MostGloriousLeader Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 The thing is you need the permission of the people who control a protectorate to roll there and therefore it is more or less standard for people to ask for it ooc to clear up any hassles. Owned-you did ask first and I'm inclined to support him. At first I honestly thought that your post was his DOE until I payed better attention to the names. There is also the fact that your in game soi is barely able to encompass New York City let alone the whole state. I'm not trying to put you down or prevent you from getting a start here but this is just how I see this situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Kingswell Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 (edited) [quote name='supercheese' timestamp='1341550065' post='3004523'] Thing is you need Greenlands permission to RP there at all, as it is technically his land. You don't. Owned-You does. [/quote] Is the land he is claiming actually controlled/owned by Greenland or just protected? If it is the later then both of them can make IC claims if they wish. Remember protected land is still unclaimed white land open to [b]ANY[/b] one to claim. [quote name='MostGloriousLeader' timestamp='1341550251' post='3004525'] The thing is you need the permission of the people who control a protectorate to roll there and therefore it is more or less standard for people to ask for it ooc to clear up any hassles. Owned-you did ask first and I'm inclined to support him. At first I honestly thought that your post was his DOE until I payed better attention to the names. There is also the fact that your in game soi is barely able to encompass New York City let alone the whole state. I'm not trying to put you down or prevent you from getting a start here but this is just how I see this situation. [/quote] Wrong. Protectorates are not actual land belonging to the protector, it is still unclaimed white space just protected by another nation. If for some reason the land does belong to the protector then it needs to be shaded in the same colour as the nation protecting it as it is open unclaimed land. Edited July 6, 2012 by Kevin Kingswell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercheese Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='Kevin Kingswell' timestamp='1341550265' post='3004526'] Is the land he is claiming actually controlled/owned by Greenland or just protected? If it is the later then both of them can make IC claims if they wish. Remember protected land is still unclaimed white land open to [b]ANY[/b] one to claim. [/quote] I can't say only Ty/jed can. However it usually is not open to everyone, especially if it has already been given to someone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Kingswell Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='supercheese' timestamp='1341550362' post='3004529'] I can't say only Ty/jed can. However it usually is not open to everyone, especially if it has already been given to someone else. [/quote] As I said if it is just white protectorate land then anyone can claim it IC. After all the land doesn't belong to the protector it is just being protected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Enema Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 I like the size of this dude's balls. Westaxe, good luck, just keep in mind this can and will be more than likely be contested ICly, you don't seem to have a problem with that, which I find epic and full of win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercheese Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='Kevin Kingswell' timestamp='1341550477' post='3004536'] As I said if it is just white protectorate land then anyone can claim it IC. After all the land doesn't belong to the protector it is just being protected. [/quote] The land does belong to them.... its their choice to give it to whomever they wish. Its similar to something like Puerto Rico. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westaxe Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='supercheese' timestamp='1341550065' post='3004523'] Thing is you need Greenlands permission to RP there at all, as it is technically his land. You don't. Owned-You does. [/quote] If we're getting into technicalities, wouldn't I need permission from Greenland AND the American Commonwealth then, since it is listed as a joint protectorate? There has been no mention of Owned-You asking the owner of the American Commonwealth for permission to RP there as of yet. Further, this is an IC problem. Let it be dealt with IC-ly. If Greenland doesn't want me to RP there (seeing as how the American Commonwealth has already responded IC-ly that they have no problem with it pending Greenland's permission) then let them state their case and deal with the IC consequences. Forgive me for saying this, but this may be why there is an issue attracting new players to this community. When a new player arrives, they are beaten down by the OOC back room deals and alliances of people. It seems many of you prefer to play this game in an OOC manner rather than an IC manner with the backroom deals and preferential treatment to a player who, while he has been here a while, already has a nation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voodoo Nova Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 Welcome Westaxe. Or should I say welcome back? