Getting Tired

[Yawoo]

Pre-planned wars are the best way to go

[Sabioviejo]

Pre-planned wars are the best way to go

*Damnit* I wanted to invade Indonesia........ to eh.... establish Sweden's historical reign over Indonesia back!

[Subtleknifewielder]

I'm sitting on the fence with this one. On one hand, it's a nice idea in theory...but there are som many variables to consider that planning out a war in advance is still not going to guarantee that it turns out the way you intended.

[Mergerberger II]

Being outgunned, teched and numbered isn't an instant lose, take Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan and many more. The USA & Allies were superior on all areas but we all know how the first end and the last 2 are going to end.

So I'm pretty sure that we beat the !@#$ out of Iraq and Afghanistan, considering that Saddam was hung and the Taliban doesn't control Afghanistan anymore.

Regardless of poorly researched and analyzed examples, restricting people to only pre-planned wars is not a good thing. If Lynneth decided he wanted to roll me and I had no allies, would I be pissed? Yeah, sure as hell, but you know what? I would endure, and I would somehow survive! Isn't that bloody amazing!

You know what you take out of the game if you do this? The fun, the satisfaction of winning. Nordland was the biggest single nation that ever existed, yet the world brought it down, you know what would have happened if we had 'planned' wars? Not the destruction of Nordland, I can assure you. If every other nation in the world comes to you and says 'we want to go to war with you' and you have to approve their request to roll you, are you going to do it? Probably not.

Back in Nordland, we planned the invasion of Slavorussia for near a month. We did everything perfectly. We isolated Slavorussia enough, we knew exactly who would join and on what side, we deployed our troops over the course of several weeks in preparation. If you want less OOC bickering, then that is how a war should be fought. Lots of planning goes into it. Even this war with Bavaria, we did the same thing, really, we spent time planning that war, though not as much, and it didn't work out as well as a result (oh well )

If you want to pre-plan a war, then go ahead, I'm sure it'd be brilliant, but dumping wars that aren't planned out will not be a good move. Frankly, I doubt you would ever see another war again, maybe the occasional one here and there, but what is RP without war?

Of course another thing that it'd get rid of is all of the OOC hatred. Some people just hate, which is not the way to RP.

[Markus Wilding]

Did you count on the Comintern joining on Slavorussia's side? Or was my invasion planned a long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away?

[Malatose]

Did you count on the Comintern joining on Slavorussia's side? Or was my invasion planned a long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away?

Actually it was, which is why we kill you in a day.

[HHAYD]

I am against pre-planned wars if it involves with the attacker and defender agreeing on something. Remember that one rule where if a player is refusing to recognize a war that his/her nation will be purged from the map? Basically, the preplanned war rule would allow players to not recognize wars by saying, "ZOMG! I don't wanna fight! Wha!" or, "If you want to fight me, I haz to win, you haz to lose!"

I prefer RP wars where the defender has no idea what is going on until the attacking begin or someone declares war on him/her unless if the defender spied on other nations.

Edited August 23, 2009 by HHAYD

[Mergerberger II]

Did you count on the Comintern joining on Slavorussia's side? Or was my invasion planned a long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away?

Well, they declared war, you were part of the ComIntern, and we had intelligence that said you were joining on Slavo's side. You make the call.

Edited August 23, 2009 by Mergerberger II

[Justinian the Mighty]

I'd like to point out Nordland probably only won because I rage quit. The war began in the NC's favor but half the world was about to attack them, and apparently Sargun was about to betray them. I felt so overwhelmed at the time that I didn’t fully realize how much support I had, so I just gave up. In hindsight I honestly believe all that planning would have been for nothing if I had fought to the end.

Anyway, on some level I agree with you merger. It could be less fun, then again maybe not. However constant war isn’t my definition of fun, I won‘t be upset if I go 6 months without a war. I’ve had my fill of drama for a while.

[King Kevz]

Just checked the World map/Guidelines thread and there is no actual rule saying refusing to accept a war/invasion means you instantly lose your land. I think most of the community agreed to it but it isn't "official" yet as it isn't in the world map thread.

