An Announcement from the Mushroom Kingdom

[Ogaden]

[quote name='feardaram' timestamp='1339694754' post='2983640']
i will concede this point. both groups could have avoided the war. neither did. it's that easy.
[/quote]

I don't think you understand how your own alliance operates.

[feardaram]

[quote name='James Dahl' timestamp='1339695249' post='2983654']
I don't think you understand how your own alliance operates.
[/quote]
i would disagree.

[dejarue]

[quote name='feardaram' timestamp='1339695240' post='2983653']
what does that have to do with anything? we've already established and acknowledged that he was declared on prior to applying to mk.
[/quote]
I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that everyone in this conversation right now has been involved in government. I recognize a lot of names, and the ones I don't I'll just assume I haven't run into. So I'll assume we've all been through the "go to the alliance attacking and see if they'll release" conversation.

The fact he claimed to be protected really doesn't mean anything. Nations will say all kinds of things to try and get out of a war. "I'm protected". "That's not fair". "My friends will destroy you!". "I'm going to find out who you are and sue you!".

None of it means anything until you go to the alliance listing them and negotiate a release. You know this is how it works. I know this is how it works. Yet only one of us is denying what everyone here already knows. Screenshots of him claiming he has a force field mean nothing. You aren't protecting someone on your AA, you are attacking an alliance to get someone off their ZI list. "Officially"

Of course we all know it has nothing to do with Dave, but all this half-hearted attempt at e-lawyering why you are also in the right is pathetic.

Edited June 14, 2012 by dejarue

[Krihelion]

who wants diplomacy when you could have WAR

[Bernhard Klein]

This has probably been mentioned many times over, but I like that one of dave's peaced wars was one by MK with the reason "Raid."

EDIT: pictures are fun

[img]http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/3807/mkwarthingy.png[/img]

Second edit (probably also mentioned quite a bit)

[quote]Article I: Membership
Section One: Regarding Admission to the Kingdom

An applicant to the Mushroom Kingdom may only be admitted by the King, the Prince, or the Lord High Inductor on an individual basis. Any prospective member-state should expect to undergo a brief interview and is expected to be [b]free of active wars and off any enemy target lists upon the time of his or her application.[/b][/quote]

Whoops.

Anyway, y'alls have fun now

Edited June 14, 2012 by BKlein

[feardaram]

^^^ so MK is so bad because we didn't do all of that yet csn is fine for just going ahead and nuking? i don't get it but ok. regardless, this should be fun.

Edited June 14, 2012 by feardaram

[askani the rotund]

How much would CSN want to let Dave off the hook? Balance it out with the cost of his nuke damage and call it even.

[dejarue]

[quote name='feardaram' timestamp='1339695778' post='2983669']
^^^ so MK is so bad because we didn't do all of that yet csn is fine for just going ahead and nuking? i don't get it but ok. regardless, this should be fun.
[/quote]
CSN was already at war with him. It doesn't matter what Dave says. It would have mattered if MK had gone to CSN to get Dave off the list. Until then, he's a legitimate target.

Maybe I spoke out of turn. Maybe you haven't had to handle one of these conversations before. Yes, MK is the one that should have approached CSN to get Dave off their list. Now you know.

[alyster]

[quote name='askani the rotund' timestamp='1339695811' post='2983670']
How much would CSN want to let Dave off the hook? Balance it out with the cost of his nuke damage and call it even.
[/quote]


Aint you a fun one.

[feardaram]

[quote name='dejarue' timestamp='1339696056' post='2983674']
CSN was already at war with him. It doesn't matter what Dave says. It would have mattered if MK had gone to CSN to get Dave off the list. Until then, he's a legitimate target.

Maybe I spoke out of turn. Maybe you haven't had to handle one of these conversations before. Yes, MK is the one that should have approached CSN to get Dave off their list. Now you know.
[/quote]
csn had to know that nuking someone under the protection of MK could lead to this. they didn't care.

[askani the rotund]

[quote name='alyster' timestamp='1339696069' post='2983675']
Aint you a fun one.
[/quote]
I'm an old diplomat and I can't help myself.

[dejarue]

[quote name='feardaram' timestamp='1339696130' post='2983676']
csn had to know that nuking someone under the protection of MK could lead to this. they didn't care.
[/quote]
They were never told that he was under MK protection. I'm repeating myself here.

It doesn't matter what Dave claimed. MK never went to CSN to ask to get him off the list, or assert protection. Dave could have claimed to be a space alien or protected by admin himself and it wouldn't matter unless admin came and said so.

Do I need to draw you a picture?

[Beauty]

Rotavele had Spied,
Dave got ZIed,
Rotavele's FA Died,
Dave cried,
The world is !@#$ting on each other.


I dont see why this should involve 28 pages of discussion to establish that.

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='feardaram' timestamp='1339696130' post='2983676']
csn had to know that nuking someone under the protection of MK could lead to this. they didn't care.
[/quote]


They were already at war with him, why wouldn't they nuke him? If you want to protect a nation that is on a zi list and in active wars with another alliance, it's your responsibility to contact them asking for his release.

[feardaram]

[quote name='dejarue' timestamp='1339696289' post='2983678']
They were never told that he was under MK protection. I'm repeating myself here.

It doesn't matter what Dave claimed. MK never went to CSN to ask to get him off the list, or assert protection. Dave could have claimed to be a space alien or protected by admin himself and it wouldn't matter unless admin came and said so.

