revenge doctrine

[Merrie Melodies]

i have raided several unaligned and red team nations over the past few days

my nation is here

http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_d...ation_ID=274870

I am quite sure someone will drop by, if no one else, myself in good time.

[Näktergal]

Thats actually just an extension of it. Before the war, they were both active Doctrine's.

Technically, both are still active - it's just that the odds of either being enforced when the NPO is already being hit from multiple angles by powerful enemies are fairly low, and thus, they're probably functionally inactive.

That doesn't mean the NPO can't reiterate their commitment to their principles after the war ends. Even more so if they receive terms that don't explicitly require them to cancel both doctrines. There's also nothing preventing them from documenting every single violation of the Moldavi and Revenge Doctrines NOW, during the war, and punishing violators LATER for what they did. It's entirely possible that some of the people who are currently very smug about moving their smaller alliances into Red or about raiding unaligned Red nations will find themselves getting their teeth kicked in a few months from now. If the NPO has shown the world ANYTHING, it's that they're very, very good about paying back old debts, no matter how minor they might seem to outsiders. And that they're very, very patient about waiting until the time is right for revenge.

The comments on the Wiki are more wishful thinking and a bit of hopeful opportunism than anything else. Much like some of the people in this very topic, there are a lot of people who stand to profit from a weakened NPO control over Red, and who are gleefully pushing the issue. That doesn't make it true, though. And it doesn't mean the NPO won't be in a position to do something about it in the future if they choose to.

Personally, I find it sad that people are already pushing for the Revenge Doctrine to be axed, because I honestly think it's the best thing the NPO ever did in the entire history of CN (even if they DID sort of get the idea from FAN). The complaints of the people screaming the loudest about the NPO defending unaligned nations in Red say a hell of a lot less about the NPO than they do about the childish immaturity of the Tech raiders who apparently lack the balls to fight anyone unless they can ambush them alone. Never mind the fact that there are thousands of other unaligned nations in nearly a dozen other teams, oh no - the fact that there are unaligned nations in Red that they're not allowed to attack is apparently a personal insult to the pirates and cowards among us, and there will be no justice in the world until they're once again able to mug anyone and everyone they like, no matter where they choose to hide.

To hell with abolishing the Revenge Doctrine over Red - I'd rather see it spread to other spheres. Then maybe the opportunists would have to fight for their supper for once, rather than simply picking on the easy victims. That's probably too much to hope for in a world where most nation leaders are teenage boys, though.

[Merrie Melodies]

Wow lot of threats against the member of the Dark Templar I'll be interested in seeing whether or not anything is done about it.

And anyone else who has raided red, they will be attacked along with him as well. It appears the war with the NPO is a dramallama that just keeps giving.

I have a tremendously long memory and a deep rooted dislike of punks, couple that with my fondness of RED and I think I can assure you I'll do what ever I can to cause misery to that Dark Templar clown.

[ModusOperandi]

Technically, both are still active - it's just that the odds of either being enforced when the NPO is already being hit from multiple angles by powerful enemies are fairly low, and thus, they're probably functionally inactive.

That doesn't mean the NPO can't reiterate their commitment to their principles after the war ends. Even more so if they receive terms that don't explicitly require them to cancel both doctrines. There's also nothing preventing them from documenting every single violation of the Moldavi and Revenge Doctrines NOW, during the war, and punishing violators LATER for what they did. It's entirely possible that some of the people who are currently very smug about moving their smaller alliances into Red or about raiding unaligned Red nations will find themselves getting their teeth kicked in a few months from now. If the NPO has shown the world ANYTHING, it's that they're very, very good about paying back old debts, no matter how minor they might seem to outsiders. And that they're very, very patient about waiting until the time is right for revenge.

The comments on the Wiki are more wishful thinking and a bit of hopeful opportunism than anything else. Much like some of the people in this very topic, there are a lot of people who stand to profit from a weakened NPO control over Red, and who are gleefully pushing the issue. That doesn't make it true, though. And it doesn't mean the NPO won't be in a position to do something about it in the future if they choose to.

Personally, I find it sad that people are already pushing for the Revenge Doctrine to be axed, because I honestly think it's the best thing the NPO ever did in the entire history of CN (even if they DID sort of get the idea from FAN). The complaints of the people screaming the loudest about the NPO defending unaligned nations in Red say a hell of a lot less about the NPO than they do about the childish immaturity of the Tech raiders who apparently lack the balls to fight anyone unless they can ambush them alone. Never mind the fact that there are thousands of other unaligned nations in nearly a dozen other teams, oh no - the fact that there are unaligned nations in Red that they're not allowed to attack is apparently a personal insult to the pirates and cowards among us, and there will be no justice in the world until they're once again able to mug anyone and everyone they like, no matter where they choose to hide.

