Why the Doom and Gloom?

[Alex987]

Well I've been around CN for almost 2 years, haven't really posted on the OWF but I do follow it a bit. The general attitude seems to be a sadness that CN is dying and that it is on an irreversible path of shrinking until it eventually disappears. Random wars, random grudges, random anything. The problem with this way of thinking is that it fosters the same kind of end it laments.

As the population of CN decreases - the impact every individual has increases. Alliances become smaller, so an individual's alliance work and war prowess become more important than just a number on a stat sheet - or at least a number on a smaller stat sheet. What also goes hand-in-hand with this is how the majority of people that delete from CN are inactive, or soon to be due to real life circumstances, etc. These also lead to a more compact community.

The problem is when active people turn into inactive people, due to the depressive way of thinking that CN is dying. This is more a mental trend of low confidence and interest more than anything else. If mindsets change, the community and trends would change, and the voices that speak the most are typically the ones that have the largest impact. But hey, if mindsets don't change, I'll be more individually important, so I suppose it's a win-win lose-lose either way

If I'm misunderstanding anything please feel free to point it out, it seems like there are inherent positives and negatives that come from both sides, and only the negatives are being acknowledged.

[HalfEmpty]

Yours is interesting take on the current player situation.

The way I look at it the fewer players the better the chance I have to win. The last 10 players will be in 6 alliances and 3 of the players will be ghosting.
I intend to be one of the non-ghosts.

[Owned-You]

As evident by the post above mine I would say that CN isn't dying at all. It's simply consolidating itself into a small core of players who will remain until the day admin disables the servers. What this means is our politics will become more streamlined and barring any major fallout in current power-circles we'll have a less dynamic political movement. In the past there were a variety of different groups vying for different aims with opposing ideals but over the span of time these groups have more or less merged into one another to create more united groups.

This same principle is supported by the evidence of various alliances merging themselves to form newer larger groups; the latest example being Anarchy Inc. But overall this process or "dying" as it's been called has been happening for years now. At this point the vast majority of casual players have departed leaving only a core of hardcore players to remain. So I wouldn't worry about the game shrinking drastically or dying anytime soon.

[HM Solomon I]

[quote name='Owned-You' timestamp='1345878005' post='3025148']
As evident by the post above mine I would say that CN isn't dying at all. It's simply consolidating itself into a small core of players who will remain until the day admin disables the servers. What this means is our politics will become more streamlined and barring any major fallout in current power-circles we'll have a less dynamic political movement. In the past there were a variety of different groups vying for different aims with opposing ideals but over the span of time these groups have more or less merged into one another to create more united groups.

This same principle is supported by the evidence of various alliances merging themselves to form newer larger groups; the latest example being Anarchy Inc. But overall this process or "dying" as it's been called has been happening for years now. At this point the vast majority of casual players have departed leaving only a core of hardcore players to remain. So I wouldn't worry about the game shrinking drastically or dying anytime soon.
[/quote]

^ this

When CN had 30,000-40,000+ players, most of those players had jumped on the bandwagon, they weren't ever going to be permanent fixtures in the Cyberverse. This shrinkage will eventually bottom out because there will always be players who stick around for as long as admin permits; there will always be the hard core members. I for one plan to stay around for as long as possible.

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='Owned-You' timestamp='1345878005' post='3025148']
As evident by the post above mine I would say that CN isn't dying at all. It's simply consolidating itself into a small core of players who will remain until the day admin disables the servers. What this means is our politics will become more streamlined and barring any major fallout in current power-circles we'll have a less dynamic political movement. In the past there were a variety of different groups vying for different aims with opposing ideals but over the span of time these groups have more or less merged into one another to create more united groups.