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercheese Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 The issue is that you are going for land that all the owners have said is going to another RPer. That makes it an OOC issues as you have no right to RP there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Kingswell Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='supercheese' timestamp='1341550550' post='3004544'] The land does belong to them.... its their choice to give it to whomever they wish. Its similar to something like Puerto Rico. [/quote] If it is the land I think then it is shown as white on the map meaning its open to ALL. If it is actual claimed territory fo Greenland then it is up to Greenland who can RP there. People need to remember than no matter what people say they are protecting if the land is not actually annexed into another nation then it is open to any claims. Though as they are protecting it any armed uprisings or other uprisings would and could face the forces of the protector. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voodoo Nova Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='supercheese' timestamp='1341550695' post='3004551'] The issue is that you are going for land that all the owners have said is going to another RPer. That makes it an OOC issues as you have no right to RP there. [/quote] Not at all. Depending on how a protectorate is set up, just because it has been said it goes to another player does not mean that is how it will happen IC. Claims can be contested and challenged. Owned has stated he wishes to do a RP with Westaxe over New York as well. I fail to see the issue. At Kevz: Protectorates are not unclaimed white land. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westaxe Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='MostGloriousLeader' timestamp='1341550251' post='3004525'] The thing is you need the permission of the people who control a protectorate to roll there and therefore it is more or less standard for people to ask for it ooc to clear up any hassles. Owned-you did ask first and I'm inclined to support him. At first I honestly thought that your post was his DOE until I payed better attention to the names. There is also the fact that your in game soi is barely able to encompass New York City let alone the whole state. I'm not trying to put you down or prevent you from getting a start here but this is just how I see this situation. [/quote] Claiming an area greater than your SOI is not allowed by the rules. However, I am not doing that. What I AM doing is asking for a piece of land greater than my SOI to be granted to me. This, from what I have read, is not at all against the rules. [quote name='Voodoo Nova' timestamp='1341550673' post='3004550'] Welcome Westaxe. Or should I say welcome back? [/quote] Thank you for your welcome. [quote name='supercheese' timestamp='1341550695' post='3004551'] The issue is that you are going for land that all the owners have said is going to another RPer. That makes it an OOC issues as you have no right to RP there. [/quote] Actually, since I posted in an IC forum, it makes it an IC issue. Let it be dealt with as such. Or are you simply afraid that someone is going to come in and upset your precious OOC status quo? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercheese Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 ah well if owned-you and westaxe are going to go into it together then thats fine. Most of not read something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercheese Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Westaxe' timestamp='1341550859' post='3004561'] Actually, since I posted in an IC forum, it makes it an IC issue. Let it be dealt with as such. Or are you simply afraid that someone is going to come in and upset your precious OOC status quo? [/quote] My OOC status quo? The hell you talking about? I'm telling you has it is. Edited July 6, 2012 by supercheese Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Kingswell Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='Voodoo Nova' timestamp='1341550785' post='3004559'] At Kevz: Protectorates are not unclaimed white land. [/quote] Then just what the hell are they? On the map all I see for protectorates is white land with text overlaid saying something like "Nation XXX protectorate" this to me shows that the land is unclaimed but protected either through force or diplomacy. Now if said land actually belongs to the protector it needs to be the same colour as the nation protecting it to avoid confusion of whether someone can establish a claim IC or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westaxe Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='supercheese' timestamp='1341550944' post='3004563'] My OOC status quo? The hell you talking about? [/quote] You are trying to quell an IC issue through OOC pressure and backroom deals. From what I've been reading these past few weeks, that is not uncommon in this community. I am choosing to deal with an issue in a pure IC manner, and it seems very much like you have a problem with that. And I am wondering why you have such a big problem with a new player who happens to do things slightly differently from the way you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westaxe Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='Tidy Bowl Man' timestamp='1341550496' post='3004539'] I like the size of this dude's balls. Westaxe, good luck, just keep in mind this can and will be more than likely be contested ICly, you don't seem to have a problem with that, which I find epic and full of win. [/quote] Sorry I missed this. Thank you for your welcome. If this is contested ICly, then we will see where it goes. Hopefully someplace interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercheese Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='Westaxe' timestamp='1341551060' post='3004568'] You are trying to quell an IC issue through OOC pressure and backroom deals. From what I've been reading these past few weeks, that is not uncommon in this community. I am choosing to deal with an issue in a pure IC manner, and it seems very much like you have a problem with that. And I am wondering why you have such a big problem with a new player who happens to do things slightly differently from the way you do. [/quote] The problem I had was that I thought you were going in and