Announcement From The German Empire

[Karl I]

the first reformation was laughable..
the mocking reformation was epic beyond words..
the second reformation is a disgrace..

TGE isn't meant to be reformed and should remain DEAD!!! it died w/ it's REAL Emperor/Kaiser

o/ KFred

on another note.. I know of a few former TGE members who will never return to this mockery alliance who calls themselves TGE!!!

[Bob]

[quote name='Karl I' timestamp='1310866082' post='2757456']


the first reformation was laughable..
the mocking reformation was epic beyond words..
the second reformation is a disgrace..

TGE isn't meant to be reformed and should remain DEAD!!! it died w/ it's REAL Emperor/Kaiser

o/ KFred

on another note.. I know of a few former TGE members who will never return to this mockery alliance who calls themselves TGE!!!
[/quote]
I'm not sure you used enough emoticons. You really illustrated your point well though, congrats.

Edited July 17, 2011 by Penlugue Solaris

[Centurius]

[quote name='Karl I' timestamp='1310866082' post='2757456']


the first reformation was laughable..
the mocking reformation was epic beyond words..
the second reformation is a disgrace..

TGE isn't meant to be reformed and should remain DEAD!!! it died w/ it's REAL Emperor/Kaiser

o/ KFred

on another note.. I know of a few former TGE members who will never return to this mockery alliance who calls themselves TGE!!!
[/quote]

Considering the great achievements the old one made and reputation it had, this one can only go up.

Edited July 17, 2011 by Centurius

[Karl I]

KFred was a TRUE Kaiser/Emperor.. who made great achievements.. it's [i]idiots[/i] who tried to rule it after KFred who corrupted it's reputation!!


and the way I'm seeing it, this so called Kaiser Wilhelm I, seems like a puppet to me..

Edited July 17, 2011 by Karl I

[wes the wise]

[quote name='Boogeyman657' timestamp='1310857858' post='2757407']
Someone gets it!
[/quote]

So you guys think its ok to message other alliance's membership and ask them to join your own? I can understand your point, but you don't find poaching the least bit dishonorable?

[steodonn]

[quote name='wes the wise' timestamp='1310868715' post='2757485']
So you guys think its ok to message other alliance's membership and ask them to join your own? I can understand your point, but you don't find poaching the least bit dishonorable?
[/quote]

This is a perfectly acceptable thing to do. IF your member are easily poached by such a message to poacher would be doing the alliance a favor

[Ashoka the Great]

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1310846908' post='2757320']
Nice to see that NoR can recognize their mistakes and try to fix them. Congratulations.
[/quote]

There were no mistakes.

[quote name='Anger' timestamp='1310850960' post='2757358']
Heh, I think you're misunderstanding what I meant exactly, I was just pointing out the facts. I had no problems with you attacking TGE, I was just stating you weren't as generous as you are now to TGE on Wilhelm's first reformation. No offense meant by it. I'm a fan of NoR if anything so apoligies if I came across as slandering you.
[/quote]

[i]Mea culpa[/i].

[quote name='Comrade Craig' timestamp='1310856363' post='2757396']
....TGE's entire raison d'etre was to harass NoR and NoV... [/quote]

Well, at least you've finally admitted to this. For years we'd been saying the only reason you and FOK held on to TGE was that they were "not NoR/NoV," and you guys repeatedly denied it.

The truth has set you free.

[wes the wise]

[quote name='steodonn' timestamp='1310868925' post='2757489']
This is a perfectly acceptable thing to do. IF your member are easily poached by such a message to poacher would be doing the alliance a favor
[/quote]


SO, if I were to attempt to recruit members of say, MK, via means of IRC, in game PM, or forum PM, MK would not care?

[Britishdude]

[quote name='wes the wise' timestamp='1310869245' post='2757497']
SO, if I were to attempt to recruit members of say, MK, via means of IRC, in game PM, or forum PM, MK would not care?
[/quote]

Why would you want to recruit MK members?

[Trout]

[quote name='wes the wise' timestamp='1310869245' post='2757497']
SO, if I were to attempt to recruit members of say, MK, via means of IRC, in game PM, or forum PM, MK would not care?
[/quote]
Probably not.

[MaGneT]

[quote name='Frederick III' timestamp='1310812185' post='2757184']
No, Just no. Seriously, get out. Now.
[/quote]
Stomp your foot louder and pout a little more, it might work.
[i]Do something about it....[/i] lest you be known as an impotent dethroned crybaby.


wait
[quote name='Karl I' timestamp='1310866082' post='2757456']


the first reformation was laughable..
the mocking reformation was epic beyond words..
the second reformation is a disgrace..

