\m/ announcement; Regarding Current Events

[TehChron]

I really don't know how you can have such blatant double standards without shooting yourself in the face with a nail gun.

Penkala resigned from Nueva Vida on the 24th; war was very much on the horizon, and not only that, but it was clear that Nueva Vida would be involved. Why? Because I literally told him I was fed up with \m/'s behaviour, and if an opportunity to smack them for acting like jackasses came up, we'd take it.

Ya, we gave him a free pass to leave because quite frankly we don't want anyone in our alliance who doesn't want to be there by their own will. It would be stupid. Did Penkala inform us a week in advance? No. Hell, I didn't even know he left until someone asked me if I gave a bad word about him to Fark... I guess they didn't accept him and someone thought maybe I had something to do with it... cause you know, Fark cares about my opinion for things like this. Then he chose to join CSN. Good for you guys, you gained an active and valuable member. But by your own standards, he is a traitor.

Let's repeat that; by YOUR OWN STANDARDS he is a traitor. If we, Nueva Vida, don't have a problem with his actions, that's a completely different story. We're not calling anyone a traitor, but you are.

Let he without sin cast the first stone.

Ahhhhhhhhhh

The sweet, sweet smell of blatant hypocrisy.

I just can't start my day properly without seeing it called out.

[NLights]

I'd say Hizzy is well on his way to winning best poster of the year for 2010.

[Lord Brendan]

I really don't know how you can have such blatant double standards without shooting yourself in the face with a nail gun.

Penkala resigned from Nueva Vida on the 24th; war was very much on the horizon, and not only that, but it was clear that Nueva Vida would be involved. Why? Because I literally told him I was fed up with \m/'s behaviour, and if an opportunity to smack them for acting like jackasses came up, we'd take it.

Ya, we gave him a free pass to leave because quite frankly we don't want anyone in our alliance who doesn't want to be there by their own will. It would be stupid. Did Penkala inform us a week in advance? No. Hell, I didn't even know he left until someone asked me if I gave a bad word about him to Fark... I guess they didn't accept him and someone thought maybe I had something to do with it... cause you know, Fark cares about my opinion for things like this. Then he chose to join CSN. Good for you guys, you gained an active and valuable member. But by your own standards, he is a traitor.

Let's repeat that; by YOUR OWN STANDARDS he is a traitor. If we, Nueva Vida, don't have a problem with his actions, that's a completely different story. We're not calling anyone a traitor, but you are.

Let he without sin cast the first stone.

This certainly changes my opinion of his entry; I didn't believe he had resigned that recently. I shall look into it.

However, as is the case with Astronaut Jones, my opinion on this matter means little.

[Thomas Jackson]

On the other hand, let's look at \m/'s situation: they're chumps. They punched their last ticket. They knew it, you knew it, everybody knew it. They have no fighting capability. But your entrance into the war gave them the possibility of one symbolic win... even if the are completely and utterly destroyed, ZI'd across the board, if your side wins, they will sign the peace treaty on the winning side. You've given them their only light in a dark cave; the possibility of being on the winning side.

So, in saying that, it is not by any exaggeration to claim that you are part of \m/'s coalition. You will go down in history as either 1) having died for \m/, or 2) having saved \m/.

Considering our circumstances, I would say we're doing a pretty good job. The fact that Polar's blitz was a complete and utter failure only made things easier for us.

I see you too underestimate our resolve. We're not going to just roll over and die because you destroyed our precious, shiny infrastructure. There is more to \m/ than just the alliance and the name itself. \m/ carries an attitude, one which has not and never will be destroyed. Electron Sponge is only half right when he claims he killed \m/. He did ultimately cause the disbandment of the alliance, which led to the disappearance of the name. However, Sponge failed to destroy the attitude behind \m/. The remaining members flocked around, the memories and the idea never fading, until ultimately they became one again. You may be able to take our lives, our infrastructure, our technology and our freedom. But you can never take the essence of \m/, and for that reason, we shall never die.