This same principle is supported by the evidence of various alliances merging themselves to form newer larger groups; the latest example being Anarchy Inc. But overall this process or "dying" as it's been called has been happening for years now. At this point the vast majority of casual players have departed leaving only a core of hardcore players to remain. So I wouldn't worry about the game shrinking drastically or dying anytime soon.
[/quote]


The minute the population decreases to the point Admin looses his donators, he will pull the plug on this game quicker than you could say it So yea, by having a lesser pool of people to get money from will inevitably kill this game He certainly wont be paying for it out his own pocket for our enjoyment. To think this place isn't dying or wont die is delusional at best.

I don't understand how people have the crazy idea that this game will be kept going if the donators stop lining the Admins pocket. (I'm not insulting him for treating it as an income) I would do the same. But if you have a 5000 hardcore membership base, and none of those people donate. The place wont be going for very long.


Think of the potential for donations with 40k players.

Think of the potential for donators for 30k players

And so on, and so on, until it reaches critical point Admin pulls the plug

Edited August 25, 2012 by Hiro Nakara

[IYIyTh]

Lexxy, refer to my avatar for my feelings.

[Emperor Wilbers]

[quote name='HM Solomon I' timestamp='1345893395' post='3025168']
^ this

When CN had 30,000-40,000+ players, most of those players had jumped on the bandwagon, they weren't ever going to be permanent fixtures in the Cyberverse. This shrinkage will eventually bottom out because there will always be players who stick around for as long as admin permits; there will always be the hard core members. I for one plan to stay around for as long as possible.
[/quote]

Double this! ^

I agree, it will not die out anytime soon. Well put!

[Sultan Ahmed]

Good god IYIyTh, do you have to use every GIF I post as an avatar? Also, I share that expression on his face. And by the way, why would a hardcore member who loves this game and wants to stay forever refuse to donate every now and then?

Edited August 25, 2012 by Sultan Ahmed

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='Sultan Ahmed' timestamp='1345922367' post='3025226']
Good god IYIyTh, do you have to use every GIF I post as an avatar? Also, I share that expression on his face. And by the way, why would a hardcore member who loves this game and wants to stay forever refuse to donate every now and then?
[/quote]


Because some people just don't want to pay for this !@#$. If you think that the baseline membership would fund this game with a few handfuls left then you're as delusional as the people that think it will never be switched off.

I'm guessing this little update wasn't implemented because of his growing donations from members.

5-1-2012
The nation bonuses provided by donating have been doubled.
The referral bonuses have been increased from ($1 million, 100 land, 40 infras, or 20 tech) to ($5 million, 500 land, 100 infras, or 50 tech) for each player referral that you bring into Cyber Nations that reaches 5,000 nation strength.


More the opposite, it's there to encourage more people to donate.

Edited August 25, 2012 by Hiro Nakara

[Sultan Ahmed]

I never said that I think that. Bonus increasing could also just be due to the fact that nations get bigger and bigger and such small numbers are just not worth the trouble.
However, discussing this matter on a serious basis is senseless, since we (or at least I) dont know the servecosts. Then again, fewer people could mean weaker servers and therefore less money needed.



edit: The sense of this thread was the mindset of people and not the actual way the game is going to die. So maybe we should stick to it.

Edited August 25, 2012 by Sultan Ahmed

[Owned-You]

[quote name='Hiro Nakara' timestamp='1345893674' post='3025169']
The minute the population decreases to the point Admin looses his donators, he will pull the plug on this game quicker than you could say it So yea, by having a lesser pool of people to get money from will inevitably kill this game He certainly wont be paying for it out his own pocket for our enjoyment. To think this place isn't dying or wont die is delusional at best.

I don't understand how people have the crazy idea that this game will be kept going if the donators stop lining the Admins pocket. (I'm not insulting him for treating it as an income) I would do the same. But if you have a 5000 hardcore membership base, and none of those people donate. The place wont be going for very long.


Think of the potential for donations with 40k players.

Think of the potential for donators for 30k players

And so on, and so on, until it reaches critical point Admin pulls the plug
[/quote]
I'm not commenting on the business aspects of this game. We as players aren't privy to the information needed to determine the cost of business and amount of donations needed to keep CN afloat so it's irrelevant to discuss it.