TGE isn't meant to be reformed and should remain DEAD!!! it died w/ it's REAL Emperor/Kaiser

o/ KFred

on another note.. I know of a few former TGE members who will never return to this mockery alliance who calls themselves TGE!!!
[/quote]
[quote name='Karl I' timestamp='1310868681' post='2757484']
KFred was a TRUE Kaiser/Emperor.. who made great achievements.. it's [i]idiots[/i] who tried to rule it after KFred who corrupted it's reputation!!


and the way I'm seeing it, this so called Kaiser Wilhelm I, seems like a puppet to me..
[/quote]
1) TGE was never a good alliance. It was never well-regarded. It was never respected. It was a group of children who happened to be able to latch on to the Germanic pride folk who were a bit tentative about their nationalism.
2) I find it funny that you're talking about mockery alliances, given your AA. It was KoH that had a hissy fit about Wilhelm trying to rekindle old connections, was it not? What a joke...

[quote name='wes the wise' timestamp='1310869245' post='2757497']
SO, if I were to attempt to recruit members of say, MK, via means of IRC, in game PM, or forum PM, MK would not care?
[/quote]
No, because MK, like all alliances run by savvy and intelligent folk, understand that each ruler retains the right to make sovereign decision about which alliance they choose to be a part of. If a friend asks a friend to join their alliance, there is nothing wrong with that. If you object to someone leaving your alliance and joining another, that's completely childish. The only objectionable behavior that could be tied to this would be broad recruitment messages sent to an entire AA.

If Kingdom of Hyrule got mad because Wilhelm decided to message their entire alliance saying "come join TGE," that would be mildly understandable. Instead, they got mad because they harbor the delusion that their members' sovereignty belongs to the government. Frankly, if I were a member of that alliance, I would take note of the fact that my government is so insecure in its own ability to retain members that it is censoring the world around me in a desperate attempt to remain mildly viable and I'd make a swift exit. I'd advise any members of KoH to do just that, as no one should be part of an alliance that comes in between you and your freedom of choice in alliance membership.

[Vladimir Nikanor]

[quote name='MaGneT' timestamp='1310873346' post='2757548']
If Kingdom of Hyrule got mad because Wilhelm decided to message their entire alliance saying "come join TGE," that would be mildly understandable. Instead, they got mad because they harbor the delusion that their members' sovereignty belongs to the government. Frankly, if I were a member of that alliance, I would take note of the fact that my government is so insecure in its own ability to retain members that it is censoring the world around me in a desperate attempt to remain mildly viable and I'd make a swift exit. I'd advise any members of KoH to do just that, as no one should be part of an alliance that comes in between you and your freedom of choice in alliance membership.
[/quote]
I like the point you made in this paragraph. Well put indeed.

[Kaiser Wilhelm I]

[quote name='Vladimir Nikanor' timestamp='1310875275' post='2757577']
I like the point you made in this paragraph. Well put indeed.
[/quote]

Agreed, well said.

[Nemhauser]

[quote name='D34th' timestamp='1310846908' post='2757320']
Nice to see that NoR can recognize their mistakes and try to fix them. Congratulations.
[/quote]
What mistakes?

[quote name='Karl I' timestamp='1310868681' post='2757484']
KFred was a TRUE Kaiser/Emperor.. who made great achievements..
[/quote]
I am so going to quote this in the funny section on our boards.

Edited July 17, 2011 by Nemhauser

[AnCapistan]

Oh great, you came back? We don't need another !@#$%* German nationalism themed alliance.

Oh and even better, you're going to be NoR's !@#$%*.

Edited July 17, 2011 by Mr Damsky

[Ashoka the Great]

[quote name='Karl I' timestamp='1310868681' post='2757484']
KFred was a TRUE Kaiser/Emperor.. who made great achievements.. it's [i]idiots[/i] who tried to rule it after KFred who corrupted it's reputation!!
[/quote]

I can't believe I missed this one.

Great achievements? TGE's entire reason for existing was to serve as 'not NoR/NoV' and that's it. It was founded by someone with a grudge against Nordreich for the sole purpose of serving as an alternative our adversaries could support. That's why TGE 1.0's allies kept putting up with the idiocy displayed by [b]every[/b] leader of the alliance.

Go have a chat with those former friends and ask them what they really thought of TGE under anyone's leadership. Odds are they'll tell you what they've told so many others; that TGE was a running joke of an alliance from Day One. TGE's former allies have described K-Fred as either "dense" or "extremely difficult to deal with." And that's what they've said to me, by the way. I can't imagine what they've said to each other in private, but somehow I suspect it isn't any gentler.




Returning to the real matter at hand, however....

