Official Announcement from The Order of the Paradox

[janax]

Am I to guess that, and I quote, TOP are asshats?

I'm also surprised that you think so little of the people we declared on.

Mitchh...I love you, man. Sadly for you, it's completely platonic.

And I admit it, I chuckled a little.

[GuMMyWoRm]

o/ TOP Id hate to be on purple right now :lol:

[LOLtex]

You just made my point, I'm wondering why TOP even got involved to start with, Obviously you guys are well respected among the community, which may be the reasoning behind you mediating, however when I looked at you guys and the war It was my belief TOP wins this war by not fighting it.

Don't get my wrong, I love it that you entered the War, I'm really enjoying your choice of targets for other reasons.

Take a step back for a second and imagine the war from our perspective. MDP partner is declaring on MDP partners, other partners declaring for the hell of it, and TOP is caught in the middle. To add icing to the cake, we're a republic. While we move at what some may call a slow pace, I wouldn't have it any other way. With that said, if we had entered on the side of Karma, people would have been upset. If we had entered on the side of Hegemony, more people would have been upset. If we had not entered the fray at all (ie. UjW) everyone would have been upset. There is no good choice for TOP here, but we have done the best we could with what we were given. We're not supposed to appease anyone, we're just doing what we think is best.

[Branimir]

If someone has an issue with us and calls us cowards, you are welcome to redirect any and all second wave declarations by "Hegemony" toward TOP. I am sure my brothers in arms would welcome if targets came to us, instead of us needing to seek them out with sword and fire.

Your move.

And do know Saber that we would be completely justified in doing so, speaking in regards to New Pacific Order. You are now currently engaging some of our treaty partners in an offensive capacity while we didn't engaged offensively any of yours (if of course, you don't have some kind of a treaty with OV about which I do not know) and I am quite sure that must break some kind of a treaty clause of our MDP (if that didn't get canceled already and I missed that).

While I doubt NPO will direct its fire towards you as we have a nice selection of targets to choose from already, this is a regrettable action which will forever remain embedded in collective memory of both alliances which share such a long and rich history together both on alliance level and on a level of individual member nations and leaders.

On the same note, kudos to United Purple Nations, Invicta, Echelon and Boards Alliance of Protectorate States. You must have done something right to get this attention.

Edited April 27, 2009 by Branimir

[Khyber]

This has not been an easy choice for us, but when you consider the side that is fighting to protect the NPO are not doing it out of loyalty to them but honoring a treaty, and to be perfectly honest there is no treaty obligation in this war that demands we get ingaged in this war, as when NPO attacked OV they lost our obligation to protect them, and when everyone else started going to one side or the other we weren't obligated to follow them due to our MDPs. Take into effect that we have no MADP and only oAs here and there, when it came to choosing a side we had the choice to go in for IRON, who was doing it out of nessessaty to their treaty, OG in the same boat as IRON, or the rest of citadel, FOK, and some orange alliances.

We were already leaning towards one side, secret meetings behind our backs, our exit from Q before the war started, our talks of cancelation for the Valhalla and MCXA treaties. Idealogically we were more skewed to Gremlins then we were to the side that was defending the NPO, minus IRON who I think we still feel idealogically similar too, allufe, quiet, honorable without the need to go about judging openly or to grandstand.

So all in all, I'm suprised that so many were suprised by this declaration.

[Branimir]

Looking treaty wise obviously TOP found it self in a cluster$%&@. I do not believe anybody would really mind you staying out and neutral.

Actually it would seem as the most logical step even further seeing how alliances towards which you were closer will not get really destroyed in this war as they are obviously on a bigger, winning side. And you can always aid them massively after the war.

The fact that despite that you did feel the need to jump in is a message to be acknowledged and so it will be.

[Khyber]

And do know Saber that we would be completely justified in doing so, speaking in regards to New Pacific Order. You are now currently engaging some of our treaty partners in an offensive capacity while we didn't engaged offensively any of yours (if of course, you don't have some kind of a treaty with OV about which I do not know) and I am quite sure that must break some kind of a treaty clause of our MDP (if that didn't get canceled already and I missed that).

While I doubt NPO will direct its fire towards you as we have a nice selection of targets to choose from already, this is a regrettable action which will forever remain embedded in collective memory of both alliances which share such a long and rich history together both on alliance level and on a level of individual member nations and leaders.

On the same note, kudos to United Purple Nations, Invicta, Echelon and Boards Alliance of Protectorate States. You must have done something right to get this attention.

Branimir, actually there is no mention of not attacking treaty partners in our MDP. But I understand how the spirit of the treaty would be broken with such an act. Lets say in the same way that spirit would be broken if we tried to mediate peaceful negotiation and before they were over you attacked.

What suprises me to this point is that the NPO has not apologized to it's allies, us included, after it's actions, and instead has decided to lie to it's membership about what we know and don't know. I do not regret I am on the opposite side of NPO, I regret I am on the opposite side of IRON, and that we are in this war with alliances I know are vultures and hypocrates.

