Reformation of TBBAF and DoW

[The Big Bad]

[quote name='Hiro Nakara' date='11 May 2010 - 02:57 PM' timestamp='1273604260' post='2294922']
I'm here for laughs and nothing more, nobody from \m/ is here for the Gremlins, what are you so confused about? How many times does it have to be typed before it sinks in. You are not liked, people hate you, you made yourself vunrable and you got hit because the oppertunity presented itself. It has nothing to do with Gremlins in the slightest, for the 50th time, I hope this soothes or cures this problem you have with being confused.

Happy now?
[/quote]

People hate me? But last I checked this was all lulz. Nothing to do with hate or anger. And thanks for clearing up that this is all about me and not Gramlins. I feel kind of good knowing I am so important to you guys. Heck I have been retired for well over a year and even left Planet Bob and you guys just can not stop thinking about me even now. Well as much as I enjoy you trying make \m/ and everything else all about me, I am afraid you will have to wait for later when I am done with Gramlins. After the huge deal you all have made me my ego is really going strong. Thank you for stroking it so much.

Edited May 11, 2010 by The Big Bad

[The Big Bad]

[quote name='Emperor Marx' date='11 May 2010 - 03:04 PM' timestamp='1273604658' post='2294936']
You're the only one kicking and screaming for attention. We just gave it to you. Don't complain because it wasn't the kind of attention you were looking for.
[/quote]

I love any attention. It is really great to know that people make such a fuss about me. The worst thing that could have happened was I formed TBBAF and nobody cared. That would mean that because I have been inactive and away for over a year people had forgotten about me. Instead I found my name gains just as much attention as it ever did. You have allowed me keep what could have been a short announcement going and going and going. Thus allowing me to rail against Gramlins harsh, cruel and unacceptable Uncondtional Surrender terms over and over. So thank you for all the attention and for changing you alliance policy on raiding just for me. I am The Big Bad now go talk about me. Also when your done talking about me start talking about how a term like Unconditional Surrender could be used against you if it were allowed to stand. Maybe \m/, just to clear its name, should make a public annoucement condemning Gramlins. Just a thought. Unless of course you want to keep this all about me.

[Lezrahi]

[quote name='The Big Bad' date='11 May 2010 - 01:09 PM' timestamp='1273604971' post='2294950']
People hate me? But last I checked this was all lulz. Nothing to do with hate or anger. And thanks for clearing up that this is all about me and not Gramlins. I feel kind of good knowing I am so important to you guys. Heck I have been retired for well over a year and even left Planet Bob and you guys just can not stop thinking about me even now. Well as much as I enjoy you trying make \m/ and everything else all about me, I am afraid you will have to wait for later when I am done with Gramlins. After the huge deal you all have made me my ego is really going strong. Thank you for stroking it so much.
[/quote]

You are very welcome.

Enjoy nuclear hellfire. Thank you, in turn, for the Technology that helps to sustain us.

[The Big Bad]

[quote name='Lezrahi' date='11 May 2010 - 03:29 PM' timestamp='1273606133' post='2294974']
You are very welcome.

Enjoy nuclear hellfire. Thank you, in turn, for the Technology that helps to sustain us.
[/quote]

I do not have tech or much of anything else. I do not know if you have noticed but I am not much of a nation builder. Starting from scratch it will take me a month to get back to where I was, if that. If I bother. Did you think I was enterting into this war without knowing my little nation would be zi'd? I made an alliance DoW on Gramlins and attacked them, if some raiders or other people who can not stop thinking about me did not attack then MHA or maybe even FARK would have. However my nation is not important. This however is, why don't you tell me what you think about Gramlins unconditional surrender terms?

[ktarthan]

So basically... what you're saying is... \m/ was helping Gramlins by trying to stop you from waging a war that you (and everyone else) knew wouldn't make a difference, and also by diverting attention from Gramlins to you which enabled you more opportunity to rail against and bring attention to Gramlins?