Do I need to draw you a picture?
[/quote]
i guess so. he sent peace and claimed he had protection from MK. if csn cared they could have looked into it. they didn't and nuked anyway. i guess they didn't mind this outcome.

[feardaram]

[quote name='Hiro Nakara' timestamp='1339696337' post='2983680']
They were already at war with him, why wouldn't they nuke him? If you want to protect a nation that is on a zi list and in active wars with another alliance, it's your responsibility to contact them asking for his release.
[/quote]
unwritten rules sound great until your alliance gets declared on. oops.

[Blooddraken]

[quote name='feardaram' timestamp='1339696130' post='2983676']
csn had to know that nuking someone under the protection of MK could lead to this. they didn't care.
[/quote]

Why was it CSN's responsibility to contact MK? They were already at war with Dave. Hell, one of yours was at war with Dave that very day.

When you accepted him as an Applicant, it became your responsibility to end his wars peacefully. Not anyone else's.

CSN had the right to ZI Dave as per their rules (and even Dave's agreement based on the other thread on the subject). MK did not have the right to declare war on CSN for what they had been doing before MK got involved.

[Seerow]

[quote name='dejarue' timestamp='1339696289' post='2983678']
They were never told that he was under MK protection. I'm repeating myself here. [/quote]


Congratulations, you have earned the "Didn't read the OP" sticker. I hope you like gold stars!

[dejarue]

[quote name='feardaram' timestamp='1339696357' post='2983681']
i guess so. he sent peace and claimed he had protection from MK. if csn cared they could have looked into it. they didn't and nuked anyway. i guess they didn't mind this outcome.
[/quote]
Do you think admin should destroy nations if while being attacked someone claims admin is protecting them?

It wasn't CSN's responsibility. It was MK's.

[quote name='Seerow' timestamp='1339696440' post='2983684']
Congratulations, you have earned the "Didn't read the OP" sticker. I hope you like gold stars!
[/quote]
Just read the prior, like, 14 posts. You'll be caught up in no time.

Edited June 14, 2012 by dejarue

[feardaram]

[quote name='Blooddraken' timestamp='1339696411' post='2983683']
Why was it CSN's responsibility to contact MK? They were already at war with Dave. Hell, one of yours was at war with Dave that very day.

When you accepted him as an Applicant, it became your responsibility to end his wars peacefully. Not anyone else's.

CSN had the right to ZI Dave as per their rules (and even Dave's agreement based on the other thread on the subject). MK did not have the right to declare war on CSN for what they had been doing before MK got involved.
[/quote]
i'll take that back. it's their responsibility if they wanted to avoid war. i guess they didn't want to.

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='feardaram' timestamp='1339696391' post='2983682']
unwritten rules sound great until your alliance gets declared on. oops.
[/quote]

Yea figuired as much. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!!!!!!!!!!!!!! RAWWWR.

[askani the rotund]

[quote name='feardaram' timestamp='1339696130' post='2983676']
csn had to know that nuking someone under the protection of MK could lead to this. they didn't care.
[/quote]
Did MK's .Gov contact CSN and verify his status? of vice versa ?

Edited June 14, 2012 by askani the rotund

[Clash]

Sorry was afk for a moment, the cat protested his empty water dish by putting my golf ball in it.
Smart lil critter, 2x as smart as MK's war logic.

[quote name='Lyria' timestamp='1339691691' post='2983548']Ask any alliance. They have used their applications process to discuss existing wars that their applicants have. CSN did not do what 99% of alliances do, that being go to MK, query an official, and explain the situation again. Instead, CSN nuked while ignoring any attempts by MK to negotiate or even discuss the matter.[/quote]
MK: Taking in spies and ZIs since 2012. Now boarding the bs express.
How about an alternate scenerio, mi amigo?

[quote name='askani the rotund' timestamp='1339694349' post='2983628']Or if you're really concerned for the ZI'd nation's well being contact CSN and come to a accommodation. The cost of the infraction couldn't be as much as a war.[/quote]
You mean MK should have contacted CSN before even considering taking in someone on their ZI list, while at CSN is already at war with them? WHAT A BOLD IDEA. Not that accepting proven and admitted spies with ZIs isn't what the cool kids avoid anyways, unless you just want to use it as an excuse for a war. Most would say accepting a spy with a well-deserved ZI is bad juju, and using it as an excuse for a war is even more silly.

[img]http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/01/52/1c/d2/mexican-plate.jpg[/img]

Ok let's take some inventory:
Lettuce: Check.
Rice: Check.
Beans: CHECK.
Carne Asada: Check.

OMFG. MK is one taco short of a combo plate!

[alyster]

[quote name='dejarue' timestamp='1339696289' post='2983678']
They were never told that he was under MK protection. I'm repeating myself here.
[/quote]


How many times do people plan to ignore my last comments here. Anything on MK, MK applicant and MK factions AAs are protected. What part of that is hard to understand? If you want to make claims against someone who moved to one of these AAs you come and talk to us first. Instead CSN announced on OWF yesterday that they will ZI our applicant with out talking to us.

1337 is a reasonable guy, I'm 100% positive we could have worked something out.

[feardaram]

[quote name='dejarue' timestamp='1339696468' post='2983685']
Do you think admin should destroy nations if while being attacked someone claims admin is protecting them?

It wasn't CSN's responsibility. It was MK's.


Just read the prior, like, 14 posts. You'll be caught up in no time.
[/quote]
i don't get what point you are trying to make here. if csn cared about not getting declared on they could have taken steps to be assured that it wouldn't happen. they didn't take those steps.