Executive Minister Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 If you guys wanna bump yourselves down to Vietnam Era, be my guest, but you're digging your own graves guys. The big boys are always going to hug the highest tiers. Shammy is right. All this will do will make it easier for the little guy to get crushed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Enema Posted January 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 The little guys can get crushed easily enough as it is now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Executive Minister Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Tell that to the little guy when his 1000 tech drops from being worth 2011 hardware to 1970's hardware. The fact that you guys are considering this shows just how blind some of you people are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Enema Posted January 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 I don't think anyone here is going to go for a 40 year drop in technology level, that's just absurd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff744 Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 [quote name='Executive Minister' timestamp='1358485750' post='3078447'] Tell that to the little guy when his 1000 tech drops from being worth 2011 hardware to 1970's hardware. The fact that you guys are considering this shows just how blind some of you people are. [/quote] The little guy already gets stomped by 2025+ tech that is based on highly theoretical research and is eventually annihilated by technobabble satellites that can find a lone man in the middle of a jungle which is quickly followed by near impossible to detect strategic bombers capable of annihilating half an army. 1970s hardware is still capable of fighting 2000 tech, assuming a little guy is dumb enough to actually annoy a large nation enough that he actually invades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Enema Posted January 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 To repeat myself, If we bring the tech cap down to 2013, we should bring it up to 1980. From there the bonuses for size can be factored in on the basis of infrastructure. It's x 5 for 7500 infra 8500 to 9500 can be x 6 9500 and up can be x 7 7500 to 9500 get 10 more squadrons 9500 and up get another 10 more. That's 240 combat aircraft, that's a pretty sizable increase in striking power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Zephyr Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 I have a few questions on this. Can we implement tech that was experimental in the 80s, proven to work, but never implemented because of some arbitrary reason? Also what about space fighting? I don't really like the idea of being able to take out satellites, for one we never really say how many satellites we actually have in orbit, so shooting them down in the first place is arbitrary. For two, shooting at satellites is such a crapshoot. They are moving really fast, usually have no ID to tell whether they are military or TV satellites, they have arbitrary altitudes depending on their purpose, there's a ton of junk in space so you'd have to distinguish between those, and EMP would just take out every satellite in that area, allied or not. My third concern is Internal RP. Anybody who's read my stuff knows I like to RP having really advanced tech internally because I think it's cool. I know it wouldn't technically be affected by the scale, but it wouldn't make much sense for me to have cool stuff and just a modern military (or in reality for me 1980s-90s tech since the NPO gets into wars with nukes too often). I think bringing down the tech scale would help a little bit with the ego stuff. It's much easier to understand things we have now than it is to do hours of research into something theoretical in the future and claim that it's invincible. The tech would obviously still provide an advantage, but I think it'd be easier to say that my AADN could take out a couple of F-22's (or equivalent) than it taking out a couple of Triyuns F-5's (or whatever super stealth !@#$%^&* aircraft he has). Mostly because we know how an F-22 works, and how to counter it (well not really since it's never fought another another nation that would be capable of taking it down, but still). The main problem would still of course be getting both sides to admit they are taking losses, but that can be settled in GM court. Hopefully with less walls of texts that are required to explain the super advanced !@#$ that everyone has now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evangeline Anovilis Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 [quote name='Lord Zephyr' timestamp='1358526886' post='3078624'] Mostly because we know how an F-22 works, and how to counter it (well not really since it's never fought another another nation that would be capable of taking it down, but still). [/quote] Second part you corrected yourself, but first part... do we really know how it works? I think there is still a lot on the F-22 that is classified. As far as I know, we don't even really know the meximum speed of it, nor do we have a clue how the RAM is really composed. And this is once again a good reason to go with a techscale that is around 1900, if not earlier, as by now, there is nothing classified on a WWI biplane. And there surely are battle reports on how these aircraft fared in actual combat over the Western and Eastern front. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah Tintagyl Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 (edited) See...not only would the world be more balanced, between the little guys with culverins and the larger guys with cannon, but its also easier to understand. Markus, no one is saying you need to study Frederick the Great's battle lines, antiquity, medieval, and early modern produces more epic literature. In the modern sense, everyone is trying to be GI Joe anyways, why not make it an age when men were bold and didn't have to hide behind the barrell of an automatic rifle. Edited January 18, 2013 by Sarah Tintagyl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triyun Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 (edited) [quote name='Sarah Tintagyl' timestamp='1358531439' post='3078645'] See...not only would the world be more balanced, between the little guys with culverins and the larger guys with cannon, but its also easier to understand. Markus, no one is saying you need to study Frederick the Great's battle lines, antiquity, medieval, and early modern produces more epic literature. In the modern sense, everyone is trying to be GI Joe anyways, why not make it an age when men were bold and didn't have to hide behind the barrell of an automatic rifle. [/quote] I am. Class is assigned Chapters 1-4 of Jomini along with a 4 page critical evaluation 1.5 spacing please . Honestly the issue needs to be if its ego letting go of the past, I don't think you can really argue its universal that high tech wars cause problems, the Tianxia-German and Colombian-Athenian Wars had periods of frustrations but not problems. Its when two sides go into it with heavy preconceived notions of the other side, and especially when one attributes OOC morality to IC actions or uses OOC morality for justifying IC actions. The problem is that in my view things break down when you create bad choices for