The New Grämlins

[Thomas Jackson]

With the experience Crymson has with running alliances into the ground, I find his input on the matter exquisitely hilarious.

[shahenshah]

[quote name='Crymson' date='19 April 2010 - 09:49 PM' timestamp='1271695756' post='2266388']
Ramirus and his close compatriots had been strangling the relationship between TOP and the Gramlins for a long before that. Ramirus was also the one most directly responsible for the internal decline of the Citadel. He was astonishingly hostile to almost all involved, creating an atmosphere of significant tension; worse, many of the rest of us were certain that he was leaking information from Citadel government areas whenever it suited his purposes. This spawned an atmosphere of complete distrust; the other Citadel governments stopped sharing classified information within the Citadel, as none trusted Ramirus and the Gramlins to keep that information in trust.
[/quote]

You forgot the part where Ramirus approached us to consider essentially a backstab to TOP while Gre was still [u]in[/u] Citadel and [u]allied[/u] to TOP. Sup Pudge.

[quote]It is also certain that TOP/IRON had the option to persue peace in the first day of the war, when they saw what was moving against them and before the nukes started flying, they chose to ignore that last chance[/quote]
I seem to recall we pursued peace but it was rejected by other side after NpO's backstab. You can better argue the merits from strategic point of view the reasons for rejecting the peace, but you dont have to fabricate lies to make some point.



[quote name='SynthFG' date='19 April 2010 - 08:34 PM' timestamp='1271691243' post='2266311']
Our objectives in entering were to
1) Respond to IRON/TOP's unwarented agression in striking at our freinds in MK,
2) To prevent our freinds in MK, FoK, FARK etc from taking the extra damage they would have done had we not entered with MHA and tied up IRON
[/quote]
Now that these have expired as to agreements with MK, FoK, FARK, MHA etc, what is the current CB?

Edited April 19, 2010 by shahenshah

[Carlton the Great]

[quote name='Thomas Jackson' date='19 April 2010 - 12:55 PM' timestamp='1271696094' post='2266398']
With the experience Crymson has with running alliances into the ground, I find his input on the matter exquisitely hilarious.
[/quote]
TOP has lost a lot of NS but we still have the same member count.

[flak attack]

[quote name='shahenshah' date='19 April 2010 - 01:00 PM' timestamp='1271696385' post='2266410']
Now that these have expired as to agreements with MK, FoK, FARK, MHA etc, what is the current CB?
[/quote]
You probably want to talk to someone that's still in Gre to find out about that one.

[shilo]

[quote name='flak attack' date='19 April 2010 - 07:16 PM' timestamp='1271697390' post='2266426']
You probably want to talk to someone that's still in Gre to find out about that one.
[/quote]
Sorry, but their answering machine is still stuck with unconditional surrender, so for the time being, they aren't really worth talking to.

[Sal Paradise]

[quote name='Crymson' date='19 April 2010 - 09:49 AM' timestamp='1271695756' post='2266388']
Ramirus and his close compatriots had been strangling the relationship between TOP and the Gramlins for a long before that. Ramirus was also the one most directly responsible for the internal decline of the Citadel. He was astonishingly hostile to almost all involved, creating an atmosphere of significant tension; worse, many of the rest of us were certain that he was leaking information from Citadel government areas whenever it suited his purposes. This spawned an atmosphere of complete distrust; the other Citadel governments stopped sharing classified information within the Citadel, as none trusted Ramirus and the Gramlins to keep that information in trust. [/quote]

I'm liking this Ramirus guy more and more.

[Arcturus Jefferson]

[quote name='Thomas Jackson' date='19 April 2010 - 12:55 PM' timestamp='1271696094' post='2266398']
With the experience Crymson has with running alliances into the ground, I find his input on the matter exquisitely hilarious.
[/quote]
The Citadel comments are even more hilarious/galling coming from him.

[King Chill I]

[quote name='MNNorthStars' date='19 April 2010 - 01:09 AM' timestamp='1271657379' post='2265997']
Well if they were to sign with IRON and be obligated to hit GRE...
[/quote]

Dude! Shhhh....

[quote name='Crymson' date='19 April 2010 - 02:29 AM' timestamp='1271662175' post='2266067']

Treaties do not apply retroactively. Were NPO to sign an MDP with IRON, they'd have no CB against the Gramlins.

The next time you decide to come in and act smartassed, try not to say something stupid in the next sentence.
[/quote]

Actually, he is right and you are wrong.