[Comrade Korey]

We have half the world as our lackeys? What? When we entered this war many of us had no idea how it would play out. What we did know is that it was unlikely to be the easy fight \m/ seems to believe we were trying to pick. We are not the bullies here, we knew the risks we took and we knew we weren't just picking on the weak (That's you, \m/)

[hizzy]

Considering our circumstances, I would say we're doing a pretty good job. The fact that Polar's blitz was a complete and utter failure only made things easier for us.

I see you too underestimate our resolve. We're not going to just roll over and die because you destroyed our precious, shiny infrastructure. There is more to \m/ than just the alliance and the name itself. \m/ carries an attitude, one which has not and never will be destroyed. Electron Sponge is only half right when he claims he killed \m/. He did ultimately cause the disbandment of the alliance, which led to the disappearance of the name. However, Sponge failed to destroy the attitude behind \m/. The remaining members flocked around, the memories and the idea never fading, until ultimately they became one again. You may be able to take our lives, our infrastructure, our technology and our freedom. But you can never take the essence of \m/, and for that reason, we shall never die.

Which is basically what I already said; even if you get ZI'd across the board and every one of your nations was down to 0 in every category, being on the winning side will mean more to you than coming out with stats intact. I don't underestimate your resolve at all; I am very well aware that no power on Planet Bob has the ability to change what another alliance does. Nobody can force you to disband unless you care more about your infra than your community, and I don't think that's the case with you.

That being said, it will be significantly harder to tech raid innocent alliances when you have no infra, and that's good enough for me.

[New Reverie]

The essence of \m/ has always been a group of nations assembled with the purpose of using collective protection to bully and piss on as many other nations as possible.

\m/ will die because so long as you are loosing this war, and you will loose, your membership cannot get off on picking on others. You will loose your resolve and move on because you've done it once already.

[Stilgar]

I'd say Hizzy is well on his way to winning best poster of the year for 2010.

The fact that he hasn't been winning is a mystery to me.

[Thomas Jackson]

Which is basically what I already said; even if you get ZI'd across the board and every one of your nations was down to 0 in every category, being on the winning side will mean more to you than coming out with stats intact. I don't underestimate your resolve at all; I am very well aware that no power on Planet Bob has the ability to change what another alliance does. Nobody can force you to disband unless you care more about your infra than your community, and I don't think that's the case with you.

That being said, it will be significantly harder to tech raid innocent alliances when you have no infra, and that's good enough for me.

If you do not underestimate our resolve, then why do you say we have punched our last ticket? Regardless of the outcome of this war, you have not seen the last of us. This war is quite tragic, and could have been easily avoided. Perhaps war was wanted too much for it happen. I don't know, and it probably is not my business to know. But as I see it, a closed issue became the spark for this whole affair. I especially dislike that one of Grub's aims is to compromise our charter and our sovereignty. I despised the first hegemony, and I do not wish to see another.

For the record, other than the Bel Air raid on the Pissed Off Puerto Ricans, I have not been a tech raider, nor was I involved in the raid on FoA or the entire "incident" involving Grub and our members. But I believe it is not up to another alliance to choose whether my brothers and sisters can raid if they so wish.

[Penkala]

I rarely inform people I'm leaving, why should I? You'll figure it out eventually. CSN as an alliance may be taking the stance that they're not championing their behaviour, but it's members are very vocal about it, and they are championing their behaviour. Originally I left wanting to get into TOP, but after briefly talking to a few people, I realized it would take a lot of effort to mend the fences over there, and I didn't want to stay unaligned for the months it would take to do so. I'm still going to try to mend those fences however.

Of course, you wouldn't have known that, because you just assumed I'm a treasonous !@#$%^& who left CSN on the eve of war to join the enemy. How about penkala though? Did he not do that to Nueva Vida to join CSN? Ah, but he's on your side, so that's not treason at all.

You're beneath me to continue talking to.

