GOON spy orders

[Haquertal]

[quote name='oinkoink12' timestamp='1285276608' post='2462487']
We'll there is still a way out of this.
its your (the agressors) choice, we offer peaceoffers every day.


[/quote]

Did you miss the memo that sending secret aid to a nuclear rogue isn't aggression?

[Andre27]

[quote name='Meer Republic' timestamp='1285275696' post='2462465']
Andre was it a problem when GGA hid behind NPO for so long? Like when they wanted VE or Gramlins off green? Or was that different?
[/quote]

GGA did depend too much on its allies. That was one of the mistakes which many GGA governments have fought to rectify, both prior and after Karma.
GOONS is in the stage where they claim they can handle anything while they hide behind their allies every time.

As for VE, funny you mention them, even though the GGA got blamed for that one it was GOONS who pushed the move against VE.
Gramlins was not an issue in the green civil war. The issue at the time was with CIS and NTO. GOONS pushed the move on VE because of the Obsidian Entente

Edit:
But let's get back on topic already. There have been too many ad hominem attacks, references to disbanded alliances and historic conflicts already.

Edited September 23, 2010 by Andre27

[Mayzie]

Have fun Jim, it was no doubt boring sat unaligned waiting for someone to attack and it never happening. Sometimes you have to create your own drama to keep things interesting.

Look me up when it's all over and done with, if you need anything.

[Choson]

[quote name='Andre27' timestamp='1285277441' post='2462501']
GGA did depend too much on its allies. That was one of the mistakes which many GGA governments have fought to rectify, both prior and after Karma.
GOONS is in the stage where they claim they can handle anything while they hide behind their allies every time.

As for VE, funny you mention them, even though the GGA got blamed for that one it was GOONS who pushed the move against VE.
Gramlins was not an issue in the green civil war. The issue at the time was with CIS and NTO. GOONS pushed the move on VE because of the Obsidian Entente
[/quote]
How are we hiding behind our allies, when they come to us, asking if they can assist us? Is that a concept that you just can't grasp?

[Haquertal]

[quote name='Choson' timestamp='1285277554' post='2462504']
How are we hiding behind our allies, when they come to us, asking if they can assist us? Is that a concept that you just can't grasp?
[/quote]

Because obviously if we went spying every nation (like we've been doing obviously) nobody will attack since our allies are too big.

[Meer Republic]

[quote name='Andre27' timestamp='1285277441' post='2462501']
GGA did depend too much on its allies. That was one of the mistakes which many GGA governments have fought to rectify, both prior and after Karma.
GOONS is in the stage where they claim they can handle anything while they hide behind their allies every time.

As for VE, funny you mention them, even though the GGA got blamed for that one it was GOONS who pushed the move against VE.
Gramlins was not an issue in the green civil war. The issue at the time was with CIS and NTO. GOONS pushed the move on VE because of the Obsidian Entente
[/quote]


So you're happy being a hypocrite then, I remember you merrily cheerleadering the fact that your alliance relied on it's allies to enable you to throw your weight around. Or have you undergone some great Spongelike redemption and all your history has been absolved?

The VE thing would never have happened had GGA not wanted it to, the OE angle was just a bonus at the time.


But yes let's go back to the topic before your hypocrisy is further exposed.

Edited September 23, 2010 by Meer Republic

[Umar ibn Abd al-Aziz]

[quote name='JimKongIl' timestamp='1285269282' post='2462364']
Well $%&@ you too.
[/quote]

[quote name='JimKongIl' timestamp='1285269383' post='2462368']
Just shutup and fight.
[/quote]
Do I detect a degree of tetchiness? C'mon bro it's alright, we're all friends itt - it just sounds like you could use a bit of a hug to cheer you up, hey?

[Choson]

[quote name='Umar ibn Abd al-Aziz' timestamp='1285277849' post='2462512']
Do I detect a degree of tetchiness? C'mon bro it's alright, we're all friends itt - it just sounds like you could use a bit of a hug to cheer you up, hey?
[/quote]
A radioactive hug?

[mrcalkin]

[quote name='Andre27' timestamp='1285277441' post='2462501']
GGA did depend too much on its allies. That was one of the mistakes which many GGA governments have fought to rectify, both prior and after Karma.
GOONS is in the stage where they claim they can handle anything while they hide behind their allies every time.[/quote]
Looks like that was a failed fight considering it was the normal mode of operations of the GGA until its disbandment. Let's not forget that GOONS, on the grand scheme of things, is in its infancy compared to an alliance like GGA that existed since nearly the beginning of the game in comparison. It makes sense that their mid to upper tiers are less developed while it didnt make any sense that GGA relied on the NPO for such basic nation equipment as WRC's when they had already existed for [b]years[/b].

