Official Announcment from LOSS

[drugsup]

This isn't just about Pacifica. You betrayed five other alliances whose names aren't "Pacifica." You preach that Pacifica is the dirtiest, most evilest alliance out there yet look at what you did. Your hands aren't clean and people will remember that the next time they sign a treaty with you.

Since when was cancelling a treaty betrayal? You should look at Pacifica's history for attacking the very people that kept them from harm.

We are no direct threat to our former allies, we respect them very much. Our Princeps made a promise not to engage any of our former allies.

Edited April 24, 2009 by Drugsup

[Mjolnir]

Since when was cancelling a treaty betrayal? You should look at Pacifica's history for attacking the very people that kept them from harm.

We are no direct threat to our former allies, we respect them very much. Our Princeps made a promise not to engage any of our former allies.

Canceling a treaty = Typically nothing wrong

Canceling six treaties = o_O

Canceling six treaties right after your allies activate them = Sincerest Betrayal. I believe that's also a new record, right?

[Death666Angel]

Hai thar, Ross!

@ LoSS: I'm watching you -.-.

[Michael Locke]

Canceling a treaty = Typically nothing wrong

Canceling six treaties = o_O

Canceling six treaties right after your allies activate them = Sincerest Betrayal. I believe that's also a new record, right?

I wasn't aware they were activated... Maybe I'm in the wrong LOSS? Are you looking for the Legion of Smallest Superpowers?

[drugsup]

Canceling a treaty = Typically nothing wrong

Canceling six treaties = o_O

Canceling six treaties right after your allies activate them = Sincerest Betrayal. I believe that's also a new record, right?

What on earth makes you think they were activated? LOSS cancelled on the 17th. If they were activated even during the cancellation period (one of which was 5 days) LOSS would have been obliged to help. Get your facts straight.

[cleaverlch]

It seems to me that certain people here failed primary school maths.

[askani the rotund]

Canceling a treaty = Typically nothing wrong

Canceling six treaties = o_O

Canceling six treaties right after your allies activate them = Sincerest Betrayal. I believe that's also a new record, right?

I knew it was war for sure when LOSS backed out,It's like watching the dogs or chickens before an earthquake scramble around.

[itastenice]

Someone needs to get all their bases straight.

[deth2munkies]

This isn't just about Pacifica. You betrayed five other alliances whose names aren't "Pacifica." You preach that Pacifica is the dirtiest, most evilest alliance out there yet look at what you did. Your hands aren't clean and people will remember that the next time they sign a treaty with you.

Of course they aren't, but the treaty announcement was antibacterial soap and this is furious scrubbing.

The treaties canceled were treaties of convenience and not much else and never truly reflected LoSS's stance nor who they cared about, this is their true colors coming out and my only regret was that I wasn't a part of this finally happening.

[Bob]

Canceling a treaty = Typically nothing wrong

Canceling six treaties = o_O

Canceling six treaties right after your allies activate them = Sincerest Betrayal. I believe that's also a new record, right?

You were quite clearly at war and able to activate treaties when they canceled. Oh wait..you aren't.

I knew it was war for sure when LOSS backed out,It's like watching the dogs or chickens before an earthquake scramble around.

Thanks for reinforcing the idea that NPO uses its allies. You never really liked LoSS did you?

[askani the rotund]

You guys are right, you backed out before the war.

[deth2munkies]

You guys are right, you backed out before the war.

They backed out of a treaty that your alliance pressured them into and violated on at least one occasion.

[RossGarner]

Of course they aren't, but the treaty announcement was antibacterial soap and this is furious scrubbing.

The treaties canceled were treaties of convenience and not much else and never truly reflected LoSS's stance nor who they cared about, this is their true colors coming out and my only regret was that I wasn't a part of this finally happening.

Its funny how openly this can be admitted. LoSS will sign treaties just for the political benefit and skip out on them if they become difficult, all nice and succinct.

[Michael Locke]

Meh, D2M leave them be.

You were there when we signed with NPO, so was I.