Yes, I left NV. I decided I wanted to leave about 2 weeks ago to return to SF but waited to think it through. When I found out about the war I stayed a few more days, but eventually did leave. NV doesn't have a huge problem with it (since, after not getting into Fark, they said they would have welcomed me back if I re-applied).

2) We know we messed up, and if you don't think \m/ is going to be changing as a result of this, whatever the outcome is, prepare to be suprised.

Bull. You don't recognize any mistake on your part at all. You pulled us all into this through sheer stupidity, as did Polar. What I was told when I tried to warn you guys this could explode in your allies' faces was amazing and showed not only a lack of remorse for your actions but a distinct lack of concern for what happened to your allies and their friends.

Ya, we gave him a free pass to leave because quite frankly we don't want anyone in our alliance who doesn't want to be there by their own will. It would be stupid. Did Penkala inform us a week in advance? No. Hell, I didn't even know he left until someone asked me if I gave a bad word about him to Fark... I guess they didn't accept him and someone thought maybe I had something to do with it... cause you know, Fark cares about my opinion for things like this. Then he chose to join CSN. Good for you guys, you gained an active and valuable member. But by your own standards, he is a traitor.

I informed Nelchael more than a week in advance, and he knew about my feelings from day one.

Edited January 28, 2010 by Penkala

[Thomas Jackson]

The essence of \m/ has always been a group of nations assembled with the purpose of using collective protection to bully and piss on as many other nations as possible.

\m/ will die because so long as you are loosing this war, and you will loose, your membership cannot get off on picking on others. You will loose your resolve and move on because you've done it once already.

Being as I was not an original member, being I was not yet here on Bob, I cannot speak fully about the original \m/, but I have read as much on their history as I possibly can, and I must disagree with you. The two situations are entirely different. The original \m/, at the time of its end, was in shambles. Key losses in leadership critically damaged them, and with the terms presented to them, they decided it was best to go their separate ways. The current \m/ is a group that cares little for infra. Losing it will do nothing to us, and if it does make some leave, then they shall not be missed. This is as tight-knit of a group that I have ever been associated with on Bob, and we are in it together for the long haul. Win or lose, we will remain here.

[Coursca]

1) \m/ is not going to be disbanding over this.

2) We know we messed up, and if you don't think \m/ is going to be changing as a result of this, whatever the outcome is, prepare to be suprised.

3) This "coalition" is not fighting for \m/, PC, or GOONS right to tech raid an alliance the size of FoA, they are fighting because their treaties compell them to. Some don't agree with Polar's conduct in the war or in the buildup to the war, however most hate \m/'s conduct (and by extension \m/) for their behavior. This war, like most wars, is about alliances honoring treaties. Nobody is in this war to defend the concept that \m/, PC, and GOONS can tech raid a 33 member alliance. The sooner everyone realizes this, the sooner we can all just continue destroying each others nations until a peace is had.

4) \m/ began fighting this war with the understanding that perhaps only 1 alliance would come in. We prepared for this war given the short time we had by preparing to do the most damage we could do against the new Polar Order, with absolutely no hope that anyone else would come into this war. We fight this war not for some "coalition", but for our own pride at not allowing Grub tell us what to do. We have made some mistakes, sure, I'll admit that. However these mistakes are going to be rectified, without Polar's involvement in \m/ internal affairs.

5) \m/ is not friends with the majority of the coalition arrayed on "our" side, they have publicly stated that they have no desire to be friends. We have gained no friends at all during this conflict, not with the coalition arrayed against us, nor the coalition arrayed on "our" side. We hold no ill conceived notion that we will be "winning" anything in this war, only to show that we will not disband after 7 days of war, that we will never accept a foreigner tell us how to interpret our own charter, we will never let a foreigner disrespect us in our own IRC channel, and that we will not let the world tell us how to behave.

Do not mistake this for a statement that we will not change our behavior. Do not mistake this for an admission that we plan to make raiding 33 member alliances a policy of ours. We will make changes because we desire to, we will make changes because of us, not for you, not for Polar, not for the world.