people, and you have these grudges that can only be resolved through complete capitulation or villification. People should not be going back and trying to make sweeping generalizations to the negatives of other players, nor should conditionality from the past be used as prerequisites for future interactions. You can't really say, "Well I view things one way and the only way that we'll get along is if you completely change." Nor should there really be permanent OOC cold wars. Further the justification for not following this advise cannot really be "well you did it in the past, so you're being a hypocrite now." thats a recipe for permanent feuding. The problem is at its core that there really isn't a communal feeling in CN RP anymore and there is this believe that if the other guy plays something you don't like then they must be a bad guy. Further there is this assumption that if the guy your opposing got to a place of prominence, because you don't like him/her that that person obviously won underhandedly That needs to change. I mean really thats the only independent variable thats different between the Colombian War and the African War if one really thinks about it. That said if Sarah and Eva want to RP 1701 they should be able to do it, and interpret events in that context, and if whomever wants to play 2701 they can do that too, but they should be respectful to each other when plasma bolts turn into musket balls, and cavalry turn into dino transformers. That's my view of this. Edited January 18, 2013 by Triyun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kankou Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Conveniently forgetting the past is not the way to be, both RP and RL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centurius Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 I've seen this issue raised a lot and feel it need to be refuted, if you hope going back to any kind of timeframe will get rid of the debates you are sorely mistaken. In late 2007/early 2008 CNRP had underground countries, forcefields protecting cities and gundams. This time saw only a very limited amount of OOC. Under the time of LVN's techscale the strictest regulations ever were imposed and ooc fights were even more common than they are now. If we cap it at modern there will be fights over the actual details of a F-22 and how to combat it(People who can actually speak on this fully reliable aren't even allowed to say it) and stealth fighters aren't the only military systems subject to extreme secrecy leaving plenty of fields left to make a guess. Capping it at the 18th century someone will cite some kind of historian or outline his own system which totally could be done at the time and would be better than what they had. If we capped it at sticks and stones someone will claim their stone is heavier and/or sharper than the other one. The reason you have wars devolve into ooc ones is the level of competitiveness and some case just pity in such wars. As Triyun stated, the Colombian example was mostly one for fun. Shammy. myself and Triyun did it with no out of character hostility at all, there was not much to lose for either side and historically we didn't see each other as competition. The result a war that saw the most extensive use of missiles in cnrp history, high tech aircraft and in general military equipment but pretty much no line of OOC. This recent African war is the polar opposite with both geographical and political competitiveness and a long OOC grudge. Don't blame the tech, blame the competitiveness in cnrp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah Tintagyl Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 [quote name='Kankou' timestamp='1358536457' post='3078682'] Conveniently forgetting the past is not the way to be, both RP and RL. [/quote] It's writing, if you only read contemporary fiction that gets boring too. Why so serious (about RL/RP)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kankou Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 I'm always serious, even when joking. Also, my post was responding to Triyun, since his post basically amounts to "Forget the past even if there were !@#$%bags." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markus Wilding Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 [quote name='Kankou' timestamp='1358540956' post='3078701'] I'm always serious, even when joking. Also, my post was responding to Triyun, since his post basically amounts to "Forget the past even if there were !@#$%bags." [/quote] How dare we try to be mature, responsible adults! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kankou Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 *Shrugs* That being said, seems like that started censoring D-bag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triyun Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Kankou can you answer the question to me right now, are you having fun with the way things are? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kankou Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Exactly what things? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triyun Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Playing this game. Games should be fun. Are you enjoying the game as it is now in the aggregate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kankou Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 So so. Being busy researching tanks for WG makes one think less of actual RPing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynneth Posted January 18, 2013 Report Share Posted January 18, 2013 Remove the techscale in its entirety, make 18th century balloon bombers equal in power and performance as Tupolev supersonic bombers. Everything is equal, other than skill and ability to write walls of text. Problem (not) solved. [i][size=1]Back to lurking occasionally.[/size][/i] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vidarr the Terrible Posted January 19, 2013 Report Share Posted January 19, 2013 I'm with Cent. No amount of rule changes will change the amount of childishness I'm seeing. Seriously, the OOC thread for the african war has so many petty insults just lobbed around it's absolutely ridiculous. The AUP leaks showed me exactly how childish people are being. So, rule changes, blah blah blah. Nothing is going to restart CNRP and make it better. The only thing that will invite new players and breathe new life into the community is if people stop being so combative, and actually take the time to be friends with each other. The toxic personalities in here scare new people. They scare me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Enema Posted January 19, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2013 Sighs... page 7 and this is all we've managed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kankou Posted January 19, 2013 Report Share Posted January 19, 2013 As usual. After all, those that need to change always say everyone else needs to change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centurius Posted January 19, 2013 Report Share Posted January 19, 2013 [quote name='Kankou' timestamp='1358556010' post='3079020'] As usual. After all, those that need to change always say everyone else needs to change. [/quote] Don't give me that holier than thou crap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.