To hell with abolishing the Revenge Doctrine over Red - I'd rather see it spread to other spheres. Then maybe the opportunists would have to fight for their supper for once, rather than simply picking on the easy victims. That's probably too much to hope for in a world where most nation leaders are teenage boys, though.

Sir,

While I respect your opinion I cannot help but to point out its flaws; first of all, the Moldavi Doctrine (and, in turn, the Revenge Doctrine) have eliminated the natural ability for the Red Team to have multiple alliances with which it can promote and encourage sphere prosperity.

This is evident in the below-average ability for Red Nations to acquire stable trades and/or tech transactions as is the case on other (more populous spheres); to be frank, the Red Team just doesn't have the numbers that it should have.

The other core colors, such as Orange and Blue, have each benefited greatly from having multiple alliances established on each of them; this has fostered diplomatic understanding and cooperation between sovereign communities. Red, however, does not have this advantage and the presence of a single controlling entity (appointed as such by itself) has led to the disadvantage of not having that diplomatic understanding and cooperation; witness the recent failures of the Pacifican diplomatic corps as evidence of that.

Simply put, the more nations and communities that are on Red, the better; not only have the present doctrines enabled the NPO to hide certain nations under an unaligned affiliation, but it has also restricted the benefits of Red Team self-determination.

In a word, this is unacceptable and why many alliances are now taking matters into their own hands and establishing themselves here.

Now, in the future the majority of us are sincerely willing to work with the NPO to maintain a stable and prosperous sphere; the more the merrier, as the old saying declares.

[Cobalt]

Go ahead and start raiding red unaligneds. I'll be sure to try and find someone to deal with you after this war is over.

You're a cowardly oppurtunist.

A couple of more nukes and ill be in range.

Just because you act like the NPO doesn't mean your alliance gets to run things when they're gone. Congratulations on the chest beating though, I hope it made you feel strong/powerful/important/needed/insert-your-insecurities-here.

- - -

Personally, I'd like to see NPO still enforce the Revenge Doctrine after the war - protecting a sphere from tech raids isn't a bad thing. I'll be happy to see the Moldavi Doctrine fall... open up the red sphere for the first time in years.

[Voodoo Nova]

i have raided several unaligned and red team nations over the past few days

my nation is here

http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_d...ation_ID=274870

Would you have done this a month ago?

[TehChron]

MO...Shut up.

The NPO never used the Revenge or Moldavi doctrines to prevent people from forming alliances. If anything, they used it as an excuse to encourage individual alliances that cropped up in that sphere as useful lists for trading partners.

Moldavi doctrine was a pretext for opening up those kinds of relations, nothing more when it came to that. You're being an opportunist, which is fine, but please, dont be delusional.

[Chet Ubet]

Freak the Revenge Doctrine I want the Moldavi doctrine to be void

[Merrie Melodies]

And you wonder why we wont let you back in? We dun lik no hipocrites!

Thankfully you didn't, what a waste it would be if youwish was trapped in a stink hole like PC.

[King DrunkWino]

The wiki says both the Revenge Doctorine and the Moldavi Doctorine are defunct, however I have not seen anything official on these forums.

Probably the right way to think about it. I know I'm going to believe their in force until I see an announcement to the contrary starting with a

/then again, I've never been much for tech raiding in the first place.

[cowen70]

I have a tremendously long memory and a deep rooted dislike of punks, couple that with my fondness of RED and I think I can assure you I'll do what ever I can to cause misery to that Dark Templar clown.

Good luck you are going to need it. That will have various consequences. If you have the backing of your alliance then it will mean a war since DT aren't unconnected, or if you don't you'll be ground into dirt.

I do wonder whether or not its all talk though, which is why I commented on this thread. I really do wonder if anyone will be backing up their threats after all this is done.

[ModusOperandi]

MO...Shut up.

The NPO never used the Revenge or Moldavi doctrines to prevent people from forming alliances. If anything, they used it as an excuse to encourage individual alliances that cropped up in that sphere as useful lists for trading partners.

Moldavi doctrine was a pretext for opening up those kinds of relations, nothing more when it came to that. You're being an opportunist, which is fine, but please, dont be delusional.

You may disagree with my opinion, however, please concentrate on arguing the facts rather than making pointed insults at the person.

It is a fact that the Moldavi Doctrine has prevented any other Red Alliances from forming here; as proof I would like to point to the non-existence of many other Red alliances up until now. Counter-argument?

The Moldavi Doctrine was used as a pretext to lay claim to the Red Team back when other alliances were also claiming control over other color spheres; NAAC Blue, Legion Purple, GATO Brown. It is the last hold-over from that early era. Counter-argument?

[Merrie Melodies]

Good luck you are going to need it. That will have various consequences. If you have the backing of your alliance then it will mean a war since DT aren't unconnected, or if you don't you'll be ground into dirt.

