Johnny Apocalypse Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 [quote name='LegendoftheSkies' timestamp='1339729775' post='2984293'] I too am disgusted by what MK is doing, but will still fight for my alliance in support of MK. Praise me for my undying honor and loyalty. [/quote] o/ LoTS You are truly a role model for us all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incitatus Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 (edited) "The whole SF vs DH/MJ/PB/etc was all a front. The end goal has always been the return of Pacifica - Ivan has been lurking in the shadows this whole time and cut a deal with his former worst enemy, Archon. Don't believe that Pacifica has honor, don't believe that this is coming from the heart. They. Will. Destroy. You." -Future Xiphosis Love ya Xiph Good show Pacifica. Great post, and I think most can sympathize with your political status and your stance on the current situation. Edited June 15, 2012 by Incitatus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trimm Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 [quote name='Letum' timestamp='1339729662' post='2984288'] Spin implies that there are several people out there who have an interest in making it look like the NPO has different motives and goals than what it actually has, and would therefore engage in a campaign to twist perceptions to that effect. Don't try and sell some kind of !@#$%^&* of it not being "necessary". That is not the kind of world we live in. Our statement exists to prevent that spin from happening in the first place, and not as the base line upon which the spin will be applied. You are being deliberately obtuse in not recognizing that. If you feel it is indefensible, that's a cool story for you bro. We feel it is a pretty straightforward set of reasoning. [/quote] The world we live in is one where your words and actions will be "spun" reguardless. Knowing that, I would be careful about going onto the OWF and stating an openly contradictory position that OPENS itself to ridicule. What, did you really think that you could just come out and say, "Hey folks, don't like the CB at all, but gonna defend it anyway, mkay?" and not then have that position be the foundation of a heap of well deserved ridicule? How on Bob does it make sense to come out publicly with a stance that just about nobody is going to take at its face and then say that you were just trying to get ahead of the "Spin Doctors"? If your [i]actual position[/i] is so dumb to start with, then you are just inviting criticism and derision, not getting ahead of it. Yknow, I'm glad you guys don't like MK's CB here. I don't either. But to come in here and expect to be lauded for openly and clearly criticizing an act that you then in turn immediately commit yourself to defending is sheer lunacy man. If you guys are so committed to defending TLR if they support MK, then you should have taken the only reasonable, and I use that word loosely, option that actually made any sense and kept your feelings about the CB confined to private channels. Because folks here aren't going to let you have your cake and eat it too. THAT is the world that we live in brother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Letum Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 [quote name='Johnny Apocalypse' timestamp='1339728776' post='2984266'] So why did you feel it necessary to let us know that you don't agree with the cb. If you're just going to defend your allies then do just that. Leave your own personal morals back in Francograd if your aim really is to simply defend allies, don't start grandstanding and harping on about how you feel this cb is unjustified because clearly it's not that big of a deal for you because you're rolling with it anyway. [/quote] It's quite interesting to see this from the same Umbrella who was so adamant about NPO being quiet and dangerous in the past, because nobody knew where they stood, and just assumed the worst based off the rumours they got told. We took your advice to heart, you should be happy. Let's not be amateurs here. There are dozens of parties all over the web who would have an interest in making NPO look bad. Some want to make us look like we have given up our backbone and are unquestioning puppets. Some want to show us as MK allies. Some want to show us as an aggressive beast that can't wait to get to SF or XX or VE or Polar or what have you. So we feel the need to let everyone know where we stand. Yes, there are inherent conflicts in our position, but so be it. Just because it isn't what you would like to hear does not mean that we are going to shut up and keep our opinions at home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Letum Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 [quote name='trimm' timestamp='1339730278' post='2984302'] If you guys are so committed to defending TLR if they support MK, then you should have taken the only reasonable, and I use that word loosely, option that actually made any sense and kept your feelings about the CB confined to private channels. [/quote] We obviously see this