What is regrettable here is how little the NPO valued us in the end, and how quick you were willing to throw away such a long and rich history we had shared together both on an alliance level and on a level of individual member nations and leaders. Because lets not beat around the bush, you knew what kind of position it would have put TOP in if you started this war.

[TECUMSEH]

So all in all, I'm suprised that so many were suprised by this declaration.

I don't think anyone should be surprised with respect to which side TOP entered on. The surprise, IMO, is how they entered. As you noted, TOP's bonds with and ties to Gre and Citadel are indisputable. I would not have guessed such strong ties with the SF alliance of the Orange team. I was obviously wrong.

Again, no criticism from me -- TOP acted in a way that its members obviously felt was needed. I thinks surprise is the right word.

Here's to a good fight, and my own personal well-wishes to a friend in TOP, Aalumni, who is off fighting Echelon.

(Edited to add quote)

Edited April 27, 2009 by TECUMSEH

[ojiras ajeridas]

The fact that despite that you did feel the need to jump in is a message to be acknowledged and so it will be.

As it is the fact that you attacked during peace negotiations lead by us without any information in reguard. This is not the way true friends should act.

[Khyber]

Looking treaty wise obviously TOP found it self in a cluster$%&@. I do not believe anybody would really mind you staying out and neutral.

Actually it would seem as the most logical step even further seeing how alliances towards which you were closer will not get really destroyed in this war as they are obviously on a bigger, winning side. And you can always aid them massively after the war.

The fact that despite that you did feel the need to jump in is a message to be acknowledged and so it will be.

I'm shocked you just acknowledged the fact that we did not agree with your actions that brought this war about till right now.

The only thing that will change with our declarations is we will bring the war to a close faster hopefully, and spare some of our real allies on the other side some furthur damage. Yes we could have turned this war around for you, maybe, or sat neutral and gotten to number 1. But for the sake or our friends on both sides we felt we needed to do this.

[Meer Republic]

And do know Saber that we would be completely justified in doing so, speaking in regards to New Pacific Order. You are now currently engaging some of our treaty partners in an offensive capacity while we didn't engaged offensively any of yours (if of course, you don't have some kind of a treaty with OV about which I do not know) and I am quite sure that must break some kind of a treaty clause of our MDP (if that didn't get canceled already and I missed that).

While I doubt NPO will direct its fire towards you as we have a nice selection of targets to choose from already, this is a regrettable action which will forever remain embedded in collective memory of both alliances which share such a long and rich history together both on alliance level and on a level of individual member nations and leaders.

You forewent our treaty when you decided to use our good faith attempts to mediate into a diversion for your underhandedness. We can go into other things you've done that demonstrate your complete disrespect for us if you like but this is not the place.

[WarriorConcept]

NPO and MCXA complaining about not honoring treaties?

This is rich.

[FlogYou]

I am honored to be fighting against TOP in this war, They seem to be a very well organized military machine, as can be judged by their update blitz. I think the pre-midnight attacks went well for my against my 2 TOP nations, after midnight, not so well. I look forward to further bloodshed over the course of this war. I certainly hope you bought extra bleach, I have a feeling like I am about to get very bloody

[Branimir]

Branimir, actually there is no mention of not attacking treaty partners in our MDP. But I understand how the spirit of the treaty would be broken with such an act. Lets say in the same way that spirit would be broken if we tried to mediate peaceful negotiation and before they were over you attacked.

It is broken all right for me for what little its worth.

What suprises me to this point is that the NPO has not apologized to it's allies, us included, after it's actions, and instead has decided to lie to it's membership about what we know and don't know. I do not regret I am on the opposite side of NPO, I regret I am on the opposite side of IRON, and that we are in this war with alliances I know are vultures and hypocrates.

You can rationalize this as how you please. We were trapped by so called "karma" into this war. Their propaganda machinery working fast spinning things as to fit a certain picture.

Some have realized that but did honestly said that we had it coming and they do not care. Some even to this day parade as it were the truth, but after the dust settles Bob shall be called Bob.

What is regrettable here is how little the NPO valued us in the end

You have no idea about what you are talking about. This shall sting for many of us deeply as we do in fact care.

As it is the fact that you attacked during peace negotiations lead by us without any information in reguard. This is not the way true friends should act.

The so called "karma" propaganda stunt from where they jumped start this war is not about what I care here. As stated you rationalize your decision how you wish to.

I can though, state my sadness that you have chosen this way and attacked this fine examples of alliances.

I'm shocked you just acknowledged the fact that we did not agree with your actions that brought this war about till right now.

I am acknowledging that our close friendship build over the years is over. And on this sad way, from my point of view.

The only thing that will change with our declarations is we will bring the war to a close faster hopefully

I am tough a bit amazed you went for this line right here, but whatever makes this decision being better for you.

