Coup Attempt

[Gabryal]

i'm TPF so don't think i could cast a vote there andrew

but i can say this, even though a vote may be the greatest form of democratically choosing who runs what, it'd be a biased situation in this case...from what i've seen, Echo is mostly made up of by the former SDF, am i correct on this? and because of that the member base would choose primarily with who they recognize most/alrdy have pledged loyalty to.

if i'm wrong and someone can correct me on that please do cause i bet i'm a bit out of the loop

quick question though, has anyone decided to sit down as a mediator between the two?

It's my experience that Democracy is a very very bad thing in TE. It's a war game, there was a time when soldiers elected their company commander, and that commander was often incompetent, even if was popular.

Since this is a war game I recommend a Meritocracy. Namely those who show the most skill get the highest positions.

[Anon1]

What do you not understand? I set this alliance up. ES has been in it for THREE days. How the hell can he think that he can take over like that?

[AndrewC202]

I don't know whether to be disappointed or not.. I didn't make the list

I just copies the "Whose reading this topic ATM" so YES! you should be disappointed, lol.

[Emperor Stranger]

Now you people may understand just how crazy he is. He thinks I will give up the alliance I created.

Well according to you, the AA is trashed. Wouldn't a good founder just start a new alliance if theirs was trashed?

What do you not understand? I set this alliance up. ES has been in it for THREE days. How the hell can he think that he can take over like that?

I thought you said it was two days? And really, you have not too much to boast about. You have been in it for what, seven?

[Anon1]

I thought you said it was two days? And really, you have not too much to boast about. You have been in it for what, seven?

I have been setting it up for three weeks? As sarasate or BG they both know.

[Emperor Stranger]

I have been setting it up for three weeks? As sarasate or BG they both know.

Alliance Seniority: 9/28/2009 7:24:54 PM (10 Days)

10 days is really three weeks. But technically, SDF has been considering this merger for five days. Either way, you are wrong.

Edited October 9, 2009 by Emperor Stranger

[Anon1]

10 days is really three weeks. But technically, SDF has been considering this merger for five days. Either way, you are wrong.

I would not have "echo" as my AA when i was the only member. I was in TPF.

[rtellez06]

Actually only really for Standard and chatting. If you can handle the PM system as well as ES did and use my target system for war which I will not disclose for all your eyes are not worthy then you will be fine such as SDF was.

Edit: Lurunin, AndrewC202, The Wizard of Oz, mtndew, rtellez06*, Stevee, Folger Soldier, dogbite if you are one of these people I command you to agree with me.

*The force is strong with this one.

I agree. Oh and we don't use forums right now (Mathias broke them)

[Emperor Stranger]

I would not have "echo" as my AA when i was the only member. I was in TPF.

Was that not you I saw as the one member in Echo?

<eyerack[Echo]> why did you start this?

<eyerack[Echo]> because you didnt get a gov position?

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> because i felt you were a threat to the alliance

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> and because of the bs you put me through

<eyerack[Echo]> a threat to an alliance you have no connection to

<eyerack[Echo]> you were in it for three days

<eyerack[Echo]> youre insane

Apparently, I have no connection to the alliance even though mine is merging into it. I found that a little funny. (And I found it funny that he has absolutely no negotiating skills whatsoever.)

[AndrewC202]

21:40 eyerack[Echo] so you are going to kick me out of the alliance that I created and that you have been in for two days

21:40 eyerack[Echo] your logic is so flawed its not even funny

Isn't that what you stated you did in the first few posts? That ES couldn't lead an alliance that:

1. Originally was made of ghosts and/or Echo members

2. Was unbiased because most of the members where SDF's loyalists.

Because:

1. He was unfit to rule as a leader

or

2. Just because

"your logic is so flawed its not even funny"

Look eyerack I don't know you personally or how good/bad you are at leading an alliance but I do think that what you did to ES was wrong and for him to have to leave with the members who have been through hell and still aren't out of it yet is bad.

