A joint R&R/AiD/Echelon Announcement....

[bigjoepryde]

Rudolph was there and saw most of the communication mainly the communication between me and the rogues and the other govt so i wouldnt call him a puppet for sitting in the channel watching whats happening

[Rudolph]

[quote name='EgoFreaky' timestamp='1294534288' post='2569074']
No... Polar is sticking up for their ally as well, so was tLW earlier today. I respect both of them for that.

You're a puppet because you just blindly repeat keve's story without making an attempt to hear 2 sides of it. Which makes you a puppet who's opinion is forgotten 5 minutes after this is over without it ever having helped your ally.
[/quote]
And I will say it again.

I was in their private/ally channel when this went down, I know what happened on both sides. Keve did all that he could with the time he was available on IRC when this started turning to a cluster$%&@. Yes, Keve did say some things he shouldn't have. But we all make mistakes in this land.

The fact that it's become this overblown over such a routine matter is what I am reiterating. Granted, I give you props for the patience given Keve's random popups on IRC. Which I guess has played a part in this whole mess.

This whole mess is a sad state of affairs which should have not blown the way it has.

[The Archduke]

If the Minister of Foreign Affairs may make a private statement:
1) Anson negotiated without the power to negotiate
2) Therefore the negotiations didn't stand
3) Instead it was decided that the silly members of UINE who raided without permission should be attacked in turn in accordance with UINE's constitution (7 days of war for 4 of them and a ZI for the last were agreed upon)
4) It was requested that these members be expelled - this was agreed.
5) It was later indicated that that meant expel immediately
6) Those members were expelled

Shouldn't that be the end of the story? But no, there are new demands! How fun!

1- Continued attacks on the rogues under what they posted on the OWF.
2- One of the rogues will now be banned from UINE for life with no possibility of coming back.
3- They have brought the reparations back as well.
4- A ZI for the Emperor (who has done nothing wrong yet except from having a real life and a treacherous former Minister of Finance, Anson, who negotiated without permission) and our minister of defence (same).

Now that that's been set straight, I think I shall comment that these demands may not be appropriate. Now I'm off to church, and that means goodwill and peace and harmony and all of that stuff.

[Ninja gumby]

[quote name='The Archduke' timestamp='1294536142' post='2569099']
If the Minister of Foreign Affairs may make a private statement:
1) Anson negotiated without the power to negotiate
2) Therefore the negotiations didn't stand
3) Instead it was decided that the silly members of UINE who raided without permission should be attacked in turn in accordance with UINE's constitution (7 days of war for 4 of them and a ZI for the last were agreed upon)
4) It was requested that these members be expelled - this was agreed.
5) It was later indicated that that meant expel immediately
6) Those members were expelled

Shouldn't that be the end of the story? But no, there are new demands! How fun!

1- Continued attacks on the rogues under what they posted on the OWF.
2- One of the rogues will now be banned from UINE for life with no possibility of coming back.
3- They have brought the reparations back as well.
4- A ZI for the Emperor (who has done nothing wrong yet except from having a real life and a treacherous former Minister of Finance, Anson, who negotiated without permission) and our minister of defence (same).

Now that that's been set straight, I think I shall comment that these demands may not be appropriate. Now I'm off to church, and that means goodwill and peace and harmony and all of that stuff.
[/quote]

You know whats funny? That the Minister of Foreign Affairs of UINE has only 5 posts on the OWF.

[Stealthkill]

[quote name='The Archduke' timestamp='1294536142' post='2569099']
If the Minister of Foreign Affairs may make a private statement:
1) Anson negotiated without the power to negotiate
2) Therefore the negotiations didn't stand
3) Instead it was decided that the silly members of UINE who raided without permission should be attacked in turn in accordance with UINE's constitution (7 days of war for 4 of them and a ZI for the last were agreed upon)
4) It was requested that these members be expelled - this was agreed.
5) It was later indicated that that meant expel immediately
6) Those members were expelled

Shouldn't that be the end of the story? But no, there are new demands! How fun!

1- Continued attacks on the rogues under what they posted on the OWF.
2- One of the rogues will now be banned from UINE for life with no possibility of coming back.
3- They have brought the reparations back as well.
4- A ZI for the Emperor (who has done nothing wrong yet except from having a real life and a treacherous former Minister of Finance, Anson, who negotiated without permission) and our minister of defence (same).

Now that that's been set straight, I think I shall comment that these demands may not be appropriate. Now I'm off to church, and that means goodwill and peace and harmony and all of that stuff.
[/quote]
You left out the parts where Keve lied his ass off. Throughout this entire time Keve was either A) lying, B) being uncooperative, or C) trying to weasel out of deals made. Of course, there's several other details that are (conveniently) missing, but I expect no less. Either Keve merely withheld information from his ministers (surprising, he seems to value you guys oh so highly), or you're simply being economic with the truth in an attempt to deceive people. Doesn't exactly work when your opposition can fill the holes, does it?