The only thing we as players can directly influence is the politics of this game. Which as I said earlier will continue on until the very end.

Edited August 25, 2012 by Owned-You

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='Sultan Ahmed' timestamp='1345924902' post='3025235']
I never said that I think that. Bonus increasing could also just be due to the fact that nations get bigger and bigger and such small numbers are just not worth the trouble.
However, discussing this matter on a serious basis is senseless, since we (or at least I) dont know the servecosts. Then again, fewer people could mean weaker servers and therefore less money needed.



edit: The sense of this thread was the mindset of people and not the actual way the game is going to die. So maybe we should stick to it.
[/quote]

More probable is shrinking numbers and less donators, coupled with people not wanting to fund a game that doesn't intend on improving itself or the core mechanics. Like a new aiding system, penalties and warring system and many of the decent suggestions that keep getting thrown at Admin and rejected or not acted on.

This is no way any dig at him. I'd not improve it either, it's clear this place's hay day has come and gone. There is not much he could do to improve numbers, that is evident by the decline in players since it's peak.

I like the fact people are optimistic in their thinking about it will last forever. The sad reality is it wont. It's nothing to cry about, after all, it's a game that takes 5 mins of your day to play.

[Helbrecht]

Hey I just got here, and I like what I see so far.

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='Helbrecht' timestamp='1345927560' post='3025243']
Hey I just got here, and I like what I see so far.
[/quote]


You would have loved it when there was 40k+ members.

[Alex987]

Well it sounds like from this thread most people don't think that, which was the point of making it in the first place, to see what everybody thinks. Most of the usual OWF posters seem to have a similar attitude as you, but those that don't post as often seem to think more like me. Quite ironic really...

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='Owned-You' timestamp='1345926411' post='3025239']
I'm not commenting on the business aspects of this game. We as players aren't privy to the information needed to determine the cost of business and amount of donations needed to keep CN afloat so it's irrelevant to discuss it.

The only thing we as players can directly influence is the politics of this game. Which as I said earlier will continue on until the very end.
[/quote]


Yes the politics will carry on, [i]obviously [/i] while the game runs. Until Admin pulls the plug because effort v return is not what he would like. The politics has been the same since the game began and will be the same until the game gets taken down. Treaty whore, gather friends, isolate enemies, attack under !@#$ CB or no CB, rinse wash repeat many times over. There is nothing revolutionary about that.

I still don't see that being the saviour of the game. It hasn't been successful so far. The numbers keep dropping and will continue to do so.

[Owned-You]

[quote name='Hiro Nakara' timestamp='1345932988' post='3025253']
Yes the politics will carry on, [i]obviously [/i] while the game runs. Until Admin pulls the plug because effort v return is not what he would like. The politics has been the same since the game began and will be the same until the game gets taken down. Treaty whore, gather friends, isolate enemies, attack under !@#$ CB or no CB, rinse wash repeat many times over. There is nothing revolutionary about that.

I still don't see that being the saviour of the game. It hasn't been successful so far. The numbers keep dropping and will continue to do so.
[/quote]
Who said anything about saving the game?

[Alex987]

The point wasn't about raising the numbers, the point was that there is a certain supply-and-demand effect. Once the supply decreases enough, people become more individually important/appreciated, and it should even out.

[HalfEmpty]

Income per member will rise as only the hardcore remain. Bandwidth costs will drop. All would be sweet except most expenses are fixed and don't vary by member count. Still I have every intention of getting to 10 million deaders and beholding the return of Frans (the man)Joseph.

[King Tarquin]

[quote name='Hiro Nakara' timestamp='1345932988' post='3025253']
Yes the politics will carry on, [i]obviously [/i] while the game runs. Until Admin pulls the plug because effort v return is not what he would like. The politics has been the same since the game began and will be the same until the game gets taken down. Treaty whore, gather friends, isolate enemies, attack under !@#$ CB or no CB, rinse wash repeat many times over. There is nothing revolutionary about that.

