MCRABT

Well at least your having fun even if that flag is a crime against nature. Enjoy the war guys.

[quote name='Crymson' timestamp='1358562658' post='3079387'] The alcohol is flowing freely, as usual. [/quote] I see you are unable to contain your feelings of bitter self righteousness. Fill your boots and I shall fill my glass.

[quote name='Johnny Apocalypse' timestamp='1358559425' post='3079260'] That decision was made long after that conflict because we figured you couldn't be trusted, that you had alterior motives. Looks like we were right. [/quote] If we are talking about the same conflict then Valhalla ceased to exist afterwards. Funnily enough we didn't trust you all that much either, good job we cancelled that treaty. Enjoy the war fella

[quote name='Johnny Apocalypse' timestamp='1358558432' post='3079191'] so you admit you've always been a bunch of snakes and you never really changed? good 2 know [/quote] After you decided that you wanted Valhalla in the guillotine and tried to manoeuvre us into a choice between TOP-Umbrella and DR, how we moved forward was a fairly straight forward affair.

[quote name='Owned-You' timestamp='1358558177' post='3079170'] We won't lose half our membership or push for a rushed peace in less then a month. [/quote] We pushed for peace so we could get on with the real task, now we are here. Enjoy.

A war worth fighting, here is to a good honest fight. [quote name='Rush Sykes' timestamp='1358555887' post='3079012'] Deinos will show you why Umbrella doesnt need moon bases! Or something.. YAY WAR! [/quote] Haha well done sir. I tip my hat.

Scary stuff, especially with that snarling dinosaur in your sig

Good luck FEAR

BFF disbanded, mission complete Chax, you may return to the DuckNest.

It's amazing how folks in this community continually express the importance of the spirit behind a defence level treaty yet when that spirit is clearly violated by one party it's almost always deemed insufficient by the very same characters as a reason to nullify the legalese binding the alliances. Don't let it bother you one bit INT this was absolutely the right thing to do in these circumstances and you have my respect for being bold enough to outright call the situation straight down the line.

So much effort to create negative political capital. Heroic performance Chax.

[quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1357874410' post='3074426'] No intention of actually assisting? You realize these "terms" were put in place to help out YOUR allies mostly, right? And that even without them, BFF would have gone in? Keep on trying to appear all "blunt", but you're just being obtuse and pushing an obvious agenda to discredit BFF. [/quote] Well they would be defending but not assisting them to win the war, so I think it's a fair statement. The best thing that could have happened to help both BFF and my allies would have been for BFF to cancel on NEW. Our allies agreeing to absorb BFF and NEW even in a limited capacity so BFF could save face, I think shows the lengths they were willing to go to in order to contain this rather than the other way around. All BFF had to do was drop NEW who recklessly broke and voided their treaty, but that was to much for them

[quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' timestamp='1357872527' post='3074390'] Come on man, let's cut the party-line !@#$%^&* and be honest. If we had flatout cancelled on NEW for this and let them take any punishment thrown there way, would you [i]really [/i]be applauding us? Not [i]you [/i]in particular, I mean "you" as in the detractors. You all know full-well the whole thread would be "OMG BFF r !@#$%*^ they cut and run on NEW lol they sucks [/quote] I tend to just say it how it is, they acted recklessly with want and abandonment for your interests, they deserve nothing from you. In my view posting a cancellation thread saying you will honour cancellation period with no intention of actually assisting because you have made other agreements to mitigate your liability is in danger of looking like a trap for NEW who you are quite understandably aggrieved with. Knowing NEW as you do, did you not consider the possibility that this cancellation would enrage them and they, thinking that activating the treaty before the cancellation period was up would be bad for BFF, would activate it resulting in a situation where they get there teeth smashed in and you guys honour your commitment in legalese only. Of course NEW are completely mental so no one really knows how these situations may pan out. It would have been much less ugly in my view just to void the treaty and as far as these predicaments go, this situation strikes me as one where this approach would be quite justifiable.

[quote name='WarriorConcept' timestamp='1357871685' post='3074372'] We both know this turning global was in yours and NPO's hands, so you complaining seems kind of silly. Completely contradictory. If it was self-preservation, they would have skipped step 3 as TORN did. They don't need to save face at all here, NEW was obviously retarded and deserved nothing. Committing to taking on a much larger opponent for even a short term is more honorable than most other alliances would have done and more than NEW deserves. [/quote] Yes they negotiated a limited war to because that would help NEW, that makes perfect sense. I actually agree that NEW deserved nothing, not even the cancellation period. They deserved to be left to deal with the consequences of their own stupidity, like I said BFF trying to manufacture a moral victory was idiotic. My problem is not that they wronged NEW who are terrible but rather that BFF struck a deal so they could claim they would still honour their obligations which I think in most peoples minds was silly and unnecessary in the circumstances.

[quote name='Ernesto Che Guevara' timestamp='1357870395' post='3074349'] Now, regarding the allegations thrown in this thread: I'm an honest guy, and I won't hide facts or lie to cover up for myself. Regarding NEW causing a larger war, to be quite frank, we too were hungry for a war. We were sick of waiting for one to happen. If NEW had come to us with a proposal to create an almighty cluster$%&@, there's a very good chance BFF would have happily jumped on board. Unfortunately, they acted without talking to us, playing us like pawns in their game. Breach of treaty is generally regarded as grounds for immediate termination. If you doubt our resolve to honor our agreement, you may feel free to test it. Regarding logs that have been discussed, yes, there were shady dealings. We discussed things such as organized wars, pre-planned strategies, things like that. I won't deny that, and I'm sure you've got more logs than a public bathroom full of me saying things like that. The fact is, Sniper Joe and I have spent the last 48-60 hours working on this situation. Personally, I stayed up and have yet to sleep since I got into the situation early on the 9th. There were many ideas floated regarding how to deal with this, some of them shockingly more stupid than anything I can imagine. However, this is the solution we have now. Previous logs were essentially outdated the minute they were spoken. In the words of many a valley girl, what you know is [i]so [/i]five minutes ago. [/quote] That's cool it would have been easier if you had just said $%&@ NEW they are ridiculous, they $%&@ed us over so we're !@#$@#$ them back, moral claims in CN are terrible.

