Ragnarok Announcement

[R&R-Viking]

Except you are forgetting something: opinions can be wrong. If you can't provide evidential reasoning to your opinion and it's based solely on conjectures and hearsay, then your opinion is wrong.

Even if you had an airtight case people on the opposing side here would still claim that the info is false, so who cares really?

[Nutty Carrot Cakes]

Express opinions the same way you pass your English SAT

POINT

EVIDENCE

EXPLAIN

These logs aren't fake

because someone in CnG and/or SF might want to take over the world

therefore Hoo is up to some trick.

[o-dog]

Without a singular entity with the desire to impose their will on you, none of you (FEAR and UCN excluded to be perfectly honest) have any idea what to do with yourselves.

And you are sore because you could not be that entity.

We know exactly what we want (from a UCN perspective). Sorry if that doesn't tally with what you think we should want.

Edited December 31, 2009 by O-Dog

[JBone]

And yet when TPF was putting their plan together to finally attack NoV, you guys were one of the first to cancel. I may be drawing parallels where they do not exist, I doubt it, since I've been proven right so many times before. FEAR certainly is playing lap dog this time.

Though I'm not sure where the "Got mit uns" crack was supposed to hit. Just not feeling it.

We get it.

You don't like TPF

You don't like any of TPFs allies.

You never will.

Not all, actually hardly any, threads where you come in and eventually relate things back to NoV have anything to do with that war.

Please try and keep it on the subject of the OP.

I know you are still very bitter and everything, but no one really cares any longer.

.....and btw, you should change your sig to, Waiting to be wiped, again, since 2008, as that would more accurately reflect the truth.

As to the OP, my conversations with Hoo reflect a much different attitude regarding intent towards TPF. We were once allies and good friends, my hope is that relationship would be sufficient to at least be straight up with each other.

As for the comments about IRON and CDT, they do not seem to be in dispute.

[Lord Brendan]

Ultimately this is what it comes down to. I believe (still do) that NATO made a mistake in allowing itself to get chased out of CDT. This is why.

Rok didn't want you out to stop you controlling CDT, you didn't anyway. Rok wanted to take over CDT and you were in their way.

Van Hoo wanted to dictate CDT but couldn't.

I'm a bit confused as to what your party line is. Ragnarok was trying to dictate CDT but couldn't... yet they were able to "chase" NATO out of the bloc against the wishes of everyone else?

[mythicknight]

Who to believe, who to believe...

I'm gonna go make breakfast.

[Lord Boris]

You're toadies because the entire time we were in the CDT you wouldn't so much as blink without permission from the NPO. Now that they are no longer in power, you're completely lost and scurry around with little purpose. Without a singular entity with the desire to impose their will on you, none of you (FEAR and UCN excluded to be perfectly honest) have any idea what to do with yourselves.

At least you recognize the Blood For Friends part of the bloc has a drive of their own and are not simply NPO puppet-states like most of this thread has claimed.

[Canik]

Except you are forgetting something: opinions can be wrong. If you can't provide evidential reasoning to your opinion and it's based solely on conjectures and hearsay, then your opinion is wrong.

Don't be silly. I've provided just as much evidential reasoning as the people I've engaged. Now, this is seriously getting off topic. You can make a new thread all about me if you want, but this is going no where.

[WarriorConcept]

[00:28] <Warbuck[ADI]> My log shows it, so either someone hacked me or it got deleted out of yours.

[00:32] <Warbuck[ADI]> I'll unban you from #ADI- talk to ss23 and see if people can hack the .txt file

[00:34] <Warbuck[ADI]> [02:29:04] <~Warbuck[ADI]> you are an IRC admin on another server, right?

[00:34] <Warbuck[ADI]> [02:29:24] <&ss23[ADI]> Was, I quit

[00:34] <Warbuck[ADI]> [02:29:28] <&ss23[ADI]> I was "the" admin

[00:35] <Warbuck[ADI]> [02:29:31] <~Warbuck[ADI]> can people hack your log files?

[00:35] <Warbuck[ADI]> [02:29:48] <&ss23[ADI]> that's not really a IRC related question

[00:35] <Warbuck[ADI]> [02:29:53] <&ss23[ADI]> The short answer is yes...