I still don't see that being the saviour of the game. It hasn't been successful so far. The numbers keep dropping and will continue to do so.
[/quote]

I've been reading all of your posts on this thread and i don't no why your being so negative. I know this games "Hey day"(I was there for that btw) is past. But that dosent mean there couldn't be a massive influx of new players from some unseen place or event, mabye something will shake this place up. and if not I think it will still be here for awhile.

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='HalfEmpty' timestamp='1345970385' post='3025334']
Income per member will rise as only the hardcore remain. Bandwidth costs will drop. All would be sweet except most expenses are fixed and don't vary by member count. Still I have every intention of getting to 10 million deaders and beholding the return of Frans (the man)Joseph.
[/quote]


profit loss v effort.

[quote name='King Tarquin' timestamp='1345971641' post='3025337']
I've been reading all of your posts on this thread and i don't no why your being so negative. I know this games "Hey day"(I was there for that btw) is past. But that dosent mean there couldn't be a massive influx of new players from some unseen place or event, mabye something will shake this place up. and if not I think it will still be here for awhile.
[/quote]

Because that's happened so far hasn't it. The trend has been in decline for years.


[quote name='Alex987' timestamp='1345960318' post='3025323']
The point wasn't about raising the numbers, the point was that there is a certain supply-and-demand effect. Once the supply decreases enough, people become more individually important/appreciated, and it should even out.
[/quote]

And again this wont stop the plug being pulled so to speak.

Edited August 26, 2012 by Hiro Nakara

[the rebel]

[quote name='Hiro Nakara' timestamp='1345974046' post='3025341']
profit loss v effort.[/quote]

Smaller player base equals smaller costs while maintaining profit margin.
Effort...what effort? Nothing has changed much since the space wonders.

[King Tarquin]

[quote name='Hiro Nakara' timestamp='1345974046' post='3025341']
profit loss v effort.



Because that's happened so far hasn't it. The trend has been in decline for years.




And again this wont stop the plug being pulled so to speak.
[/quote]


The fact is though you have no idea what it costs to run this game and no idea how much the admin takes in. So saying that he will pull the plug anytime to is just guesswork

[Hiro Nakara]

[quote name='the rebel' timestamp='1346008046' post='3025426']
Smaller player base equals smaller costs while maintaining profit margin.
Effort...what effort? Nothing has changed much since the space wonders.
[/quote]


I'm sure there is a great deal of effort running this cesspool. I'm sure its warranted by the income he makes from it. That will eventually change when people get fewer and less donations come in. He's not doing it to scrape by for your enjoyment.

[quote name='King Tarquin' timestamp='1346009357' post='3025431']
The fact is though you have no idea what it costs to run this game and no idea how much the admin takes in. So saying that he will pull the plug anytime to is just guesswork
[/quote]

A bit like the people saying it is not dying. I'd have a rough idea of how much a server costs, for a game like this, it's not to hard to get an approximate. Again the fact he's raising the donations amounts leads me to believe that donations are not as free flowing as they were when he had 40k members, again that's not to hard to grasp either.


Do you think Admin wont shut this place down when its run its coarse?

Do you think Admin has this place purely for your enjoyment?

Edited August 26, 2012 by Hiro Nakara

[Voodoo Nova]

[quote name='Alex987' timestamp='1345960318' post='3025323']
The point wasn't about raising the numbers, the point was that there is a certain supply-and-demand effect. Once the supply decreases enough, people become more individually important/appreciated, and it should even out.
[/quote]

Individual player importance/alliance importance has no bearing on whether or not admin wishes to continue this game. Money rules the world and if this doesn't meet the wants/needs of admin, I wouldn't expect it to last long either. Every player here should realize we play the game because we enjoy it (or have wasted enough of our life on it to check in 5 minutes a day), and admin runs it because he see an investment opportunity to continue making money off of the game.