Crimson Guard Edict #5: Ultimatum to Internet Superheroes

[Dochartaigh]

I'm trying so hard to figure out if you're doing this while laughing or sincere tears running down your face.

i am sooooo crying at the moment and am soooo about to post a video with me crying out "Leave CG alone!!!!".

[Sulmar]

Hold your horses, before we argue what is war and what isn't, were any attacks made besides GAs? If so, IS you just declared war whether you like it or not. If not, you just raided an established alliance, and you better pay up.

That would be a yes.

[LordAkanata]

More like profit. That's what a raid is.

Dude, as much as you and Emperor Marx want to believe otherwise, I know what a raid is. This isn't a tech raid, a land raid, whatever. How many times do we have to go over this point? Tech raids don't use CM's, use air attacks, launch naval blockades, and certainly do not spy nukes away.

If you'd like to just blow other people's pixels up, expect yours to burn in return.

Edited August 21, 2009 by LordAkanata

[Portugal]

Hm, the word of the day is: Tech Raid.

T-E-C-H-R-A-I-D

Ta-Ech

Tech

Ra-Aid

Raid

Tech Raid.

You realize, most alliances have it to where their government has to Okay tech raids. Without any treaties, you had no deterrant against that. If you had a couple of things would have happened:

1. If you had been tech raided at all, it wouldn't have been on a large scale

2. You would get reparations

Well guess what, you didn't have any treaties so you did get raided on a large scale and you won't be getting reparations. Now if Internet Superheroes decides to be nice and actually consider it, that's their thing. But you can't force them to. You're not in the position for that. You should have just taken the peace and licked your wounds and we all could be onto better things.

Oh I see it now. You're all trying so hard to call it a tech raid so in case CG gets any allies they somehow are in the "wrong". Well, regardless of how hard you try to change the name of it, pretty much everyone here sees it as naked aggression, so continuing the charade won't help IS. (assuming anyone helps CG, that is. What the hell do I know).

[Groucho Marx]

Hold your horses, before we argue what is war and what isn't, were any attacks made besides GAs? If so, IS you just declared war whether you like it or not. If not, you just raided an established alliance, and you better pay up.

Like I've said numerous times already, your standards for raiding are your own.

Edited August 21, 2009 by Emperor Marx

[Neo Uruk]

Dude, as much as you and Emperor Marx want to believe otherwise, I know what a raid is. This isn't a tech raid, a land raid, whatever. How many times do we have to go over this point? Tech raids don't use CM's, use air attacks, launch naval blockades, and certainly do not spy nukes away.

If you'd like to just blow other people's pixels up, expect yours to burn in return.

I'd just like to reiterate that IS sets its own raiding policy.

[Groucho Marx]

Dude, as much as you and Emperor Marx want to believe otherwise, I know what a raid is. This isn't a tech raid, a land raid, whatever. How many times do we have to go over this point? Tech raids don't use CM's, use air attacks, launch naval blockades, and certainly do not spy nukes away.

If you'd like to just blow other people's pixels up, expect yours to burn in return.

Oh I see it now. You're all trying so hard to call it a tech raid so in case CG gets any allies they somehow are in the "wrong". Well, regardless of how hard you try to change the name of it, pretty much everyone here sees it as naked aggression, so continuing the charade won't help IS. (assuming anyone helps CG, that is. What the hell do I know).

Ugh, why can't you get this concept;

Like I've said numerous times already, your standards for raiding are your own.

Edited August 21, 2009 by Emperor Marx

[Jipps]

Has anyone from IS actually said the reason for war? I see tech raid being tossed around a lot, but it doesn't appear to be true.

My ears are open.

[Thorgrum]

Pretty sure their raiding rules define what raiding is for them and what isn't.

Okay. IS raided CG, which is a form of war with set boundaries on what the attacker can and can not do. CG's lack of treaties allowed IS to do this.