trying to take land promised to Owned-you. But because owned-you has choose to RP it out with you that is another story and I am fine with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voodoo Nova Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Kevin Kingswell' timestamp='1341550993' post='3004566'] Then just what the hell are they? On the map all I see for protectorates is white land with text overlaid saying something like "Nation XXX protectorate" this to me shows that the land is unclaimed but protected either through force or diplomacy. Now if said land actually belongs to the protector it needs to be the same colour as the nation protecting it to avoid confusion of whether someone can establish a claim IC or not. [/quote] People can establish whatever they want ICly in a protectorate, the land is still protected by the person and they can still choose to disallow the person from establishing a nation there ICly through force or diplomacy. The reason why it is white is to let people know that the person is simply protecting the land, and that it is not part of their nation. [quote name='supercheese' timestamp='1341551179' post='3004572'] The problem I had was that I thought you were going in and trying to take land promised to Owned-you. But because owned-you has choose to RP it out with you that is another story and I am fine with it. [/quote] Just because an OOC promise is made, doesn't mean a damn thing IC. Edited July 6, 2012 by Voodoo Nova Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westaxe Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='supercheese' timestamp='1341551179' post='3004572'] The problem I had was that I thought you were going in and trying to take land promised to Owned-you. But because owned-you has choose to RP it out with you that is another story and I am fine with it. [/quote] I posted a RP in an IC forum. I posted it on land where there was no RP ICly, no claim in the map thread, and was, for all intents and purposes, empty. And because of a backroom deal that I had no way of knowing about I am suddenly trying to "take" land from another player who [u]already has a nation[/u]? You have an extremely funny definition of "take". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Kingswell Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='Voodoo Nova' timestamp='1341551208' post='3004573'] People can establish whatever they want ICly in a protectorate, the land is still protected by the person and they can still choose to disallow the person from establishing a nation there ICly through force or diplomacy. The reason why it is white is to let people know that the person is simply protecting the land, and that it is not part of their nation. Just because an OOC promise is made, doesn't mean a damn thing IC. [/quote] Okay thanks for clearing that up, from the way some people were answering it seemed to be that IC claims in protectorates could be/would be ignored which was what I was arguing against. Its all been cleared though so all is good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Enema Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='Voodoo Nova' timestamp='1341551208' post='3004573'] Just because an OOC promise is made, doesn't mean a damn thing IC. [/quote] YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS, Assuredly, it is annoying to some but you have to admit at least the guy isn't crying like a hoe and running away to mommy leaving a trail of complaints over so called rule infractions. It all started IC and he's keeping it IC. Brilliant, the way it should be for the rest of us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supercheese Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='Westaxe' timestamp='1341551315' post='3004575'] I posted a RP in an IC forum. I posted it on land where there was no RP ICly, no claim in the map thread, and was, for all intents and purposes, empty. And because of a backroom deal that I had no way of knowing about I am suddenly trying to "take" land from another player who [u]already has a nation[/u]? You have an extremely funny definition of "take". [/quote] He does not already have a nation maybe? If you looked a little harder you would see he dropped that nation a few days ago. And it is a protectorate so unless given permission you are not allowed to RP in it. Stop making an issue of it. It has been resolved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Kingswell Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='Westaxe' timestamp='1341551315' post='3004575'] I posted a RP in an IC forum. I posted it on land where there was no RP ICly, no claim in the map thread, and was, for all intents and purposes, empty. And because of a backroom deal that I had no way of knowing about I am suddenly trying to "take" land from another player who [u]already has a nation[/u]? You have an extremely funny definition of "take". [/quote] Westaxe Owned-You is nationless right now the map hasn't been updated with it yet is all as it is still recent. Also even though the deal may have been agreed OOC is will still have to be RP'd IC to have effect and with your RP it will be disputed. So in general don't worry about it you will both get to RP your claims out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Kingswell Posted July 6, 2012 Report Share Posted July 6, 2012 [quote name='supercheese' timestamp='1341551438' post='3004581'] He does not already have a nation maybe? If you looked a little harder you would see he dropped that nation a few days ago. And it is a protectorate so unless given permission you are not allowed to RP in it. Stop making an issue of it. It has been resolved. [/quote] You don't need the protectorates owners' permission to post an IC claim you just may end up having to fight for your right to exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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