I hope some take the time to read this and I hope it clarifies \m/'s position somewhat.

This is a really well-articulated post and I hope its appreciated by my comrades for its own objective merit.

Though my only comment is that pride can be both a great motivator and a great hindrance to progress.

You want to change for yourselves? Yes, that's great. Progress at its finest, even. However, to get there, some pride will have to be swallowed by all involved and folks will have to meet halfway.

But, until then, we fight. And I fight.

NINJA-EDIT: Also, your post would have made a better OP.

Edited January 28, 2010 by Coursca

[Sephiroth]

\m/ is just getting painful to watch, do you guys enjoy humiliating those fighting on your side and making those helping you wish they didn't? Some alliances could benefit greatly from Radio silence, if those on "your" side are embarrassed by that fact maybe you should consider something very different in how you handle OWF.

[Timmmehhh]

1) \m/ is not going to be disbanding over this.

2) We know we messed up, and if you don't think \m/ is going to be changing as a result of this, whatever the outcome is, prepare to be suprised.

3) This "coalition" is not fighting for \m/, PC, or GOONS right to tech raid an alliance the size of FoA, they are fighting because their treaties compell them to. Some don't agree with Polar's conduct in the war or in the buildup to the war, however most hate \m/'s conduct (and by extension \m/) for their behavior. This war, like most wars, is about alliances honoring treaties. Nobody is in this war to defend the concept that \m/, PC, and GOONS can tech raid a 33 member alliance. The sooner everyone realizes this, the sooner we can all just continue destroying each others nations until a peace is had.

4) \m/ began fighting this war with the understanding that perhaps only 1 alliance would come in. We prepared for this war given the short time we had by preparing to do the most damage we could do against the new Polar Order, with absolutely no hope that anyone else would come into this war. We fight this war not for some "coalition", but for our own pride at not allowing Grub tell us what to do. We have made some mistakes, sure, I'll admit that. However these mistakes are going to be rectified, without Polar's involvement in \m/ internal affairs.

5) \m/ is not friends with the majority of the coalition arrayed on "our" side, they have publicly stated that they have no desire to be friends. We have gained no friends at all during this conflict, not with the coalition arrayed against us, nor the coalition arrayed on "our" side. We hold no ill conceived notion that we will be "winning" anything in this war, only to show that we will not disband after 7 days of war, that we will never accept a foreigner tell us how to interpret our own charter, we will never let a foreigner disrespect us in our own IRC channel, and that we will not let the world tell us how to behave.

Do not mistake this for a statement that we will not change our behavior. Do not mistake this for an admission that we plan to make raiding 33 member alliances a policy of ours. We will make changes because we desire to, we will make changes because of us, not for you, not for Polar, not for the world.

I hope some take the time to read this and I hope it clarifies \m/'s position somewhat.

This is a good post and should be in the Opening-post instead of the rubbish that Comerade Goby guy posted.

[hizzy]

If you do not underestimate our resolve, then why do you say we have punched our last ticket? Regardless of the outcome of this war, you have not seen the last of us. This war is quite tragic, and could have been easily avoided. Perhaps war was wanted too much for it happen. I don't know, and it probably is not my business to know. But as I see it, a closed issue became the spark for this whole affair. I especially dislike that one of Grub's aims is to compromise our charter and our sovereignty. I despised the first hegemony, and I do not wish to see another.

For the record, other than the Bel Air raid on the Pissed Off Puerto Ricans, I have not been a tech raider, nor was I involved in the raid on FoA or the entire "incident" involving Grub and our members. But I believe it is not up to another alliance to choose whether my brothers and sisters can raid if they so wish.

I say you punched your last ticket because prior to this the only thing \m/ was really known for was running around acting like monkeys with sigs that imply you're "ruining" something when in reality you were just a sideshow. You continually told people to do something about it, and now you got kicked in the teeth. Mind you this doesn't come as a surprise to me; 12 hours before RoK got fed up with you I warned Hoo that his goodwill would be taken for granted. He was pretty adamant that you guys didn't deserve to get attacked, but then, as I told him, you pushed it further.

