Jimmy2e Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 I find it very odd that it took a week for someone to upgrade Fresh's masking on the Q forums. Its been 3 days and i haven't been masked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delta1212 Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Depends how u look at it reallyConsidering TSO is invite only u could have only joined them in 1 of 2 ways. Either you were a loyal member of USN and got invited to join TSO which is Poaching or you were always planning to leave and were just using us a shield which in my book is spying. Considering Arvili had to be kick/banned from our members channel after he changed his AA i'm thinking it was the latter I'm going to back up Cora on this. She makes some valid points that are kind of hard to dismiss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor José Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Maybe not, but the point still stands. Its been mentioned plenty of times, including in the logs you provided, that someone spoiled it by leaking the news early. If you wanted it kept a secret you dont go around telling your entire gov and a few others unless you have a motive behind it, especially not a couple of months in advance. How else do you plan for a new alliance? Of course you have to tell people in advance. You could go to Red and enjoy the benevolent NPO's Revenge Doctrine. Go to peace mode unaligned. Join the Citadel Trading Company, perhaps. There are plenty of possibilities. And perhaps you're right. I'm not going to for a moment lie to myself or anyone else and say that I haven't made any mistakes. To me, heading to USN for a while seemed like the best plan. Considering TSO is invite only u could have only joined them in 1 of 2 ways. Either you were a loyal member of USN and got invited to join TSO which is Poaching or you were always planning to leave and were just using us a shield which in my book is spying. See my above response. Considering Arvili had to be kick/banned from our members channel after he changed his AA i'm thinking it was the latter I can't speak for arivili. Were you up-front about your intentions with the USN? I'll have to admit that I was not, no. I discussed that with sig as well, but since we had already had a leak, I didn't plan on creating another one by spilling the beans. I didn't know the USN government, so you can hardly blame me for not implicitly trusting them. I'm sure they're a great bunch of people, but I wasn't going to go around flapping my mouth and create another potential security issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delta1212 Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 I'll have to admit that I was not, no. I discussed that with sig as well, but since we had already had a leak, I didn't plan on creating another one by spilling the beans. I didn't know the USN government, so you can hardly blame me for not implicitly trusting them. I'm sure they're a great bunch of people, but I wasn't going to go around flapping my mouth and create another potential security issue. So maybe a better approach would have been to join an alliance you trusted enough to give the government a heads up instead of USN? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluffyewunga Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 So there for u expected us to "look after" you till something better came along. You know that hole your digging your self in to, i think it's deep enough don't you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D34th Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 This getting more and more interesting, now future TSO members joined others alliances planning stay in them just to hide real motive for leaving MCXA. Mommy more popcorn please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Srqt Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 (edited) I shouldn't even respond since I said I would only answer to polite, thoughtful questions, but rushed to form TSO, thanks to a rather unfortunate leak of information. Not abandon MCXA. It may look like that from the outside looking in, but as I said, that was never my intention. If our intention was to abandon MCXA, we would have up and left the moment our plan was leaked rather than at least attempting to give forewarning and transition peacefully. An unfortunate leak is when a spy finds out he has been caught and manages to escape to peace mode, I would call an alliance finding out that their government was covertly planning to abandon them in order to found a new alliance a fortunate leak. Edited February 27, 2009 by KingSrqt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodivine Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 (edited) Its been 3 days and i haven't been masked I'm sorry to hear that Jimmy2e. If I had admin there I'd make sure you'd be taken care of. Especially since MCXA is a signatory and ally in the Q. It's import to make sure that all alliance governments are represented in such a great block. Edited February 27, 2009 by Myworld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor José Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 So maybe a better approach would have been to join an alliance you trusted enough to give the government a heads up instead of USN? Well, saying I didn't trust USN at all is not true, but perhaps you're right. I'm not claiming to be perfect. Anyways, I have real life issues to attend to. I've presented my case as best I can. It will be interesting to see how many of you continue your condemnations of TSO based on misconceptions and half-truths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remaliat Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 An unfortunate leak is when a spy finds out he has been caught and manages to escape to peace mode, I would call an alliance finding out that their government was covertly planning to abandon them in order to found a new alliance a fortunate leak. I would actually consider it counterintelligence against a treasonous group... but hey, water under the bridge. Nothing we say or do will change what has happened so I will make my first post in this topic to wish the best of luck to TSO, and to MCXA, and to reassure people that from my past experiences with TOP they know what they are doing and will handle this in a manner that best suits them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kindom of Goon Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 How else do you plan for a new alliance? Of course you have to tell people in advance. Exactly, and the only reason