[TimeMaster]

Well, since RnR, Echelon, etc, seem to want this issue public. . .how about you tell everyone what deals Keve has reneged on? Mind you, we're talking deals Keve agreed to, not Ansem (who didn't have the authority to make said deals). Those don't count. . .

[The Archduke]

What holes? I would love to hear of them. Unless you're referring to the forum hack by Anson? I've seen proof...

The MoFA of UINE has a real life, so doesn't bother to reply to most of these topics. There's not much point in me participating in them anyway... nobody ever takes much notice of what other people say. They just say what they like.

[Toshiro Hitsugaya]

[quote name='The Archduke' timestamp='1294551427' post='2569350']
What holes? I would love to hear of them. Unless you're referring to the forum hack by Anson? I've seen proof...

The MoFA of UINE has a real life, so doesn't bother to reply to most of these topics. There's not much point in me participating in them anyway... nobody ever takes much notice of what other people say. They just say what they like.
[/quote]

From what I can see everyone in UINE has soo much of a real life they might as well stop playing now...

[nippy]

[quote name='bigjoepryde' timestamp='1294521018' post='2568829']
only a small proposion of that damage was inflicted by the rogues. they had a nation who had quit and had opened him self up for warring with another alliance. I beleive AiD can back me up on this.
[/quote]

What in the world is a 'proposion'? Good lord, son, weren't you just using the 'University age' argument?

[Bob Janova]

[quote name='Toshiro Hitsugaya' timestamp='1294559840' post='2569544']
From what I can see everyone in UINE has soo much of a real life they might as well stop playing now...
[/quote]
Yes, quite. So far your emperor, MoD and MoFA have all played the 'I'm too busy to help sort out a diplomatic crisis' card. If that's the case, then you shouldn't be in a government position, where you are required to be available for diplomatic talks if something happens. And if there's nobody in UINE who is active enough to do that, then you should disband.

[Stealthkill]

[quote name='TimeMaster' timestamp='1294551303' post='2569348']
Well, since RnR, Echelon, etc, seem to want this issue public. . .how about you tell everyone what deals Keve has reneged on? Mind you, we're talking deals Keve agreed to, not Ansem (who didn't have the authority to make said deals). Those don't count. . .
[/quote]
First that comes to mind is the issue of whether or not the raiders were really rogues or not. Typically, one demasks rogues immediately, and expels them on their own. They don't wait until they get called out on it then claim they are rogues but keep them masked. Then demask them but keep them with a secondary masks of membership. Funnily enough, he called them inactive as well. I guess by UINE standards, former ministers, deputies of recruitment, chief diplomats, and regular IRC presences warrant an inactivity label. Mighty high standards I must say, from the looks of it, Keve himself doesn't even fulfill them. Then of course the original deal of tech deals never happened regardless of what Anson said afterwards. I believe Keve later said that he wanted no part of them. Then of course there was continued hostilities after the initial peace agreement with AiD. I'm sure there are more that I am forgetting, but nevertheless, it was quite irritating. All we can hope for is that this last peace agreement prevails.

[quote name='The Archduke' timestamp='1294551427' post='2569350']
What holes? I would love to hear of them. Unless you're referring to the forum hack by Anson? I've seen proof...
[/quote]
I don't want to get into Anson and that mess you guys are making, but the forum hack was proven to be a lie. The "proof" we were given was not only inadequate to prove he did anything, but it was also forged. We proved it as such. I mean really, if you're gonna forge proof, at least make it proof that will unmistakably incriminate somebody.

[Grealind]

[quote name='Bob Janova' timestamp='1294574140' post='2569665']
Yes, quite. So far your emperor, MoD and MoFA have all played the 'I'm too busy to help sort out a diplomatic crisis' card. If that's the case, then you shouldn't be in a government position, where you are required to be available for diplomatic talks if something happens. And if there's nobody in UINE who is active enough to do that, then you should disband.
[/quote]

Aye, hence my getting involved. And, um, when was the Minister of ___ not allowed to get involved in diplomacy? I purposely leave which one out because as far as I, and probably a number of other people, are concerned, Minister means that they have some level of authority in the alliance. UINE has 6 Ministers. MoE (active) MoD (university, i guess), MoR (no clue), MoFA (Who knows), MoIA (on Holiday), and the MoF (me). We had Triums, but hardly ever online. Keve was, Joe has now pointed out many times, away. So all this government. Who's allowed to actually do something?

Now, I'll admit, I did read the resolution that Keve posted in the government section of the forums. There was this odd word there.. something to the effect of 20 rounds of tech raids? Yikes! If that's how Keve does diplomacy, it's a wonder he won't let his gov talk. Looks like it's all figured out

Also, Joe.. as a side note, I messaged Keve trying to coordinate the $9 mill I owe UINE. Twice I did this. Both messages were opened. Neither one was responded. if you are going to tout that I owe money, at least make sure I haven't offered to repay it first. The second message stated that if I didn't get a response, that would mean I owed nothing. Now, if only the Emperor of UINE is allowed to discuss any outside matters, then it looks like I owe nothing.

Edited January 9, 2011 by Anson