Mathias

[quote name='Moridin' timestamp='1296422989' post='2611496'] Why does anybody think these sort of idiotic callout threads will actually bring about some meaningful change from the other side? Or, if you don't think they will, why make them? [/quote] Look at who wrote the OP and you'll have your answer.

[quote name='the damned' timestamp='1296233348' post='2607515'] Doesnt five years make you the [i]Old[/i] Pacific Order? Happy Birthday, i guess. [/quote] That joke should be punishable by EZI.

Happy Birthday Pacifica! Enjoy your last one!

I think it's funny that of all people Methrage is the only one not declaring war on GOONS.

[quote name='SpiderJerusalem' timestamp='1296090654' post='2603782'] Accepting Sir Paul's antics, which genuinely pissed of a lot of MK members would be another [/quote] No it didn't.

I wasn't going to read it. Glad I did. See you out there FAN.

[quote name='Omniscient1' timestamp='1296090299' post='2603771'] Right Chimaera is definitely not a person who has time to make any threads about CN events or help out IAA or anything of the sort. You got me there.... [/quote] You know he's not that active so I don't get why you're arguing that. I didn't say he was gone, but if that's your standard for an active person then IAA is the most active alliance on Bob.

[quote name='Omniscient1' timestamp='1296081189' post='2603387'] Darth Andrew and Chimey were both old school IAAers. PHD was a long time ally to the old IAA. [/quote] I'd hardly call Chimaera active. TL would have been a good example though.

[quote name='infinite citadel' timestamp='1296080462' post='2603369'] We haven't fought NPO since NoCB. We received reps via the alliances fighting them in Karma, however we weren't on the surrender terms at all and had no say in the reps process. Nice try though [/quote] Yeah, but MK is an evil mastermind that has a hand in everything.

[quote name='Omniscient1' timestamp='1296079864' post='2603353'] No, most old school IAAers are still with us. Nice try though "hurr durr they're different now". I appreciate the effort. [/quote] The people in charge aren't the old school IAAers. Hell, the people that are active aren't even the old school IAAers. Which sucks cause I miss talking to a lot of them. edit: I don't actually care about proving whether or not this is a new IAA or not, just lamenting an unfortunate fact.

Legion has shown their true character, and it is virtuous and honorable. Ave Legio!

Little p. VE is far more lenient than us horrible horrible people in Doomhouse.

[quote name='mhawk' timestamp='1296074702' post='2603208'] I had discussed this policy with moo for many many months and was there helping him draft the very announcement. You'll also remember when TPF backed up Zenith trying to prevent GOD's desire to pzi kaiser martens. We were walking the walk well before your friends in Karma. I don't count months before the war as "our fate was sealed". You'll remember TOP, Sparta, and MHA were still in Q at that time. [/quote] Alright. And as for the GOD comment; GOD (and SF in general) was solidly on your side prior to Karma. You don't get to lump their actions while tied to you in with us as some sign of hypocrisy. Not to mention GOD was still trying to disband people during Karma so I think we can establish a pattern of behavior. They learned it from watching you Dad. They learned it from watching you.

[quote name='mhawk' timestamp='1296074358' post='2603192'] TPF and NPO announced a policy of no PZI/EZI well before the karma war. There are 2 threads on it in the archives somewhere. [/quote] Define "well before the Karma war." Does that mean after your fate was already sealed? RV mentioned in another thread that he was let off PZI two months before Karma in an attempt to do some damage control, so I find it hard to believe that NPO looked deep into their hearts and ended a practice they (and their allies) had been actively using for years with no ulterior motive.

[quote name='mhawk' timestamp='1296074001' post='2603178'] This is BS. Research will show that a majority of Q including TPF and NPO signed anti EZI/PZI declarations well before karma. Take this off the list of BS you accomplished. [/quote] I remember a ZI Peace Pact, but I also remember Andromeda having to take its name off it because Pacifica yelled at them. I also remember NPO was pissed at VE for it. So what are you talking about? (Note: I may have actually forgotten.)

