Crimson Guard Edict #2: Statement of Clarification

[JackSkellington]

I wasn't talking about Zeta nor IF. But sure, let's go with your statement.

[Bird of Passage]

I refer you back to my previous post - which CG is conveniently ignoring - as my response to your mudslinging.

He began to laugh, almost manically.

Ahhh, Sileath. Truly, you are a rare breed here. Willing to go to any length to weaken your enemies.

I see now why they hate you. I do not carry that hate myself, no...but I understand now. I can only find it incredibly ironic that you would turn upon arguably the only one who was explicitely in favor of actually defending you. Some may call me gullible for such views, but I suppose, like Francesca, I believed in setting aside your past.

What the Guard does in response to this is up to them...as for the Dynomite Pact, and Rebel Virginia as well, I suppose I owe both an apology. I still believe that the Guard is an alliance, and should begin to act like one...but I see now the reasons why you all do what you do. Enjoy yourselves.

Edited July 31, 2009 by Bird of Passage

[New Frontier]

I am not an "issue". I set up those forums, I have setting up the finance department, I have done so much work for this alliance. I've been productive with this alliance, and not a problem like Sileath.

I lol'd.

You are an issue.

[crushtania]

Good luck with everything Crimson Guard.

[Mathias]

I am not an "issue". I set up those forums, I have setting up the finance department, I have done so much work for this alliance. I've been productive with this alliance, and not a problem like Sileath.

Just because you haven't caused problems yet doesn't mean you're not an issue.

[Francesca]

It's amazing how quickly good intentions can go sideways, eh Frannie?

I don't quite know what you are referring to.

Yeah, me leaving CG had everything to do with me just being Sileath and nothing to do with the fact that you were bending over backwards to a group of 4 nations, a bunch of log-faking thugs, and not standing up to them because you just wanted to "put the situation behind us."

I have been a diplomat for a long time. If there is a diplomatic solution to an issue, in this case the issue of the war between you and the Dynomite Pact, I would prefer to take that than to jump straight to a military solution, especially given that several members of the Dynomite Pact are my Vox brothers. If you have an issue with that, well, that's a shame but I have this tendency to be friends with people who hate each other.

I told you I would not surrender to them. What was difficult to understand? The original Statement of Clarification on the CG forums did not recognize Dynomite Pact as a legitimate group. That was a great statement.

Like it or not, the Dynomite Pact does exist and there were issues between you and them which had to be resolved. To act as though Dynomite Pact did not exist, or that those issues were not there, was impractical at best if I wanted to support you and get these issues behind us.

Now, despite the fact that is was said that their alliances don't stand behind their hot air, despite the fact that I have never attacked any of their members, despite the fact that they have no credibility with anyone except the most hardcore Sileath haters due to their log-faking ways, despite all this and more you wanted me to bow down to them.

Not bow down to them exactly. Hell, I volunteered to pay your reps personally, you wouldn't pay a cent. I expected you to accept the other fair and reasonable terms so that we could all move on and focus on the future. That doesn't mean you needed to kiss their feet.

Very well, you want to choose your own FA policy? Then I will depart.

Yes, surprising though it may seem, I am the Chancellor of this alliance and have the legal right under our charter to decide our foreign policy. I have the experience and intelligence to do so.

Interesting though how I have not taken any shots at CG, and been rather clear about why I have left, and you have decided to use me as a crutch to try to improve your image.

I have not used you to improve my image, nor do I have any intention of doing so. If I cared so much about image, I would never have let you into my alliance in the first place, let alone given you Minister of Interior.

Want to improve your image? Stand up to someone instead of "putting in so much work" for people begging for surrender. I really would prefer not to be your enemy, CG, so I advise you to stop bringing me up.

It's a little difficult to ignore the events that have taken place surrounding you, especially given the number of people who have come to our channel to ask us about what happened, or the taunting messages I've been getting from people to say "I told you so." I suppose it's about as difficult as ignoring a group of people who had my Minister of Interior on ZI.

