Groucho Marx

I, uh, suddenly don't want to be over 100K NS anymore.

The only fundamental understanding about "Francoism" anyone needs to know is that it is a pseudo-philosophy that can mean whatever you want it to at any given time for any reason. Even rubber bands aren't that flexible.

If I get your reference right, yeah no kidding.

Correct me if I'm wrong but you personally weren't even involved in that whole affair. So let me fill you in; Kaskus encouraged Mongols to refuse any deals, period, and when it became clear that Mongols weren't going to cooperate we declared war. Kaskus opportunistically bandwaggoned into that fight and still act like you won that war to this day. You pulled another similar stunt on NSO touting your line about your great "victory" in the GOONS-Mongols war but only got spanked a second time.

That's a whole lot of words that only reinforce my point that maybe you need to stop bragging about betraying your allies like it was for the ~greater good~. You know talking about \m/ doesn't bother me, right? I have on multiple occasions admitted to having made mistakes regarding that failed venture and treated it as a very significant learning experience for myself. I'm just glad that regardless of how irrelevant \m/ became, we had TPF freaking out that we came back for vengeance against them (which we didn't, but Hoo offered us an opportunity everyone wanted to jump on) and like it or not we were the catalyst of a major conflict that resulted in a significant change in the political dynamic of CN at that time and its effects are still felt today. And best of all, it was at your expense. Anything after that point though, you're right. When I and the rest of the founders had left all that remained was a shell of a shell, run by delusional fools.

Same difference. They committed an act of war and they were going to do right by their mistake until Kaskus convinced them not to in order to create an unnecessary war that you inevitably lost anyway.

See below, thanks: You lied to us about NPO and DR every chance you had and over exaggerated anything DH may have done to "provoke" poor little NPO and DR. You shut out any viewpoints or opinions of your allies in DH in favor of taking sides against your allies and repeatedly in private meetings lied to our faces and gave us a line anytime Brehon started running his mouth and inflaming tensions. You only did a far better job at fighting in that war than GATO did though, because GATO's nations were refusing to fight and the alliance as a whole had to be cajoled into following C&G into the conflict. So I can't deny that you at least committed to your act at the expense of your membership. And I too have plenty of logs of you yanking us around in private about NPO and DR and your intentions as leader of one of our closest allied groups. What alliances really SHOULD be doing is not following your example of hamstringing your allies for months, shooting down any attempts at changing the situation and then making your deal with Brehon to "spare" MK in order to get a good peace deal while making sure ODN had a place in an NPO led post-war world. But at least you put on a good show fighting one last war for MK and then signing with NPO immediately afterwards. I'm glad you have such overwhelming respect for somebody who spent all of his time on his radio show ranting about how he would destroy C&G if it meant attacking your allies. I guess if you want to be friends with a conniving blowhard like Brehon who has no regard for anyone else, then I guess that's your prerogative and is an excellent example of your character. So please, spare me. :rolleyes: Sure there were other reasons for the dissolution of that bloc, but your attitude and behavior toward everyone was just as rotten then as it is today and a major part of what makes dealing with Non Grata unappealing. I suppose next time you find yourself in a similar situation to eQ you won't repeatedly threaten to exit the war if the side you decided to join doesn't accept absurd terms you felt were "reasonable". :rolleyes: Anyways, all you complained about throughout the entirety of my time as Secretariat was Umb and VE's "plot" to attack you and how we were enabling them. Your self-fulfilling prophecy came true last war, though. Congratulations on being the one party most responsible for it finally happening. At least now I don't have to listen to that !@#$%^&* anymore.

Sorry but we didn't try to extort Mongols. They attacked one of our members and refused to pay any kind of reasonable, token reparations. Let's not revise history for the sake of making an irrelevant point.

haha EPIC SLAM #ownageavenue Man Grub you're witty as all hell, yo! Throw down more sicknasty verbage, dude. You're the person most responsible for Polar's years of isolation that led to a few rollings. I wouldn't brag about your behavior that took your successors years to undo.

We attack unaligned entities for the same reason every other raiding alliance does - they are unaligned and without protection. What we have never done is attack neutral alliances. All in all this is one very boring non-event that has very little chance of escalating into something that matters. People taking sides in this issue do so disingenuously and without any conviction of supporting their self righteous condemnation of DBDC's actions today. Within the next week or two we will see this conflict come to its inevitable conclusion, and the status quo will be maintained. Any words said here today will only serve to prop up any stances toward one another that people have already held for some time now and in doing so we'll see even greater inaction than we have so far. The only people that need to take notice of this war are the other neutral alliances, but for the rest of us? Let's face it, nobody really cares.

