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ColchestersKing

An Open Letter to the NPO

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When an alliance is at war seems to be the perfect time for a bashing session. And from the feel of the forums, the NPO members wishing to respond may be fiery and zealous, however, they are the ones likely to be drowned under the weight of the posts from our side of the rift.

Chug that koolaid buddy, its rather hot today.

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Hmm, doesn't MHA still hold a treaty in which part of that is not to flame each other? Way to take the high road.

Seriously, enough with the Spartan judgement. The ONLY thing that Sparta can judge NPO on is for the aggression on OV. Everything else you were right there with them so for you to be pushing the largest reps ever seen as being fair is equivalent to some extreme hypocrisy. You really should just allow the guy from FOK to do all the talking because they were not side by side with NPO for a long time through all the horrible things that these massive terms are meant to punish them for like you guys were.....

Something positive comes out of the thread after all. Who would have thought?

thank you but just to point out i am not FOK i am iFOK there is a difference ;)

but yes again i am happy to do this

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:D

Good old self-righteous Londo.

People don't seem to understand that they are lucky to have people like Londo dealing with things like terms and reparations.

I know, I heard mollasses and cold day were out on break for the war, luckily not all was lost as their apprentice is still around.

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thank you but just to point out i am not FOK i am iFOK there is a difference ;)

but yes again i am happy to do this

Had no issues at all with the way you brought any of this up. I was actually talking about Tromp when I mentioned the guy from FOK. I recognized the difference in alliance.

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So now, like vampires we want to destroy

See, you are still a threat and want to destroy.

I love snipping quotes :)

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Had no issues at all with the way you brought any of this up. I was actually talking about Tromp when I mentioned the guy from FOK. I recognized the difference in alliance.

hehe my mistake but yes tromp is a good choice also

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NPO surrender terms are immoral, put this in your signature if you're down.

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Seriously, enough with the Spartan judgement. The ONLY thing that Sparta can judge NPO on is for the aggression on OV. Everything else you were right there with them so for you to be pushing the largest reps ever seen as being fair is equivalent to some extreme hypocrisy. You really should just allow the guy from FOK to do all the talking because they were not side by side with NPO for a long time through all the horrible things that these massive terms are meant to punish them for like you guys were.....

Did you read my posts? Nothing about the past or judgment is in any of them. And your knowledge of who was involved with what is woefully lacking. Sparta knows what it has done. You do not. Please try to address you posts to the content of mine instead of your bias against my AA.

I think a neutral arbitrator would be a good idea, but I can't think of anyone who is qualified for such an important position who does not have a bias.

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Looking at my calculations, with 2 weeks of nuclear war, the minimum amount you can lose (including turtling) is a little over 5000 infra. Please note these calculations do not include tech modifiers which would surely add hundreds if not thousands of infra damage on, or even WRCs for that matter.

Now if we look at NPO's nations, we will notice that they only have 33 nations above 9k infrastructure or above. So if all the nations currently large enough to pay reparations were faced with 2 weeks of nuclear war, they would only really have 33 (at most) nations to pay off the 8 billion dollar reparations. Of course, this number would slowly grow with rebuilding, but that is a ridiculous expectation of Karma.

Note: These calculations are very rough, and do not include tech modifiers, WRCS, sattelites, not turtling, missile defenses, SDIs, or anything else. I just used the base number for attacks.

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Did you read my posts? Nothing about the past or judgment is in any of them. And your knowledge of who was involved with what is woefully lacking. Sparta knows what it has done. You do not. Please try to address you posts to the content of mine instead of your bias against my AA.

I think a neutral arbitrator would be a good idea, but I can't think of anyone who is qualified for such an important position who does not have a bias.

If we are thinking of people to act in this role then may i suggest MiketheFirst; mike does not hold bias when he has a job to do and is capable of delivering home truths if need be,

but in terms of qualified we just need someone who can put thier alliance aside for a moment and mearly act as thier morals dictate, again while i may not be a widly known figure i if called upon can do this and to be honest would very much like to.....bear in mind it may be benificial to have someone in the role who is not known extensivly to either party thus ensuring that no bias will take place

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Did you read my posts? Nothing about the past or judgment is in any of them. And your knowledge of who was involved with what is woefully lacking. Sparta knows what it has done. You do not. Please try to address you posts to the content of mine instead of your bias against my AA.

I think a neutral arbitrator would be a good idea, but I can't think of anyone who is qualified for such an important position who does not have a bias.

