GOONS owes me $90,000,000

[Sardonic]

[quote name='BlkAK47_002' timestamp='1284064016' post='2447946']
Just because your alliance goes around harassing micro AA's doesn't mean you are more significant than Schatt.
[/quote]
No, it's because we have a strong culture, political presence, and connections that make us more significant than Schatt.

[Kzoppistan]

After about 10 pages I sort of zone out nowadays, since the arguments always devolve into the minutia that, even if resolved point by painstaking point, doesn't necessarily shift the original argument in any meaningful direction far enough to change it.

I'll just cut through the [i]blah blah blah[/i] and state that if Schatt is making the case that GOONS routinely impose punitive damages on those that transgress against them, but won't apply the same standard to themselves, despite that the difference of transgressions committed by GOONS is probably much higher than those against them, I will agree.

But, if someone else were to state that GOONS probably don't really care about that difference and only enjoy exercising their rhetorastics (rhetoric + gymnastics, get it?) as an amusing way to attempt deflection of the fact, I will also agree.

Power needs no justification, after all.

Now. Since I've conveniently chopped, compressed, and sealed this argument into easily digestible chunks for the think-light, obviously some thanks are in order.


[center]I [b]demand $90 Million[/b] for services rendered.[/center]

Edited September 9, 2010 by Kzoppistan

[DictatatorDan]

[quote name='Sardonic' timestamp='1284064237' post='2447950']
No, it's because we have a strong culture, political presence, and connections that make us more significant than Schatt.
[/quote]
[color="#FF0000"]You deserve a gold star...you've earned it. This is simply...hillarious. [/color]

Edited September 9, 2010 by DictatatorDan

[JT Jag]

[quote name='DictatatorDan' timestamp='1284069506' post='2448047']
[color="#FF0000"]You deserve a gold star...you've earned it. This is simply...hillarious. [/color]
[/quote]Good job not even trying to arguing the point, friend. You get a PLATINUM star for effort though.

[Locke]

[quote name='Locke426' timestamp='1284054318' post='2447794']
And there's GPA on the bronze podium, the envy of all but the top 2 for their political prowess and clout.
[/quote]
I wish I had been the one to come up with this brilliant quote. Maybe the names will be similar enough for me to try passing it off as that.

[mrwuss]

[quote name='DictatatorDan' timestamp='1284069506' post='2448047']
[color="#FF0000"]You deserve a gold star...you've earned it. This is simply...hillarious. [/color]
[/quote]


[color=#dc1400]Y[/color][color=#dc2800]o[/color][color=#dc3c00]u[/color] [color=#dc6400]d[/color][color=#dc7800]e[/color][color=#dc8c00]s[/color][color=#dca000]e[/color][color=#dcb400]r[/color][color=#dcc800]v[/color][color=#dcdc00]e[/color] [color=#b4dc00]a[/color] [color=#8cdc00]p[/color][color=#78dc00]i[/color][color=#64dc00]n[/color][color=#50dc00]k[/color] [color=#28dc00]s[/color][color=#14dc00]t[/color][color=#00dc00]a[/color][color=#00dc14]r[/color][color=#00dc28]![/color] [color=#00dc50]B[/color][color=#00dc64]u[/color][color=#00dc78]t[/color][color=#00dc8c],[/color] [color=#00dcb4]a[/color][color=#00dcc8]l[/color][color=#00dcdc]a[/color][color=#00c8dc]s[/color][color=#00b4dc],[/color] [color=#008cdc]w[/color][color=#0078dc]e[/color] [color=#0050dc]s[/color][color=#003cdc]a[/color][color=#0028dc]v[/color][color=#0014dc]e[/color] [color=#1400dc]t[/color][color=#2800dc]h[/color][color=#3c00dc]o[/color][color=#5000dc]s[/color][color=#6400dc]e[/color] [color=#8c00dc]f[/color][color=#a000dc]o[/color][color=#b400dc]r[/color] [color=#dc00dc]s[/color][color=#dc00c8]i[/color][color=#dc00b4]g[/color][color=#dc00a0]n[/color][color=#dc008c]i[/color][color=#dc0078]f[/color][color=#dc0064]i[/color][color=#dc0050]c[/color][color=#dc003c]a[/color][color=#dc0028]n[/color][color=#dc0014]t[/color] [color=#dc1400]p[/color][color=#dc2800]e[/color][color=#dc3c00]o[/color][color=#dc5000]p[/color][color=#dc6400]l[/color][color=#dc7800]e[/color] [color=#dca000]w[/color][color=#dcb400]i[/color][color=#dcc800]t[/color][color=#dcdc00]h[/color][color=#c8dc00]i[/color][color=#b4dc00]n[/color] [color=#8cdc00]t[/color][color=#78dc00]h[/color][color=#64dc00]e[/color] [color=#3cdc00]w[/color][color=#28dc00]o[/color][color=#14dc00]r[/color][color=#00dc00]l[/color][color=#00dc14]d[/color][color=#00dc28].[/color]

[BlkAK47_002]

[quote name='JT Jag' timestamp='1284071394' post='2448081']
Good job not even trying to arguing the point, friend. You get a PLATINUM star for effort though.
[/quote]
There's really nothing to argue about. It's just common knowledge.