[Chief Savage Man]

[quote name='The Big Bad' date='11 May 2010 - 03:40 PM' timestamp='1273606838' post='2294995']
I do not have tech or much of anything else. I do not know if you have noticed but I am not much of a nation builder. Starting from scratch it will take me a month to get back to where I was, if that. If I bother. Did you think I was enterting into this war without knowing my little nation would be zi'd? I made an alliance DoW on Gramlins and attacked them, if some raiders or other people who can not stop thinking about me did not attack then MHA or maybe even FARK would have. However my nation is not important. This however is, why don't you tell me what you think about Gramlins unconditional surrender terms?
[/quote]

Gramlins is being ridiculous and unreasonable. There. Now shut up.

[Geoffron X]

\m/ doesn't care about Gram. The only thing they care about is an opportunistic cowardly attack for no reason.

[Daikos]

Now that that's out of the way...

Is anyone really surprised that TBB is making another childish cry for attention? For the love of admin, he made an IRC room for himself so that people can come "hang out" with him and his constant attempts to be "bad" are reminiscent of an angsty teenager. Instead of doing something that a rational / non egotistical individual would do like, oh I dunno, joining IRON or aiding IRON, he instead forms an alliance with all of his friends (read: nobody) and starts flailing his arms around and making incoherent statements.

I think you're all missing a real gem here as well. If one does recognize TBBAF as an alliance (which, obviously, no sane individual would do) then said alliance would be at war with Gramlins. Which would make The AUT's aiding of TBBAF an act of war against Gramlins. So, am I to believe that since AUT recognizes TBBAF as an alliance he is willing to put his alliance into a state of war with Gramlins?

[The AUT]

[quote name='Daikos' date='11 May 2010 - 09:36 PM' timestamp='1273610154' post='2295087']
I think you're all missing a real gem here as well. If one does recognize TBBAF as an alliance (which, obviously, no sane individual would do) then said alliance would be at war with Gramlins. Which would make The AUT's aiding of TBBAF an act of war against Gramlins. So, am I to believe that since AUT recognizes TBBAF as an alliance he is willing to put his alliance into a state of war with Gramlins?
[/quote]

Glad to see you're as informed as you usually are and that I've come to expect of you! TBB addressed everything, do try and keep up. I know it pains you that your alliance is so irrelevant and likely a Gremlins groupie but still, please try.

Edited May 11, 2010 by The AUT

[The Big Bad]

[quote name='ktarthan' date='11 May 2010 - 03:54 PM' timestamp='1273607629' post='2295028']
So basically... what you're saying is... \m/ was helping Gramlins by trying to stop you from waging a war that you (and everyone else) knew wouldn't make a difference, and also by diverting attention from Gramlins to you which enabled you more opportunity to rail against and bring attention to Gramlins?
[/quote]

To be honest \m/ has no idea what they are doing. Clearly I have taken advantage of them and used them to spread my agenda. By suggesting they came out to help Gramlins they openly said they do not support Gramlins and that Gramlins are wrong. What does it say about Gramlins that even an alliance like \m/ is desperate to distance themselves from them? Wars are fought in many ways. The war against Gramlins has many fronts. Bringing attention to Gramlins demands of Unconditional Surrender and the threat it is to every alliance on Planet Bob is but one front of many. I do not command a mighty alliance. I barely even have a nation. What I do have is a name and the ability to bring attention to things. The only war I can fight against Gramlins that matters is to keep the spot light on them and their demand for unconditional surrender. TBBAF is fighting the only war it can. \m/ has by accident helped me to keep he talk of Gramlins in a very active topic with people who were not talking about them before. Have I been baiting them? Of course, thats the way I work. But in the end they and I agree Gramlins uncontidtional surrender terms are unacceptable. Speaking of them how do you feel about Gramlinss terms and do you see the threat the present to every alliance on Planet Bob?

[Gerald Meanĕ]

[quote name='The Big Bad' date='11 May 2010 - 09:51 PM' timestamp='1273611070' post='2295115']
To be honest \m/ has no idea what they are doing.
[/quote]

Sure we do, we're watching some members of ours smack you around.