Ya, it's easy to say war was wanted; you kept asking people for it. Now you got it, and you're complaining.

[Thomas Jackson]

I say you punched your last ticket because prior to this the only thing \m/ was really known for was running around acting like monkeys with sigs that imply you're "ruining" something when in reality you were just a sideshow. You continually told people to do something about it, and now you got kicked in the teeth. Mind you this doesn't come as a surprise to me; 12 hours before RoK got fed up with you I warned Hoo that his goodwill would be taken for granted. He was pretty adamant that you guys didn't deserve to get attacked, but then, as I told him, you pushed it further.

Ya, it's easy to say war was wanted; you kept asking people for it. Now you got it, and you're complaining.

I'm certainly not complaining, I've lost nearly 2,000 infrastructure alone and I'm loving every minute of it.

I will certainly agree with you that the conduct of some members has been less than satisfactory. I do believe the "incident" was in poor taste, but was only intended jokingly. I have not seen the logs, but based on what I do know, it sounds like Grub went there to ruffle feathers, and if you go into the lion's den looking for trouble, chances are high you will receive it. Does not make what was said acceptable, not one bit. I'll joke around in our channels, but when in an environment where the whole world is listening, you need to act respectful, and I am hoping to improve my conduct here as a start.

[Coursca]

This is a good post and should be in the Opening-post instead of the rubbish that Comerade Goby guy posted.

This likes strikingly similar to my Ninja-Edit a few posts up.

Imitation is the highest form of flattery.

[Subwoofer Fuhr]

o/ Hizzy

Laying down a better set of posts than I could hope to.

[andyt2k]

2) We know we messed up, and if you don't think \m/ is going to be changing as a result of this, whatever the outcome is, prepare to be suprised.

3) We have made some mistakes, sure, I'll admit that. However these mistakes are going to be rectified, without Polar's involvement in \m/ internal affairs.

Do not mistake this for a statement that we will not change our behavior. Do not mistake this for an admission that we plan to make raiding 33 member alliances a policy of ours. We will make changes because we desire to, we will make changes because of us, not for you, not for Polar, not for the world.

Come on Caliph, man to man, nuke victim to nuke victim and as we're at war with each other be honest to me and everyone else

You say it was a mistake to raid that alliance and that it would have changed anyway, that's rubbish, if you do something stupid and get away with it, of course you're going to do it again, that's the point of crime and punishment and so on. If no one did anything about it obviously you'd do it again.

I mean if you know it's wrong to do it, why did you do it, and if you agree with it then you'd do it again and if you think it's right, fight for your right

[Sephiroth]

I'm certainly not complaining, I've lost nearly 2,000 infrastructure alone and I'm loving every minute of it.

I will certainly agree with you that the conduct of some members has been less than satisfactory. I do believe the "incident" was in poor taste, but was only intended jokingly. I have not seen the logs, but based on what I do know, it sounds like Grub went there to ruffle feathers, and if you go into the lion's den looking for trouble, chances are high you will receive it. Does not make what was said acceptable, not one bit. I'll joke around in our channels, but when in an environment where the whole world is listening, you need to act respectful, and I am hoping to improve my conduct here as a start.

I don't think bragging about ruing the game for everyone is a good idea, not sure if you guys think its clever but its not. The only ones your ruining the game for are those in \m/ that were scared to lose their pixels, but are losing them anyways. I started a week before the unjust war so I never got the chance to dislike \m/, but you guys are doing a good job at getting a bad rep even if you were not associated with any previous \m/. You guys don't come off as bad @#$% or anything worthwhile when all you do is raid alliances with little chance to fight back (Was it \m/, GOONS, and PC that all hit FoA, or just \m/?) Seems strange that it would take 3 alliances to fight one alliance without allies, the impression I get from your type are thieves that are afraid of an even fight.