Do their raiding rules have any provisions about bawing if someone fights back? Sucks when a raid target dosent just accept the peace and or isnt on the way to deletion. Sometimes they fight back with whatever means they have (kudos to CG for fighting back with alternative means and coming to the OWF, they might end up on the plus side of tech because of that action). So okay its a tech raid, now IS gets to deal with the consequences of it.

Just like CG gets to deal with thier realities of lacking paper treaties. Reads like one big mess, entertaining as hell though, thanks for that.

[Neo Uruk]

Do their raiding rules have any provisions about bawing if someone fights back? Sucks when a raid target dosent just accept the peace and or isnt on the way to deletion. Sometimes they fight back with whatever means they have (kudos to CG for fighting back with alternative means and coming to the OWF, they might end up on the plus side of tech because of that action). So okay its a tech raid, now IS gets to deal with the consequences of it.

Just like CG gets to deal with thier realities of lacking paper treaties. Reads like one big mess, entertaining as hell though, thanks for that.

IS never said they wouldn't accept consequences as far as I know.

[Fort Pitt]

Like I've said numerous times already, your standards for raiding are your own.

Well anyone who isn't a complete and utter idiot knows that CM's, and bombers are not part of raiding, and being that Pink has a large tech raiding influence, I'm gunna guess that you know what your doing.

[Emperor Brutus]

Has anyone from IS actually said the reason for war? I see tech raid being tossed around a lot, but it doesn't appear to be true.

My ears are open.

Its a tech raid, make no more of it.

[Hell Scream]

Our lack of treaties does not mean a lack of friendships. Fran's "empty" thread of CG and friends retaliating is not an empty threat at all, and those friends are more than just 1 alliance.

Xander declared war, he wanted us to bend down to feel superior. Guess what, we will not bend down. Time to die.

[Newhotness]

You'd better believe it. I read all 26 pages and still have no idea what IS's CB was for this war, so what choice does the world have but to conclude naked aggression was the reason?

Then i guess RAD gets to have more fun

[Neo Uruk]

Well anyone who isn't a complete and utter idiot knows that CM's, and bombers are not part of raiding, and being that Pink has a large tech raiding influence, I'm gunna guess that you know what your doing.

So, anyone who sets rules different from your standards are idiots? Nice to know that world police do exist and work.

[Druss the Legend]

The Fact that everyone is arguing about the same exact things we were arguing about when I left the thread makes me a pretty happy person.

GC, Your tears are delicious etc.

FAKE EDITTTTT (GRAMMAR)

Edited August 21, 2009 by Druss the Legend

[Gauner]

Well anyone who isn't a complete and utter idiot knows that CM's, and bombers are not part of raiding, and being that Pink has a large tech raiding influence, I'm gunna guess that you know what your doing.

I use CMs and Bombers when i raid, am i not raiding then? please tell me what im doing because im clueless and utterly stupid

[Thorgrum]

IS never said they wouldn't accept consequences as far as I know.

Cool, do you know the answer to my other question regarding their tech raiding rules? Im not a raider myself but most of the raiding policies I have read go along the lines of "if your target fights back you deal with the mess".

I dont know myself, if they do then I dont see what the problem is at all. They tech raid, it goes bad the get attacked back. Balls in CG court in my view the issued the ultumatum and it looks like it has been refused so do they fight back (call in friends) or accept the peace and the raid? We are at 26 pages, lets move this to the next logical step in the tech raid scenario.

[2burnt2eat]

I use CMs and Bombers when i raid, am i not raiding then? please tell me what im doing because im clueless and utterly stupid

You need nukes too.

Edited August 21, 2009 by 2burnt2eat

[Hell Scream]

The Fact that everyone is arguing about the same exact things we were arguing about when I left the thread makes me a pretty happy person.

GC, Your tears are delicious etc.

FAKE EDITTTTT (GRAMMAR)

Tears? You underestimate us.

[zigbigadorlou]

And now, some of my favorite posts from this thread:

WhyDoYouContradictIS?