Heh.

RUKUNU surrendered during the Unjust War, and then Neutral Shoving disbanded. GOONS 2.0 comes along and RUKUNU decided we weren't truly goons. The rest is history.

I thought it was Valhalla's underhanded deal with NPO to not trade nukes during the conflict at the expense of everyone else on that front.

I'm way more open minded than our Co-Pilot, it seems. I can set aside my innate desire to nuke TPF in exchange for tech.

You spent months before the war lying to us about NPO and DR's intentions while you personally helped inflame the tensions by making up ridiculous claims about Umbrellan aggression, siding against your own ally to boot. You lied to your membership, and to the rest of us in DH, about who was responsible for provoking the bad blood between NPO and Umbrella, you deliberately misled us about your own plans for the post-war period and you set yourself up to sign with all of our enemies as soon as EQ was over. Your best friend Brehon had been saying for months that he would roll over all of you in C&G to get at Umbrella and yet to you Umbrella were the scapegoats you used to turncoat because you were convinced Non Grata, NPO and IRON would be able to hold that unstable coalition together post-war. I can't tell you how many times everyone in DH laughed at you for trying to convince us that "NPO is the future!" when at the time their head of state was a foaming at the mouth drunkard who had absolutely no regard for his allies or in your case personally, his pawns. But you want a cookie because you didn't outright swap sides (or threaten to drop out in the middle of the conflict like Non Grata) before EQ. That's cute. You didn't need to cut and run then because you OsRavan had already made all of the arrangements necessary to guarantee yourself a place in the new world order without taking a public PR hit for being a two-faced, slimy, moral-when-convenient pile of trash that everyone already knows you are. It's just too bad for you that Brehon burned everything down in the poor way he handled his mouth, and the war.

Greanpeace did always have a disturbing lack of casualties for as old and large as that nation has been for so long. Good luck, I guess.

It's almost as if you have mastered the art of being incredibly vague and intentionally misleading. Let me know the next time your sugar daddy attacks our MDoAP ally and what exactly you expect us to do about it (hint: it isn't going to be 'nothing'). You've already demonstrated that you care more for your skype circlejerk than allies of more than 4 years. You're right, Non Grata helped plan with NPO, AI and IRON to attack Umbrella, and by extension MK and GOONS. The very example of how toxic dealing with Non Grata can be. You left PB because you were so delusional you were convinced VE and Umbrella were planning to attack you when that was never the case, no matter how much they may have had disagreements with you at the time over stupid things both of you had done or said. And in that delusional victim complex you had you built up a toxic atmosphere nobody wanted to be around any longer. I spent the first 6 months in \m/ keeping morons like Caustic and Goby from dumping on everything we were trying to build, which certainly helped when certain members, who left for Poison Clan not long after, called Grub a racial slur. Ultimately my early efforts were in vain since I stopped caring halfway through that bastardization of an alliance, that should have remained dead, and I made some dumb mistakes from the very beginning in setting it up. It certainly didn't help the people I had counted as my right and left hands were crazy or soul crushingly stupid aside from Chief and Chief did the smartest thing possible and left for Umbrella when it became clear that alliance wasn't worth the effort anymore. I should have followed his example a lot sooner because joining GOONS after so many months of dysfunctional stupidity was like night and day. Though aside from reforming that pile of garbage, I think the worst mistake I made during that time was disengaging from managing that dump toward the end of the year (due to personal reasons that frankly aren't anyone's business) and allowing people like Merrie and Margrave lead the alliance in all but name. Even in spite of my absolute personal distrust in Non Grata, I still worked at keeping things friendly and on the level because it was best for GOONS, and our mutual allies, at the time. Non Grata were the only ones in that partnership that were outright hostile and unwilling to reciprocate my efforts at every turn because you are unwilling to put my past behind you. Your childish behavior both in public and behind closed doors coupled with your bad decision making made it easy for me to make the case for cancellation. I've already demonstrated in my 2 years as Secretariat for GOONS that I am capable of learning from past mistakes but so far Non Grata haven't been able to do that in the three years your alliance has existed. It isn't impossible, though. I believe if Non Grata shed the baggage you carry from that acidic alliance culture and shortsighted greed you can reinvent your alliance for the better. I just don't have any faith in you, Stewie, one of the men behind Bear Force One, in bringing about that positive change anytime soon. I'm glad you cared about me so much that you begged Sardonic not to allow me in government.