[The Wizard of Oz]

i'm TPF so don't think i could cast a vote there andrew

but i can say this, even though a vote may be the greatest form of democratically choosing who runs what, it'd be a biased situation in this case...from what i've seen, Echo is mostly made up of by the former SDF, am i correct on this? and because of that the member base would choose primarily with who they recognize most/alrdy have pledged loyalty to.

if i'm wrong and someone can correct me on that please do cause i bet i'm a bit out of the loop

quick question though, has anyone decided to sit down as a mediator between the two?

LOL, what a great concept. A great way to grow your AA.

Alliance 1 (40 members) offers to merge with Alliance 2 (20 members) Alliance 1 Leader in a few days decides to coup Alliance 2 leader. As a logical solution, lets let all members vote who they want for leader. Alliance 1 leader gets 40 vote , Alliance 2 leader gets 20. Alliance 1 leader wins, his alliance now has 60 members and can move on to the next AA.. Pure Genius.

[Gabryal]

I'm not sure but what vote isn't biased in terms of members. The main point is however that both are saying that the members are more loyal to each other and both are putting arguments forward and other alliances are getting involved therefore let the votes speak for itself.

I was more under the impression ( as the IRC post says ) that ES was attempting to overthrow eyerack in his own alliance. I have other information that says so as well, though you'll just have to take my word on that, I won't reveal my sources. In my experience eyerack is the better leader, aside from being a long time friend of my alliance, so therefore TPF has decided to back him, in response to his long friendship, competence, and levelheadedness.

If you go through the OWF, you will see the amazing level of ES's in game incompetence. If you look at the alliances he's been in/create you'll see the amazing level of in game incompetence.

This isn't personal between ES and me. Though he'd never believe it, I care very little about what he has to say, I care much more about his attitude, and what I perceive of massive instability.

ooc] Also I'm stating for the record I have no personal "beef" with ES, he thinks I do, but I do not. Narcissism often makes people think the universe revolves around them, I have a wife and a daughter and a life outside of CN. If ES believes I can afford the time to "hate" someone in a game, that's not only narcissism that's malignant narcissism, which is absolutely devastating to anyone they are around, including those in an alliance that interact with him. You can see for yourself that a malignant narcissist almost always blames others for their own problems, becomes angry easily with those who disagree with them, and think that they are better than everyone around them. If you look at the way ES posts, the way he reacts, and the way that he responds to any sort of criticism you'll see what I see, you have to realize that even on a game you cannot change the core of what you are, and it shows in ES's words and actions. [ooc

[Lurunin]

I'm not sure but what vote isn't biased in terms of members. The main point is however that both are saying that the members are more loyal to each other and both are putting arguments forward and other alliances are getting involved therefore let the votes speak for itself.

point taken, it's almost impossible to take an unbiased poll even when measuring a random topic let alone one that will affect a govt.

i've yet to see one member of echo that's not, ES or eyerack, come into this topic and put forth either their opinions nor their insight on whats going on in the alliance. if we had even one person do that then we may be able to have a bit more understanding than "No U!"

(and back to the forum as a necessity thing that was being said earlier, i do believe that forums are necessary when you're running an alliance. it allows for your members to be able to keep in constant contact with one another and allows them to review anything of importance at anytime, rather than on CN where things are automatically deleted after 10days. plus, if you're member base is active enough, can effectively allow for strikes and aid to flow in w/o having to MM everyone in the alliance)

[Lurunin]

LOL, what a great concept. A great way to grow your AA.