IS said it's not a raid, already(After initially claiming it is. o/ Honor)

The claims are now the war was started because of me. I have proven the claims obsolete.

Did I spy at IS? Declare war? I spoke my mind freely. I got a war. o/

haha. wrong.

Why can't you stop making up lies and stick to one story? Just please do that. And honor, that too, get some.

um, who are you listening to? and honor? really?

Here, Sakura confirms that it was a tech raid. Now, are you(everyone saying it's for my hate for pink)saying that Sakura is a liar?

Nice, calling your own members liars is very classy IS. I hope enjoy having any lack of honor and decency to say the truth. You attacked because you can attack, because you find it funny. And then you lied. Then you lid again. STICK TO ONE STORY.

Honor again? sounds like a bloody broken record.

There is this "declare war" button that is required to Declare War. When you press it, you Declare War. Is that so hard to understand? Plus, IS says it's revenge, why can you claim something that contradicts IS's claims?

You would be a marvelous muckraking politician if it weren't for the fact that we can go back a couple pages and see the truth. The truth that a total of TWO people from IS have actually posted in here, neither of which spouting "REVENGE" and twisting sakura's words to say something completely different.

Lets set it straight: They were looking for someone to raid, you are big posters with a vendetta against pink and lots of tech and no protector. Who should we raid then??? gee, I wonder...

And then you sideswipe us with this:

[OOC]Showing any emotion over a game other than entertainment beats the point of playing a game, no?[OOC]

What

the

leet

is

going

on?

you just said the basic tenant of lulizm. fail. fail. fail.

Spying nukes away is never done to turn a profit.

oh really? you don't spy away nukes so that you can't get hit by them? what good is a raid if you lose all of the tech with the click of a big red button?

They will be held accountable.

POSTURING FOR THE WING

[Gauner]

You need nukes too.

OHHHH so thats what im missing, because you know i search up for unaligned nations in my range...i find weak ones with alot of tech...i declare war....i ground attack.....i use bombers...i use cms......but at some point it just stops becoming a raid and its always really bugged me why. Thanks for clearing that up, ill be sure to use nukes in the future

[Inquisitor Tolkien]

It's a raid. Stop crying.

Ah, semantics. How I love thee. A Tech Raid, or (OMG BRACE YOURSELF) a raid, is for accumulating tech or even land. What you call it is irrelevant, the methods you may or may not use in a (tech) raid, are irrelevant. You can't impose your standards upon others just because you don't agree with how they're doing things.

I've been pretty consistent though. You also might want to note that Rey isn't a Government member of RAD. He's allowed to voice his opinions all he wants, however only I and the rest of the Government can say we are speaking for RAD as a whole.

Are we still arguing about the whole tech raid thing? This is bordering beyond ridiculous. Just because you want to think of it as a tech raid, doesn't mean the alliance being attacked should view it as one. Indeed, if you are going to use naval blockades, spies, cruise missiles, and aircraft, any reasonable alliance would look upon it as a declaration of war, without the declaration. Just calling it a tech raid does not somehow deprive the alliance being "raided" of the ability to defend themselves. What you are doing is simply trying to justify what can quite frankly be said as an aggressive war without casus belli with a flimsy excuse. Oh, it's not a war, it's a tech raid. Is not a tech raid a form of limited war for gain? And if said raid did not attempt to minimize the damage done to the target being attacked, then does not actually fit the definition of a limited war, and such should not be even given the pretext of it. This is all semantics, mind you, but nevertheless, since the lot of you seem to be doing nothing but arguing semantics, why not?

Finally, what does it matter if it is? Tech raiding an entire alliance has been done before, and it is nothing more then an aggressive war without the declaration. You cannot hide behind the ridiculous excuse of "oh, it's a tech raid", if that alliance's friends comes in and helps out, as it isn't a reason to declare war whatsoever.

Hm, the word of the day is: Tech Raid.