[quote name='Geoffron X' timestamp='1296073308' post='2603154'] EZI doesn't let people reroll. PZI does. [/quote] The distinction only matters to people that are incredibly petty. "Oh we'll let you play again, but ONLY under a new name! It's your NAME that wronged us!" If you're going to let someone play again anyway, why wouldn't you just sentence them to ZI? Why make them go through the hassle of rerolling for resources?

[quote name='The Reccesion' timestamp='1296061129' post='2602827'] I guess it just depends on how you look at it then. Their are a couple alliances who don't like NpO and they are on their side just to defend their ally, and they don't consider themselves on NpO's side. [/quote] By supporting an alliance defending NpO you're freeing them up to attack NpO's attackers thus supporting NpO.

[quote name='The Reccesion' timestamp='1296060674' post='2602814'] Yeah I get that, but theirs other alliances who didn't want to fight for Polar. But they had obligations to defend their allies, which Valhalla is neglecting. Just because you defend your ally doesn't make you on "Polars side". [/quote] Yes it does. That's the definition of being "on 'Polar's side.'"

[quote name='The Reccesion' timestamp='1296059309' post='2602795'] I know their not cowards. I use to be a huge fan of them, but this war makes them seem like cowards from what their reasoning's are for not entering. They arn't the only ones who are mad with NpO, the others still honored their respective treatys. [/quote] That's the problem with a global war. Unless you're obviously being a spineless coward, I'm not going to fault anyone for making difficult choices regarding their treaties in a war like this. It's not like Valhalla is or was a rank and file Polaris hailer. Quite the opposite; so I don't blame them for not wanting to support their side in this war.

I don't get the train of thought that FAN is somehow more justified in attacking NPO than Doomhouse is. Especially because the same people just got done saying that "NPO paid for its sins in Karma." People just like praising FAN's actions because they stood by for a year while FAN was forced to stay in peacemode, so you still feel a little guilty. Yeah, I stood by and let it happen as well, but I don't go around hailing everything they do in an attempt to make up for my inaction. So what is it? Did NPO pay for their sins and FAN is JUST AS EVIL as Doomhouse? Or are Doomhouse and FAN both justified in attacking Pacifica?

[quote name='The Reccesion' timestamp='1296058732' post='2602782'] Then call me stupid. Until they get off their ass and back up their [b]MDP[/b] partners they are nothing but cowards. [/quote] I'm sure Valhalla doesn't particularly care what you think of them. I've never liked Valhalla, but coward has never been a word I'd use to describe them.

[quote name='Chimaera' timestamp='1296022813' post='2602251'] I am not against the institution of war - I am against the premise of unjust and pointless wars. War is a critical factor in the maintenance of this community and planet and should happen at regular intervals. But it should not happen at the whim of those who feel like killing something because of three year old actions. Hell, I would personally rather there not BE any inter-alliance treaties and force each alliance to make their own way in the world rather than gliding on the coattails of others. Alas, that is impossible. [/quote] Fine, then they insulted our mothers. That's been used before right? No one's ever declared war on an alliance they like. Every war is the result of the attacker finding an "acceptable" reason to do what they wanted to do anyway. And what's the point of finding that reason when the people you're attacking are only going to dispute it's validity anyway?

[quote name='TrotskysRevenge' timestamp='1296024310' post='2602303'] NOT: I apoligis for bad writing. I am now in Rehab Centr and hav lot to relern. Ples bar with me. OOC: I wuld lik to thank evry one for wel wishs and thots and prayrs. I wuld lik to thank Archon, Zulchep, AirMe, Chefjoe, Shadow, RSox and Stormsend for cowbels. I wuld like thank membrs of my alince for al they hav don and continu to do. I lik this CN comunite becus ther ar tims that game afilashuns put asid and we can suport each othr. [/quote] OOC: Good luck with your recovery. Oh and I guess, IC: I agree with this war!

I like the cut of your jib.

[quote name='Omniscient1' timestamp='1296015206' post='2601829'] It's fairly easy to see. I don't have to call them all out for you. If you're not illiterate you can find which treaties aren't being honored. If you are illiterate then me telling you won't help you anyway. [/quote] It would certainly be convenient and support the points you made in the OP.