[The Big Bad]

[quote name='Daikos' date='11 May 2010 - 04:36 PM' timestamp='1273610154' post='2295087']


Now that that's out of the way...

Is anyone really surprised that TBB is making another childish cry for attention? For the love of admin, he made an IRC room for himself so that people can come "hang out" with him and his constant attempts to be "bad" are reminiscent of an angsty teenager. Instead of doing something that a rational / non egotistical individual would do like, oh I dunno, joining IRON or aiding IRON, he instead forms an alliance with all of his friends (read: nobody) and starts flailing his arms around and making incoherent statements.

I think you're all missing a real gem here as well. If one does recognize TBBAF as an alliance (which, obviously, no sane individual would do) then said alliance would be at war with Gramlins. Which would make The AUT's aiding of TBBAF an act of war against Gramlins. So, am I to believe that since AUT recognizes TBBAF as an alliance he is willing to put his alliance into a state of war with Gramlins?
[/quote]

Do try and keep up. TBBAF has refused any aid or new members. I am also happy to see I am so important to have drawn out a member of whatever alliance you are in. So are you here because of me as well? Are you one of those that just can not get enough of me? Or are you here in support of Gramlins? Why don't you tell us all how you feel about Gramlins and demands for uncondional surrender.

[Gerald Meanĕ]

To be honest I actually don't mind the idea of unconditional surrender in alliance wars if it is warranted. Gramlins case isn't really warrented, but in the case of the whole war at the start between top/ect vrs the people they attacked I could see unconditional surrender being used.

[The Big Bad]

[quote name='Gerald Meane' date='11 May 2010 - 04:54 PM' timestamp='1273611231' post='2295121']
Sure we do, we're watching some members of ours smack you around.
[/quote]

Well the mighty \m/ smacks around a nation that most people could build in a week with nukes. And bragging about it no less. Wow you all sure are impressive. How will I ever rebuild back to my former level? Well as much as you love watching me, why don't you start watching Gramlins? They have layed out a direct threat to yours and evey other alliance on Planet Bob by trying to set a precedent of uncconditional surrender. Why don't you show how big you are by doing something about it? I know your to big of cowards to raid them but, at least you could create a petition or something. It might be good to think about something other then me all day. Just how do you feel about Gramlins?

[Gerald Meanĕ]

[quote name='The Big Bad' date='11 May 2010 - 10:04 PM' timestamp='1273611829' post='2295142']
Well the mighty \m/ smacks around a nation that most people could build in a week with nukes. And bragging about it no less. Wow you all sure are impressive. How will I ever rebuild back to my former level? Well as much as you love watching me, why don't you start watching Gramlins? They have layed out a direct threat to yours and evey other alliance on Planet Bob by trying to set a precedent of uncconditional surrender. Why don't you show how big you are by doing something about it? I know your to big of cowards to raid them but, at least you could create a petition or something. It might be good to think about something other then me all day. Just how do you feel about Gramlins?
[/quote]

If you've got them use them I always say. Not to mention we've got to start building up that grl again so no one gets too complacent with it. As far as gramlins goes they're a threat to \m/ in the same way \m/ is a threat to them, which is to say none. Really the unconditional surrender thing only works against them ironically enough in the same way you ended up being attacked. It is very rare for the slighted to forget, and gramlins will have to keep itself from ever getting into a situation where it is on the losing side of a war since no one has forgotten what they did. All that needs to be done is wait for the right time.

Edited May 11, 2010 by Gerald Meane

[Caliph]

[quote name='The Big Bad' date='11 May 2010 - 02:04 PM' timestamp='1273611829' post='2295142']
Well the mighty \m/ smacks around a nation that most people could build in a week with nukes. And bragging about it no less. Wow you all sure are impressive. How will I ever rebuild back to my former level? Well as much as you love watching me, why don't you start watching Gramlins? They have layed out a direct threat to yours and evey other alliance on Planet Bob by trying to set a precedent of uncconditional surrender. Why don't you show how big you are by doing something about it? I know your to big of cowards to raid them but, at least you could create a petition or something. It might be good to think about something other then me all day. Just how do you feel about Gramlins?
[/quote]
The Grämlins crusade is not something we are a part of. That is your crusade, not ours. While I personally don't think their policy of wanting only unconditional surrender is going to work out for them, they are a sovereign alliance and can make their own decisions and policies.