Here is some 3rd grade creative thinking for the CB that you dont really need.

Gre have been mean to our little friends in IRON, we like IRON, IRON being hurt hurts us, because Gre are mean we think they might hurt IRON again so we gonna hurt them first.

You should know since you colored between some of the same lines very recently.

[Zangmonkey]

[quote name='Ejayrazz' date='18 April 2010 - 06:02 PM' timestamp='1271638917' post='2265558']
A few things come to mind. Like many others, I also disagree with Rush's assertions; but that has been covered. Gremlins, as an alliance, would never accept unconditional surrender if it was offered to them; it's proven in their history. Some may e-lawyer this, but Gremlins simply wouldn't allow for it. In the Codex, they're not to offer terms they themselves wouldn't accept. They are losing people because old gremlins who are still there do not agree with these decisions. Ultimately, the only ones who are left will be those supporting these terms; talking sense to Gremlins will have no effect. It's their decision to make.
[/quote]

Remember when "we" said that TOP would never surrender or pay reps?

[Heft]

As a note: In the absence of laws, there are no criminals. Describing anything as "terroristic" also seems silly to me, but from a denotative perspective it at least isn't blatantly incorrect.

Just because you don't like something doesn't mean you get free reign to apply whatever negative descriptors to it that you think sound the most dramatic and compelling.

I remember when Gramlins stood up for semantics and proper word usage. They have fallen so far. This is truly the worst tragedy of this story, right here.

[Baden-Württemberg]

[quote name='Thomas Jackson' date='19 April 2010 - 06:55 PM' timestamp='1271696094' post='2266398']
With the experience Crymson has with running alliances into the ground, I find his input on the matter exquisitely hilarious.
[/quote]

Crymson has been in TOP since I know him, and that's probably before you even started being a Ruler on this planet.

TOP was the #1 alliance in the game, they have [OOC]a great community[/OOC], and I am sure they aren't at the bottom at the moment. They have many dedicated Members, and I am quite certain they'll raise again.... I don't see how that is running alliance[b]s[/b] into the ground. But yeah, keep being ignorant.

[Heft]

[quote name='King Chill I' date='19 April 2010 - 12:37 PM' timestamp='1271698637' post='2266447']
Actually, he is right and you are wrong.

Here is some 3rd grade creative thinking for the CB that you dont really need.

Gre have been mean to our little friends in IRON, we like IRON, IRON being hurt hurts us, because Gre are mean we think they might hurt IRON again so we gonna hurt them first.

You should know since you colored between some of the same lines very recently.
[/quote]
This whole thought process is remarkably dumb and ignorant. I suppose it is very 3rd grade, yes. But even these forums usually manage to hit [i]at least[/i] sixth grade level thinking.

[Crymson]

[quote name='Thomas Jackson' date='19 April 2010 - 10:55 AM' timestamp='1271696094' post='2266398']
With the experience Crymson has with running alliances into the ground, I find his input on the matter exquisitely hilarious.
[/quote]

Feel free to query TOP's membership to see how they feel about me and how I spent two years apparently running TOP into the ground the whole time... ya. Ignorant post anyone?

[quote name='Arcturus Jefferson' date='19 April 2010 - 11:35 AM' timestamp='1271698507' post='2266445']
The Citadel comments are even more hilarious/galling coming from him.
[/quote]

Haha. I really tickled a nerve on you back in the day, didn't I? And the best way you can come back at me is with comments such as, "Crymson was bad in the Citadel" and "TOP's government isn't accountable to its members!" The former is very much a subjective assessment, and the latter is something you know nothing about. But does it work for you? If so, keep on.

[quote name='Matthew PK' date='19 April 2010 - 11:37 AM' timestamp='1271698646' post='2266449']
Remember when "we" said that TOP would never surrender or pay reps?
[/quote]

Aww. Is the backlash to your totally stupid path of argument in this thread spurring you to take shots at other alliances? Aww... waaaah..

Edited April 19, 2010 by Crymson

[Rush Sykes]

[quote name='Crymson' date='19 April 2010 - 01:45 PM' timestamp='1271699097' post='2266469']
Feel free to query TOP's membership to see how they feel about me and how I spent two years apparently running TOP into the ground the whole time... ya. Ignorant post anyone?



