A call to the Maratha

[Mogar]

I think you misunderstand the will of Allarchon and Mushqaeda as a whole.  

 

but ok. 

Please, feel free to explain why out of any targets to rogue, you pick a small unconnected alliance instead of someone able to actually fight back against you, if you had picked GPA or someone where it was an even match, I may have more respect for you, but instead you hit someone with less upper tier nations and someone you knew would be unprepared for any level of aggression.

[Innerspeaker]

you attack what amounts to civilians for no reason other than boredom, you and your ilk used very similar actions by Q as reason to justify rolling Pacifica twice, what gives you the right to do what you spoke out against only a few years ago?

but these civilians have guns and buy tech and get a free pass to score points from out of bounds.

 

there was like, 1 TDO nation in peace mode when the will of Allarchon presented itself to Mushqaeda. The other ~100 were in war mode. Each of my opponents had nukes when I declared. Each had a full airforce, military wonders, etc. The nations I'm fighting now were certainly not "civilian" nations, by any means. They are merely incompetent; the wealthy inept.

 

I don't remember you posting a neutral-menace call to arms when Doomhouse rolled over the Superfriends, or when Continuum plowed into each of its opponents. Where were their ideals? When the chips are down and you've found yourself pinned between the crosshairs of a mushlim army, the neutrals won't ride in to defend you, Mogar. They're the most selfish, lazy institutions this world has ever known. They exist solely to see themselves grow until this world has dissolved into nothing. They're worthless in the literal sense of the word. You're arguing for the idealistic defense of the idealistically-bankrupt. 

Edited September 21, 2013 by Gairyuki

[Mogar]

but these civilians have guns and buy tech and get a free pass to score points from out of bounds.

 

there was like, 1 TDO nation in peace mode when the will of Allarchon presented itself to Mushqaeda. The other ~100 were in war mode. Each of my opponents had nukes when I declared. Each had a full airforce, military wonders, etc. The nations I'm fighting now were certainly not "civilian" nations, by any means.

 

I don't remember you posting a neutral-menace call to arms when Doomhouse rolled over the Superfriends, or when Continuum plowed into each of its opponents. Where were their ideals? When the chips are down and you've found yourself pinned between the crosshairs of a mushlim army, the neutrals won't ride in to defend you, Mogar. They're the most selfish, lazy institutions this world has ever known. They exist solely to see themselves grow until this world has dissolved into nothing. They're worthless in the literal sense of the word. You're arguing for the idealistic defense of the idealistically-bankrupt. 

these civilians have done no aggressive actions towards you, you make yourselves no better than Pacifica was rolling GPA.

 

Peace mode has economic penalties, and I would bet your opponents did not have a military alliance level of war chests, it must be so hard to defeat people who have never fired a shot.

 

I didnt ask the neutrals to help because DH rolling SF had nothing to do with neutrality, unless you want to count CSN getting rolled after surrendering and claiming neutrality. Q committed their crimes and actually had to pay for them, I fought in IRAN for Q specifically to ensure I atoned for my crimes. Mushqaeda wants to commit the crimes and then receive no punishment. I've never put myself into a situation expecting anyone but myself for help, I will be here to say I told you so to GPA and WTF should Mushqaeda continue this crusade against neutrality. Peace is not a selfish institution, peace is a philosophy people should be allowed to live by if they so choose, and the rest of the world should allow them to live in peace instead of treating them as prey.

Edited September 21, 2013 by Mogar

[Gibsonator21]

Not defending your Ideals is dumb.

Have fun defending yours. I'll be over here with mine not giving a crap.

[Joe Kremlin]

Neutrals have no problem sitting on the sidelines watching atrocities committed despite having the strength to stop them. I have no pity for them now.

[Mogar]

Have fun defending yours. I'll be over here with mine not giving a crap.

infra is fleeting, casualties are forever!

 

Neutrals have no problem sitting on the sidelines watching atrocities committed despite having the strength to stop them. I have no pity for them now.

your alliance is certainly not one I expect to enter on any side other than perhaps MQ's.

[Gibsonator21]

infra is fleeting, casualties are forever!

 

your alliance is certainly not one I expect to enter on any side other than perhaps MQ's.

I have other ideas, ones that benefit me and my ideals more. :>

[Ernesto Che Guevara]

No MQ member below my rank may post in this thread. 

[Sumo 845]

You should declare on MK, they are the real masters behind this.

[Sumo 845]

Sorry, double post.

Edited September 21, 2013 by Sumo 845

[Commander shepard]

 

 

Ok, you have my approval. 

[Mogar]

You should declare on MK, they are the real masters behind this.

MK is more than welcome to fire upon me or TDO, until that happens I'll focus on those hitting TDO.

 

Ok, you have my approval. 