[ktarthan]

[quote name='The Big Bad' date='11 May 2010 - 01:51 PM' timestamp='1273611070' post='2295115']
Speaking of them how do you feel about Gramlinss terms and do you see the threat the present to every alliance on Planet Bob?
[/quote]
Well first off I feel that you [b]really[/b] like the phrase "unconditional surrender". Also, they aren't at the terms phase yet - "unconditional surrender" is not a term. By definition, it explicitly denies terms.

Second, while I understand the Gramlins' point, I wouldn't go about it the same way.

I also think there is a bit of confusion about what "unconditional surrender" truly means, and how it relates to politics on planet bob. In definition, it is the opposite of conditional surrender, where the surrendering party is offered certain conditions, generally regarding their wellbeing, before [b]agreeing[/b] to surrender. This leads to a bit of disconnect when we compare it to how we traditionally handle surrenders, where the surrendering party is the one who abides by conditions before they are [b]allowed[/b] to surrender. The shoe is, essentially, on the other foot. So when we talk about "unconditional surrender" in the scope of our politics, it seems to imply that the victor will be able to enforce whatever terms it feels necessary. I think that this idea is unacceptable, but not necessarily what it means.

It seems that the Gramlins are taking their position out of both books. On one hand, they seem to not expect to be able to impose whatever terms they want. On the other hand, they still imply there will be terms discussed after the surrender.

I guess to answer your question more directly, I cannot say what I feel about "unconditional surrender" until it has been properly defined within the context of our politics. Everyone seems to have their own theory, but it has yet to be seen what it will be in practice.

(PS: I don't believe that you "planned it all along" - but I'm willing to drop the point)

[Lezrahi]

[quote name='Caliph' date='11 May 2010 - 03:10 PM' timestamp='1273612226' post='2295155']
The Grämlins crusade is not something we are a part of. That is your crusade, not ours. While I personally don't think their policy of wanting only unconditional surrender is going to work out for them, they are a sovereign alliance and can make their own decisions and policies.
[/quote]

I, personally, dislike The Grämlins for what they have tried to do, and am, in fact, enjoying the spectacle of them being brought low by the forces of IRON and DAWN. I do not care for IRON or DAWN; they are there, and that is all there is to my thoughts on them. But they are putting on a good show, so I must applaud them. And, if this whole debacle increases awareness of the situation, whether or not it was The Big Bad's plan all along (to which, I call complete !@#$%^&*), then that is also a good turn.

Despite that, Caliph is right: \m/, officially, could care less about what happens to IRON, DAWN, Methrage, or The Grämlins. It does not matter to us what the outcome of that situation is any more than it might have mattered to the Goons when they were at war with Methrage. Our interest lies solely with The Big Bad, whom we consider to be a complete douche, and the fact that he is both wide open and possessing of a particularly attractive reserve of Technology (or...did, before we hit him).

To The Big Bad: Though I believe that you are hardly the man in [i]any[/i] position to mount a moralist crusade of [i]any[/i] kind against [i]anyone[/i], given your past exploits; I personally wish you luck in your little insurrection...not that it matters; your nation is dead, and your 'friends' are not by your side. Save, perhaps, for The AUT (whom, to clarify, we don't care for either; if he has sent aid to The Bad, then that is just more for us to steal).

To IRON, DAWN, and The Grämlins: Good show.

That is all.

