Rayvon Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 Wow, you don't get out much do you? Don't you know it's a bad idea to lie to the Sponge?Let's try this again. What would you like to try again? Your timeline/facts are both wrong and incomplete. So - let's try that again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Impero Romano Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 Wow, you don't get out much do you? Don't you know it's a bad idea to lie to the Sponge?Let's try this again. You are missing quite a few things/have a large mistake in your time line...no lies involved. Or do you know that already? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electron Sponge Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) okay.. That could be a little off base but I do hear lots of things. If they want to clear that possible misconception up, I am more than willing to listen to them with an open mind. I think that the situation can best be summed up as some people got a bit fearful, and some unwarranted moves were made, things got heated on all sides, and now this apology is the sole outcome. Don't you know it's a bad idea to lie to the Sponge? Members of the ODN, I come to offer you information on the situation which has arisen. I assure you that its escalation has been very rapid, and that members of our government, as well as multiple allies, have been working for hours on end today to try to avert it.The situation is very complicated, but began as a result of VE demanding additional tech reparations from The International, our ally, after sketchy negotiations following the OV & VE vs. USA war. After extended (and unproductive) discussions about the validity of VE's claim, International and ourselves gave up and offered to pay the demands in order to prevent further escalation. Last night, VE all of a sudden demanded the ZI of Comrade Craig, General Secretary of The International. They felt that his asking us to be involved in negotiations was akin to him conspiring to start a war against them. They stated that it will either be his ZI, or The International will be attacked. Much more talks have been made, but VE has been unable to compromise. Moreover, their diplomatic conduct has been inexcusable. The International will not be releasing Craig, and nor should they. The ODN very much supports their decision. VE (and their associates in OV) have been completely unreasonable, and should they declare on The International over this incident, the ODN will be defending our allies. I urge all ODN members to make individual preparations for war. I do not believe we will be attacked initially, but if we do join in to defend International, we will likely face counter-attacks from third parties. However, we have already been in discussions with our allies, the large majority of which have already expressed their support for us. Please use this thread to discuss the issue, as well ask to ask questions you may have. Let me also be clear: This information is not to leave this forum. Update: After literally over three hours of mediated discussions tonight (in addition to a good four hours at least this afternoon), a proposal to avoid war has been reached. This proposal currently hinges on VE's Lord Cornelius accepting the apology of Craig. For the record, I don't like this. I feel it is an unjust resolution. However, given the very complicated state of world affairs (read: retarded treaty web), it is in our best interests to agree to this peaceful resolution. VE's conduct has been observed by outside parties and there may be additional affects of that in the near future. For now, we are waiting in our stance of moderate preparedness. If VE's Lord accepts the apology then the issue is complete. As I said, this is not my preferred result, however it may work out best for International and ourselves in the long run. More Update: The apology has been posted and accepted. It appears that all parties are standing down. By request of International, I ask that no other ODN members post in the thread. They would like it to just die quickly. edit: do you VE geniuses know how close you were to being a crater? Edited March 19, 2009 by Electron Sponge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Impero Romano Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) edit: do you VE geniuses know how close you were to being a crater? A crater...from ODN...right... You think we are oblivious apparently. Sunstar in his post portrayed the incident in his own special light and without the necessary details as well, but in a way did not get it to far off. Of course we new full well what the sequence of events would be if our hand was forced...however we will never shy away from what we feel is right. You really thought this is news? Also, how does any of that equate to there being lies in my post lol Edit: Fixed that for you, and no sorry its not a CB Edited March 21, 2009 by Il Impero Romano Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade Craig Posted March 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 I repeat my request that no members of the International post in this thread. -Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvon Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) Congrats. You've rooted it all out. Although - even Sunstars post there is full of holes (mostly on purpose for the sake of OPSEC - but also because they failed to read a lot of what is in black and white in front of them). Either way. The issue is dead. It's resolved. Your attempts to re-hash this !@#$%^&* is nothing short of .... Well... Expected ... From the likes of you. E: The request that Ordo Verde members remain cordial towards ODN/INT/Craig still also remains in effect. Edited March 19, 2009 by Rayvon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gen Lee Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 The honorable thing to do when you screw up is make it right and apologize. Well done sir. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groucho Marx Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) A crater...from ODN...right...You think we are oblivious apparently. Sunstar in her post portrayed the incident in her own special light and without the necessary details as well, but in a way did not get it to far off. Of course we new full well what the sequence of events would be if our hand was forced...however we will never shy away from what we feel is right. You really thought this is news? Also, how does any of that equate to there being lies in my post lol When Sponge asks you a question, you answer it. As for the rest of the situation, I'm not familiar with it but I'm glad Comrade Craig was able to come to a peaceful and honorable conclusion to this chain of events over reparations. I'm actually going to go even further and congratulate ODN for aiding our mutual ally in the negotiations, regardless of how VE saw it. Well done gentlemen. Edit: Craig Edited March 19, 2009 by Emperor Marx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlaricTheGreat Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 okay..edit: do you VE geniuses know how close you were to being a crater? Most of the time I find what you post on here as highly informative and entertaining, despite my admission to myself that I don't always know the whole story being presented. However, in this specific case, as you said above, "could be a little off-base." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvon Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 When Sponge asks you a question, you answer it. He doesn't deserve, nor does the situation warrant, a full and complete response to him. Your allies wish this situation remain quiet as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delta1212 Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) As an ally of everyone involved, I'd ask Sponge to please shut the $%&@ up. Aside from benig wrong pretty much across the board on this, I had enough fun tearing my hair out the first time through. I don't need you tossing around random bull trying to stir it back up again, nor do I think anyone involved including me wants to revisit this again. Thank you. Edited March 19, 2009 by Delta1212 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
California King Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 Most of the time I find what you post on here as highly informative and entertaining, despite my admission to myself that I don't always know the whole story being presented. However, in this specific case, as you said above, "could be a little off-base." Pretty much this. Good to see Craig did the right thing. I hope both our allies can move on from this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viridia Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) eh, honestly Sponge I would say one of two things. Either Sunstar doesnt have all his/her facts straight, or the General Membership of ODN was just lied to by their government. Edited March 19, 2009 by Viridia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Impero Romano Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) eh, honestly Sponge I would say one of two things. Either Sunstar doesnt have all his/her facts straight, or the General Membership of ODN was just lied to by their government. Im sure he already knew our side as well as what we know and just felt like getting in a situation where he could put up Sunstars post to try and rehash things. Fortunately, no one has any interest in doing that Edited March 19, 2009 by Il Impero Romano Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Srqt Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) As an ally of everyone involved, I'd ask Sponge to please shut the $%&@ up. Aside from benig wrong pretty much across the board on this, I had enough fun tearing my hair out the first time through. I don't need you tossing around random bull trying to stir it back up again, nor do I think anyone involved including me wants to revisit this again. Thank you. I am going to echo my cupcake friend. I talked a lot with VE and I talked with Int I harassed delta and I saw more logs than any human being should ever have to read. In the end all our friends are happy and their is no need to try and stir it back up. Craig did some things everyone freaked out and that is why this thread exists, not to embarrass anyone, but to show an amicable solution. Edit: )): Kyber )): Edited March 19, 2009 by KingSrqt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dujek Onearm Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 This situation is over, we don't need to keep discussing it any longer, specially here. Good show Craig, I'm very proud to call you and The International my allies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonOfHoward Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) I got 2 words for you Craig. Apology accepted. Edited March 19, 2009 by SonOfHoward Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilzey Land Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 Good to see this finally resolved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vilien Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 Glad this was resolved. No one needs this kind of thing to develop into something that gets blown way out of proportion. Good luck to Viridia and the International. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electron Sponge Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 Im sure he already knew our side as well as what we know and just felt like getting in a situation where he could put up Sunstars post to try and rehash things. Fortunately, no one has any interest in doing that Actually I asked you for your side and I was basically told to get stuffed. If you don't want a viewpoint opposite yours being broadcast unopposed the intelligent thing to do is to tell your side of the story. I said on a couple of different occasions that I was curious what the whole story was. I'd rather not have to deal with using my undercover sources to find things out like this but I can if necessary. Those of you who seem to think that I'm butting in where I'm not wanted and that this should end right here - I've got a question for you. Do you know where you are? This is a public forum and when you make a thread here anyone can reply with any comment they wish within certain guidelines of propriety, and ask questions should they desire to learn more about the situation at hand. Most times, alliances are more than willing to oblige and will give at least a decent sketch of the situation. VE on the other hand seems to think that things can still stay a secret once the ramifications of them are made public. I simply wanted to know "wtf?" and said what I had already heard. I mean come on, there were quite a few alliances that were on a war alert over this and some of us would like to know exactly what the problem was. At the point where I had said what I'd heard, if there was any intelligent leadership in VE they'd have refuted me quite easily with their far more in-depth grasp of the situation. In fact on a couple of occasions I admitted there may be flaws in my knowledge