[TehChron]

To be fair, Fran, I didnt so much say "I told you so", as Ive said "you asked for it".

But yeah, good luck in the future, CG.

[Francesca]

To be fair, Fran, I didnt so much say "I told you so", as Ive said "you asked for it".

But yeah, good luck in the future, CG.

Heh, the message I was thinking of wasn't actually your pm, but in your case you are correct.

[Proxian Empire]

Fran.

I felt a mixture of shock and confusion that people like Sileath and Baseballer would be given any sort of power in a new alliance. Glad to see everyone has come to their senses.

[HeinousOne]

Like it or not, the Dynomite Pact does exist and there were issues between you and them which had to be resolved. To act as though Dynomite Pact did not exist, or that those issues were not there, was impractical at best if I wanted to support you and get these issues behind us.

The question is though, should they be allowed to exist? By being a member of it and stating it is an official group they take upon themselves the actions of everyone within the group. Some of those actions might go against policies of their protecting alliances. When such a group crosses the line from just being a little popularity clique into one that actually reaches out and acts as a group against others then one must ask if such should be allowed to go on by giving them credibility when they do such.

If such continues you might see groups like these formed on purpose between alliances when they see what actions they can get away with without bringing harm to their alliances.

[watchman]

This seems like a fine alliance and exceptionally well run with extraordinary professionalism. I would love to escape the poorly run mob of noobs that I am currently a part of, and join your exceptional cause.

Where might I sign up?

[New Frontier]

This seems like a fine alliance and exceptionally well run with extraordinary professionalism. I would love to escape the poorly run mob of noobs that I am currently a part of, and join your exceptional cause.

Where might I sign up?

Granted, not everyone can backstab an alliance, avoid certain destruction in an upcoming war, and then be dicks to their former home afterwards, but nobody's perfect.

[watchman]

Granted, not everyone can backstab an alliance, avoid certain destruction in an upcoming war, and then be dicks to their former home afterwards, but nobody's perfect.

I assume you're describing CG leadership.

EDIT: have to be nice

Edited August 2, 2009 by watchman

[Francesca]

This seems like a fine alliance and exceptionally well run with extraordinary professionalism. I would love to escape the poorly run mob of noobs that I am currently a part of, and join your exceptional cause.

Where might I sign up?

You know perfectly well that I have personal issues with your alliance. It is highly unlikely that I will ever accept TSO members to my alliance, because I know that you have no ethical issues with running out on your own blood. As far as second chances go, even I have my limits.

[TypoNinja]

I assume you're describing CG leadership.

EDIT: have to be nice

*WHOOSH*

That sound was NF's post flying straight over your head. Likely at about Mach 2.

[watchman]

You know perfectly well that I have personal issues with your alliance. It is highly unlikely that I will ever accept TSO members to my alliance, because I know that you have no ethical issues with running out on your own blood. As far as second chances go, even I have my limits.

Wait... didn't you spy on MCXA for Vox while you were a member?

Anyway, does this mean I won't get the starter aid? I could go for $3M.

[Francesca]

Wait... didn't you spy on MCXA for Vox while you were a member?

Ad hominem, ad hominem, ad hominem..........

[Grinder]

Ad hominem, ad hominem, ad hominem..........

So wait...you're allowed to spy on your own alliance and sell them out, but members of an alliance are not allowed to leave at will? And you're allowed to attack our ethics, but we can't point to your own ethical debacles in response?

Is this the alliance of second chances or double standards?

Granted, not everyone can backstab an alliance, avoid certain destruction in an upcoming war, and then be dicks to their former home afterwards, but nobody's perfect.

I was not aware that willingly agreeing to pay reparations to someone while helping them avoid a war they didn't need at the time constituted behaving in such a matter.

