R3nowned

[quote name='Lamuella' timestamp='1299430306' post='2654473'] surely the point is that you aren't obligated to attack. It opens the door of admission to a conflict without meaning you have to step through it. For the people you would absolutely definitely without a shadow of a doubt help out under all circumstances, sign an MDP. For those who you would probably help out, but don't feel the same obligation towards, sign an ODP. [/quote] But what then, is the difference between a non-chaining MDP then? It also opens the door of admission to conflict without meaning you have to step through it. That's why it's optional. That's why it's ridiculous to ask for reps from an alliance that went in on an ODP.

Yes, that's why you should control your own war through the use of ODPs and only use MDPs with allies that you know you will die for, regardless of what they did to get into war. More value needs to be placed on both ODPs and MDPs

[quote name='Myzebedeeistaken' timestamp='1299396493' post='2654229'] One significant difference is that of when one of the treaty partners is directly attacked and there is no chain. A mutual defence pact will automatically be activated (subject to the conditions and provisos usually included in such a treaty - usually along the lines 'if you've been a !@#$% and get slapped for it, this treaty becomes optional') whereas an optional defence pact will remain, well, optional. Can see the thrust of your argument, but differences there are. [/quote] What on earth is the point of an ODP then, if you're not going to honour it? For me, if an ODP partner is attacked, the treaty is activated. Why else would I sign that treaty? Back on topic, activated ODPs aren't a reason for reps any more than any MDP treaty. The only difference between the two treaties in my view is the degree of how close an alliance is to each other.

Non chaining is probably the worst addition to treaties in CN ever. It's one of products of this massive treaty web that's spun up, and I suspect that if they were abolished, more people would be more careful of who they treatied with, rather than treatying anything that moves. Think about it. What difference is there from a non chaining MDoAP to an oDoAP treaty? Absolutely none! You're basically saying that you'll only definitely defend your treaty partner in case of a preemptive attack, and how common is that? (well, it's more common these days, but I hope for that trend to die out after this war) In other words, you're basically saying to your treaty partner that you might defend them when time comes, when it suits your purpose. Absolutely no difference to an ODP. Non-chaining treaties. Get rid of them. *Subject not applicable to bloc treaties. That's another thing altogether.

We're on the rise and unstoppable

Go get 'em PR Good luck in your wars

go get 'em CD

[quote name='Penkala' timestamp='1299159246' post='2651090'] So if I were to sign a blanket ODP with every alliance in the world (DT did the same thing... just with a bunch of alliances on all conceivable sides), and selectively choose which to honor, allowing me to hit whichever alliance I please, I'd be fine and should never be subjected to reps? After all, since I have a treaty, I'm in the clear in your eyes, right? In addition, I maintain that, given the fact that DT and LoSS have no other treaties, and seeing the way DT talks about LoSS, they are not friends. They activated that treaty to join a side of the war, not to defend a friend. Why should an alliance that chooses to bandwagon onto the side they're most tied to be given white peace? [/quote] Every MDP+ treaty signed these days ARE ODPs. There's absolutely no difference between a non-chaining MDP and an ODP. [quote name='Schattenmann' timestamp='1299188387' post='2651498'] Edit2: That's right! Sun WuKong--a top 100 nation--deleted in that period, and daggarz left. CSN just sucks at war. [/quote] SWK finally deleted? I'll miss that old fart...

good luck NoR, not that you'll need it.

eh, this publication was lacking compared to some previous ones...

Where do I sign up?

Good luck with moving forward. I know what it's like, and it is a difficult road ahead.

I never mentioned any "side". I used the term "group", and CSN is certainly within that "group" of alliances.

This gets a hail o/ Wolfpack

Spoiler alert: We're awesome

Congrats on peace guys! Sweet terms O.o

LSF or INT are the alliances for you. I'm not sure other socialist/communist alliances still exist.

Seriously? Reps? For a micro? I haven't seen something this ridiculous since the DT reps Grats on peace though Edit: Is VE offering KoH protection during the terms? Or are they out on their own? Since Polar is busy...

If NoR goes through with this... helping the same group of alliances that, by force, took 20k tech from their ally DT, well... That's just stupid isn't it?

Damn, this is fantastic! This must be like, the best spy ever

1 year birthday coming up! Join us in the celebrations!

Terrible terms are terrible Seriously, 20k tech? Congrats on peace though.

You won't be seeing them for a very long time then

Is this a morale boosting post from GOONS? Because the OP is pretty retarded...

You should join us, we have good stuff.