When NoR returned there was an expectation in terms of the way in which we would do business. I think it's safe to say that we have pretty much dashed those expectations on more than two years of activity. Any comparison between Nordreich now and Nordreich in 2006-07 (or, for that matter, NoV in 2007-08) is really quite pointless, and anyone who makes the comparison is not someone we take seriously. Some of the people in the alliance are the same, but that's about it. The fact that Nordreich 2.0 has thus far lasted more than six times longer than the original would seem to indicate we're doing something right. I'll leave it to others to discuss what that something might be.

Today, TGE has an opportunity to get it right from the beginning. Many have pointed out that by the end of its first run, TGE had pretty much destroyed its reputation. I don't think anyone within TGE (then or now) can deny this and still keep a straight face. So it's right to be wary of their reformation, just as many were concerned about ours.

Will TGE succeed in breaking free of its past? Beats me. My crystal ball is broken. But I'm not about to deny them that opportunity. I'm not going to utter any self-evident, trite, moronic "Haters gonna hate" nonsense. (Seriously, anyone who uses that phrase except in an ironic way does not deserve to be treated as a grown-up. Those of you who think it actually means something....ugh....lost causes.) I'll just say, "Let time tell." If they manage to avoid their predecessor's mistakes, good for them. If not, then perhaps some of the current detractors are right and the brand itself carries some kind of 'curse' with it.

They feel the need to try, and we're going to try to help them. Sorry if this bothers some of you. Perhaps an antacid would help.

[MutedFaith]

Brb, reforming Norden Verein and getting a protectorate from LSF.

[Megamickel]

[quote name='Ashoka the Great' timestamp='1310882512' post='2757644']I'm not going to utter any self-evident, trite, moronic "Haters gonna hate" nonsense. (Seriously, anyone who uses that phrase except in an ironic way does not deserve to be treated as a grown-up.)
[/quote]
Haters gonna hate
Seriously though, you put it perfectly. This is the ONLY way a TGE reformation could happen - and whether it works out or not, we know this is the right decision.

[Kamek]

You were recruiting new nations to join TGE while you were hiding in NoR, the very alliance that was rolling them. You're a complete coward.

You couldn't just start your own alliance, you had to take the name of a reputable one so you could recruit easier. It's much easier to tell people "Come back home", than to do your own thing and actually put some work into it.

So you decide to bring back TGE from the dead, a decision that a lot of former TGE members are all ready ticked off about, and then you have the audacity to choose NoR, their long time hated enemy, as their protector? Who do you think you are?

Edited July 17, 2011 by Kamek

[Vladimir Nikanor]

[quote name='MutedFaith' timestamp='1310896285' post='2757698']
Brb, reforming Norden Verein and getting a protectorate from LSF.
[/quote]
Honestly, if you did that, I wouldn't care at all. Really. You see, that Norden Verein would not be the original. Anyone with sense can tell the original from the reformed. Of course when it comes to TGE, the more appropriate titles would be "Deformed" and "Reformed".

Don't be mad because we helped reform the only Puppet Anti-NoR Alliance you ever had and flipped its FA resolve. I don't know if this is jealousy, anger (of a lost opportunity), or outright anger because you're too busy believing in what you wanted TGE to be instead of what it really was. The old TGE was terrible. This is not an NoR resolve; but rather an international one. If you honestly went all this time believing that TGE was a good ally, I feel sorry for you. From this side of the fence, we wanted you to let TGE go for two reasons.

1.) We wanted to kill them
2.) Some of us legitimately felt sorry for you guys; as many of us [i]do[/i] respect INT

It's simple really. This situation is also simple. We're speaking of an Alliance that is not the original. Now; had this been reformed with Kaiser Frederick and yet became our friend and was Anti-INT; then I could see room for anger. But mind you this reformation is not Anti anything with the exception of Anti-Kaiser Frederick. Which, if they want to live, is logical in every sense.

[quote]You were recruiting new nations to join TGE while you were hiding in NoR, the very alliance that was rolling them. You're a complete coward.

You couldn't just start your own alliance, you had to take the name of a reputable one so you could recruit easier. It's much easier to tell people "Come back home", than to do your own thing and actually put some work into it.

So you decide to bring back TGE from the dead, a decision that a lot of former TGE members are all ready ticked off about, and then you have the audacity to choose NoR, their long time hated enemy, as their protector? Who do you think you are? [/quote]
What in God's name was "reputable" about TGE? Really? I'm tired of people using the "TGE was Honorable, you're ruining their name" argument on this one. Stop it; it's ridiculous. Really. When it comes to Reputation for this TGE, the sky is going to be the limit. It can really only go up from here.