[quote]As for VE, funny you mention them, even though the GGA got blamed for that one it was GOONS who pushed the move against VE.
[b]Gramlins was not an issue in the green civil war.[/b] The issue at the time was with CIS and NTO. GOONS pushed the move on VE because of the Obsidian Entente
[/quote]

They were, however, an issue when you signed UJA out from under them and got thoroughly pissed when you could no longer hold onto your precious senate seat, lol.

Also, just fyi, but this GOONS is not the same alliance as the old GOONS. VE even went so far as to sign a treaty with this GOONS, lol.

Edited September 23, 2010 by mrcalkin

[Choson]

[quote name='mrcalkin' timestamp='1285278232' post='2462519']
Also, just fyi, but this GOONS is not the same alliance as the old GOONS. VE even went so far as to sign a treaty with this GOONS, lol.
[/quote]
But... but... but they [i][b]are[/b][/i] the same.

[Andre27]

[quote name='Meer Republic' timestamp='1285277682' post='2462509']
So you're happy being a hypocrite then, I remember you merrily cheerleadering the fact that your alliance relied on it's allies to enable you to throw your weight around. Or have you undergone some great Spongelike redemption and all your history has been absolved?

The VE thing would never have happened had GGA not wanted it to, the OE angle was just a bonus at the time.


But yes let's go back to the topic before your hypocrisy is further exposed.
[/quote]

While i was in the GGA i never "cheerleadered" the fact that the GGA relied on its allies too much.
There were a few idiots (one in particular) who made remarks like that, only to give the rest of the alliance a splitting headache.

Personally I've always admitted mistakes and GGA government of that time should not have given GOONS what they wanted then.
I was, and am, glad VE reformed and prospered.
Credit where credit is due though and although the GGA took the blame for the disaster of the green civil war, GOONS were those who pushed for the destruction of VE.

Do not try to accuse me of hypocrisy without knowing me or where i stood for during the time i was GGA government.
It may help you sleep better, but it does not do justice to the truth.

As i said earlier, let's get back on topic.

[TypoNinja]

[quote name='The MVP' timestamp='1285249870' post='2462140']
So we're supposed to be moral when dealing with GOONS when they're one of the biggest proponents of the anti-moralist brigade?
[/quote]

Yes, the important part of a moral code is that you adhere to it, the idea that someone else not holding the same standards as you is an excuse for you to abandon your own values is simply stupid.

[quote name='Beefspari' timestamp='1285253013' post='2462175']
I'm confused. How can we wear the pants if MK is pulling the strings? Which one trumps the other?
[/quote]

MK are the suspenders that hold up your slacks. Strings and Pants

[JT Jag]

Guys, get it together. We aren't a legitimate alliance because we're same as the old GOONS and alliances can't reform, but we're also not the old GOONS because we aren't as good.

[mrcalkin]

[quote name='JT Jag' timestamp='1285279103' post='2462537']
Guys, get it together. We aren't a legitimate alliance because we're same as the old GOONS and alliances can't reform, but we're also not the old GOONS because we aren't as good.
[/quote]

Conclusion: GOONS do not exist.

[JimKongIl]

[quote name='oinkoink12' timestamp='1285276608' post='2462487']
We'll there is still a way out of this.
its your (the agressors) choice, we offer peaceoffers every day.


[/quote]

It's a little early for you to be having second thoughts isn't it?


-BTW-Thank you, Feanor and Mayzie.

[Beefspari]

[quote name='Andre27' timestamp='1285265346' post='2462307']
But this is not the first time GOONS depended on allies. Even when engaging the relatively mediocre level UOKMB nations they received assistance from their allies.
Almost as if they cannot handle things themselves wouldn't you say.

Even if MK, Umbrella, FOK, PC etc are itching for a fight, this does not change anything about how this reflects on GOONS ability to handle these situations themselves.
[/quote]
You know what, even besides all the other facts like how our allies wanted to chip in and FOK isn't even allied to us, I have to ask,

Why do you feel like we should even have to do everything by ourselves? What do you believe the point is in having allies if you aren't supposed to use them? Everyone just signs MDPs and treaties with people and then never uses them because that's cowardly? What is this, some sort of samurai duel where we only do 1 on 1 fights, GAs only, no sanctions, no allies (OOC: Final Destination)?