In all honesty, I have a candidate in mind. Clearly a member of a Karma alliance or a member of NPO won't do, so why not ask someone who has ties to both sides? Ask Almighty Grub. Does anyone here doubt he would listen to both sides and do his best to help end the fight with a reasonable solution? NpO has friends on both sides of the conflict. I think he would do well, though I'm not sure if either side would ageree.

Edit to avoid double:

Looking at my calculations, with 2 weeks of nuclear war, the minimum amount you can lose (including turtling) is a little over 5000 infra. Please note these calculations do not include tech modifiers which would surely add hundreds if not thousands of infra damage on, or even WRCs for that matter.

Now if we look at NPO's nations, we will notice that they only have 33 nations above 9k infrastructure or above. So if all the nations currently large enough to pay reparations were faced with 2 weeks of nuclear war, they would only really have 33 (at most) nations to pay off the 8 billion dollar reparations. Of course, this number would slowly grow with rebuilding, but that is a ridiculous expectation of Karma.

Note: These calculations are very rough, and do not include tech modifiers, WRCS, sattelites, not turtling, missile defenses, SDIs, or anything else. I just used the base number for attacks.

How can you expect anyone to listen to these "rough calculations" when you don't show how you got them and just randomly throw them out there? There has been plenty of calculating done by both sides, and the threads are still around a couple pages down, go look at them if you want to see what things would look like, or just do them out yourself and show us.

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I realise all to well that the NPO does not accept surrender or harsh terms very well but as a saying goes "Winning a war yet loosing an empire is no victory and Loosing a battle to save an empire is no defeat"

I hope the leadership of NPO reads this and takes the above quote to heart. They are one heck of an alliance (I must admit, even if I am anti-Pacifica) and to maintain their empire, they should end the war and start rebuilding.

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So if all the nations currently large enough to pay reparations were faced with 2 weeks of nuclear war, they would only really have 33 (at most) nations to pay off the 8 billion dollar reparations.

You miss an important point: warchest. It only takes $200m to rebuild to 5k.

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Did you read my posts? Nothing about the past or judgment is in any of them. And your knowledge of who was involved with what is woefully lacking. Sparta knows what it has done. You do not. Please try to address you posts to the content of mine instead of your bias against my AA.

I think a neutral arbitrator would be a good idea, but I can't think of anyone who is qualified for such an important position who does not have a bias.

Yes I read them and I quoted them. How is my knowledge lacking? You deny that you were directly involved in tC, which everyone seems to call part of the NPO sphere of influence, up until mere moments of time before all this began to kick off? That is the official stance of Sparta, sorry if you were very slow to act as most seemed to know you fealt but that does not show anything but cowardice.

I find it rather cute you would try to disregard my post by labeling it all as simple bias against your AA. Honestly I don't give a damn about your alliance so it would be pretty hard for me to be biased against it. When I say I am tired of seeing the Spartan judgement obviously I am speaking to more then just your own post as yours is merely reflective of the opinions coming from your camp. Yes, I realize you think you are being individualistic with your posts here but from someone on the outside watching, they appear rather similiar. So yes, I am going to label it as Spartan judgement because it all is coming off very similiar in appearance. If you do not wish it to be labeled as such then come up with something original.

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If both sides agreed to anyone, it would be great, but you'd have to get approval from something like 18 alliances, so I wouldn't hold my breath.

Edit:

Yes I read them and I quoted them. How is my knowledge lacking? You deny that you were directly involved in tC, which everyone seems to call part of the NPO sphere of influence, up until mere moments of time before all this began to kick off? That is the official stance of Sparta, sorry if you were very slow to act as most seemed to know you fealt but that does not show anything but cowardice.

I find it rather cute you would try to disregard my post by labeling it all as simple bias against your AA. Honestly I don't give a damn about your alliance so it would be pretty hard for me to be biased against it. When I say I am tired of seeing the Spartan judgement obviously I am speaking to more then just your own post as yours is merely reflective of the opinions coming from your camp. Yes, I realize you think you are being individualistic with your posts here but from someone on the outside watching, they appear rather similiar. So yes, I am going to label it as Spartan judgement because it all is coming off very similiar in appearance. If you do not wish it to be labeled as such then come up with something original.

I don't think you know what bias means. You also don't know anything that happened inside Q, and you apparently didn't realize that FOK was also a member of Q. Luckily, you do apparently know that I'm cute, so I forgive you your ignorance.

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You miss an important point: warchest. It only takes $200m to rebuild to 5k.

How much of a warchest do you think they had at the beginning of the war? Now? After the two weeks? That makes all the difference. As a Gramlin, you should actually have a good bit of experience with large nation warfare, share with us. :D

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You miss an important point: warchest. It only takes $200m to rebuild to 5k.