Alliance 1 (40 members) offers to merge with Alliance 2 (20 members) Alliance 1 Leader in a few days decides to coup Alliance 2 leader. As a logical solution, lets let all members vote who they want for leader. Alliance 1 leader gets 40 vote , Alliance 2 leader gets 20. Alliance 1 leader wins, his alliance now has 60 members and can move on to the next AA.. Pure Genius.

exactly at what i was trying to hint at

[Emperor Stranger]

I was more under the impression ( as the IRC post says ) that ES was attempting to overthrow eyerack in his own alliance. I have other information that says so as well, though you'll just have to take my word on that, I won't reveal my sources. In my experience eyerack is the better leader, aside from being a long time friend of my alliance, so therefore TPF has decided to back him, in response to his long friendship, competence, and levelheadedness.

<eyerack[Echo]> youre insane

<eyerack[Echo]> yeah

<eyerack[Echo]> thats an insult

<eyerack[Echo]> im done

His levelheadedness astounds me. By the way, that's in a peace negotiation where I didn't even through a single insult.

If you go through the OWF, you will see the amazing level of ES's in game incompetence. If you look at the alliances he's been in/create you'll see the amazing level of in game incompetence.

Fight Club was crippled three days into the game by an alliance four times its size. Let's see how well your alliance fairs.

This isn't personal between ES and me. Though he'd never believe it, I care very little about what he has to say, I care much more about his attitude, and what I perceive of massive instability.

You can't deny that your opinion is biased. Don't worry, most of everyone's opinions in this case will be.

ooc] Also I'm stating for the record I have no personal "beef" with ES, he thinks I do, but I do not. Narcissism often makes people think the universe revolves around them, I have a wife and a daughter and a life outside of CN. If ES believes I can afford the time to "hate" someone in a game, that's not only narcissism that's malignant narcissism, which is absolutely devastating to anyone they are around, including those in an alliance that interact with him. You can see for yourself that a malignant narcissist almost always blames others for their own problems, becomes angry easily with those who disagree with them, and think that they are better than everyone around them. If you look at the way ES posts, the way he reacts, and the way that he responds to any sort of criticism you'll see what I see, you have to realize that even on a game you cannot change the core of what you are, and it shows in ES's words and actions. [ooc

I have a life, too! D: Amazing coincidence.

[Emperor Stranger]

Eyerack's amazing peace negotiation skills really shine at this point:

<eyerack[Echo]> what happens now.

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> i have no intentions on becoming leader of another alliance

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> im sick of being government at this point

<eyerack[Echo]> so you have intentions of becoming the leader of echo?

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> if i see that my alliance will be affected by your rule, then yes

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> alliance > wants

<eyerack[Echo]> your alliance? what do you not understand? I created this alliance. I set up the forums. I have absolutely no problem with you taking them back to sdf or whatever alliance. I will tell them myselves to leave.

<eyerack[Echo]> myself*

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> folger didnt kick out tiberius because he wanted to, he did it because he saw him as a threat to his alliance

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> my = relative

<eyerack[Echo]> so you are going to kick me out of the alliance that I created and that you have been in for two days

<eyerack[Echo]> your logic is so flawed its not even funny

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> dont forget that MY alliance is in your alliance

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> sdf may not exist in legal form, but it exists in the member's hearts

<eyerack[Echo]> ok

<eyerack[Echo]> take them back

<eyerack[Echo]> i dont want them now

<eyerack[Echo]> im going to start over

<eyerack[Echo]> now that you trashed it

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> choose a different aa

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> shouldnt be too hard

<eyerack[Echo]> no/

<eyerack[Echo]> ?

<eyerack[Echo]> i set this alliance up?

<eyerack[Echo]> this is hilarious

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> and its supposedly trashed

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> if the alliance name is now trashed, then the smart thing to do would be to switch

<eyerack[Echo]> not really

<eyerack[Echo]> start fresh with the same

<eyerack[Echo]> there are only 10 members

<eyerack[Echo]> most are inactive ghosts

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> 17 members

<eyerack[Echo]> generalization

<eyerack[Echo]> you get what i am saying

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> well, if you want to inactive ghosts, spartan defence force has 11 still under that aa

<eyerack[Echo]> good, you have a base for the rest of these members to go back

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> the thing is thats what you get with te

<eyerack[Echo]> what?