of the situation and I asked for enlightenment promising an open mind. That didn't happen so I posted some of what I've heard so it could be refuted... and I did get about 10 responses via private message, some confirming the side of things I'd already heard and some disputing it hotly. What does it take for someone to answer a simple question in a public discussion? No wonder nothing ever happens anymore - everyone is afraid to have an opinion on things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Srqt Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 (edited) Actually I asked you for your side and I was basically told to get stuffed.If you don't want a viewpoint opposite yours being broadcast unopposed the intelligent thing to do is to tell your side of the story. I said on a couple of different occasions that I was curious what the whole story was. I'd rather not have to deal with using my undercover sources to find things out like this but I can if necessary. Those of you who seem to think that I'm butting in where I'm not wanted and that this should end right here - I've got a question for you. Do you know where you are? This is a public forum and when you make a thread here anyone can reply with any comment they wish within certain guidelines of propriety, and ask questions should they desire to learn more about the situation at hand. Most times, alliances are more than willing to oblige and will give at least a decent sketch of the situation. VE on the other hand seems to think that things can still stay a secret once the ramifications of them are made public. I simply wanted to know "wtf?" and said what I had already heard. I mean come on, there were quite a few alliances that were on a war alert over this and some of us would like to know exactly what the problem was. At the point where I had said what I'd heard, if there was any intelligent leadership in VE they'd have refuted me quite easily with their far more in-depth grasp of the situation. In fact on a couple of occasions I admitted there may be flaws in my knowledge of the situation and I asked for enlightenment promising an open mind. That didn't happen so I posted some of what I've heard so it could be refuted... and I did get about 10 responses via private message, some confirming the side of things I'd already heard and some disputing it hotly. What does it take for someone to answer a simple question in a public discussion? No wonder nothing ever happens anymore - everyone is afraid to have an opinion on things. Of course your free to ask what you want, and even if I was one to say otherwise I really wouldn't have much leverage to use to make you stop. The thing is the majority of people that are telling anyone anything in this situation are the ones who most likely know the least and teh ones that know the most would rather stop beating the dead horse that this is to us. Both INT and VE are close allies to my alliance and this is a situation I have talked to both alliances about daily for at least a week maybe two (I have an awful perception of time). You originally came in here accusing VE of trying to embarrass someone and then in the same breath wanted more details, has it occurred to you that perhaps the withholding of details may be in an attempt to spare that same someone possible embarrassment? That maybe if the whole story were to be spilled out to the public it would become apparent as to why this ended in an apology by this particular person? I have no reason to favor anyone in this situation I was privy to all the information on both sides and I can tell you that no good will come from milling over this. This thread is for VE and INT to kiss and make up and airing dirty laundry will not be very conducive to that purpose. INT and VE are both good alliances and great allies. I am just glad this is over. Edited March 19, 2009 by KingSrqt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raider Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 I for one am glad to see such this issue was worked out peacefully. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Impero Romano Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 As I stated before, neither side felt the details needed to be public as no one actually wanted the situation to be inflamed any further then it already was. Furthermore, the situation was very long and detailed...the public apology was merely a gesture of Craigs sincerity, and it is done. If you are truly concerned you are welcome to come find me in #ve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvon Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 Of course your free to ask what you want, and even if I was one to say otherwise I really wouldn't have much leverage to use to make you stop. The thing is the majority of people that are telling anyone anything in this situation are the ones who most likely know the least and teh ones that know the most would rather stop beating the dead horse that this is to us. Both INT and VE are close allies to my alliance and this is a situation I have talked to both alliances about daily for at least a week maybe two (I have an awful perception of time). This. Yes your free to ask, but we're free to say 'Too bad, you don't need details. Situation is done.' You originally came in here accusing VE of trying to embarrass someone and then in the same breath wanted more details, has it occurred to you that perhaps the withholding of details may be in an attempt to spare that same someone possible embarrassment? That maybe if the whole story were to be spilled out to the public it would become apparent as to why this ended in an apology by this particular person? Also agreed. This ended in an apology. Not war. This is the most important point. Your pushing is just a futile effort to re-hash the feelings. It won't work. I have no reason to favor anyone in this situation I was privy to all the information on both sides and I can tell you that no good will come from milling over this. This thread is for VE and INT to kiss and make up and airing dirty laundry will not be very conducive to that purpose.INT and VE are both good alliances and great allies. I am just glad this is over. You should favour OV dammit - forget VE and INT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sethb Posted March 19, 2009 Report Share Posted March 19, 2009 Glad to see this mess finally worked out. An craig thank you for doing the right thing here, you have earned my respect. o/OV o/VE o/INT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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