Haha. I really tickled a nerve on you back in the day, didn't I? And the best way you can come back at me is with comments such as, "Crymson was bad in the Citadel" and "TOP's government isn't accountable to its members!" The former is very much a subjective assessment, and the latter is something you know nothing about. But does it work for you? If so, keep on.



Aww. Is the backlash to your totally stupid path of argument in this thread spurring you to take shots at other alliances? Aww... waaaah..
[/quote]

The arrogance with which you approach this cause is quite frankly astounding, given the totality of recent events. The truth is, your arrogance, at this point, makes you look nearly on par with GRE. Please do continue.

[shilo]

[quote name='Rush Sykes' date='19 April 2010 - 07:56 PM' timestamp='1271699762' post='2266484']
The arrogance with which you approach this cause is quite frankly astounding, given the totality of recent events. The truth is, your arrogance, at this point, makes you look nearly on par with GRE. Please do continue.
[/quote]
I disagree with that assessment, completely. I do agree that this thread is not about Crymson.

Edited April 19, 2010 by shilo

[Rush Sykes]

[quote name='shilo' date='19 April 2010 - 01:59 PM' timestamp='1271699947' post='2266489']
I disagree with that assessment, completely. I do agree that this thread is not about Crymson.
[/quote]

No, it is not. However, sometimes in this world, certain people reach moments in time, where they are guilty of the very same things they are being smug about. It is when that moment is reached, it is best for them (and in this case, those they are "attempting" to help)... to just shut up and stick with facts relating to the situation, rather than all the "haha, I think I made you mad" nonsense. It is a disservice to the attempts to solve the current dilemma.

[King Chill I]

I guess let me speak from my somewhat balanced position of a former Gre, someone who agreed with a lot of the stuff Ram did and my former title as official TOP apologist in Gre.

[quote name='Crymson' date='19 April 2010 - 11:49 AM' timestamp='1271695756' post='2266388']
Ramirus and his close compatriots had been strangling the relationship between TOP and the Gramlins for a long before that. Ramirus was also the one most directly responsible for the internal decline of the Citadel.
[/quote]

Actually you are the one that took a very big dump on TOP-Gre relations long before Ram was even in the picture (ask any current or former member and they will all agree).


[quote name='Crymson' date='19 April 2010 - 11:49 AM' timestamp='1271695756' post='2266388']
Ramirus was also the one most directly responsible for the internal decline of the Citadel.
[/quote]

As far as i know Citadel never really recovered from the February-March-April 2009 issues (although for good or bad Ram did take a dump on whatever was left).

[quote name='Crymson' date='19 April 2010 - 12:45 PM' timestamp='1271699097' post='2266469']
Aww. Is the backlash to your totally stupid path of argument in this thread spurring you to take shots at other alliances? Aww... waaaah..
[/quote]

Actually you are the one taking the shots. He was only saying absolutist statements dont necessarily lead to congruent actions.

[Crymson]

[quote name='Rush Sykes' date='19 April 2010 - 11:56 AM' timestamp='1271699762' post='2266484']
The arrogance with which you approach this cause is quite frankly astounding, given the totality of recent events. The truth is, your arrogance, at this point, makes you look nearly on par with GRE. Please do continue.
[/quote]

Do I know you, or are you yet another know-it-all who thinks that they know me based on flaming me having been the proverbial flavor of the week for awhile?

I'll answer it for you: you don't know me, and you know nearly knowing about me. Kapish?

Edit: You also seem to know nearly nothing of Ramirus. But oh, I forgot... being a minister of foreign affairs automatically bequeaths upon you knowledge of everything FA.

Edited April 19, 2010 by Crymson

[Wes Walz Pants]

[quote name='shilo' date='19 April 2010 - 01:59 PM' timestamp='1271699947' post='2266489']
I disagree with that assessment, completely. I do agree that this thread is not about Crymson.
[/quote]
Lets get back to talking about DAWN and bandwagons please.

As much as Rush would like to avoid talking about his friends in Namlins and their claims of terrorism its gonna continue. Has there been any confirmation from the Matthew PK PR Firm as to the validity of the pastebin logs? Surely if the claims of criminal mischief and terrorism are true then Matthew and his cohorts would have no problem in confirming the alleged message from Ram.

I mean honestly, criminal and terrorist? Nice use of catchphrases there Gramlins.

[Rush Sykes]

[quote name='Crymson' date='19 April 2010 - 02:08 PM' timestamp='1271700469' post='2266498']
Do I know you, or are you yet another know-it-all who thinks that they know me based on flaming me having been the proverbial flavor of the week for awhile?