Where does this point of view even come from? To never let your allies do anything for you because that means you're a coward? Is this some sort of honor thing? Pride? Why should we even care? Maybe your alliance doesn't have a good enough relationship with your allies to trust them with anything, but we do. Allies are just members of our AA that are one step removed. They're as good of buddies as we are with our own members. I'm sorry if your allies just take up room and benefit you in no way.

Or is this another sort of double-standard where it's okay when you do it but not us? I expect you to cancel every one of your treaties so you can make sure to do everything yourself without using allies as crutches. You wouldn't want to appear weak or anything. Chop chop.

[Beefspari]

[quote name='Haflinger' timestamp='1285274080' post='2462439']
Most alliances are pro nuke rogue, as long as the rogue's hitting someone they don't like.
[/quote]
I really hate agreeing with you Haflinger, but yeah this type of hypocrisy and double-standard is blazingly true and obvious as of late.

[Banksy]

Was this really worth it, Jim? You really don't have much of a hope, especially with that warchest. You seem like the sort of person who likes to make a stand for what they believe in. But this isn't a particularly dignified exit you've chosen.

Edited September 23, 2010 by Banksy

[JT Jag]

[quote name='mrcalkin' timestamp='1285279332' post='2462545']
Conclusion: GOONS do not exist.
[/quote]I guess you could say that There Are No Goons. Good day.

(the two of you out there that get this reference, this one's for you)

[JimKongIl]

[quote name='fant0m' timestamp='1285273188' post='2462428']
My deepest apologies, I wasn't aware I'm not allowed to post on these forums anytime I'm involved in a war.
[/quote]

You are, I was just goading a bit. No true offense intended. Best of luck for a good fight.


[quote name='Banksy' timestamp='1285281215' post='2462582']
Was this really worth it, Jim? You really don't have much of a hope, especially with that warchest. You seem like the sort of person who likes to make a stand for what they believe in. But this isn't a particularly dignified exit you've chosen.
[/quote]


Hope of what? I'm not exiting. I am fighting. A rogue is just one nation fighting one or more alliances without backup.

Edited September 24, 2010 by JimKongIl

[JimKongIl]

[quote name='Methrage' timestamp='1285270591' post='2462389']
Good luck and enjoy your wars JimKongIl, I'm sure you'll be able to dish out a lot more damage than they can do to you. Thanks for the assistance as well.

o/ JimKongIl
[/quote]


[quote name='kriekfreak' timestamp='1285274794' post='2462447']
Yeah right
[/quote]

Keep score bigmouth. BTW I thought you were Dowing.

[Baldr]

[quote name='Haquertal' timestamp='1285200365' post='2461520']
The point is to check their slots and make it unlikely that they'll accept. Why would we check slots with 3mil/50T/2k ?
[/quote]

So the "lets check their aid slots" aid was sent for $1, as someone else posted?

According to the game rules, http://www.cybernations.net/terms.asp, that is not allowed.

Search that page for "unsubstantial".

[mrcalkin]

[quote name='Baldr' timestamp='1285286475' post='2462708']
So the "lets check their aid slots" aid was sent for $1, as someone else posted?

According to the game rules, http://www.cybernations.net/terms.asp, that is not allowed.

Search that page for "unsubstantial".
[/quote]

The text you are speaking of says:

"Nations caught trying to fill opponent’s aid slots by sending unsubstantial joke aid packages will receive an in-game warning."

In this situation, the most important word in that sentence is "joke".

Edited September 24, 2010 by mrcalkin

[TypoNinja]

[quote name='Beefspari' timestamp='1285280723' post='2462571']
Where does this point of view even come from? To never let your allies do anything for you because that means you're a coward? Is this some sort of honor thing? Pride? Why should we even care?
[/quote]

It probably stems from the Hegemon era when third string alliance would bully others around because they had the political/military ties to the right people. Little people throwing around weight they didn't have, operating under the political truism of "our (larger) friends will kick your ass".

Calling in allies would have gained negative connotations because it was usually someone small threatening a larger party for stupid reasons.

A typical defensive mindset in that scenario would then have been something along the lines of "Can't even do your own dirty work, eh?"

Just a guess on my part, but it seems logical.

[fant0m]

[quote name='JimKongIl' timestamp='1285285798' post='2462684']
You are, I was just goading a bit. No true offense intended. Best of luck for a good fight.
[/quote]

Good luck to you as well and may you bring me many casualties. Bob Sanders has been in the top 5 for far too long.