Edited May 11, 2010 by Lezrahi

[the masheen]

[quote name='Lezrahi' date='11 May 2010 - 03:29 PM' timestamp='1273613325' post='2295180']
I, personally, dislike The Grämlins for what they have tried to do, and am, in fact, enjoying the spectacle of them being brought low by the forces of IRON and DAWN. I do not care for IRON or DAWN; they are there, and that is all there is to my thoughts on them. But they are putting on a good show, so I must applaud them. And, if this whole debacle increases awareness of the situation, whether or not it was The Big Bad's plan all along (to which, I call complete !@#$%^&*), then that is also a good turn.

Despite that, Caliph is right: \m/, officially, could care less about what happens to IRON, DAWN, Methrage, or The Grämlins. It does not matter to us what the outcome of that situation is any more than it might have mattered to the Goons when they were at war with Methrage. Our interest lies solely with The Big Bad, whom we consider to be a complete douche, and the fact that he is both wide open and possessing of a particularly attractive reserve of Technology (or...did, before we hit him).

To The Big Bad: Though I believe that you are hardly the man in [i]any[/i] position to mount a moralist crusade of [i]any[/i] kind against [i]anyone[/i]; given your past exploits, I personally wish you luck in your little insurrection...not that it matters; your nation is dead, and your 'friends' are not by your side. Save, perhaps, for The AUT (whom, to clarify, we don't care for either; if he has sent aid to The Bad, then that is just more for us to steal).

To IRON, DAWN, and The Grämlins: Good show.

That is all.
[/quote]

Good stuff! I agree with this and I am happy that this is how \m/ feels. I'd also like to point out the whole "it's the precedent" argument. Does this mean that The Big Bad is FOR the precedent of going rogue and attacking alliances?

[ktarthan]

Edit: Frig. Disregard.

Edited May 11, 2010 by ktarthan

[Daikos]

[quote name='The Big Bad' date='11 May 2010 - 04:56 PM' timestamp='1273611345' post='2295123']
Do try and keep up. TBBAF has refused any aid or new members. I am also happy to see I am so important to have drawn out a member of whatever alliance you are in. So are you here because of me as well? Are you one of those that just can not get enough of me? Or are you here in support of Gramlins? Why don't you tell us all how you feel about Gramlins and demands for uncondional surrender.
[/quote]

Whatever alliance I am in? The last time you entered a thread of ours you were claiming that you talked to all of our allies behind closed doors and that they all disliked us. Now you don't know who we are. Which one is it? And here I thought you were a political genius...

I'm here because I smelled the stench of rampant hypocrisy and attention seeking. It seems to be coming from you.

[jer]

[quote name='The Big Bad' date='11 May 2010 - 08:09 PM' timestamp='1273604971' post='2294950']
People hate me? But last I checked this was all lulz. Nothing to do with hate or anger. [...] After the huge deal you all have made me my ego is really going strong. Thank you for stroking it so much.
[/quote]
[quote name='The Big Bad' date='11 May 2010 - 08:26 PM' timestamp='1273606000' post='2294973']
I love any attention. It is really great to know that people make such a fuss about me. The worst thing that could have happened was I formed TBBAF and nobody cared. That would mean that because I have been inactive and away for over a year people had forgotten about me. Instead I found my name gains just as much attention as it ever did. [..] Just a thought. Unless of course you want to keep this all about me.
[/quote]
[quote name='The Big Bad' date='11 May 2010 - 09:51 PM' timestamp='1273611070' post='2295115']
To be honest \m/ has no idea what they are doing. Clearly I have taken advantage of them and used them to spread my agenda. [...] I do not command a mighty alliance. I barely even have a nation. What I do have is a name and the ability to bring attention to things. The only war I can fight against Gramlins that matters is to keep the spot light on them and their demand for unconditional surrender. TBBAF is fighting the only war it can. [...] Have I been baiting them? Of course, thats the way I work.
[/quote]
At this point you are really nothing more than a very [b]very[/b] VERY poor man's Rebel Virginia; a terrible cheap copy that is really an insult to the original. This thread isn't a hotbed of support for you and your actions (no matter how many times you say it is) because there are more people mocking you than supporting you. There is no great support for your agenda (contrary to your claims) because anti-Gre/pro-IRON campaigns are being fought more effectively than this elsewhere already (I'd venture to say that you are actually damaging those campaigns with your bizarre display here) and the only people here because of your name (lol) are the ones currently smashing you to pieces on the battlefield.