[Lynneth]

However constant war isn’t my definition of fun, I won‘t be upset if I go 6 months without a war. I’ve had my fill of drama for a while.

I fully agree with this.

[Justinian the Mighty]

I put this under the idea that one player cannot force another to rp something they don't want to.

[HHAYD]

I put this under the idea that one player cannot force another to rp something they don't want to.

So that means if I wanted to roll in and nuke you repeatedly, vomit biological and chemical weapons, and refuse any peace terms, you have to choice to not OOCly recognize an IC war? Wow.

Edited August 23, 2009 by HHAYD

[Justinian the Mighty]

So that means if I wanted to roll in and nuke you repeatedly, vomit biological and chemical weapons, and refuse any peace terms, you have to choice to not OOCly recognize a IC war? Wow.

If I can't roll in nuke you destroy your entire army then make you my puppet and force you to run every rp idea you have by me first, then wait for my approval before you can post, then why should I allow you to destroy my country?

Lets remember that the Americas, where you rp, are for the most part stable. You guys aren't constanly forced to fight each other, where as Europe and from time to time Asia are constantly fighting over the most trivial things.

Edited August 23, 2009 by Justinian the Mighty

[Sargun II]

Nordland was the biggest single nation that ever existed,

No it wasn't.

More importantly, pre-planned wars aren't supposed to be for major, global conflicts where everybody and their grandmother gets involved.

[loannes]

I'd like to point out Nordland probably only won because I rage quit. The war began in the NC's favor but half the world was about to attack them, and apparently Sargun was about to betray them. I felt so overwhelmed at the time that I didn’t fully realize how much support I had, so I just gave up. In hindsight I honestly believe all that planning would have been for nothing if I had fought to the end.

Anyway, on some level I agree with you merger. It could be less fun, then again maybe not. However constant war isn’t my definition of fun, I won‘t be upset if I go 6 months without a war. I’ve had my fill of drama for a while.

Does me bombarding you with a couple of ships count as a war? >_>

I put this under the idea that one player cannot force another to rp something they don't want to.

But that's not really a good policy. Say I (somehow) piss off RA. Lavo brings in the tanks and enough men to roll me within an hour, fair and square. I decide I don't like that and don't recognize the war. This is just a tool for someone to OOCly end something they don't like that's happening ICly. How would anyone get anywhere if this was an official rule?

Lets remember that the Americas, where you rp, are for the most part stable. You guys aren't constanly forced to fight each other, where as Europe and from time to time Asia are constantly fighting over the most trivial things.

There's more people in Europe/Asia. If you're stuck in a crowd, you're going to end up elbowing (or punching) someone.

[Mergerberger II]

No it wasn't.

Yes, it was. Not by land, but in strength.

[KaiserMelech Mikhail]

I’m not saying every last detail has to be agreed on by everyone involved, but a little predictability goes a long way.

I'm with you here. I would like to know if I am going to be invaded, even if it is just so I could announce my schedule and plan for RPing.

[Justinian the Mighty]

Does me bombarding you with a couple of ships count as a war? >_>

Yes, but it happened after I said I would declare war on the Dutch.

But that's not really a good policy. Say I (somehow) piss off RA. Lavo brings in the tanks and enough men to roll me within an hour, fair and square. I decide I don't like that and don't recognize the war. This is just a tool for someone to OOCly end something they don't like that's happening ICly. How would anyone get anywhere if this was an official rule?

You piss me off all the time, but do I try to roll you everyday? I think if Lavo brought you a solid reason for you to be rolled you would agree with him, and therefore go along with it. But for instance the last war in Europe was bs, everyone knows it was just because everyone was bored and wanted to roll someone.

There's more people in Europe/Asia. If you're stuck in a crowd, you're going to end up elbowing (or punching) someone.

If I elbow someone and apologize immediately after they (usually) don't beat me to within an inch of life. More to the point HHYAD doesn’t have to endure constant war, or constantly rebuilding from those wars. He sits in the middle of North America and can rp whatever he wants. I on the other hand have to make sure everyone knows I have border defenses, because I have unfriendly governments west, south and east of me. It gets really tiresome after a while.

