many others in other alliances find funny. we didnt contribute to their demise in any way, we just pretty much knew that the alliance led by fran was destined to fall apart.

im sorry your totalitarian alliances dont allow you to have fun, all i can say is that while i regret bringing this to the owf because of all of the needless backlash i brought to my friends who werent involved in this, that i am proud to be a viridian and be able to be in a place where at least 15 other alliance members have a sense of humor.

[im317]

seeing as my name is in the title and all i think i kind of should make a post about it. now we(those who participated in the pool) decided to bet on this when we noticed that only 1 member of the original CG government didn't either have past or current issues with VE, or were on at least 1 PZI list.

so yeah, we(those who bet) didn't think the alliance would last, but we did nothing to try and force them to there disbandment. admittedly this being posted in public was a bad idea, but the outrage some of you are showing is ridicules.

do i regret placing a bet on this, no i don't. why should i? VE grants its members free speech, those of us who participated exercised our rights. this was not government sponsored or endorsed. i honestly feel bad for the average member of CG as they have lost there home for reasons i do not know.

[Corinan]

So because they think disbandment under some circumstances is an injustice that means they must think that all disbandments are unjust or they are hypocrites?

If you're complaining about your own alliances disbandment one day and then celebrating another alliances disbandment the next, some would call it hypocritical, yes.

[Hell Scream]

As KingSrgt stated above, This is not the consensus of all Viridians. This is just a few who decided to act in a very interesting manner towards CG, I had an issue with CG when it first formed briefly but changed my thoughts after I talked to some of their .Gov. I never agreed with this being brought forward for all to see. So in a way I can see why some are aggravated at some flaunting the fall of an Empire...No matter how small that Empire is.

Nevertheless the Kuse does not support the op in this case and I've been a proud Viridian for over a year.

Pffttt, stop making VE look good!

[Hell Scream]

Corinan, are you attempting to use logic in [ooc]Cybernations[ooc]?

How foolish.

[King Srqt]

If you're complaining about your own alliances disbandment one day and then celebrating another alliances disbandment the next, some would call it hypocritical, yes.

If someone punches me in the face for no reason I will probably be pretty pissed about it. If I watch someone I don't like punch themselves in the face I will probably laugh.

Sure we both got punched in the face but the manner in which it happened is very different so it is not hypocritical to have different reactions.

Same thing applies here.

Corinan, are you attempting to use logic in [ooc]Cybernations[ooc]?

How foolish.

His logic is flawed, it fits right in.

Edited August 26, 2009 by KingSrqt

[Hell Scream]

If you're complaining about your own alliances disbandment one day and then celebrating another alliances disbandment the next, some would call it hypocritical, yes.

If someone punches me in the face for no reason I will probably be pretty pissed about it. If I watch someone I don't like punch themselves in the face I will probably laugh.

Sure we both got punched in the face but the manner in which it happened is very different so it is not hypocritical to have different reactions.

Same thing applies here.

His logic is flawed, it fits right in.

Does it?(apply here)

Disbandment is not funny.

[Stumpy Jung Il]

Does it?(apply here)

Disbandment is not funny.

If you dont find it funny, Corinan is quite an odd choice of posters to be defending/agreeing with.

[Doitzel]

If you're complaining about your own alliances disbandment one day and then celebrating another alliances disbandment the next, some would call it hypocritical, yes.

Except it was two years ago, not so much "yesterday".

Does it?(apply here)

Disbandment is not funny.

Not inherently, no. Nor is it inherently tragic. It's all about the surrounding circumstances. I'm glad you're catching up with us.

[TypoNinja]

Does it?(apply here)

Disbandment is not funny.

Not funny, but desirable?

[14:43] <HellScream[VE]> Terms?

[14:43] <HellScream[VE]> For NPO?

[14:43] <HellScream[VE]> Over my dead body

[King Srqt]

Does it?(apply here)

Yes

VE was attacked for no reason which resulted in disbandment (which would equate to the first part of my analogy)

You disbanded with no outside pressure to do so (which would equate to the second part of my analogy)

[Hell Scream]

Not funny, but desirable?

[14:43] <HellScream[VE]> Terms?

[14:43] <HellScream[VE]> For NPO?

[14:43] <HellScream[VE]> Over my dead body

We were at war with NPO at the time and I viewed them as an eternal enemy that made an alliance I spent about 2 years of my life helping build disband. Having NPO disband was necessary. Otherwise NPO comes back and destroys us. Well, and that's what's going to happen, Round 2.

VE and CG were not in a state of war and CG not disbanding did not threaten VE's security. How can you compare those 2?

[Corinan]

Except it was two years ago, not so much "yesterday".

Ok, so the difference between it being hypocritical or not hinges on the passage of time. I'll try to keep that in mind.

[Hell Scream]

Yes

VE was attacked for no reason which resulted in disbandment (which would equate to the first part of my analogy)

You disbanded with no outside pressure to do so (which would equate to the second part of my analogy)

There was a reason, as VE leadership has states many times in an attempt to suck up to GGA. Are you calling Egore a liar?

[Goldie]

[07:06] <HellScream[VE]> Infiltrating NPO with multis with my rl friends....so fun

[07:06] <HellScream[VE]> I keep on screwing with their tech stroe

i really like you hs, and we had some good times, but youre just being very hypocritical now yourself.

Edited August 26, 2009 by goldielax25

[SonOfHoward]

We were at war with NPO at the time and I viewed them as an eternal enemy that made an alliance I spent about 2 years of my life helping build disband. Having NPO disband was necessary. Otherwise NPO comes back and destroys us. Well, and that's what's going to happen, Round 2.

VE and CG were not in a state of war and CG not disbanding did not threaten VE's security. How can you compare those 2?

You joined NPO becuase you think they'll destyroy VE? How loyal of you.