The Treaty of Zurich II

[Sargun II]

[quote name='Zoot Zoot' timestamp='1303435974' post='2696084']
The Commonwealth is curious as to why the UK launched a series of long range missiles into the mid Atlantic? Given the tensions in the region was it the wisest course of action?

I won't lie when I say until the trajectories were worked out in the first few minutes of launch, we were on the verge of responding with our own missiles.
[/quote]

"None of your business. We will not alter any plans made with other nations, classified or otherwise, because of tensions the Commonwealth made up to keep us on our guard.

"The United Kingdom officially votes yes on the expulsion of the Commonwealth."

Edited April 22, 2011 by Sargun

[Zoot Zoot]

So instead of exercising caution and firing long range missiles away from the theatre, you fire them right past/over England and into a storm?

It's almost like your trying to start a war sir.

Edited April 22, 2011 by Zoot Zoot

[Sargun II]

[quote name='Zoot Zoot' timestamp='1303436720' post='2696107']
So instead of exercising caution and firing long range missiles away from the theatre, you fire them right past/over England and into a storm?

It's almost like your trying to start a war sir.
[/quote]

"Given that they were never fired anywhere near English land or possessions, not only are you factually incorrect but your attempts - unprovoked - at slander are duly noted."

[Zoot Zoot]

You fired missiles Into the mid Atlantic from Scotland, it's close enough to England to cause concern. It's flightpath took it, again, close enough to cause concern.

OOC
You didn't say where in the UK they were fired from so I'm going to assume Scotland.

[Sargun II]

[quote name='Zoot Zoot' timestamp='1303437167' post='2696114']
You fired missiles Into the mid Atlantic from Scotland, it's close enough to England to cause concern. It's flightpath took it, again, close enough to cause concern.

OOC
You didn't say where in the UK they were fired from so I'm going to assume Scotland.
[/quote]

"So what you're saying is that they were fired [b]not at England[/b] and [b]away from England[/b], and you fully agree with me. Thank you for confirming."

[Zoot Zoot]

We never once said they were fired AT England, we said they were fired close enough to cause concern and until their trajectories were established by SKYNET, we were ready to respond with our own missiles is what I'm saying.

A ground force is easy to track and observe, if a missile is launched it could either go somewhere else, or at an English target. By the time this is established, it could be too late if said missile has a nuclear payload.

I am sure if England did what you have done, you would be screaming blue murder, if not declaring war against us.

[Sargun II]

[quote name='Zoot Zoot' timestamp='1303437890' post='2696125']
We never once said they were fired AT England, we said they were fired close enough to cause concern and until their trajectories were established by SKYNET, we were ready to respond with our own missiles is what I'm saying.

A ground force is easy to track and observe, if a missile is launched it could either go somewhere else, or at an English target. By the time this is established, it could be too late if said missile has a nuclear payload.

I am sure if England did what you have done, you would be screaming blue murder, if not declaring war against us.
[/quote]
"Given that we are geographical neighbours, we would not find anything amiss in a missile launch that is not in our direction or fired at an ally. We [b]are[/b] allies, after all."

[Kaiser Martens]

"If UK's concern regarding the troops being positioned by the border had been legitimate, then this would too be. It might be paranoia, but this certainly adds fuel to the fire.""

[Zoot Zoot]

The UK, unlike England, has thousands of miles of open lad and the luxury of being able to fire missiles away from it's neighbours, your northern coastline for example and firing them north or north west.

I speak locally of England and Scotland of course, we do have other overseas territories for such launches.

[Sargun II]

[quote name='Kaiser Martens' timestamp='1303438049' post='2696128']
"If UK's concern regarding the troops being positioned by the border had been legitimate, then this would too be. It might be paranoia, but this certainly adds fuel to the fire.""
[/quote]

"However, troops positions and missiles launches are entirely different. The threat of a missile launch is only during the immediate phase of launching - and seeing as the missiles have been launched and it was never a threat to England, whereas those troops [b]are still there[/b], the comparison is completely wrong."

[Yawoo]

"Regardless of the missile launch, the voting continues and is now as follows:

Expulsion of England:

Germany: Abstain
England: No
UK: Yes

We now await the Austrians. "

[Kaiser Martens]

"Given the missile being launched, we cannot abstain any longer and will vote against the expulsion."

"Though either way at this point we are rather close to leaving Zürich altogether, UK and England are apparently unable to come to any compromise whatsoever, and this is dissapointing."

[Zoot Zoot]

It seems your motion is defeated Sir. Perhaps it would be best, as I suggested earlier, if the UK leaves Zurich.

We won't drop as low as demanding your expulsion. You joined willingly, you can leave willingly.

[Kaiser Martens]

"Well, I do suppose that such a thing is [i]not[/i] what I meant for a compromise..."

