Itsuki Koizumi Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 If anyone wants to know, this is GDA's official stance.Yes, it was wrong for the ICB nation to raid an aligned nation. However, as everyone here can check, the nation was 18 days old, and the attack was an honest newbie mistake. What was also wrong is UCR sending 2 other nations to pound said new nation into the ground, without attempting to work out a solution with either me or Burnt (which by the way he was actively trying to do). We all make mistakes. I'm not condoning what the ICB nation did, but it's clear that UCR wasn't exactly proactive with trying to de-escalate this conflict. We do not endorse tech raiding aligned nations, but in this case, this is CLEARLY a gross use of force. I am working with both parties right now in order to find an amicable solution. You do realize that the attacking party wanted UCR reparations of 100 tech Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groucho Marx Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 Yes, because a protector assisting their protectorate (who is clearly in the wrong in this case) in their extortion of raid victims is definitely something to be a fan of. All praise the fair and mighty GDA. That would make him a hypocrite to his stance on the IS-CG conflict. Also, hurry! Someone don your white armor and rush to UCR's aid! FOR ALL THAT IS GOOD, MORAL AND FOR GREAT JUSTICE! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebel Virginia Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 (edited) To be fair GDA hasn't done anything yet, but, if they do, well, I can't really say anything.On a second inspection, it would seem UCR is declaring on someone double their size, without proofing that ICB is supporting that raider. I reviewed the wars, and UCR only attacked the attacking nation. However, in response to the UCR's justified defense of its member nation, Brengsklau began in the unnecessary and uncalled for attacking of uninvolved UCR nations. And there, you have, the indisputable facts of the matter. We do not endorse tech raiding aligned nations, but in this case, this is CLEARLY a gross use of force. So, self-defense is now something always unjustified and to be looked down upon? I'll be sure to cite you on this from now on. The truth is that tech raiders deserve no protection from their alliances. If their victim has friends who will rain Hell upon the thug, then it is a thing of beauty indeed. I can only hope that I can see more of this, although I know it will not be happening. You see, this is why tech raiding is so widespread. Because it is encouraged by incompetent governments shielding cowards from the consequences of their actions. If alliances stopped protecting these individuals from what is so rightly due to them, I can assure you that this issue will precipitate once and for all. Edited September 16, 2009 by Rebel Virginia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slonq Posted September 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 To: RA2Leader From: 2Burnt2Eat Date: 9/13/2009 10:48:15 PMSubject: The Solution Message: Brengstklau wants UCR to cease their attacks IMMEDIATELY. We have already asked you to do this, and you have responded by having more assaults orchestrated on our member. We also want the Union of Communist Republics to pay 100 tech to cover the damage President Dasi has incurred, which was far above what was called for, but your alliance decided to snub Brengstklau and continue with the attacks. The shipments should be sent to Evry88 of Silence. Finally, we want an apology of the way this was handled. We received this case, and shortly afterward you jumped the gun and attacked our member before anything could be worked out. When we asked you to stop attacking him, you continued attacks. This is an insult on our government, and an alliance as a whole. There will be no more stalling, or false words and contradictory actions. You have 24 hours to comply or we will be forced to take steps to protect our members from further aggression. This was the letter that the Chairman of the CPUCR received. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masterfod Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 You do realize that the attacking party wanted UCR reparations of 100 tech Yes, I do. Probably wasn't the best thing to do, but from what I've been told, UCR was not only being uncooperative, but downright belligerent. The reps were probably out of place, but my opinion still stands: if a new guy makes a mistake, you don't pound him into the earth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masterfod Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 This was the letter that the Chairman of the CPUCR received. ... as this letter completely shows. Burnt was probably more pissed off than anything about UCR's response. But enough from me. I should probably wait for him to reply to this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhysicsJunky Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 You do realize that the attacking party wanted UCR reparations of 100 tech I read it as they consider that justified because of the "gross use of force". The standing rule in CN, whether you like it or not, seems to be that if your nation is raided you and your alliance are not supposed to fight back but it's your job, the attacked, to work out a diplomatic solution. This policy seems to be coming under question (with good reason in my own opinion) after the karma war but the viewpoint, which is very raider friendly, still has considerable backing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo Uruk Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 (edited) I never said who is right or wrong. I stated I like GDA. I'm pretty sure I'm not being foolish at all. You're supporting the protector getting involved. Either you're supporting the offending alliance. or you're following some illogical trail of thought. EDIT: Oh god I just realized he never said "war" Edited September 16, 2009 by Rey the Great Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vilien Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 I am always happy to see more examples of "it's not what you do, but who you are". Hopefully someone will stand up for UCR in this, though I don't think that's particularly likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Itsuki Koizumi Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 Yes, it was wrong for the ICB nation to raid an aligned nation. However, as everyone here can check, the nation was 18 days old, and the attack was an honest newbie mistake. They Should have put an exception xD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x8BitL0gic Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 (edited) So many small alliance wars that end so quickly. The best of luck to you, I suppose. o/ Edited September 16, 2009 by x8BitL0gic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