T-E-C-H-R-A-I-D

Ta-Ech

Tech

Ra-Aid

Raid

Tech Raid.

You realize, most alliances have it to where their government has to Okay tech raids. Without any treaties, you had no deterrant against that. If you had a couple of things would have happened:

1. If you had been tech raided at all, it wouldn't have been on a large scale

2. You would get reparations

Well guess what, you didn't have any treaties so you did get raided on a large scale and you won't be getting reparations. Now if Internet Superheroes decides to be nice and actually consider it, that's their thing. But you can't force them to. You're not in the position for that. You should have just taken the peace and licked your wounds and we all could be onto better things.

Pretty sure their raiding rules define what raiding is for them and what isn't.

Okay. IS raided CG, which is a form of war with set boundaries on what the attacker can and can not do. CG's lack of treaties allowed IS to do this.

[OOC] Pretty much. You should never take this game seriously, with all the things that go on.[/OOC]

I see both of you are basically saying that you are able to do this because CG had no treaties and thus was an easy target. I'm not going to spin it any more. I hate might makes right, but c'est la vive.

Also, are we STILL arguing this? Does my post not exist? Quoting myself seems in poor taste, but I think it bears repeating.

They attacked an alliance en masse and, as has be confirmed throughout this, quite frankly, stupid thread, was not meant as a tech raid, moreso as a war because of a joke topic made by Hellscream.

If it were a tech raid, they would not have used spies, cruise missiles, aircraft, or naval blockades. If an alliance were subjected to such attacks, it is, quite frankly, a declaration of war. If you are going to make a declaration of war, at least post one, or at least have a valid reason for doing so. This whole affair is nothing more then blatant aggression on IS's part, and quite frankly, they deserve every bit of peanut gallery heckling they are getting right now.

This ludicrous suggestion that "tech raiding rules" are subjective and thus what IS is doing is still a tech raid is, quite frankly, bull!@#%. If every alliance is allowed to decide what a tech raid is, then I say Greenland Republic is perfectly within rights to tech raid another alliance in an organized fashion, say IAA (Chim must burn!), and use all military options available, be they spies, naval blockades, cruise missiles, aircraft, and nukes, for a couple weeks; well, that's what a tech raid is in Greenland Republic. This of course barring the fact that Greenland Republic does not tolerate tech raiding, but I digress. This argument is rather fallacious as if taken seriously, every single war can be considered a "tech raid", if the aggressor alliance chooses to name it that way. Bad, horrible, mutilated logic must be put down.

[LordAkanata]

I'd just like to reiterate that IS sets its own raiding policy.

When people have only your word to go on that something is a tech raid, despite the facts, there's something clearly wrong. We know the community doesn't support naked aggression from the example of the Karma War, and that's what this looks like, despite what you say.

Sure, let IS have its policy. But IS will have to pay for it in the end. If people are ready to declare war on you at any moment because of your policy, then you should consider changing said policy.

Edited August 21, 2009 by LordAkanata

[Fort Pitt]

Just a quick post, taken from IS's boards:

IV. Tech Raid Policy

a. To maintain the rights of individual nation tech raiding will be permitted under strict guidelines.

i. A target will not be a member of an alliance. An alliance is considered an AA that has 15+ members and/or has a valid protection treaty.

ii. As we are a member of the pink team we feel its counter to our goals to attack nations on the pink team. This will be strictly enforced.

iii. Tech raids will be limited to 2 ground attacks then peace sent. If the nation refuses peace or retaliates then you may attack again and then send peace. This may continue until the war has expired.

iv. You raid at your own risk and should you be overtaken by your target you may request diplomatic and monetary assistance from the alliance, we are within our right to refuse this aid. It will be determined on a case by case basis. Under no circumstance will military assistance be provided.

See the underlined, as I had asked above, anything more than 2 GA's is an attack, not a raid. IS's raiding guidelines confirm that they also believe this.

http://is.ipbfree.com/index.php?showtopic=8 (you don't need to be masked to see it)