[JT Jag]

[quote name='BlkAK47_002' timestamp='1284081858' post='2448285']
There's really nothing to argue about. It's just common knowledge.
[/quote]You're right. The topic on who is more influential right now, Schattenmann or GOONS, really isn't worth arguing because it's blindingly obvious what the answer is. On that, I agree with you.

[TehChron]

[quote name='JT Jag' timestamp='1284085354' post='2448347']
You're right. The topic on who is more influential right now, Schattenmann or GOONS, really isn't worth arguing because it's blindingly obvious what the answer is. On that, I agree with you.
[/quote]
The discussion was one of relevance period, not influence at this point in time, actually.

Do try and keep up.

I'll put in my two cents and say that since Schattenamanmannan had a hand in overthrowing the evil empire of Pacifica, he is therefore more relevant historically, and has more relevance to the current state of affairs than GOONS does.

Sure you may have more [i]influence[/i] now, but only because Schatt was one of the ones that paved the way for your rise to power.

[Leftbehind]

[quote name='JT Jag' timestamp='1284085354' post='2448347']
You're right. The topic on who is more influential right now, Schattenmann or GOONS, really isn't worth arguing because it's blindingly obvious what the answer is. On that, I agree with you.
[/quote]

Sorry kid but GOONS and Schattenmann are on about the same level of influential. With everything he has done in the past and the friends he made along the way has given him influence over some people. Much like, your alliance's influence rides on the fact that you have gotten lucky with making the right friends at the right time and not by any acts. Just because people make threads about you guys doesn't mean your alliance has any influence over anothers.

[Voytek]

[quote name='Chron' timestamp='1284087660' post='2448398']The discussion was one of relevance period, not influence at this point in time, actually.[/quote]

No it wasn't. Don't move the goalposts, thanks in advance.

[TehChron]

[quote name='Voytek' timestamp='1284087953' post='2448404']
No it wasn't. Don't move the goalposts, thanks in advance.
[/quote]
Really now? I coulda sworn it was our good friend JT that was doing so up until the point where I called him out on it.

But you know, it's not like itd be the first time either one of us was wrong.

[Voytek]

[quote name='Chron' timestamp='1284088100' post='2448406']
Really now? I coulda sworn it was our good friend JT that was doing so up until the point where I called him out on it.

But you know, it's not like itd be the first time either one of us was wrong.
[/quote]
Unless he specifically defined it one way or the other you have to assume that he was talking about relevance or influence in the context of this issue. That's kind of how the thread system works.

Edited September 10, 2010 by Voytek

[TehChron]

[quote name='Voytek' timestamp='1284088206' post='2448411']
Unless he specifically defined it one way or the other you have to assume that he was talking about relevance or influence in the context of this issue. That's kind of how the thread system works.
[/quote]
The discussion was about relevance, not influence, however.

So by that definition, JT [i]was[/i] the one moving goalposts. If you want I can provide quotes to that effect?

[Voytek]

[quote name='Chron' timestamp='1284088360' post='2448413']
The discussion was about relevance, not influence, however.

So by that definition, JT [i]was[/i] the one moving goalposts. If you want I can provide quotes to that effect?
[/quote]
It doesn't matter either way, as I believe my post would have implied if you'd read it:
[quote name='Voytek' timestamp='1284088206' post='2448411']Unless he specifically defined it one way or the other you have to assume that he was talking about relevance [b]or[/b] influence[/quote]

[TehChron]

[quote name='Voytek' timestamp='1284088473' post='2448419']
It doesn't matter either way, as I believe my post would have implied if you'd read it:
[/quote]
[quote]You're right. The topic on who is more [b]influential[/b] right now, Schattenmann or GOONS, really isn't worth arguing because it's blindingly obvious what the answer is. On that, I agree with you.[/quote]I apologize if I interpret words by their definitions rather than implied imaginary context.

I should learn to read between the invisible lines, like you do.

Ah, to be human and not some kind of nigh-godlike orator like Schattenman.

Edited September 10, 2010 by Chron

[Voytek]

[quote name='Chron' timestamp='1284088604' post='2448423']
I apologize if I interpret words by their definitions rather than implied imaginary context.

I should learn to read between the invisible lines, like you do.

Ah, to be human and not some kind of nigh-godlike orator like Schattenman.
[/quote]

The context isn't imaginary though, unless you want to get into an existential debate about whether this thread really exists or whether it's a figment of our imaginations?

[TehChron]

[quote name='Voytek' timestamp='1284088710' post='2448428']
The context isn't imaginary though, unless you want to get into an existential debate about whether this thread really exists or whether it's a figment of our imaginations?
[/quote]
I dunno, I mean, the context was a discussion on relevance. Influence was the new word being thrown around there.