For a while it looked like you'd somehow got away with a clean break from your past but through your own attention seeking behaviour and general stupidity you are now - finally - receiving your just desserts, with both your nation and (whatever was left of) your ill-gotten reputation in tatters. Just as they should be.

Edited May 11, 2010 by Aimee Mann

[The Big Bad]

[quote name='Lezrahi' date='11 May 2010 - 05:29 PM' timestamp='1273613325' post='2295180']
I, personally, dislike The Grämlins for what they have tried to do, and am, in fact, enjoying the spectacle of them being brought low by the forces of IRON and DAWN. I do not care for IRON or DAWN; they are there, and that is all there is to my thoughts on them. But they are putting on a good show, so I must applaud them. And, if this whole debacle increases awareness of the situation, whether or not it was The Big Bad's plan all along (to which, I call complete !@#$%^&*), then that is also a good turn.

Despite that, Caliph is right: \m/, officially, could care less about what happens to IRON, DAWN, Methrage, or The Grämlins. It does not matter to us what the outcome of that situation is any more than it might have mattered to the Goons when they were at war with Methrage. Our interest lies solely with The Big Bad, whom we consider to be a complete douche, and the fact that he is both wide open and possessing of a particularly attractive reserve of Technology (or...did, before we hit him).

To The Big Bad: Though I believe that you are hardly the man in [i]any[/i] position to mount a moralist crusade of [i]any[/i] kind against [i]anyone[/i], given your past exploits; I personally wish you luck in your little insurrection...not that it matters; your nation is dead, and your 'friends' are not by your side. Save, perhaps, for The AUT (whom, to clarify, we don't care for either; if he has sent aid to The Bad, then that is just more for us to steal).

To IRON, DAWN, and The Grämlins: Good show.

That is all.
[/quote]

Well if you had been paying attention from the very start you would know this has nothing to do with morality. It has to do with setting a precedent that if allowed to stand could be used against any alliance on Planet Bob. To actively oppose Gramlins is a matter of self preservation to every alliance on Bob. Also please come by and enlighten me sometime about these past exploits that anger you so. As for my nation, it is now as it has always been irrelevant. It allows me to be here nothing more. You might have noticed its lack of infra, tech and pretty much anything else it needs. Although I think for the first time in my long history I have my trade slots full thanks to my friends at IAA who set me up in a trade circle when I was with them. Speaking of friends any aid offered including retro treaty agreements have been declined. As I have explained over and over its not about \m/ and its not about me. Well a little about me. Its about Gramlins. Its about Unconditional Surrender. Imagine if you had to face unconditional surrender. You have to know for an alliance like yours that would not end well. You say it does not matter to you but, it should. It should matter to everyone. And I think to most people it does. People however are more worried about treaties, rebuilding and what may happen if they do act. So they leave it to others and hope it all works out. Of course people could prove me wrong. Nations and alliances could act. If they have the guts.

[The Big Bad]

[quote name='Daikos' date='11 May 2010 - 05:54 PM' timestamp='1273614869' post='2295216']
Whatever alliance I am in? The last time you entered a thread of ours you were claiming that you talked to all of our allies behind closed doors and that they all disliked us. Now you don't know who we are. Which one is it? And here I thought you were a political genius...

I'm here because I smelled the stench of rampant hypocrisy and attention seeking. It seems to be coming from you.
[/quote]

If you expect me to remember every random alliance that does something stupid over the last 3 or 4 years that I call out then you better get me a secretary to keep a list. However I am flattered that whatever I did or said had such an impact on you that you could not resist coming here. My ego thanks you.

[ktarthan]

It actually has everything to do with morality. A precedent being set is not inherently a bad thing - it becomes one when it opposes your morals.