It was clear to me we had only one choice without getting LOSS killed.

[askani the rotund]

You were quite clearly at war and able to activate treaties when they canceled. Oh wait..you aren't.

Thanks for reinforcing the idea that NPO uses its allies. You never really liked LoSS did you?

First of all I don't speak for the NPO, Personally no I don't like them.It's not they haven't done this before. As for using them,I just personally think people should live up to their commitments.

[deth2munkies]

Meh, D2M leave them be.

You were there when we signed with NPO, so was I.

It was clear to me we had only one choice without getting LOSS killed.

Actually, I really don't want to leave it alone. It feels really good to be proud of my old alliance for once, and I like it. And @RossGarner: When Echelon is put into the position that post-terms LoSS was, you tell me what you would sign to get your alliance back on solid ground.

[Michael Locke]

Deth, you knew the reason we didn't go to war when you left. Welcome to the completion of that reasoning.

[Vitiation]

Deth, you knew the reason we didn't go to war when you left. Welcome to the completion of that reasoning.

Lets keep CE out of this; even if all you have to say is ume 4 lyfe.

Edited April 24, 2009 by Vitiation

[deth2munkies]

Deth, you knew the reason we didn't go to war when you left. Welcome to the completion of that reasoning.

I admit, I lol'd. It was still a huge mistake, though.

Lets keep CE out of this; even if all you have to say is ume 4 lyfe.

OOC: Wrong game buddy.

[RossGarner]

Meh, D2M leave them be.

You were there when we signed with NPO, so was I.

It was clear to me we had only one choice without getting LOSS killed.

Many other alliances survived those wars without having to "sign a treaty." You can use the NPO as an excuse here, but Slayer from TPF, leaders from the NpO, and others in several alliances spent a great deal of time trying to make sure you didn't have to spend all of your existence on the Pink team, in neutrality.

D2M: Nothing. I'm not a government member of Echelon any longer, and I wouldn't sign on with whatever new power structure emerges from this war, just to do so. We would probably end up relying on the few friends we have left on the other side of the war for assistance rebuilding and placing ourselves on the map again.

[ErrantVenture]

o/ LOSS

[Bob]

Excuse me, but you're either ignorant of the history between LoSS and Echelon or just plainly trolling. As a former member of Echelon's diplomatic staff that spent months in negotiations with the NPO to help get LoSS out of their old neutrality, repaying us by canceling our treaties when we need them most, and then declaring on our allies who are legitimately defending us is not honorable in the slightest.

How is it not honorable in the slightest? They are honoring their treaties as well. And thanks for the insult, it totally supported your argument and made you seem tough

I didn't know Echelon spent months in negotiations, perhaps you should be better at them and then you could do it much faster. It also leads me to wonder why LoSS's treaty with you was not signed until after GR canceled on them, as well as why I never heard a thing about LoSS being assisted by Echelon in getting off neutrality, when I did hear that TBB and TPF had assisted them. Funny how that works.

They canceled the treaties before anything went to war, and who started the war? Pacifica! Oh, I forgot, they only suspended them as well :/ But, how could they have possibly known this would be when you would need them the most when your allies were the ones gearing up for war? If you had been attacked and they had advance notice of it, I would understand. However, they only knew TPF would be engaging someone and might need their help from what I have been told, and so how on earth would that lead them to believe NPO/Echelon would be the underdogs in this war, and it would not be just another curbstomp?

Glad the restructuring went well.

When they are people like you, I don't think that its bailing. Its more "realizing that your allies are incompetent and/or manipulative" and will just use you.

I especially love the bold part. That reminds me of someone.

One entry found.