differently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trimm Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 [quote name='Letum' timestamp='1339730712' post='2984311'] We obviously see this differently. [/quote] Obviously, and now you'll get to reap what you've sown. The side you are supporting is obviously discomforted by your open dismissal of their CB, the side you'll end up opposing thinks you look spineless for supporting a CB you claim to not be able to stand, and the rest of the world gets to call you foolish for thinking that neither of these things would result from you shouting to the rafters such an inherently contradictory position to begin with. Is this really the end result of Pacifican political thought? You guys really have changed in more than a few ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceknave Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 @Trimm and JA Okay, let's play a game of what if. Let's suppose for a moment we didn't bother post up this thread that you're whining about. We'll be stuck with people !@#$%*ing just the same, only about how the big bad NPO is out to get someone, so yeah, you better watch your ass because NPO's back and quiet, which equals dangerous. Oh, wait, we did try that. And what happened? We got attacked and our upper tier thrashed for our efforts. Thanks, guys. Okay, so we posted, clearly stating our position in this matter and you're like WTF?!?!? Come on, guys. Make up your minds. We post, you !@#$%*, we don't post, you !@#$%*. Come on, what do we have to do to NOT get some !@#$%*ing for once? Can't you just be happy with us making it clear what OUR direction is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Letum Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 [quote name='trimm' timestamp='1339730958' post='2984317'] Obviously, and now you'll get to reap what you've sown. The side you are supporting is obviously discomforted by your open dismissal of their CB, the side you'll end up opposing thinks you look spineless for supporting a CB you claim to not be able to stand, and the rest of the world gets to call you foolish for thinking that neither of these things would result from you shouting to the rafters such an inherently contradictory position to begin with. Is this really the end result of Pacifican political thought? You guys really have changed in more than a few ways. [/quote] I don't know if you've noticed, but we aren't exactly BFF with either DH or SF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trimm Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 [quote name='Iceknave' timestamp='1339730993' post='2984318'] @Trimm and JA Okay, let's play a game of what if. Let's suppose for a moment we didn't bother post up this thread that you're whining about. We'll be stuck with people !@#$%*ing just the same, only about how the big bad NPO is out to get someone, so yeah, you better watch your ass because NPO's back and quiet, which equals dangerous. Oh, wait, we did try that. And what happened? We got attacked and our upper tier thrashed for our efforts. Thanks, guys. Okay, so we posted, clearly stating our position in this matter and you're like WTF?!?!? Come on, guys. Make up your minds. We post, you !@#$%*, we don't post, you !@#$%*. Come on, what do we have to do to NOT get some !@#$%*ing for once? Can't you just be happy with us making it clear what OUR direction is? [/quote] I would be THRILLED with you making your direction clear to the world anytime that you like, if your position made one frakking ounce of sense to start with. What I said, and what I will continue to say, is that if you intended to support TLR regardless of your feelings about the CB, then you should have taken the smartest political position that said feelings about said CB left you and kept those feelings confined to private channels. Because coming out on the OWF with such a shamelessly ridiculous stance does nothing except open you up to hard feelings from one side and ridicule from the other. What then have you accomplished for yourselves? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceknave Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 (edited) [quote name='trimm' timestamp='1339731275' post='2984325'] I would be THRILLED with you making your direction clear to the world anytime that you like, if your position made one frakking ounce of sense to start with. What I said, and what I will continue to say, is that if you intended to support TLR regardless of your feelings about the CB, then you should have taken the smartest political position that said feelings about said CB left you and kept those feelings confined to private channels. Because coming out on the OWF with such a shamelessly ridiculous stance does nothing except open you up to hard feelings from one side and ridicule from the other. What then have you accomplished for yourselves? [/quote] Orly? If I'm not mistaken, our good friends in TLR are PERFECTLY happy with us posting this thread and they KNOW our feelings about the situation. In addition, most of the responses so far have been positive, understanding of our position, AND NOT !