I have plenty more where that came from, I will win you all over one gif at a time if need be!

[tamerlane]

Nice soap box. 

Edited September 21, 2013 by tamerlane

[magicninja]

We don't even care...whether or not we care...

[Mogar]

Nice soap box. 

you gave me a nice spot to set mine up right across from yours.

 

We don't even care...whether or not we care...

I can't stop you from letting the apathy consume you, I simply offer a different path.

[tamerlane]

you gave me a nice spot to set mine up right across from yours.

 

I can't stop you from letting the apathy consume you, I simply offer a different path.

 

 

I wasn't commenting on the location. 

[commanderragnar]

Have fun I guess. Something that's always bothered me, who the hell is that in your avi?

[Ubuntu the Great]

This shall not be tolerated !

[enderland]

The entire political world here would have stopped existing a long time ago if people didn't try to force their will on others.

 

MQ attacking TDO is just another facet of it (interestingly so is your post).

[Hereno]

TDO did nothing but expect to be left alone in peace, If you think attacking what amounts to civilians in our world is acceptable, then feel free to support MQ.

 

My problems with this post are twofold: that TDO "did nothing but expect to be left alone", and that TDO amount to "civilians".

 

Being a neutral alliance does not excuse you from building a strong nation, militarily. There are many people who support the rights of alliances to remain neutral. However, to believe that nobody would ever attack you, ever, is to invite conflict such as that between the MQ rogue group and TDO. If TDO's military capabilities are that of civilians, then only TDO is to blame for that, and I do not feel sorry for them if they were so arrogant as to believe that they were beyond being attacked. Especially considering the rather high amount of rogues that all of the neutrals have to face regardless.

 

Furthermore, considering that TDO is not a grouping of nations, but an alliance, nations can join and leave as they see fit. Many people have joined neutrals, buffed up their nations, and then jumped back out into the world of serious inter-alliance politicking. They are part of this world just as much as you, me, or our respective alliances. They are (potential) fair game for anyone who has a grievance with them, but are normally protected by precedence, people wanting there to be a right to neutrality, individual relations with members within the neutral alliance (which even more shows that neutrals are not civilians), and the fact that attacking a neutral is politically inconvenient and a waste of a lot of NS.

 

In short, while your posts are clearly in favor of TDO, I feel as though you view neutrals in the same way that many people do: as blobs that just sort of sit around gathering infrastructure, contributing nothing to the larger world, and not at all dealing with any politics, planning, or military action. Rather, neutrals are alliances which have taken on a specific place within the cyberverse, that have to deal with all of the problems of normal alliances, but just from a different perspective.

 

If you want to see a neutral alliance doing it right, in comparison to TDO, look at GPA, who are no doubt having serious discussions over this major attack on a fellow neutral alliance. It wouldn't even surprise me if they were gearing themselves up militarily and considering military action to protect their interests - that is, the precedent that neutral alliances are not to be attacked. But isn't looking out for your interests the same kind of task that a normal alliance has? Of course. And we have alliances who slack off that aren't neutral as well - you know, those follower alliances which just sort of roll with the tides of whatever the movers and shakers have come up with. So if TDO dropped the ball - which it appears they have - the only people who can be blamed for that are TDO. Probably for making the same bad assumptions that you did - that simply declaring yourself neutral is enough to prevent all serious attacks eternally. Neutrality is not, and should not be, an excuse for laziness.

Edited September 21, 2013 by Hereno

[BraveLeader]

We at The Democratic Order sincerely thank you Mogar for taking on the individual decision to join us in the war against Mushqaeda.  We thank you for your willingness to fight for morals and for your dedication to the war effort.

[Custodian]

 Neutrality is not, and should not be, an excuse for laziness.

 

The trouble with that statement is that it implies that 'laziness' is identical with not following the agenda of the non-neutrals, when in fact neglecting the things non-neutrals think important is the essence of neutrality.  No neutral alliance has ever positioned itself so as to have the means to impose its agenda on others - that's why being a 'successful' neutral is not inconsistent with being  an alliance with little influence on our world.

 

The Doombird/MQ war on TDO might well establish that an unsanctioned neutral alliance is less well placed to win wars than a militaristic alliance with aspirations to hegemony.  But I suspect that won't be news to anyone here, and it certainly won't count as a criticism of the neutral ethos that it is not suited to achieving something that it never aspired to achieve in the first place.

[Louis XVI]

You'll fall just as hard as any other neutral.

[Mogar]

I wasn't commenting on the location. 

Of course not, I merely wanted to remind you that you stand on the same ground I do, merely the other side of the coin, so to speak.

 

Have fun I guess. Something that's always bothered me, who the hell is that in your avi?

Ariana Grande, Mogatopia's queen! OOC: since boxxy happened way back when I realized using someone famous as my sig avi made it alot easier to find resource materials.