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> mha was only able to get 6 members to blitz this recent war

<eyerack[Echo]> being stuck with a crazy person?

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> you can stop the insults now

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> i have stopped them and am attempting to have a real diplomatic discussion

<eyerack[Echo]> you have insulted me plenty of times.

<eyerack[Echo]> you dont know how ridiculous you are sounding

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> in this conversation, i have not

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> i thought there were more insults, but i only counted two total in this chat

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> the two being from you

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> <eyerack[Echo]> your logic is so flawed its not even funny

<eyerack[Echo]> you have insulted me by thinking that I would believe your bs

<eyerack[Echo]> i can read, thank you

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> ok, in that case, you have insulted me more than five times so far

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> should i go over it?

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> <eyerack[Echo]> your alliance? what do you not understand?

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> that insults my intelligence, plain and simple

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> <eyerack[Echo]> now that you trashed it

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> that assumes that it was all my doing

<eyerack[Echo]> same as your posts, this whole deal

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> well then lets not insult each other during this conversation

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> its obviously gotten us no where

<eyerack[Echo]> none of this has.

<eyerack[Echo]> there is one solution

<eyerack[Echo]> get yourself together

<eyerack[Echo]> and leave

<eyerack[Echo]> its not that hard

<eyerack[Echo]> call me a bully or whatever

<eyerack[Echo]> hold a grudge

<eyerack[Echo]> i dont care

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> and that kind of attitude is what gets people killed in se

<eyerack[Echo]> but this is te

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> you are absolutely correct

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> the home of the wars

<eyerack[Echo]> not the ridiculous coups

<eyerack[Echo]> why did you start this?

<eyerack[Echo]> because you didnt get a gov position?

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> because i felt you were a threat to the alliance

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> and because of the bs you put me through

<eyerack[Echo]> a threat to an alliance you have no connection to

<eyerack[Echo]> you were in it for three days

<eyerack[Echo]> youre insane

<eyerack[Echo]> yeah

<eyerack[Echo]> thats an insult

<eyerack[Echo]> im done

<EmperorStranger[WOLF|Echo]> ok

[Varianz]

I guess it is, but then again I'm tired. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt Tibs, believe it or not my only problem with you is that you put my alliance in danger, other than that you and I have much in common.

The only reason that I put TPF in danger is because I felt that you were a threat to my alliance. Dogbite obviously hated us, and had even mentioned that TPF should attack RE with LE. Since he's pretty high up in TPF, that was a bit disconcerting. Then of course, there's the fact that information was being leaked directly from TPF to RE's enemies. Sensitive information. And the leak ran right back to you Gabs. Those two factors, combined to make me slightly paranoid.

And on a topic-related note, I personally think that this is all BS that should be brought to private channels. You aren't going to solve anything by posturing in public, you'll just keep trying to one up each other. I've worked with both of you, you're both capable of reasonable thinking. Get on IRC, talk this over.

Merges. Bad idea.

Edited October 9, 2009 by Tiberius12

[Clash]

I have no problems with you CP, but you should stop bringing that up. You did the same exact thing to Murder Inc last round as a joke, just like ES joked around this round. Get over it.

Taken out of context.

Forgetting all the other fake announcements of that day doesn't mean they didn't exist. Do you remember when MI tried to ZI me by bandwagoning on LE's TPF attack, and ended up my tech farms? They made a big stinkin' thread about that. Perhaps that meant nothing to you. It meant a bit more to me. A lil bit of payback was worth it.

Besides, though it seems like forever ago, it was this round

When all the crap goes to the side, ES's bio says he is the new Echo leader. An brand-new alliance started by eyerack. If ES wanted to be a leader, why not just stay as SDF? He was handed a bigger alliance right in his hands, and decided to fold it. Running SDF into the ground appears to have not been good enough for him. He has to try and take someone else's alliance over and do it to them too.

I don't care what you or anyone else says.

