Athens rides to WAR

[Sileath]

I'd like to state that the only member brought to us on 'recruiting charges' and he was subsequently ZI'd.

So the many of you that state things like "Menotah is teh poaching ebil." We had one case of it, and we dealt with it swiftly, any other case would have been treated the same.

There may be other people that talked to the friends and perhaps got them to join, but I don't know who they are or even if they did. I'm sure there are many cases of this all over. I'm only sorry this had to come to... well a cold war, or whatever you wish to call it.

Menotah is trying to move past this and wishes not to have bad relations with Athens.

Also, Sileath, just wait for it.

There's nothing wrong with poaching, I've done it quite a bit

But the first rule of poaching - no in-game messages!! So yeah, this mass recruitment thing was kind of a fail thing to do.

Wait for what? I'm at war with two of the three of your nations in my range, and that's just because the third is in peace mode.

My tech raiding of you ends when the TOOL protectorate reactivates, so if your alliance wants to put me on their ZI list they can get in line behind BTA, but I haven't taken any kind of military action against TOOL

[ooc]NCIS is a terrible show[/ooc]

[Sileath]

1. So the merger of two alliances is a mass recruitment eh? Never herd that before. It wasn't an absorption, it was an equal merger with changes to the charter, government and other systems.

2. There is no truth to that and you know it. Stop trying to spin it your way.

3. Someone who happened to be at that time, their Minister of Recruitment, sent recruitment messages to our AA. One was even sent to our Minister of Defense. We zied him, then released him to go do what ever he wants, along as he doesn't do it again.

Q/A threads happen all the time, they are not as bad as all these Moral support threads and DoW threads you got goin on, and this thread was posted to let you all know that war wasn't going to happen and that the protectorate was suspended for a week.

1. It's a change in culture. Yeah you have four Archons now instead of two, but how about the other gov positions? Is there a DE MoFA now?

2. You were going to go to war, TheNeverender shot it down, so now you're not. You can think that Athens is autonomous, but you answer to MK.

3. If you already ZI'd the person responsible, why were you going to go to war with this alliance?

Did I post the moral support threads? No I didn't, so don't put that on me, not my fault I have friends (read: not puppet-masters, but actual friends)

Glad to see you've calmed down a little bit, and aren't going to post another profanity-laced rant, though that first one was quite humorous.

[Venom4Viper]

i was thinking smth happened!!!!"let's check this post"....

then smth else came in my mind:

this is boooooooring........

EDIT : WORST DOW EVER !!!!

Edited July 19, 2009 by Venom4Viper

[Jgoods45]

1. It's a change in culture. Yeah you have four Archons now instead of two, but how about the other gov positions? Is there a DE MoFA now?

2. You were going to go to war, TheNeverender shot it down, so now you're not. You can think that Athens is autonomous, but you answer to MK.

3. If you already ZI'd the person responsible, why were you going to go to war with this alliance?

Did I post the moral support threads? No I didn't, so don't put that on me, not my fault I have friends (read: not puppet-masters, but actual friends)

Glad to see you've calmed down a little bit, and aren't going to post another profanity-laced rant, though that first one was quite humorous.

1. Gov Positions where agreed to by both parties. And yes, I still have my job

2. You have no !@#$@#$ clue how things went down during the past couple of days. We consulted our allies for advise, they gave it, but in the end, the decision not to go to war was our own and no one else's.

3. When their government member admitted to what we accuse them of, what we warned them not to do, and promised war if they did it, then yes, War for the whole alliance.

4. Puppet Masters? Far From it.

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...c=63674&hl=

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...c=63257&hl=

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...c=63245&hl=

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...c=62672&hl=

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...c=58947&hl=

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...c=58914&hl=

riiigght......

[Haflinger]

Well, I'm late, but I'm glad to see cooler heads prevailing in this situation.

[Sileath]

1. Gov Positions where agreed to by both parties. And yes, I still have my job

2. You have no !@#$@#$ clue how things went down during the past couple of days. We consulted our allies for advise, they gave it, but in the end, the decision not to go to war was our own and no one else's.

3. When their government member admitted to what we accuse them of, what we warned them not to do, and promised war if they did it, then yes, War for the whole alliance.

4. Puppet Masters? Far From it.

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...c=63674&hl=

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...c=63257&hl=

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...c=63245&hl=

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...c=62672&hl=

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...c=58947&hl=

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?s...c=58914&hl=

riiigght......

1. Apparently not agreed to by everyone as this splinter alliance was founded.

2. I hear what you are saying, but I also hear what other people are saying, which is that TheNeverender would not sign off on the war, and therefore it was dead in the water.

3. That's laughable that you'd catch someone responsible for an act, ZI them, and then attack their alliance afterwards.

Those are all links to the World Affairs forum, and they all relate to world affairs - my war with BTA, my declaration of moral victory against BTA, the apology to Rebel Virginia as part of my surrender terms to RV/Dynomite Pact, the announcement that due to RV attacked me the surrender terms had been breached (I've had to link to that twice in this thread because people have been asking why I haven't been complimenting RV in every post) the months-old thread of my issue with NSO, and the months-old thread of my economic system. In other words, all those threads have a message, as opposed to "We're an alliance, ask us questions," or, "There's an alliance who tried to recruit from their former alliance who we absorbed, and we caught the person who did it and ZI'd them and we were going to attack them but TheNeverender told us not to so we won't but we're going to call this a DoW thread anyway just for the lulz."