You forewent our treaty when you decided to use our good faith attempts to mediate into a diversion for your underhandedness. We can go into other things you've done that demonstrate your complete disrespect for us if you like but this is not the place.

As I stated to others, I can not be bothered by the propaganda spin put on the "peace talks" by the so called "karma". Logs are out there for everybody to read and understand. And they shall.

Of course now, there will be a overwhelming attempt at rationalization of this decision. And in doing so, it shall be forgotten the positive things that were made and had, they victories shared and prosperity ensured to "stat collect". It will come by those in TOP coming from alliances once set up to be pitted against us. I am though also confident that there are people in TOP that shall not forget the great bond that once existed and will not get overly deep in all the BS that is sure to fallow.

That is all I have to say. Good day gentlemen.

edit:

NPO and MCXA complaining about not honoring treaties?

This is rich.

And here comes WC. We couldn't have this discussion without you now could we. Keep on message WC keep on message.

Edited April 27, 2009 by Branimir

[scythegfx]

lol

Poor Invicta.

o/ TOP

Oh Ephie, really? At least we still have friends who trust and believe in us, and arent stuck nuking 8KNS nations "for the hell of it"

Now, I'm gonna go all sentimental on you and say That we're richer in honor and friends than you will ever be.

And hey, at the rate you're going, we probly have more money too =P.

[TBRaiders]

You are now currently engaging some of our treaty partners in an offensive capacity...

IMO, Nobody in this conflict is fighting for the "defense" of Pacifica. There are only two sides to any conflict and Pacifica was the aggressor. Everyone can do treaty-speak and play words games, but if you are fighting for the side currently labeled as the Hegemony you either believe their cause is just or you allowed your nations to be drawn in through poorly worded treaty obligations and mostly likely misguided pride.

Even under your own definition of defensive and offensive obligations, TOP has violated nothing. They are defending an ally who entered this fray defending an ally. I know how difficult this has been for TOP with treaty partners and friends on both sides and realize there was no action they could take, to include inaction, that wouldn't draw criticism. I would have respected TOP no matter what decision they made because I know it would have been one they considered carefully and one they realized was correct for them.

[Hasin]

I don't think anyone in TOP will soon forget the bond that was shared by NPO and TOP over these past two years.

[Meer Republic]

As I stated to others, I can not be bothered by the propaganda spin put on the "peace talks" by the so called "karma". Logs are out there for everybody to read and understand. And they shall.

Of course now, there will be a overwhelming attempt at rationalization of this decision. And in doing so, it shall be forgotten the positive things that were made and had, they victories shared and prosperity ensured to "stat collect". It will come by those in TOP coming from alliances once set up to be pitted against us. I am though also confident that there are people in TOP that shall not forget the great bond that once existed and will not get overly deep in all the BS that is sure to fallow.

This nonsense only works on alliances that weren't there. We were on irc trying to negotiate a peaceful solution to this ridiculous affair, you were declaring war. Now with this great bond we have anyone would maybe expect you to tell us you were going to declare war rather than make us look like fools for trying to clear up your mess while you obviously had no intention of a peaceful outcome. Get over yourself, we're not buying what you're selling.

I love the fact that you act all hurt now, as you don't seem to give a damn about what anyone else thinks unless you need them.

[TBRaiders]

You can rationalize this as how you please. We were trapped by so called "karma" into this war. Their propaganda machinery working fast spinning things as to fit a certain picture.

This is rich. You were trapped by Karma into declaring on OV during peace talks? Yes, very rich.

Trapped can be better defined by many of your current allies who are disgusted with your actions and find themselves on the losing side of this conflict with no justifiable reason to their members. How many are currenty debating behind closed doors how much longer they must continue to see their nations get destroyed for your own arrogance and foolish mistake?

[Buller]

Keep spinning that loom Branimir

[NLights]

Branimir I understand your frustration and believe me when I say that many in TOP are frustrated too. This entire war and the problems with both 'sides' is something that we have greatly struggled with internally.

The biggest thing for me is that NPO aggressively attacked an alliance while our Grand Master Crymson was working to prevent this mess, for exactly the reasons we see now. TOP, nor many other alliances I believe, wanted this war because of the state of the web. TOP was in the middle and we were working hard to make sure we weren't placed in this position. All our work to prevent exactly this situation was put to a halt when NPO/TORN blitzed OV.

It is unfortunate that our long and rich history came to this through recklessness and miscommunication.

[KingSuck]

out of interest have you guys cancelled your treaty with NPO yet?

[Dr. Dan]

out of interest have you guys cancelled your treaty with NPO yet?

There has been no cancellation, no.

[ponken]

out of interest have you guys cancelled your treaty with NPO yet?

no, we have not

[Consul of Monkeys]

out of interest have you guys cancelled your treaty with NPO yet?

Nope.