I think it's a weasel move.

[Emperor Stranger]

When all the crap goes to the side, ES's bio says he is the new Echo leader. An brand-new alliance started by eyerack. If ES wanted to be a leader, why not just stay as SDF? He was handed a bigger alliance right in his hands, and decided to fold it. Running SDF into the ground appears to have not been good enough for him. He has to try and take someone else's alliance over and do it to them too.

I didn't want to be the leader. My only gain in merging with Echo is protection and continued growth. Continued growth. Gee, it's hard to continually grow when the only person with any real recruitment skills dislikes you, huh? What does TPF propose my plan was, coup eyerack in hopes that he would continue to recruit? Fail logic is fail.

[partymaster]

Merges. Bad idea.

Quote of the day going into my sig B)

[Clash]

Dogbite obviously hated us, and had even mentioned that TPF should attack RE with LE. Since he's pretty high up in TPF, that was a bit disconcerting.

Oh yeah dog's been holding a grudge against you - and only by extention, RE - for a few rounds now. He says you made a promise to him and lied, not following through on something. Plus some other stuff, I forget what, but he was the only one of our gov who had a problem with you. The rest, including me, supported you and RE fully. I even argued back and forth with him many times defending you, too. He would always say that you weren't trustworthy. In the end it appears he was kind of right, wasn't he?

Let's get back to condeming ES now, k thanks

[Varianz]

Oh yeah dog's been holding a grudge against you - and only by extention, RE - for a few rounds now. He says you made a promise to him and lied, not following through on something. Plus some other stuff, I forget what, but he was the only one of our gov who had a problem with you. The rest, including me, supported you and RE fully. I even argued back and forth with him many times defending you, too. He would always say that you weren't trustworthy. In the end it appears he was kind of right, wasn't he?

Let's get back to condeming ES now, k thanks

He didn't like us because back in Round...5 I think...TPF got into a war, and RE didn't defend them...mostly because we were busy fighting MHA at the time (at that time they were larger then us, and our allies in the fight, TF and SWAT, had peaced them out). He's angry because we weren't able to commit to another huge war on top of the one we were already fighting. Yeah, terribly sorry I couldn't make RE nations appear out of nowhere so they could help TPF. As for me not being trustworthy, I've done as much to advance TPF as any of you. A little gratitude would be nice.

[Lysander]

Second in command = gov position. Did I miss something? Was there a change in rules? I'm completely baffled by your contradictory statements. And don't worry who I am, for all you know I'm your worst mother trucken nightmare.

I <3 u Randy

[Lysander]

FACT - Who gives a !@#$?

I second

[Dochartaigh]

Guys, its kind of sad that because you guys have a hatred for ES, he is automatically in the wrong. ES never tried to coup eyerack. Before you guys start playing that game, look for the facts.

FACT - ES merged SDF into ECHO on the pretense that ES would have a leadership position.

FACT - ES was told 2 days AFTER the merge that he wasn't in any leadership position just because.

FACT - eyerack was inactive when ECHO got DoW'd, so ES having brought over so many SDF members, tried to get them together to fight off Frostbite.

FACT - There WAS NO coup attempt, eyerack looks like he just wanted the SDF members to screw over ES, knowing a lot of people didn't like him.

FACT - I will defend ES, I've said it plenty of times, so if eyestatic think he has allies, don't forget, ES does as well.

FACT - I just saved a bunch of money on my car insurance by leaving Geico.

I have no problems with you CP, but you should stop bringing that up. You did the same exact thing to Murder Inc last round as a joke, just like ES joked around this round. Get over it.

Edit: Apparently eyestatic changed his name to eyerack, or I just don't care.

I agree with all this said here. Also, since eyerack wants to whine and moan, i reinstate my offer to you ES to simply merge into Black. Take your SDF members and merge them into Black now and leave this all behind. leave eyerack to his few members in Echo and deprive him of what he wanted most. numbers.