The real point was that NPO made false promises to not push any kind of agenda that would have resulted in absurd, punitive measures against Umbrella or the coalition of alliances that fought on Umbrella's side in that war that C&G tried so desperately to make DH believe wasn't coming. Then when the time came for negotiating peace, the terms rolled out and everyone NPO's empty promises affected had every reason to either get angry and point out the blatant hypocrisy, putting considerable amount of pressure on the belligerents when that dirty laundry started seeing the daylight. C&G and OsRavan knew all along what was building up before EQ and what NPO was truly planning for, and they made their moves to secure a place in the post-war landscape which would follow, but even I believe OsRavan and ODN in general were legitimately taken aback by NPO and ultimately DuckRoll's decision to flip flop on their promises and that caused actual strife between them. Clearly being blatantly lied to by Brehon wasn't enough to keep OsRavan from abandoning the only allies that actually gave a damn about them and helped reintegrate them back into the global scene by signing with the ultimate instigator of the conflict, and definitely the biggest provocative influence that led to an aggressive war against ODN's closest allies though. As for Non Grata, they threatened to pull out of the war if DH et al. didn't accept whatever peace terms that we were offered that they felt were "fair". They had deliberately placed themselves in a position where they could play both sides and were ultimately burnt by that shortsighted decision. They had already been belligerent and two-faced toward MK and GOONS, constantly shit talking us in private. That they didn't think we knew about that made it even more surreal when they came to me not long after EQ had ended asking for GOONS' support in goading Polaris into open conflict through their proxy, a little collective of rogues that called themselves Bear Force One, because they needed our ties to Umbrella and Umbrella's ties to TOP's sphere in order to guarantee the advantage. "If only we hadn't downgraded [the MDoAP] with you lol" - NG Triumvirate. My point being, Non Grata isn't new to deceptive, manipulative behaviors against their allies for their own well being. It was a treaty I was glad and still glad to have canceled because any relationship with Non Grata is simply toxic and unappealing to have for any longer than absolutely necessary.

You're a huge tool. For the record, during my tenure I approached the leader of TIF with a temporary protection deal in the hopes that they would agree to something more permanent and beneficial to both parties. They are still figuring the game out for themselves, so that this is the deal that was struck isn't surprising to me. We can't make people accept our generous offers.

Let me preface this by saying that I am not in government and haven't been for some time now, so take what I say in regards to GOONS policies and positions with a grain of salt (get confirmation from Milton or Sard because chances are its just my personal opinion), but I'm willing to bet all of my technology that the bio is wrong considering that it's RUKUNU's AA and we've been fighting them since RUKUNU resumed hostilities with us after reappearing. Though I'm glad RUKUNU is recruiting others to his cause now because our training program can never have enough targets for our trainees.

I don't know, it has all the hallmarks of humor NPO seems to like. All they need now is a fake ideology.

Speaking from extensive personal experience in the wonderful world of global politics from the last two years, communicating with TDO whenever the need arises is extraordinarily, painfully slow and they have not done a good job at communicating with other officials in their own alliance government. I find it highly unlikely that in the few months that I have taken a step back from global politics that TDO has undergone radical change to overcome these problems. Anyways, considering their member committed an act of war against SPATR and there was no timely response to any SPATR inquiries, I feel that the resulting actions undertaken by SPATR were very reasonable reaction to what could have been perceived as deliberate aggression from TDO. And the results are exactly what anyone in SPATR's position would want - TDO woke up and rapidly sought a resolution to the conflict, and the offending member was expelled. Meanwhile SPATR asserts their sovereignty and resolves a security threat to their alliance in a manner that demonstrates to the rest of the world that they will not tolerate acts of aggression against them. This should serve as an object lesson in why timely responses to serious inquiries is absolutely vital to any alliance's government body, and specifically to TDO.

Sorry buddy but you're full of it. SPATR handled this very reasonably from start to finish.

An empty good will gesture, under the pretense of beneficial cooperation between all red sphere alliances, that ultimately preserves the status quo. The only interesting pieces of the treaty are that the five seats are being divided between 3 alliances, with NPO getting the majority, and that only the signatories of this treaty's senators are considered legitimate. Unless any independent senator gets the blessing of the signatories of this treaty, they can be targeted along with their alliance due to the very broad scope of the treaty's text since an "unauthorized" independent senator can be branded an external threat and dealt with as such. I'm sure this won't be abused at all. :rolleyes:

Sadly, much unlike your posting.