[quote name='Emperor Marx' timestamp='1357866780' post='3074286'] Coming from the alliance that canceled on TOP because you see them as colluding with an enemy that only thought of you as potential friends, I should eagerly listen to what you have to say about morality? NEW sold out BFF the moment they decided to deliberately expand a war that would have fizzled out on its own with no unnecessary bloodshed and without putting friends at odds with one another by not consulting with BFF before they acted. NEW deliberately tried to exploit their MADP with BFF because they saw it as a means to expand this war into something it should not be. BFF is being incredibly lenient with them on this and that you would come out of the woodwork so blatantly to attack the difficult decision that I know you would never have the balls to make yourself is quite telling on how you view your own allies and treaty obligations. [/quote] BFF inked MADP with NEW knowing they were stupid. NEW decided to act in character and do something stupid. BFF panicked, struck a deal so it didn't take damage for NEW's stupidity. BFF cancels treaty on NEW but pledges to honour treaty anyway. See what doesn't make sense to me is why didn't they just skip step 3 and cancel the treaty citing quite correctly that it was null and void? If you examine the motives of BFF they are for self preservation and to save face. That leads me to conclude that the only reason BFF pledged to honour the treaty is because they struck a deal to leave NEW high and dry while they take next to no damage, so if NEW now react to this cancellation by going ape !@#$ they are covered anyway. To suggest it's because they value the relationship is laughable, I'm sure BFF's leadership would love to see someone destroy them for putting them in this situation. I don't lay claim to morality but I have a good nose and can smell !@#$%^&* a mile off and the honourable BFF is reeking.

[quote name='Sigrun Vapneir' timestamp='1357865042' post='3074262'] If there is any evidence of such a deal I have missed it so far. [/quote] Nothing has been posted but enlightened gentleman like Stewie and I know such things. edit: [quote name='Sniper Joe' timestamp='1357865311' post='3074265'] Wow IRON, why did you put Methrage in charge of your alliance? [/quote] I'm certain you will regret making this statement before this thread is over and that amuses me greatly.

[quote name='Sniper Joe' timestamp='1357863594' post='3074253'] We're hardly abandoning them. If we wanted to abandon them we'd just say that they violated the treaty and tell them to stick it where the sun don't shine if they asked for our help. We're cancelling on them for being awful allies and nearly everyone agrees that it's completely justified. Why would we keep a treaty with an alliance who has no regard whatsoever for the people they're tied to? We're doing them a favor here, even after they took a crap all over us and our relationship. [/quote] He's not referring to the cancellation, the cancellation was absolutely the right thing to do, in fact you should never have signed the treaty in the first place. NEW goes insane on an annual basis, you knew that when you inked the treaty, it's not a new character trait. So trying to strike backroom deals so you take minimal damage if you have to enter in their defence is pretty poor. If you agree to enter on a limited conflict basis it diminishes the act of coming to their aid, essentially you are entering so you can save face while your MADP partners get theirs smashed in because you have no real intention of being of any assistance. You'd be better just being honest and saying NEW you are !@#$@#$ retarded, you violated the terms of our treaty and you can go die in the fire you have built for yourself. Instead you choose to try and claim a moral victory in a situation where it wasn't really required selling out your MADP allies in the process.

As far as MK'ers go Azaghul is pretty cool, grats fella!

[quote name='Mr Vicarious' timestamp='1354228201' post='3058204'] Casualties all around, sounds like a date /I can bring the scotch [/quote] Threesome with scotch. Excellent.

This means when we roll AI, you will have the option to attack us again FARK

Congrats friends, forward with style!

Yes, Yes the cancellation was all my doing, in a Council full of equals I have pup-petered the downfall of our historic treaty. My reasons, I have always hated TOP, my heavy involvement with your alliance and cooperation in FA ventures over the past 2 years have all been a ruse to lure you into a fall sense of security or something like that. Or maybe it is the usual members of TOP grasping onto any excuse they can find to avoid taking responsibility for your alliances' choices, choices that have pushed away TOP's most time proven allies. I wish I could say I was surprised but I have seen this villain script used by the same members of TOP a few times in the past.

[quote name='Rebel Virginia' timestamp='1353656704' post='3056482'] [color=#0000FF]Yes, I am sure Brehon will remember your disloyalty. Although I suppose it will forgive, for after all you were only doing as you were told. How good of a rabid dog would you be, IRON, if you were put down? Also, my history is flawless. It is the Truth. It is a shining Truth that shines Truly. Your attempts at revisionism shall sway no one, and it is obviously nothing more than a weak attempt to salvage your poor reputation. For all know all you to be the mongrels that you are. For it is what you are, and I am Rebel Virginia.[/color] [/quote] [color=red]Meanwhile at home Rebel Virginia finds fulfilment:[/color] [img]http://wtfoodge.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/Cool+Story+Bro.+thanks+for+helping+me+climb+up+the_71a0ee_3374173-500x656.jpg[/img]

Times sure are changing fast. Argent, IRON is here for you as always.