you would have to tell people a couple of months in advance is if you want them to join you in your project. I honestly don't know why you're bothering to deny it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delta1212 Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Well, saying I didn't trust USN at all is not true, but perhaps you're right. I'm not claiming to be perfect.Anyways, I have real life issues to attend to. I've presented my case as best I can. It will be interesting to see how many of you continue your condemnations of TSO based on misconceptions and half-truths. I started out not caring, and have grown to dislike TSO more and more every time one of you tries to "clarify" something. It seems like you guys stuck your foot in your mouth, and then tried swallowing it in the hopes that no one would notice, forgetting your leg was still attached to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Janova Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Continuum masking has always been slow ... last time I needed a mask there I had to PM WCR who had admins on the old boards. Don't take that as a sign of a conspiracy, because it's always like that. TSO members deliberately 'hid out' in other alliances, and did not tell those alliances of their intentions? If that is done in a systematic way that is abuse of protection and will justifiably earn you several more enemies. TOP may protect you from material harm (although that has an expiry clause and a cancellation clause) but they can't protect you from political harm and it seems you are collecting a significant amount of that. The basic problem is the utter selfishness of the people who make up TSO. Everything in your arguments are based entirely around what is best for you ... leaving a trail of used and annoyed alliances in your wake. It is something of a pattern now (UjW, BLEU and now MCXA and various minor players like USN, FOK and wherever else TSOers abused for a few days' protection). There's also something seriously wrong about running for government and then abandoning ship just after you win. Surely there is no better place to change the direction of an alliance than the beginning of a governmental term? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchman Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 I'm sorry to hear that Jimmy2e. If I had admin there I'd make sure you'd be taken care of. Especially since MCXA is a signatory and ally in the Q. It's import to make sure that all alliance governments are represented in such a great block. This not true. NADC had a masking backlog in BLEU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PX6DEVASTATER Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 can people just leave this well alone and move on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jer Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 (edited) Because I was fed up with MCXA, and couldn't stay there any longer. Thee environment was too hostile, too aggressive, too untrustworthy. I believe it's been said once already early on in this thread, but apparently it bears repeating. You were the leadership and it was your responsibility to create a healthy environment for all to reside. That it was apparently not a nice place at MCXA (in your opinion) reflects poorly on you as leaders and no-one else, so please stop blaming the general membership for this (... if that even is the real reason. After all the spin I've been subjected to in this thread I don't even know what day it is anymore). This negative reflection on you is further compounded by the fact that, instead of trying to fix the broken home that you'd created, you spent your time planning on your exit strategy. Edited February 27, 2009 by Aimee Mann Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twodivine Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 This not true. NADC had a masking backlog in BLEU. There was never a masking backlog while I was admin on BLEU forms. The backlog happened when I was no longer admin there. Otherwise everyone got masked when ever the signed up and posted. So go back to your little corner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmandell Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 We didn't plan to have our members slip out slowly - really, someone would notice when 40 long-time members left in the course of a couple months. But Dragonaspect said earlier: The original plan was a lot more long term with us leaving one by one over time, so we could just filter out of the MCXA without making much notice, Which is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D34th Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 can people just leave this well alone and move on? Of course they will do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neuromancer7 Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 can people just leave this well alone and move on? Sadly, no. And their inability to do so is starting to drive me up a wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchman Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Sadly, no.And their inability to do so is starting to drive me up a wall. Ignore them, Neuro. They're all talk, no bite. Their opinions have all of the relevance of Vox. That is, none. Some people have a higher notion of their importance than is actually the case. Flame on, folks. It all means nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruthenia Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Sadly, no.And their inability to do so is starting to drive me up a wall. Well, I suppose it's the least your group deserves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaannndddyyy Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 (edited) They're all talk, no bite. Who isn't these days? This thread brings much needed entertainment. :lol: Edited February 27, 2009 by aaannndddyyy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Srqt Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Ignore them, Neuro. They're all talk, no bite. Their opinions have all of the relevance of Vox. That is, none. Some people have a higher notion of their importance than is actually the case. Flame on, folks. It all means nothing. Sounds like you just described yourself pretty well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchman Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Sounds like you just described yourself pretty well. Congrats. You have mastered the fine art of "NO U" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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