United Italy Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 The UCR is the victim here. The other alliance just thinks it could do what it wants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebel Virginia Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 Yes, I do. Probably wasn't the best thing to do, but from what I've been told, UCR was not only being uncooperative, but downright belligerent. The reps were probably out of place, but my opinion still stands: if a new guy makes a mistake, you don't pound him into the earth. Your protectorate demands "reparations" from the people they attacked. How ridiculous is that? Can you blame UCR for not being cooperative? "Reparations" from someone you yourself attacked is extortion. Period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masterfod Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 They Should have put an exception xD I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying the response was just stupid. A kid stealing a candy bar and a man robbing a bank are both wrong - theft is theft - but they clearly do not warrant the same punishment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 Fight on UCR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slonq Posted September 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 He pummeled one of our nations into the ground, we did the same to him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
United Italy Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 Brengstklau seriously you suck big ones. Going for a small alliance. Listen your member raided them and your having them pay repartions? Up yours seriously Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voodoo Nova Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 Best of luck to UCR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxfire99 Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 I cannot see how ICB can justify asking for reps for a war it started. Once you launch the initial attack, you pretty much take responsability yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebel Virginia Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying the response was just stupid. A kid stealing a candy bar and a man robbing a bank are both wrong - theft is theft - but they clearly do not warrant the same punishment. Don't you dare try to downplay the severity of this. The UCR was unjustly attacked by your protectorate and then extorted by the very same. What you are telling this alliance to do is "get over it." I'm disgusted and outraged. This offense is not to be marginalized and forgotten. At least by me it won't, and rest assured my good sir, GDA will be remembered as the alliance that condoned this injustice and made it possible for the offender to pull it off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kulomascovia Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 If anyone wants to know, this is GDA's official stance.Yes, it was wrong for the ICB nation to raid an aligned nation. However, as everyone here can check, the nation was 18 days old, and the attack was an honest newbie mistake. What was also wrong is UCR sending 2 other nations to pound said new nation into the ground, without attempting to work out a solution with either me or Burnt (which by the way he was actively trying to do). We all make mistakes. I'm not condoning what the ICB nation did, but it's clear that UCR wasn't exactly proactive with trying to de-escalate this conflict. We do not endorse tech raiding aligned nations, but in this case, this is CLEARLY a gross use of force. I am working with both parties right now in order to find an amicable solution. Actually the nation is 37 days old and was at 5.8 k when he was attacked. I don't think he was a noob that didn't know any better. Yes, I do. Probably wasn't the best thing to do, but from what I've been told, UCR was not only being uncooperative, but downright belligerent. The reps were probably out of place, but my opinion still stands: if a new guy makes a mistake, you don't pound him into the earth. UCR's reactions might have been a bit exaggerated but it is nothing compared to how brengstklau reacted to UCR's response: http://www.cybernations.net/search_wars.as...rch=brengstklau Brengstklau started a war over a couple of rouge responses. That seems more of an overreaction to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludacrism2 Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 http://www.cybernations.net/search_wars.as...yallexact=exact Interesting... Also, slong, this is just a suggestion but provide screens or logs of them demanding 100 tech from you. And did you attempt to diplomatically solve the issue before ordering your nations to attack the tech raider? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChairmanHal Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 I think that I shall raid a Brengstklau nation and then when I'm counter attacked have Valhalla demand reparations from them...or not. Fair is fair after all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logan Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 I think that I shall raid a Brengstklau nation and then when I'm counter attacked have Valhalla demand reparations from them...or not.Fair is fair after all. Already thought about it. Sadly, I cannot hit a 30k nation D: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Facade Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 I hope to see a UCR victory. Best of luck to you in this noble cause. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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