 

This shall not be tolerated !

We all control our fates, every nation counts towards helping our neutral brothers and sisters.

 

The entire political world here would have stopped existing a long time ago if people didn't try to force their will on others.

 

MQ attacking TDO is just another facet of it (interestingly so is your post).

good to see my intentions not lost upon you, I understand MQ's goals, I just will do what I do best to try to stop them.

 

My problems with this post are twofold: that TDO "did nothing but expect to be left alone", and that TDO amount to "civilians".

 

Being a neutral alliance does not excuse you from building a strong nation, militarily. There are many people who support the rights of alliances to remain neutral. However, to believe that nobody would ever attack you, ever, is to invite conflict such as that between the MQ rogue group and TDO. If TDO's military capabilities are that of civilians, then only TDO is to blame for that, and I do not feel sorry for them if they were so arrogant as to believe that they were beyond being attacked. Especially considering the rather high amount of rogues that all of the neutrals have to face regardless.

 

Furthermore, considering that TDO is not a grouping of nations, but an alliance, nations can join and leave as they see fit. Many people have joined neutrals, buffed up their nations, and then jumped back out into the world of serious inter-alliance politicking. They are part of this world just as much as you, me, or our respective alliances. They are (potential) fair game for anyone who has a grievance with them, but are normally protected by precedence, people wanting there to be a right to neutrality, individual relations with members within the neutral alliance (which even more shows that neutrals are not civilians), and the fact that attacking a neutral is politically inconvenient and a waste of a lot of NS.

 

In short, while your posts are clearly in favor of TDO, I feel as though you view neutrals in the same way that many people do: as blobs that just sort of sit around gathering infrastructure, contributing nothing to the larger world, and not at all dealing with any politics, planning, or military action. Rather, neutrals are alliances which have taken on a specific place within the cyberverse, that have to deal with all of the problems of normal alliances, but just from a different perspective.

 

If you want to see a neutral alliance doing it right, in comparison to TDO, look at GPA, who are no doubt having serious discussions over this major attack on a fellow neutral alliance. It wouldn't even surprise me if they were gearing themselves up militarily and considering military action to protect their interests - that is, the precedent that neutral alliances are not to be attacked. But isn't looking out for your interests the same kind of task that a normal alliance has? Of course. And we have alliances who slack off that aren't neutral as well - you know, those follower alliances which just sort of roll with the tides of whatever the movers and shakers have come up with. So if TDO dropped the ball - which it appears they have - the only people who can be blamed for that are TDO. Probably for making the same bad assumptions that you did - that simply declaring yourself neutral is enough to prevent all serious attacks eternally. Neutrality is not, and should not be, an excuse for laziness.

I sincerely doubt GPA's war machine is going to get rolling over this, but I would certainly feel accomplished if they did, I am curious to hear what you think TDO could have done differently in this situation and still stuck to their neutral ideals though.

 

We at The Democratic Order sincerely thank you Mogar for taking on the individual decision to join us in the war against Mushqaeda.  We thank you for your willingness to fight for morals and for your dedication to the war effort.

No thanks needed, simply stand besides me and fight for your own ideals and morals, that is all I need for victory.

[Hereno]

The trouble with that statement is that it implies that 'laziness' is identical with not following the agenda of the non-neutrals, when in fact neglecting the things non-neutrals think important is the essence of neutrality.  No neutral alliance has ever positioned itself so as to have the means to impose its agenda on others - that's why being a 'successful' neutral is not inconsistent with being  an alliance with little influence on our world.
 
The Doombird/MQ war on TDO might well establish that an unsanctioned neutral alliance is less well placed to win wars than a militaristic alliance with aspirations to hegemony.  But I suspect that won't be news to anyone here, and it certainly won't count as a criticism of the neutral ethos that it is not suited to achieving something that it never aspired to achieve in the first place.

 
If the essence of neutrality was to become a hermit alliance which doesn't interact with the rest of the world, then you wouldn't be posting here right now. Would you stop buying infrastructure because normal alliances do that as well? Neutrality is, no more no less, existing without any formal treaties and remaining neutral in global conflicts.
 

Of course not, I merely wanted to remind you that you stand on the same ground I do, merely the other side of the coin, so to speak.

I sincerely doubt GPA's war machine is going to get rolling over this, but I would certainly feel accomplished if they did, I am curious to hear what you think TDO could have done differently in this situation and still stuck to their neutral ideals though.

 

Well, there are other neutral alliances - Grey Council, GPA, and WTF, to name a few of the more prominent ones. Why is it that TDO were the targets and not the others? Therein lies the answer. Not to endorse the MQ attacks, either - I am not trying to speak for or on behalf of the rogues or TDO.