[Francesca]

So wait...you're allowed to spy on your own alliance and sell them out, but members of an alliance are not allowed to leave at will? And you're allowed to attack our ethics, but we can't point to your own ethical debacles in response?

You're quite at liberty to attack my actions. However, I think it is the mark of a poor debater to ignore the arguments I presented and simply attack me in response, which is exactly what you did. But come, my former brother. This announcement isn't about the past, it's focusing on a bright future for a new, red alliance.

If you want to hear why I acted as I did, we've already got a 20 page announcement for that where everything was thrashed out. See: "Memoirs: MCXA, Vox Populi, and the true meaning of loyalty."

I was not aware that willingly agreeing to pay reparations to someone while helping them avoid a war they didn't need at the time constituted behaving in such a matter.

You agreed to pay reparations so that Fresh would have a way to avoid war without losing face. There's nothing admirable about paying reps when there's a gun to your head.

But please, this announcement is not about TSO. You don't have any relevance to me or my alliance any more, praise Admin.

Edited August 2, 2009 by Francesca

[Grinder]

You're quite at liberty to attack my actions. However, I think it is the mark of a poor debater to ignore the arguments I presented and simply attack me in response, which is exactly what you did. But come, my former brother. This announcement isn't about the past, it's focusing on a bright future for a new, red alliance.

If you want to hear why I acted as I did, we've already got a 20 page announcement for that where everything was thrashed out. See: "Memoirs: MCXA, Vox Populi, and the true meaning of loyalty."

You brought up the past, not us. We just asked about how your policy stood with us because we do have personal issues. People in glass houses, Fran...if you don't like us bringing up your past, don't bring up ours.

You agreed to pay reparations so that Fresh would have a way to avoid war without losing face. There's nothing admirable about paying reps when there's a gun to your head.

But please, this announcement is not about TSO. You don't have any relevance to me or my alliance any more, praise Admin.

We had no gun to our head any more than they did, which is to say not at all. Leadership on both sides, as angry as some might have been, recognized that war was not beneficial to either of us.

I do wish your alliance well, and am disappointed that you still have such a massive build up of bad blood towards us. Perhaps some day you'll legitimately get past it like you claim to be.

Edited August 2, 2009 by Grinder

[New Frontier]

I was not aware that willingly agreeing to pay reparations to someone while helping them avoid a war they didn't need at the time constituted behaving in such a matter.

TFS, you're still around?

[Grinder]

TFS, you're still around?

Nope, I'm just a figment of your imagination.

Where did you think I'd be?

[Francesca]

You brought up the past, not us. We just asked about how your policy stood with us because we do have personal issues. People in glass houses, Fran...if you don't like us bringing up your past, don't bring up ours.

The point to watchman's post was to test my patience, given our history. If you want me to provide proof of that, believe me, I'm sure I can work up the guts to dump the query we just had from somewhere.

We had no gun to our head any more than they did, which is to say not at all. Leadership on both sides, as angry as some might have been, recognized that war was not beneficial to either of us.

If you truly believe this, I'd be happy to send you the records of the discussions that were displayed in the MCXA forums. But from what I remember, TSO already showed them to their entire membership, so I don't really believe that you think that.

[keltoi]

you agreed to pay reparations so that Fresh would have a way to avoid war without losing face. There's nothing admirable about paying reps when there's a gun to your head.

since you brought this up, did i agree to give fresh a way out or did i have a gun to my head?

this is mainly for New Frontiers benefit btw, you already know the answer.

Teefus, Watchman, time to leave the thread my friends, the time for explaining is long past.

again frannie, best of luck to CG in the future

[Schattenmann]

This seems like a fine alliance and exceptionally well run with extraordinary professionalism. I would love to escape the poorly run mob of noobs that I am currently a part of, and join your exceptional cause.

Where might I sign up?

Oops. I know it's been a while, but I guess someone forgot to tell you guys that you're still not really in any position to talk about other people. Still.