[Sargun II]

[quote name='Kaiser Martens' timestamp='1303439986' post='2696154']
"Given the missile being launched, we cannot abstain any longer and will vote against the expulsion."

"Though either way at this point we are rather close to leaving Zürich altogether, UK and England are apparently unable to come to any compromise whatsoever, and this is dissapointing."
[/quote]
"Please explain why an act that had nothing to do with England and was done with the private consent of another nation that has nothing to do with Europe matters in this vote."

[Kaiser Martens]

"Because your act is the Rocketry Equivalent to what England's Army is doing. Therefore, both are now at fault, as opposed to England being only at fault which had been the previous case."

[Sargun II]

[quote name='Kaiser Martens' timestamp='1303440448' post='2696161']
"Because your act is the Rocketry Equivalent to what England's Army is doing. Therefore, both are now at fault, as opposed to England being only at fault which had been the previous case."
[/quote]

"Is everyone from your nation mentally retarded? Please explain how shooting missiles [b]away[/b] from Europe is the same as stacking troops on a neighbours border and then threatening to not support them in a war."

[Kaiser Martens]

"Retarded? I would indeed think that if that is what best the UK can do for diplomacy, then I am dissapointed. Not that the English are doing at all much better. I would strongly suggest that you take that back and get your act together. We asked UK to do a single thing, that is, to state and promise here and now that if anti-europeans were to rule over Pravus Ingruo you would cease to support that land. If that were to happen, I would talk to the king himself to have the English Border Troops removed. Give some, take some. So what [i]will[/i] it be?"

[Sargun II]

[quote name='Kaiser Martens' timestamp='1303441076' post='2696166']
"Retarded? I would indeed think that if that is what best the UK can do for diplomacy, then I am dissapointed. Not that the English are doing at all much better. I would strongly suggest that you take that back and get your act together. We asked UK to do a single thing, that is, to state and promise here and now that if anti-europeans were to rule over Pravus Ingruo you would cease to support that land. If that were to happen, I would talk to the king himself to have the English Border Troops removed. Give some, take some. So what [i]will[/i] it be?"
[/quote]

"Diplomacy be damned - you just equated a non-hostile missile launch with the continued presence of troops, armour, and air forces mixed with threats and then completely ignored a call for how they're alike. The United Kingdom will do absolutely nothing until England removes its border troops. Remember: England escalated this, we responded with nothing but diplomacy."

[Sarah Tintagyl]

"To be honest, Austria's government has been watching this spectacle for quite some time and in all truth we have no clue who really to agree with nor do we feel that whatever the outcome of this election is that the problems of this pact will go away. First motions are passed to remove the United Kingdom from Zurich, now motions are passed to remove England from the pact. Clearly the two neighbors cannot get along and while we have friendships with both the English and United Kingdom, Austria does not feel that this pact benefits our friendships any longer. I have been authorized by Her Majesty to announce our cancellation of this pact. We would like to pursue individual friendships in the future, but as to this pact. Austria will withdraw.

Thank you all for you time."

[Zoot Zoot]

Our military on the border is none hostile. Those missiles fired could have been targeted at England, we know they wernt from their trajectory when they reached altitude, but on launch, it could of been a first strike.

You have orders, satellite images and even a number for Pegg to confirm the orders that they are defensive.

Deal with it. That is the situation, there is nothing you can do about it now without leaving Zurich or forcing England to stand down.

[Kaiser Martens]

"You do not respond with diplomacy, you respond with trolling. You HAVE no diplomats. Besides, what DO you expect me to do? Tell England to remove their troops from there? I'm not their dad and !@#$, and they're a sovereign nation. If they are making a choice which is arguably stupid, do not blame [i]us[/i] for [i]their[/i] actions. Yeah, they should remove the troops, it IS common sense, but, I'm not here to police any of you."

"But maybe that is the mistake. Let us try a new approach. England: Remove the troops, or we change our vote to favor the expulsion. UK: If when England's troops are removed you do agree to cancel your Pravus Ingruoan support if an Anti-European government seizes power, then we will, in fact, not leave Zürich and consider that there might be a slight chance of pulling this out from under the bridge. Yet if England were to comply and you were to show nothing positive in return, well, then we would be wasting our time. This is more akin to a bar brawl than diplomacy. Oh, and, you do still owe us an apology. Perhaps then we would indeed love to offer one of our own."

[Justinian the Mighty]

The Slavorussian delegates stand and walk out without uttering a word.

[Sargun II]

"Consider our involvement in Zurich ended."

[Zoot Zoot]

Smiling as the UK delegates left the room, Andrew turned to the German.

"I believe we should vote yes to giving Livonia and Torun full membership, unless of course we are to officially close down Zurich?"