Edited August 24, 2009 by Justinian the Mighty

[Executive Minister]

I can honestly say that preplanned wars, or at least semi-planned wars are the best way to go in terms of flexing your muscle in the CNRP world.

[KaiserMelech Mikhail]

I can honestly say that preplanned wars, or at least semi-planned wars are the best way to go in terms of flexing your muscle in the CNRP world.

Actually, I think brutally crushing a rebellion is how the kids are doing it nowadays.

[loannes]

Yes, but it happened after I said I would declare war on the Dutch.

K.

You piss me off all the time, but do I try to roll you everyday? I think if Lavo brought you a solid reason for you to be rolled you would agree with him, and therefore go along with it. But for instance the last war in Europe was bs, everyone knows it was just because everyone was bored and wanted to roll someone.

I do? D:

Ok, yeah, if Lavo thinks I need to be rolled, I probably do >_>. But that's not the point.

Blah, I don't want to argue with that right now. It's midnight.

If I elbow someone and apologize immediately after they (usually) don't beat me to within an inch of life. More to the point HHYAD doesn’t have to endure constant war, or constantly rebuilding from those wars. He sits in the middle of North America and can rp whatever he wants. I on the other hand have to make sure everyone knows I have border defenses, because I have unfriendly governments west, south and east of me. It gets really tiresome after a while.

Well, you have had a history of bad relations with your neighbors. >_>

[Stefano Palmieri]

I'll take it on a case by case basis. I really dont mid one way or the other.

[Sabioviejo]

I'll take it on a case by case basis. I really don't mid one way or the other.

I'll follow that thought.

[Centurius]

So I'm pretty sure that we beat the !@#$ out of Iraq and Afghanistan, considering that Saddam was hung and the Taliban doesn't control Afghanistan anymore.

Regardless of poorly researched and analyzed examples, restricting people to only pre-planned wars is not a good thing. If Lynneth decided he wanted to roll me and I had no allies, would I be pissed? Yeah, sure as hell, but you know what? I would endure, and I would somehow survive! Isn't that bloody amazing!

And there has only been a civil war in Iraq for years where the US lost thousands of men and billions of dollars, and the Taliban is still attacking NATO bases. The wars aren't over and they most likely wont be won but that is for another topic.

You know what you take out of the game if you do this? The fun, the satisfaction of winning. Nordland was the biggest single nation that ever existed, yet the world brought it down, you know what would have happened if we had 'planned' wars? Not the destruction of Nordland, I can assure you. If every other nation in the world comes to you and says 'we want to go to war with you' and you have to approve their request to roll you, are you going to do it? Probably not.

Back in Nordland, we planned the invasion of Slavorussia for near a month. We did everything perfectly. We isolated Slavorussia enough, we knew exactly who would join and on what side, we deployed our troops over the course of several weeks in preparation. If you want less OOC bickering, then that is how a war should be fought. Lots of planning goes into it. Even this war with Bavaria, we did the same thing, really, we spent time planning that war, though not as much, and it didn't work out as well as a result (oh well )

If you want to pre-plan a war, then go ahead, I'm sure it'd be brilliant, but dumping wars that aren't planned out will not be a good move. Frankly, I doubt you would ever see another war again, maybe the occasional one here and there, but what is RP without war?

Of course another thing that it'd get rid of is all of the OOC hatred. Some people just hate, which is not the way to RP.

You seem to forget CN and CNRP aren't wargames, they are political simulators most of the conflicts that have happened in RP wouldn't have ever happened in real life. Nations don't attack others for acts they have commited themselves(Commonwealth take-over of Hungary anyone?), and wars of expansion are certainly out of the question.

This proposal for how I read it doesn't mean unplanned wars cant happen but nations can decide not to recognize them. A kind of lock they cant be invaded without discussion but they can attack either without discussing.

Edited August 24, 2009 by Centurius