Do you really honestly think a 5k infra nation would have 200 million on them to rebuild?

200 million is over a month and a half of saving, and most of these 5k infra nations have been through war, so they have spent some of their warchest. I'm sorry, but I don't think it is feasible to even think that a majority of these nations will have enough money on hand to rebuild.

How can you expect anyone to listen to these "rough calculations" when you don't show how you got them and just randomly throw them out there? There has been plenty of calculating done by both sides, and the threads are still around a couple pages down, go look at them if you want to see what things would look like, or just do them out yourself and show us.

Alright.

40 (for defeat alert) + 20 (2 cms per day) x 3 (3 attackers) + 40 (2 aircraft attacks per day) x3 + 150 (1 nuke per day)

That is one day of minimal damage if turtling. So then you times that by 14 for 2 weeks of war and get 5180 approximate infra destroyed per day at minimum.

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Do you really honestly think a 5k infra nation would have 200 million on them to rebuild?

200 million is over a month and a half of saving, and most of these 5k infra nations have been through war, so they have spent some of their warchest. I'm sorry, but I don't think it is feasible to even think that a majority of these nations will have enough money on hand to rebuild.

He means that from ZI, a nation needs 200 mil with Factories and trades to get to 5k infra. That is actually a small amount of what a large nation should have as a warchest.

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He means that from ZI, a nation needs 200 mil with Factories and trades to get to 5k infra. That is actually a small amount of what a large nation should have as a warchest.

And money burns fast, be it from you or the enemy. Hence why I posed the question of what will be left at the end of the conflict.

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He means that from ZI, a nation needs 200 mil with Factories and trades to get to 5k infra. That is actually a small amount of what a large nation should have as a warchest.

You can't expect a 5k infra nation to have that after weeks of war, and many more in peace mode. And Locke is correct, you fly through money during war time, quite easily.

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Vladimir has claimed the NPO won Great War 1 partly because they avoided restrictive terms through negotiations and political manipulation, correct?

It may possible that Karma leadership has reason not to lessen the terms for fear that NPO will claim the lesser terms were an NPO victory.

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Vladimir has claimed the NPO won Great War 1 partly because they avoided restrictive terms through negotiations and political manipulation, correct?

It may possible that Karma leadership has reason not to lessen the terms for fear that NPO will claim the lesser terms were an NPO victory.

Entirely incorrect. And we've already conceded defeat.

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He means that from ZI, a nation needs 200 mil with Factories and trades to get to 5k infra. That is actually a small amount of what a large nation should have as a warchest.

It's far less to go from 0 to 4k than that, which is where you can easily (very easily) send out 15M a week.

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If both sides agreed to anyone, it would be great, but you'd have to get approval from something like 18 alliances, so I wouldn't hold my breath.

Edit:

I don't think you know what bias means. You also don't know anything that happened inside Q, and you apparently didn't realize that FOK was also a member of Q. Luckily, you do apparently know that I'm cute, so I forgive you your ignorance.

Actually I was quite aware of FOK's being part of Q, I was just waiting for you to point it out in your own defense. It becomes so much more powerful that way then if I had simply said that. The point was we only see the ex allies of NPO feeling the need to defend all this here. I wonder why that is hmm?

I forgive you of your ignorance when it comes to my knowledge.

Vladimir has claimed the NPO won Great War 1 partly because they avoided restrictive terms through negotiations and political manipulation, correct?

It may possible that Karma leadership has reason not to lessen the terms for fear that NPO will claim the lesser terms were an NPO victory.

Bullseye. The point we are at now is due to those fighting NPO not wanting to give an inch else they be blamed for giving NPO some sort of small victory.

Enjoy the year long war guys! Your pride deserves it.

Entirely incorrect. And we've already conceded defeat.

It doesn't matter, they all seem to have an irrational fear of NPO propaganda and decide for themselves how you guys will act in the future. As if they havn't already been successful in severely cutting you off from most of the world, which of course I do think is necessary.

The only difference is I think NPO is now at a point where you guys have to realize that you have to change the way you operate. I think you should have that choice where as some others dont think you should have any choice.

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You can't expect a 5k infra nation to have that after weeks of war, and many more in peace mode. And Locke is correct, you fly through money during war time, quite easily.

Regardless of what size the nation was before, it only takes 37 mil to get to 3k infra, a respectable level, and only 73 mil to make it to 4k, a level where a nation is large enough to clear bills and send out aid. Not as much money as it seems, is it?

Edit to avoid double:

It's far less to go from 0 to 4k than that, which is where you can easily (very easily) send out 15M a week.

Yeah, it is, I had to go look up the numbers.

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