I'll answer it for you: you don't know me, and you know nearly knowing about me. Kapish?
[/quote]

Some lessons are learned slowly, or not at all, I guess. Carry on.

[shilo]

[quote name='Rush Sykes' date='19 April 2010 - 08:03 PM' timestamp='1271700173' post='2266493']
No, it is not. However, sometimes in this world, certain people reach moments in time, where they are guilty of the very same things they are being smug about. It is when that moment is reached, it is best for them (and in this case, those they are "attempting" to help)... to just shut up and stick with facts relating to the situation, rather than all the "haha, I think I made you mad" nonsense. It is a disservice to the attempts to solve the current dilemma.
[/quote]
No offense, but I don't think you have ever talked with either, otherwise you wouldn't attempt to make any such comparison. ram is a lunatic, and he took his alliance on a path that cost gRAMlins members and reputation, by people who once helped make the alliance great, by their only ally left. TOP is a greatly respected alliance, and they have many friends and allies.
[quote name='Calderone' date='19 April 2010 - 08:09 PM' timestamp='1271700554' post='2266501']
Lets get back to talking about DAWN and bandwagons please.

As much as Rush would like to avoid talking about his friends in Namlins and their claims of terrorism its gonna continue. Has there been any confirmation from the Matthew PK PR Firm as to the validity of the pastebin logs? Surely if the claims of criminal mischief and terrorism are true then Matthew and his cohorts would have no problem in confirming the alleged message from Ram.

I mean honestly, criminal and terrorist? Nice use of catchphrases there Gramlins.
[/quote]
Indeed, damn bandwagoners

And I too got the impression a couple people are trying damn hard to make this thread about anything but their buddies gRAMlins.


That said, if those logs were fake, I am pretty sure someone from gRAMlins would be screaming fake by now. The fact that they are so oddly silent about it shows me it's quite true.

Edited April 19, 2010 by shilo

[Rush Sykes]

[quote name='Calderone' date='19 April 2010 - 02:09 PM' timestamp='1271700554' post='2266501']
Lets get back to talking about DAWN and bandwagons please.

As much as Rush would like to avoid talking about his friends in Namlins and their claims of terrorism its gonna continue. Has there been any confirmation from the Matthew PK PR Firm as to the validity of the pastebin logs? Surely if the claims of criminal mischief and terrorism are true then Matthew and his cohorts would have no problem in confirming the alleged message from Ram.

I mean honestly, criminal and terrorist? Nice use of catchphrases there Gramlins.
[/quote]

Catchphrases? Like RAMlins? Or Namlins? Indeed, nice use of catchphrases. Hypocrisy, is a grand thing.

[Rush Sykes]

[quote name='shilo' date='19 April 2010 - 02:10 PM' timestamp='1271700602' post='2266504']
No offense, but I don't think you have ever talked with either, otherwise you wouldn't attempt to make any such comparison. ram is a lunatic, and he took his alliance on a path that cost gRAMlins members and reputation, by people who once helped make the alliance great, by their only ally left. TOP is a greatly respected alliance, and they have many friends and allies.
[/quote]

Actually, none of what I said was directed at you. You were replying to a post of mind asserting that Crymson himself is globally on par with any guilt shared by Ram. Hence, my reply to your disagreement, was still commentary towards Crymson and what would be best for IRONs cause, which is the entire crux of this thread, or at least it is supposed to be.

[scutterbug]

[quote name='Calderone' date='19 April 2010 - 07:09 PM' timestamp='1271700554' post='2266501']
Lets get back to talking about DAWN and bandwagons please.

As much as Rush would like to avoid talking about his friends in Namlins and their claims of terrorism its gonna continue. Has there been any confirmation from the Matthew PK PR Firm as to the validity of the pastebin logs? Surely if the claims of criminal mischief and terrorism are true then Matthew and his cohorts would have no problem in confirming the alleged message from Ram.

I mean honestly, criminal and terrorist? Nice use of catchphrases there Gramlins.
[/quote]

From what i have been told from sources, the logs are real D:. But yeah if they were fake im sure mr PK and his awesome PR would be screaming blue murder by now.

[Tiberius C Nero]

Gramlins offers terms, IRON accepts, Gramlins rescinds terms and opts for way harsher terms...
What is wrong with this picture??
Kinda reminds one of a certain other alliance..oh wait.