[00:35] <Warbuck[ADI]> so, either it was there to begin with or it was placed there

[00:35] <Warbuck[ADI]> either way, I'm going to have my IT friends redo the security on my computer now

^You are certainly dedicated to your sarcasm

11[00:39] <Hoo[AWAY]> What you're telling me is that the fake log is IN your logs?

[00:39] <Warbuck[ADI]> IF it is fake

^"If" it's fake? The best you can come up with as a retort to someone who just said the logs that are supposedly sitting right in front of you is to imply that they might not be faked? What?

And my favorite:

[00:45] <Warbuck[ADI]> idk... that was the one line that made me change my mind, tbh... and it was there.

^The one line that supposedly changed your mind on your entire stance on the war in a set of logs from a private conversation that you leaked and your excuse for why you couldn't remember it at the beginning of the conversation is that you haven't slept much and have dealt with a lot of logs? Exactly how many foreign policy changing logs have you leaked in the last three days?

Great post that anyone whom cares about the validity of the logs shouldn't overlook.

[Aurion]

We know exactly what we want (from a UCN perspective). Sorry if that doesn't tally with what you think we should want.

You missed the part where he said that UCN was one of two that didn't have no idea what to do with themselves?

In other words, that you guys do? I'm not seeing where you disagree with him tbqh.

Edited December 31, 2009 by Aurion

[Acca Dacca]

Don't be silly. I've provided just as much evidential reasoning as the people I've engaged. Now, this is seriously getting off topic. You can make a new thread all about me if you want, but this is going no where.

You provided nothing but lack of wit and entertainment for me this morning.

[o-dog]

You missed the part where he said that UCN was one of two that didn't have no idea what to do with themselves?

No I didn't. But still, we are CDT and we are being maligned.

[Aurion]

No I didn't. But still, we are CDT and we are being maligned.

Fair enough, then.

[Anu Drake]

NATO was never chased out of the CDT and hopefully they can at least correct you on that fact. Though, it doesn't shock me that you make claims that I wanted to "control the CDT". Paranoid accusations and attempting to re-write history suits you.

I'll correct that one. NATO wasn't chased out, we left. It was the day you came to me and said RoK was leaving because the bloc was too much of a NATO bloc, at least by reputation. I offered a solution that we would leave, so that the remaining members (including RoK, as you agreed to stay, at least a while) could build up its own identity. I have no idea what happened after we left or if there was any attempt to control CDT by RoK.

[Van Hoo III]

At least you recognize the Blood For Friends part of the bloc has a drive of their own and are not simply NPO puppet-states like most of this thread has claimed.

UCN and FEAR were never a problem as far as CDT goes. To be honest I like UCN and, up until some recent terrible forum posters, liked FEAR.

Oh no! I guess that means I want to eliminate FEAR now!

Edited December 31, 2009 by Van Hoo III

[Captain Flinders]

We dropped you at the same time we dropped a few others due to a treaty review we undertook since we were having issues with quite a few others (for example, we dropped CCC and I believe one or two others). We didn't know TPF/NATO + Q were planning on going to war with you until the night before, when we started to have suspicions. I will post the logs to that effect after I get the OK from TheBigBad to put them up as evidence. For reference though, we cancelled about a month before anything occured, and we didn't simply cut and run at the first sign of any trouble. We cut ties when it became evident that NoV had no intention of carrying out promised reforms.

No need. I do believe you. Truth be told, I regretted saying that about FEAR moments after I said it. I just really do hate seeing stalwart people being played and/or hooked into a fight. Especially in the (possible) defense of something they had little to no control over and doubly because I can imagine how manipulative mhawk could be. Good luck out there guys.

Not all, actually hardly any, threads where you come in and eventually relate things back to NoV have anything to do with that war.

Meh, TPF's war history holds relevance in the conversation. Deal with it.

.....and btw, you should change your sig to, Waiting to be wiped, again, since 2008, as that would more accurately reflect the truth.

Since none of us, including Kaiser Martens, ever went anywhere, the statement stands.

*edit

KM being the "you" in the quote mind you.