I do wonder whether or not its all talk though, which is why I commented on this thread. I really do wonder if anyone will be backing up their threats after all this is done.

I speak for myself on this issue, and it has been shown that quite a large amount of trouble can be caused by a nation with zero infra. Face it DT has MyWorld in government, their a easy target to begin with.

[Haflinger]

It is a fact that the Moldavi Doctrine has prevented any other Red Alliances from forming here; as proof I would like to point to the non-existence of many other Red alliances up until now. Counter-argument?

The VG Coalition, The Red Rose to name two alliances with mostly Red nations that existed under Moldavi.

I'm sure there have been others, but I'm just going off the top of my head

[BamaBuc]

i have raided several unaligned and red team nations over the past few days

my nation is here

http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_d...ation_ID=274870

Oh !@#$, you're cool now. "LOOK AT ME I CAN RAID RED AND NPO CANT STOP ME LOL!!!" You continue to show nothing but class, Willirica.

-Bama

[Vilien]

Just because you act like the NPO doesn't mean your alliance gets to run things when they're gone. Congratulations on the chest beating though, I hope it made you feel strong/powerful/important/needed/insert-your-insecurities-here.

- - -

Personally, I'd like to see NPO still enforce the Revenge Doctrine after the war - protecting a sphere from tech raids isn't a bad thing. I'll be happy to see the Moldavi Doctrine fall... open up the red sphere for the first time in years.

I don't run things around here, and I don't expect to. I can assure you, though, that I will do whatever I can to give unaligneds protection from raiding, whether on the red sphere or any other. Still, if acting resolutely or speaking your mind freely is acting like the NPO, then I will be more than happy to do so.

I hope posting that made you feel superior to the rest of us lowlifes.

[ModusOperandi]

The VG Coalition, The Red Rose to name two alliances with mostly Red nations that existed under Moldavi.

I'm sure there have been others, but I'm just going off the top of my head

Now compare that with a list of other alliances that have been formed on other spheres; see my point?

[Haflinger]

Now compare that with a list of other alliances that have been formed on other spheres; see my point?

No, your point was that no alliances have ever been formed on Red because of the nasty Moldavi doctrine. My point was that a number of microalliances have been formed on Red, and named two (should've included WOLF too).

I'd be hard-pressed to name more than three microalliances on any sphere other than Purple.

[Merrie Melodies]

I don't run things around here, and I don't expect to. I can assure you, though, that I will do whatever I can to give unaligneds protection from raiding, whether on the red sphere or any other. Still, if acting resolutely or speaking your mind freely is acting like the NPO, then I will be more than happy to do so.

I hope posting that made you feel superior to the rest of us lowlifes.

Well said sir, well said.

[der_ko]

Would you have done this a month ago?

Would the NPO have created the Revenge doctrine in their current position?

Edited May 10, 2009 by der_ko

[SoxNation]

I don't have a philosophical problem with either doctrine, to be honest. I don't care if they hog red team. I like the protection of the unaligned. They'll be coming down at the end of this war, but not because they are such horrible policies.

the funniest thing i see in it that all of WUT hated YN5, this was originally FAN's doctrine, they were hated for it, but when NPO did it, it was great!

[ModusOperandi]

No, your point was that no alliances have ever been formed on Red because of the nasty Moldavi doctrine. My point was that a number of microalliances have been formed on Red, and named two (should've included WOLF too).

I'd be hard-pressed to name more than three microalliances on any sphere other than Purple.

Please don't get into semantics, two individuals can argue night and day over whether or not the sky is actually blue; you have named three microalliances that were created on Red, how does that point to the success of the Moldavi/Revenge Doctrines?

The answer? It does not.

It is simply semantics, my friend; if the Moldavi/Revenge Doctrines were unequivocal successes than Red would have a much higher population and would be (at the very least) average in the statistical rankings when compared to the other spheres. It is not, therefore, it has failed to harness a prosperous sphere.

Edited May 10, 2009 by ModusOperandi

[BamaBuc]

the funniest thing i see in it that all of WUT hated YN5, this was originally FAN's doctrine, they were hated for it, but when NPO did it, it was great!

When FAN enforced YN5, they shot first and asked questions never. When NPO enforced RD, they asked questions first and then shot if necessary. I think that's the difference in a lot of people's minds.

-Bama

[TehChron]

Now compare that with a list of other alliances that have been formed on other spheres; see my point?

Actually, if anything, the fact that the NPO was simply a better alternative and completely swamped all other newbie nations with better quality recruitment messages is a better cause of weaker Red alliances in general than some kind of tyrannical grip on the team color.

I mean, I see your point...It's just not valid.

[bzelger]

the funniest thing i see in it that all of WUT hated YN5, this was originally FAN's doctrine, they were hated for it, but when NPO did it, it was great!

That was before my time, but didn't FAN allow raiding other spheres even as they protected their own? I can see why that would breed resentment.