Before you guys started making @#$% of yourselves all over the forum I had a neutral opinion of you, now I have a negative opinion and finally understand why you were disbanded. I hope when the dust settles and war ends you guys learn a few lessons and really make some changes.

[Thomas Jackson]

I don't think bragging about ruing the game for everyone is a good idea, not sure if you guys think its clever but its not. The only ones your ruining the game for are those in \m/ that were scared to lose their pixels, but are losing them anyways. I started a week before the unjust war so I never got the chance to dislike \m/, but you guys are doing a good job at getting a bad rep even if you were not associated with any previous \m/. You guys don't come off as bad @#$% or anything worthwhile when all you do is raid alliances with little chance to fight back (Was it \m/, GOONS, and PC that all hit FoA, or just \m/?) Seems strange that it would take 3 alliances to fight one alliance without allies, the impression I get from your type are thieves that are afraid of an even fight.

Before you guys started making @#$% of yourselves all over the forum I had a neutral opinion of you, now I have a negative opinion and finally understand why you were disbanded. I hope when the dust settles and war ends you guys learn a few lessons and really make some changes.

There are many new members such as myself, but many important members have returned. We're connected to the old \m/ regardless of that, however.

To answer your question, \m/, PC and GOONS raided FoA in conjunction. We were the only ones singled out for it, since GOONS is tied to NpO themselves and declaring on PC would bring in all of their allies without any doubt. It seems to me like that's us being singled out for being us, but regardless, it all happened, and there's no changing it.

I do find it funny that this is coming from a member of NSO. You are very similar to us, with the only difference being you are on the other side. Having been a member of RAD and Bel Air, I'm not very fond of you guys at all. But I won't hold that against you. Change is also something that will be happening, regardless of the outcome of the war. Our government doesn't like the conduct that has gotten us in trouble as much as the next person, and there will be changes to be made.

One last thing. If we were afraid of an even fight, this war would have ended before it ever got to the point it has. We were fully prepared to engage NpO with only PC at our sides, but PC has some great friends of their own, and that means more fun for both of us.

Edited January 28, 2010 by Thomas Jackson

[Taishaku]

Before you guys started making @#$% of yourselves all over the forum I had a neutral opinion of you, now I have a negative opinion and finally understand why you were disbanded. I hope when the dust settles and war ends you guys learn a few lessons and really make some changes.

I would think that many hope that when the dust settles, they won't have the opportunity to make changes at all.

[Timmmehhh]

This likes strikingly similar to my Ninja-Edit a few posts up.

Imitation is the highest form of flattery.

Hehe didn't saw that one.

[Ryan Greenberg]

An excellent post.

We will not allow an alliance to infringe on our sovereignty simply because they do not like us. Hell, We will never allow an alliance to infringe on our sovereignty.

Another post on the "Grub planned this war because he hates \m/" conspiracy theory? Funny

[Ejayrazz]

I really can't believe all the crying by both sides. Everyone has a choice, \m/ raided an alliance merely because they could get away with it. Polaris were upset and decided to attack, whether they had the right or not is not disputable; we all have the right to do what we wish, just as \m/ has done with raiding an entity. If this tech was so important, why not do it when they were protected? Oh..cause you couldn't get away with it, right? (This isn't serious)

The point is, people have become too technical to the point where they have become idiotic. If someone wishes to DoW, they don't need a CB so indisputable no one can argue -- such as spying, OOC attacks, etc etc. What happened the whole "We don't like your actions, we don't agree with them, therefore we will DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!," because if I recall, that was the slogan around here -- "Do something about it."

\m/ did what they felt was right. Polaris did what it felt was right, essentially, you both are in somewhat of the same category and simply disagree; thus war. Stop crying and stop trying to obtain the moral high ground, be like men, nod at the other's thoughts and use your guns; don't whine and cry. Have fun with it.

Edited January 28, 2010 by Ejayrazz