I guess this thread has a message too, it's just a laughable one.

[Joey67500]

But the first rule of poaching - no in-game messages!! So yeah, this mass recruitment thing was kind of a fail thing to do.

[ooc]NCIS is a terrible show[/ooc]

We didn't mass recruit, one member sent a message to their Minister of Defense, and we punished him for it.

(OOC Lies OOC)

[Sileath]

We didn't mass recruit, one member sent a message to their Minister of Defense, and we punished him for it.

(OOC Lies OOC)

There was no mass recruitment? That kind of punches a hole in the whole Athens side of the story.

[ooc]Wtf is up with the goth girl in the lab? And McGee = dweeb[/ooc]

Edit: homonym fail

Edited July 19, 2009 by Sileath

[Lycurgus Rex]

Trust Sileath to steal a topic and make it all about him

[Aeternalis]

25 pages for a war that never happened

[Angrator]

You guys recruit from other alliances right or at least have been known to.

Menotah have also done so apparently, I am wondering if the war was because there was no real threat from Menotah as far as military retaliation is concerned, whereas you chaps have quite the military prowess. So surely diplomacy would be the obvious choice and war would want to be avoided at all costs.

However this came to a war, while it was quickly resolved it still got to this stage, and I was under the impression this had been resolved some time ago.

I really don't see how it's relevant. Ivan said this:

For my part, so long as I am Dark Lord of the Sith, the New Sith Order will not, until the conventions of the past are cast away abroad, seek to recruit from other sovereign alliances unless those alliances seek to recruit from us first.

So a fight between Athens and NSO over this matter is simply out of the question.

[Corey Faith]

I am getting really sick of the blatant lies being spewed out of Athens right now.

1. You did not give this so-called warning to people who did not join Athens that they couldn't do anything. How do I know? Because I am the former DE MoFA and I was present at all important merger talks.

2. They did not mass recruit from you. ONE member sent a message which was borderline recruitment in the first place.

3. You already punished the offending nation and 2 weeks later you decide that rolling an entire alliance is even an option?

I see no CB for war anywhere. Stop pretending you had one and admit this was simply a poor attempt to garner good PR.

[Sileath]

I am getting really sick of the blatant lies being spewed out of Athens right now.

1. You did not give this so-called warning to people who did not join Athens that they couldn't do anything. How do I know? Because I am the former DE MoFA and I was present at all important merger talks.

2. They did not mass recruit from you. ONE member sent a message which was borderline recruitment in the first place.

3. You already punished the offending nation and 2 weeks later you decide that rolling an entire alliance is even an option?

I see no CB for war anywhere. Stop pretending you had one and admit this was simply a poor attempt to garner good PR.

Well it only took 25 pages for the truth to come out.

Thank you for shedding some light on this, Corey Faith.

Edit: Also, saw it coming. What do you expect from LUE 2.0 aka Athens and MK? Honor?

Edited July 19, 2009 by Sileath

[Cobalt]

fun. At least it wasn't a "Declaration of Win"...

[Londo Mollari]

We didn't mass recruit, one member sent a message to their Minister of Defense, and we punished him for it.

(OOC Lies OOC)

Der Kaiser admitted to mass recruitment. He cloaked it at one point as claiming all nations had been sent a message informing them of the option to join Menotah, or the option to do something else, such as stay in DE. Lol. Funny, but still recruitment. Claiming that recruitment didn't take place is pretty hilarious.

"Hey guys you have the option to join my alliance, it's gonna be really cool and awesome and you will love it, but if you are lame you also have the option to stay in DE. Don't be lame choose the right option".

XD

Edited July 20, 2009 by Londo Mollari

[Sileath]

Der Kaiser admitted to mass recruitment. He cloaked it at one point as claiming all nations had been sent a message informing them of the option to join Menotah, or the option to do something else, such as stay in DE. Lol. Funny, but still recruitment. Claiming that recruitment didn't take place is pretty hilarious.

"Hey guys you have the option to join my alliance, it's gonna be really cool and awesome and you will love it, but if you are lame you also have the option to stay in DE. Don't be lame choose the right option".

XD

Do you have a copy of the mass recruitment message? It doesn't matter if he admitted to anything (in that lol interrogation screen shot, he doesn't really admit to anything) because if Athens nations received the recruitment message you should have them and be able to post them here along with some statistics as far as how many nations received the message.

If only one person got the recruitment message, that's not really "mass" recruiting.

Edited July 19, 2009 by Sileath

[Corey Faith]

First of all that log proves nothing. There are no specifics mentioned anywhere except #CDT, which means nothing. That is clearly a log piece of a whole conversation and in my opinion is ZERO evidence of anything. Also if that's the recruitment message your talking about then I just lol'd because the only message Menotah sent people was that they were leaving because they didn't agree with the merger they didn't recruit anyone or ask them to join.