Edited July 17, 2011 by Vladimir Nikanor

[Kamek]

[quote name='Megamickel' timestamp='1310911836' post='2757763']
Haters gonna hate
Seriously though, you put it perfectly. This is the ONLY way a TGE reformation could happen - and whether it works out or not, we know this is the right decision.
[/quote]

If getting NoR's permission to form and NoR's protection to not get destroyed was absolutely THE ONLY way for this to happen, then we all ready know that this is clearly the wrong decision for TGE. No need to, wait and figure it out. The only thing that this new alliance and TGE have in common is a name.

EDIT IN RESPONSE TO VLAD:

I'm not saying TGE was this great alliance. I'm just saying it's a cheap way to get some easy recruitment.

Edited July 17, 2011 by Kamek

[Vladimir Nikanor]

[quote name='Kamek' timestamp='1310921329' post='2757821']The only thing that this new alliance and TGE have in common is a name.
[/quote]
Hey! Somebody finally gets it! THIS IS THE POINT OF THEM REFORMING. They are not trying to be like the original. This is not some fantastic plot to steal the Charter, Directive, and other Intellectual Properties of a joke of an Alliance and then put it into drive with the opposite FA Directive. This is somebody who likes the name reforming something.

OOC: If you REALLY think this game could go on for years without someone out there coming up with "The German Empire" as an Alliance name, you're ridiculous. This isn't the terrible Alliance you once loved (how ANYONE could adore such an abomination is beyond me), this is something different. Him recruiting while under our protection wasn't cowardly, it was smart. Had he tried that whilst we were attacking him; he would have brought more people under our attacks. Which would have been dishonorable for someone to do. Not to mention reckless in a Foreign Affairs sense.

[CnaedmacAilpn]

This whole thread is rapidly becoming a farce.

Frankly who gives a damn. NoR has their view, those opposed, theirs. Perhaps all parties should just shut up and let these people who are called TGE give it a shot. Either it will be complete fail, or not.

It is just that as long as people keep going at it, the only people that count, namely those trying to make this alliance work, have no chance to prove one side or the other, either right or wrong.

Do I have my opinions on the validity of this, of course, am I certain of the outcome, equally so. However my AA is not TGE, so like all the rest of you whose AA is not TGE, give it a rest.

[Kamek]

[quote name='Vladimir Nikanor' timestamp='1310921672' post='2757822']
Hey! Somebody finally gets it! THIS IS THE POINT OF THEM REFORMING. They are not trying to be like the original. This is not some fantastic plot to steal the Charter, Directive, and other Intellectual Properties of a joke of an Alliance and then put it into drive with the opposite FA Directive. This is somebody who likes the name reforming something.

OOC: If you REALLY think this game could go on for years without someone out there coming up with "The German Empire" as an Alliance name, you're ridiculous. This isn't the terrible Alliance you once loved (how ANYONE could adore such an abomination is beyond me), this is something different. Him recruiting while under our protection wasn't cowardly, it was smart. Had he tried that whilst we were attacking him; he would have brought more people under our attacks. Which would have been dishonorable for someone to do. Not to mention reckless in a Foreign Affairs sense.
[/quote]

He WAS recruiting new nations while NoR was attacking people on that AA. By that, I mean, NEW (NOOBS TO CYBERNATIONS) nations were switching to "The German Empire" in game, unknowingly digging their own grave for NoR to bury them. I know this because I got messages from people who I was recruiting telling me they were joining TGE, and actually switching to that AA, while he sat in NoR, and while you were attacking TGE.

Dude, I never liked TGE. I don't think they were this great alliance. I'm just saying it's kind of a lazy way to get recruits. Taking an old name that people recogonized and called home for a long time, and then messaging old members telling them to come back. It's just stupid. But hey, congrats on the new protectorate NoR. I'm sure this will be great to watch.

[Vladimir Nikanor]

[quote name='Kamek' timestamp='1310922088' post='2757826']
He WAS recruiting new nations while NoR was attacking people on that AA. By that, I mean, NEW (NOOBS TO CYBERNATIONS) nations were switching to "The German Empire" in game, unknowingly digging their own grave for NoR to bury them. I know this because I got messages from people who I was recruiting telling me they were joining TGE, and actually switching to that AA, while he sat in NoR, and while you were attacking TGE.

Dude, I never liked TGE. I don't think they were this great alliance. I'm just saying it's kind of a lazy way to get recruits. Taking an old name that people recogonized and called home for a long time, and then messaging old members telling them to come back. It's just stupid. But hey, congrats on the new protectorate NoR. I'm sure this will be great to watch.
[/quote]
Hmm, understood.