So, unless you can retroactively dictate that we were discussing influence rather than relevance, then I'm afraid that you really are just shooting blanks here. I mean, I wouldn't be moving the goalposts and that accusation would just be you being full of hot air. Or maybe you just don't know the difference between the meanings of relevance and influence. Both options don't reflect well on you, though.

But if you want to debate existentialism, then Im afraid that this is where we'll have to part ways. I'd like to stick to the topic at hand, without trying to go off on a tangent.

I have gotta say, though. At this rate, Schatt may be able to eventually get his $90 million, sometime down the line. Or perhaps he'll undermine GOONS through more excellent propaganda? I'm looking forward to his future efforts.

Edited September 10, 2010 by Chron

[SpoiL]

[quote name='JT Jag' timestamp='1284071394' post='2448081']
Good job not even trying to arguing the point, friend. You get a PLATINUM star for effort though.
[/quote]

http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=91902&view=findpost&p=2447234
http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=91902&view=findpost&p=2447239
http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=91902&view=findpost&p=2447261
http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=91902&view=findpost&p=2447262
More links, it just goes on and on for a few pages.


You were saying?

[Storme]

lol I love how this thread started with "GOONS are hypocrites" and now we're arguing the definitions of influence vs. relevance and whether this thread even exists.

[TehChron]

[quote name='Storme' timestamp='1284090859' post='2448490']
lol I love how this thread started with "GOONS are hypocrites" and now we're arguing the definitions of influence vs. relevance and whether this thread even exists.
[/quote]
I'll tell you what:

The reason why we're no longer arguing that, is because it's become pointless to argue something that is obvious. GOONS are hypocrites, it's simply a fact.

And no one's arguing the definitions of anything, our good friend Voytek just doesn't know any better. If there's any kind of debate of the latter subject, then this is the first I've heard of it.

I, for one, am glad we were able to have this discussion.

[JT Jag]

Using my logical fallacies and jumping to the end of the argument inconsiderate of any of the details that make the incidents unique, I too have reached a conclusion and there's no point in debating it:

[TehChron]

[quote name='JT Jag' timestamp='1284092204' post='2448519']
Using my logical fallacies and jumping to the end of the argument inconsiderate of any of the details that make the incidents unique, I too have reached a conclusion and there's no point in debating it:
[/quote]
I feel bad for you and wish you weren't so closed minded as to deny the "facts" laid out in front of you. But everyone's free to be wrong, far be it from me to deny you that right of yours.

Oh well, perhaps next time you'll be willing to accept new possibilities and interpretations which can challenge and thereby enrich your world view, like Schatt has attempted to do here. I look forward to when you finally see the light, and can join me in enlightenment.

Edited September 10, 2010 by Chron

[JT Jag]

That's not going to work, friend. You and yours are the close-minded ones. You've come to the conclusion that aid sent or similar actions taken during wartime are to be taken at the same exact value, regardless of the context of the events. You think that if just because we asked for 90 million reparations for 3M (actually 4.5) worth of aid sent to a nuclear rogue by a member in good standing of an alliance who was caught for doing the same exact thing merely weeks earlier, who repeatedly lied about the incident, should be accepted at the same value as a newbie completing half a tech deal (1.5M) worth of aid to a nuclear rogue, and not knowing any better, when the situation was quickly resolved when it came to light.

Your moralism blinds you, and that saddens me, because you are clearly a bright person.

Edited September 10, 2010 by JT Jag

[TehChron]

[quote name='JT Jag' timestamp='1284092850' post='2448539']
That's not going to work, friend. You and yours are the close-minded ones. You've come to the conclusion that aid sent or similar actions taken during wartime are to be taken at the same exact value, regardless of the context of the events. You think that if just because we asked for 90 million reparations for 3M (actually 4.5) worth of aid sent to a nuclear rogue by a member in good standing of an alliance that was caught for doing the same exact thing merely weeks earlier should be accepted at the same value as a newbie completing half a tech deal (1.5M) worth of aid to a nuclear rogue, and not knowing any better as in the case of Corinan and the NSO.
[/quote] Thats a pretty hefty sentence.

Anyway, the point was you were using the punitive amount to ensure we didn't fall into a bad habit, which we were clearly forming (per your alliances own words). If the matter is a case of using overly large amounts of reparations to indicate a turning away from a bad habit, then quite clearly the hypocrisy exists, regardless of the amount of damage done or aid sent.

I mean, newbies raiding nations they simply shouldn't is a pretty bad habit for your alliance. I think you need to make a large donation to indicate your remorse to the potentially aggrieved parties. But if you think that only others need to, then that's your own right to think so, even if it is a blatant contradiction (or, to be blunt, an act of hypocrisy).
[quote]Your moralism blinds you, and that saddens me, because you are clearly a bright person.
[/quote]Moralism? Me? Oh my.

I clearly need to pay attention to the morals which I'm clearly arguing even though I have not yet done so at any point ever. I mean, I've even gone out of my way to say that being a hypocrite isn't a crime. Dang-blasted morality.

Hypocrisy simply [i]is[/i], what it [i]is[/i].

Edited September 10, 2010 by Chron