Secondly, stop ignoring my posts because you don't have a legitimate response. Do it again and I am going to assume that you fully admit that everything I said was true.

[Believland]

So recruitment= Sending messages to DE telling them they don't have and can join the only ones from DE who gave a rats $@! about them? And when has members leaving and joining an alliance suspicious? So if an Athens member left and went to a CnG alliance, would that be suspicious as well? There are a lot of reasons not to join you guys. Maybe some of them were sick of mergers, IIRC all the original members have been the products of merges, maybe they just said screw it, and left to join the ex gov't members of DE. I have a question to the ones who approved the DE merge. The alliance was founded by 4 alliances merging, and that merge never worked. So did DE need another merge?

Edit: Anyone find it funny who is questioning Der? I find it hilarious

Edited July 19, 2009 by BEazy

[Londo Mollari]

I am getting really sick of the blatant lies being spewed out of Athens right now.

1. You did not give this so-called warning to people who did not join Athens that they couldn't do anything. How do I know? Because I am the former DE MoFA and I was present at all important merger talks.

Lol.... no you weren't. You were barely present a lot of the time, by your own choice.

2. They did not mass recruit from you. ONE member sent a message which was borderline recruitment in the first place.

False, as shown by the above logs.

3. You already punished the offending nation and 2 weeks later you decide that rolling an entire alliance is even an option?

We punished Cybermaster, later we got proof (via Der Kaiser's admission, and the numbers involved) that their triumvirate had been behind that and other recruiting actions.

I see no CB for war anywhere. Stop pretending you had one and admit this was simply a poor attempt to garner good PR.

That's funny, because TOOL and the Citadel people I talked to saw us as having a legit cause for war. We were going to war up until about an hour before update the night this was posted. We told Menotah on their formation not to mass recruit or we would consider it a hostile act, they did it anyway (and told us it wasn't their problem). This is a pretty cut and dry case as far as I am concerned. Because we called off our attack now people are painting this as an attempt for PR. If we had never done anything about it people would have talked about how we wouldn't back up what we said or defend our interests. And if we had actually gone to war we would have been horrible monsters beating up the little guy.

The lesson here is that you can't win where your enemies are concerned, no matter what you do. We know who doesn't like us from the posts here, and we're not too broken up about it.

An excellent day to you all.

[Sileath]

And when has members leaving and joining an alliance suspicious?

Hahaha that's my favorite part!

"Someone from DE merges into us then leaves to join your AA 10 days later!"

Maybe he had enough of Athens (or didn't want to join in the first place but was forced to because of the merge) and wanted to join his friends from his old alliance?

[Vol Navy]

That log was considered the admission of mass recruiting and why you were going to curbstomp their entire alliance?

Wow.....that just made this whole business even weaker and Athens look even worse.

[Believland]

We punished Cybermaster, later we got proof (via Der Kaiser's admission, and the numbers involved) that their triumvirate had been behind that and other recruiting actions.

So other than Der's word, which means very little no matter time or place, you had no other proof? You didn't have a screen shot of the messages, or anything of that nature?

That's funny, because TOOL and the Citadel people I talked to saw us as having a legit cause for war. We were going to war up until about an hour before update the night this was posted. We told Menotah on their formation not to mass recruit or we would consider it a hostile act, they did it anyway (and told us it wasn't their problem). This is a pretty cut and dry case as far as I am concerned. Because we called off our attack now people are painting this as an attempt for PR. If we had never done anything about it people would have talked about how we wouldn't back up what we said or defend our interests. And if we had actually gone to war we would have been horrible monsters beating up the little guy.

This isn't a whole 'no matter what we do it's wrong' thing. It's this cry for attention that truly got under my skin, and many others. If you wouldn't have attacked Menotah NO ONE would have noticed. You just made this big thread about how you're so merciful and what not.

The lesson here is that you can't win where your enemies are concerned, no matter what you do. We know who doesn't like us from the posts here, and we're not too broken up about it.

Look up

[Sileath]

This isn't a whole 'no matter what we do it's wrong' thing. It's this cry for attention that truly got under my skin, and many others. If you wouldn't have attacked Menotah NO ONE would have noticed. You just made this big thread about how you're so merciful and what not.

When logic fails, Athens has three failsafes:

1. Get MK to make a bunch of insulting posts

2. Blame it all on "enemies"

3. Make a vague NPO reference and/or sarcastically refer to self as "new Hegemony"

This thread still wins though with Jgoods cussing me out

[the rebel]

I think Londo should put the order out for radio silence on his members, because looking through this topic each and everyone of them has a spade to dig a deeper hole with

[Makalaure]

[21:13:10] <Der Kaiser> Probably someone who was messaged beforehand and then came over here

Your "evidence/confession" is simply that a recruitment message may have been sent before the "poached" member even joined your Alliance. That is perfectly legal as Der Kaiser said, and no grounds to start a war. If someone receives numerous recruitment messages, chooses one, then decides they made the wrong choice and goes to another Alliance, there is no fault in that.