Edited December 31, 2009 by Captain Flinders

[ChairmanHal]

Or maybe that's your interpretation of it. What it looks like to me is that he's annoyed that TPF still thinks they're best friends with the meanest kid on the playground and can pull stuff like their latest operation without any consequences.

In the days following the Karma War, all of NPO's former allies had to make alternative arrangements regarding their foreign policy, Valhalla included. You won't see Valhalla looking in the rear view mirror and if some day NPO and Valhalla become allies again, it will be because on that future date it will make sense to do for the future of foreign policy at Valhalla, not because Valhalla is nostalgic for some by-gone era (if anything future relations with NPO will be in spite of those days).

TPF is in much the same position. As for this latest "stunt", if you are referring to the op that was talked about 6 months ago, recall that the professed rationale for it was that TPF found itself in a state of long term war and it was discussed as a desperation ploy/act of revenge. NPO by that point was also in a long term war and completely unable to back up TPF in any way--indeed even now they are in treaty terms and their every move is watched for compliance. Meanest kid on the playground? Not even close.

[Joe Izuzu]

Or maybe that's your interpretation of it. What it looks like to me is that he's annoyed that TPF still thinks they're best friends with the meanest kid on the playground and can pull stuff like their latest operation without any consequences.

All well and good, except that the "latest operation" took place months ago and while the last war was still raging. There has been absolutely no evidence presented that TPF has done anything hostile since they achieved peace.

So....apparently old grudges die hard.

edit: Hal beat me to it.

Edited December 31, 2009 by Joe Izuzu

[Van Hoo III]

As to the OP, my conversations with Hoo reflect a much different attitude regarding intent towards TPF. We were once allies and good friends, my hope is that relationship would be sufficient to at least be straight up with each other.

I disagree with the way you guys do things and yes I think you guys have been toadies. Despite that and the current conflict, I still genuinely like you guys.

[Starbuck]

I have not read much of this thread aside from the op, so I apologize ahead of time if this has been answered, but why is that RoK seems to care so much about what ADI says and what the world in gernal thinks about them?

[WarriorConcept]

I have not read much of this thread aside from the op, so I apologize ahead of time if this has been answered, but why is that RoK seems to care so much about what ADI says and what the world in gernal thinks about them?

If you read the OP like you claimed to, you'd realize that.

[Captain Flinders]

I have not read much of this thread aside from the op, so I apologize ahead of time if this has been answered, but why is that RoK seems to care so much about what ADI says and what the world in gernal thinks about them?

Because Van Hoo cares.

[SpiderJerusalem]

Anyone who would like to look at my computer in person can see that the logs are intact, and that the line is there. I was merely making a point- unless someone hacked me- then the logs are correct. Now who on earth would hack me to put a lousy line in a log?

This is a nice move- claiming that incriminating logs are fake. Unfortunately, the line that is supposedly "fake" IS there, and it finishes your thought there when you are calling NPO, and IRON, CDT, etc toadies that deserve their wrath.

But I suppose you just want more drama.

*sighs*

This is so cute. I mean, how on earth would anyone take your word for anything? You are the one that didn't come through for a close ally after promising you had our back. You are the coward that came running to us when you had trouble. You are someone that should be trusted as much as I would trust a 2 dollar hooker on crack with my credit card.

You have proven yourself once more with this disgraceful attempt to slander an alliance that was there when you needed it. So pretty please, with sugar on top, $%&@ off

Edited December 31, 2009 by SpiderJerusalem

[Aurion]

I have not read much of this thread aside from the op, so I apologize ahead of time if this has been answered, but why is that RoK seems to care so much about what ADI says and what the world in gernal thinks about them?

I'm going to go way out on a limb and say that Cindy Lou isn't a big fan of people trying to make his alliance (or himself, for that matter) look bad.

Edited December 31, 2009 by Aurion

[SpacingOutMan]

I have not read much of this thread aside from the op, so I apologize ahead of time if this has been answered, but why is that RoK seems to care so much about what ADI says and what the world in gernal thinks about them?

Although you should probably reread it a few times, I'll oblige you with the response "someone purposefully faked logs to make an already controversial statement into a damning statement".