Main Entry:

ma·nip·u·late Listen to the pronunciation of manipulate

Pronunciation:

\mə-ˈni-pyə-ˌlāt\

Function:

transitive verb

a: to manage or utilize skillfully b: to control or play upon by artful, unfair, or insidious means especially to one's own advantage

Pulling out the dictionary huh? I'm sorry that you were fairweather friends. Even those of us from GR who they betrayed even more deeply got over it and were still friends with them (OOC of course). Try being betrayed while you are at war, and they cut and run away from you. This is their way of making up for that and other actions in my opinion, and that makes sense. GR and LoSS were better friends than any of you have been with LoSS, knowing LoSS as well as I do and have for the last three years, and to switch sides back to the side of those they betrayed, which also includes Polaris, is a reformation of policy. The ties existed, the treaties didn't.

So you used your allies' (plural) protections at a time that you needed them the most, for, I don't even know how many months now, and 2 days before the war, you "restructure" and pick the side you want to be on. Let me know if these names ring a bell: TPF, MCXA, Zenith, Valhalla, Echelon and NPO. It's the alliances you befriend and gave your trust to, and then turned your back on, choose to ignore and dishonor your agreements with. Lots of karma there, huh?

Who was going to attack LoSS? I don't think since CIS and them got into it over Ravyns that they have had a threat against them, and during that time, I'm sorry, but MCXA, Zenith, Valhalla, and Echelon weren't treatied to them, GR, TPF, NPO, and NpO were. Now, I seem to remember tellling them that we were with them all the way, but maybe that is just my mistake. The one time they needed protection, they didn't get it from you, they got it from others.

I note yet again the treaties were only suspended.

Well, congrats on the "restructuring."

Restructuring - a euphemism for getting rid of inconvenient relationships

Oh fake definitions in the dictionary? How cute, you shouldn't have.

restructure - construct or form anew or provide with a new structure; "After his accident, he had to restructure his life"; "The governing board was ..."

[Bob]

First of all I don't speak for the NPO, Personally no I don't like them.It's not they haven't done this before. As for using them,I just personally think people should live up to their commitments.

But if the NPO membership doesn't like LoSS, why should they continue to have a relationship with you? If you don't like them, why would they possibly want to be treatied to you?

Many other alliances survived those wars without having to "sign a treaty." You can use the NPO as an excuse here, but Slayer from TPF, leaders from the NpO, and others in several alliances spent a great deal of time trying to make sure you didn't have to spend all of your existence on the Pink team, in neutrality.

yes, Legion, GATO..oh wait.

Also GWIII? Who survived that to this day without having to sign a treaty?

None of them. NPO would not let them.

[Mjolnir]

What on earth makes you think they were activated? LOSS cancelled on the 17th. If they were activated even during the cancellation period (one of which was 5 days) LOSS would have been obliged to help. Get your facts straight.

Perfect. Right around the time that we told all of our close MDP partners we were going to enact our MDPs. That was told to you on the 19th, well within the 72-hour period. Oh wait, didn't you get the memo from Jaaku? Here's a part of the convo I had with him not too long ago:

[19:27] <AllYourBase> you know we need you more then ever

[19:28] <jawayku> but as for the rest of it. I'm not part of that, and want no part of it

[19:28] <jawayku> yeah

[19:28] <jawayku> AYB, I'm not princeps

[19:28] <AllYourBase> ugh

[19:28] <AllYourBase> anymore you mean

[19:28] <jawayku> I still hold influence, but $%&@

What is that, the second lie within a 72 hour period? But it's okay, because after all, you wish the best to all your former MDP partners (from your other topic):

"Let it be known, that we still consider these fine alliances friends. Our internal restructuring was needing a clear vision. As long as I remain Princeps, LOSS will do no harm to any of these alliances" - Jaaku ........and then you attack their friends. Great.

[Michael Locke]

When you get an offer of "We'll let you be free, but for your own protection want to offer you an MDP"...

I'm sure it was the best of intentions.

"Let it be known, that we still consider these fine alliances friends. Our internal restructuring was needing a clear vision. As long as I remain Princeps, LOSS will do no harm to any of these alliances" - Jaaku ........and then you attack their friends. Great.

We have not, and will not attack any of our past allies. Of course, if we follow that logic, perhaps the war should end, since everyone is more or less tied to everyone else through friends?

Edited April 24, 2009 by Michael Locke