@#$%*ing. Damn, I'm amazed. For crying out loud, Farrin's already stated that even MK knows that we're not happy with their CB. [quote name='Farrin Xies' timestamp='1339683499' post='2983354'] You can ask any of our allies what we thought about this war, starting yesterday morning when we were notified it was a possibility. Ask TLR what we told them. [b]Hell, ask your [i]good friends[/i] at MK what Brehon told them, [b]prior [/b]to the DoW. We made no bones the entire day about our condemnation of this CB and MK with it, and this announcement is to let the whole world know what we told many people privately. Why'd we do that? Exactly so idiots like you can't come on here and say we're being two-faced.[/b] Oh well, keep on living in that quaint little reality you call Umbrella. [/quote] Read the stuff in bold carefully. So, yeah, where's the hard feelings? Who's being hurt by us stating our position? Umbrella? Surely the giant titan with unbelievable amounts of technology isn't intimidated by an alliance with the lowest Average Nation Strength of all the sanctioned alliances in the game? Edit: Clarification and spelling Edited June 15, 2012 by Iceknave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightmare448 Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 Bravo Emperor!!!! Long live the NPO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinkeegan Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 [quote name='Farrin Xies' timestamp='1339642978' post='2982615'] Pacifica stands by her friends. Test that if you dare. [/quote] Tears of laughter are rolling down my face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frederico Rodriguez Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 [quote name='Brehon' timestamp='1339642834' post='2982605']The New Pacific Order knows what it is like to be on the receiving end of a jackboot.[/quote] Alliances gain enormous strength and character through adversity, I remember my time at GATO when we got an absolute sha-lacking from your folks a few years earlier. (Probably a few years more mature heh ) [quote name='Brehon' timestamp='1339642834' post='2982605'] Granted, the concept of a "valid CB" has been dead for a long time in CN.[/quote] [url="http://cybernations.wikia.com/wiki/GATO-1V_War"]Gotta love spin doctoring.[/url] [quote name='Brehon' timestamp='1339642834' post='2982605'] [b]We will not seek any reparations. We will not go for any stupid and punitive peace terms. We will not seek to cripple anyone on the other side, even if we have a negative relationship.[/b] Our stake in this conflict is not about positioning ourselves politically, not about being an attack dog, and not about taking out an enemy. Our only desire is defending our allies.[/quote] Props, it's an honourable way to enter a war and play CN in general. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schattenmann Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 [quote name='Iceknave' timestamp='1339730993' post='2984318'] Come on, guys. Make up your minds. We post, you !@#$%*, we don't post, you !@#$%*. Come on, what do we have to do to NOT get some !@#$%*ing for once? Can't you just be happy with us making it clear what OUR direction is? [/quote] This doesn't make clear what your direction is; it makes clear what your position is, which turns out to be different from your direction. And that is where the criticism--which you're mislabeling "!@#$%*ing"--comes from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr William Westcher Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Letum' timestamp='1339715052' post='2984087'] If people are getting this butthurt over NPO not [u]toying[/u] the party line, then this thread has been successful beyond our expectations. [b]Let's not be stupid here.[/b][/quote] -Removed- Edited June 15, 2012 by Dr William Westcher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr William Westcher Posted June 15, 2012 Report Share Posted June 15, 2012 [quote name='Letum' timestamp='1339730651' post='2984309'] It's quite interesting to see this from the same Umbrella who was so adamant about NPO being quiet and dangerous in the past, because nobody knew where they stood, and just assumed the worst based off the rumours they got told. We took your advice to heart, you should be happy. Let's not be amateurs here. There are dozens of parties all over the web who would have an interest in making NPO look bad. Some want to make us look [b]like we have given up our backbone and are unquestioning puppets[/b]. Some want to show us as MK allies. Some want to show us as an aggressive beast that can't wait to get to SF or XX or VE or Polar or what have you. So we feel the need to let everyone know where we stand. Yes, there are inherent conflicts in our position, but so be it. Just because it isn't what you would like to hear does not mean that we are going to shut up and keep our opinions at home. [/quote] Hmmmm, mk?? [spoiler][quote]cry out against us all you'd like, you'll never obfuscate the fact that we control you [/quote][/spoiler] Hmmmm... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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