There comes a time..

[Lehran]

[quote name='White Chocolate' timestamp='1321916996' post='2848363']

Okay, will take that into account. You're allowed to complain a little too.

(edit: your/you're)
[/quote]

You're a bit self-righteous aren't you?

[dockingscheduled]

[quote name='NeoGandalf' timestamp='1321914562' post='2848348']
Yes, Anonymous has already fought a war with PS this round also.
[/quote]

damn turtles.

[Lehran]

[quote name='dockingscheduled' timestamp='1321919394' post='2848379']
damn turtles.
[/quote]

I like turtles

[jraenar]

[quote name='Cellardoor' timestamp='1321898022' post='2848210']
Also, the guy whining about having 6k NS and that hasn't hit dock or I back yet with his 33m...my bad. I misread the target list. I guess that's the problem with having joint threads without having identical targets. (I'm looking at you BC. And Hoop) I've actually offered him peace so I can declare on someone else. His call now.
[/quote]
Tell me, if you were fighting two nations, each with effective strength triple your own, how would you go about fighting back? Keeping in mind the extra expense of fighting with a WRC. If you haven't had the pleasure of actually fighting with one yet in TE, I'll let you know that I went into the war with Anon/TFK with 65 million. And I fought conservatively, so I could splurge in the last week. My casualty numbers should be more than enough proof that I know how to manage a war. Do you?

You're making the mistake of assuming I'm an idiot. You're assuming that all my posts are only because you attacked [i]me[/i]. I assure you, I'm not thinking about my nation. My alliance comes first. That's true now in the Empire, and it was true in the past when I was a member of Pork Shrimp.

So no, you don't get to hit another Roman. Maybe I wasn't meant to be your original target. All I know is I really hope you [s]!@#$ yourself[/s] evacuated your bowels when dock (I'm assuming him, since he's got the CIA) spied my warchest an hour and twenty minutes after the declaration, and realized that I am nowhere close to bill lock. And then immediately tried to destroy cash reserves (and failed). You're stuck with me now.

--edit: lolwordfilter.

Edited November 21, 2011 by jraenar

[dockingscheduled]

we never planned for our nations to survive this, so to our battle stations! you're by 3rd priority so apologies if i don't get to you right away.

[dockingscheduled]

[quote name='NeoGandalf' timestamp='1321919421' post='2848380']
I like turtles
[/quote]

no you don't, you left their AA yesterday!

[Lehran]

[quote name='jraenar' timestamp='1321919853' post='2848382']
evacuated your bowels
[/quote]



[quote name='dockingscheduled' timestamp='1321920367' post='2848387']
no you don't, you left their AA yesterday!
[/quote]

Not those turtles!

[Cellardoor]

[quote name='jraenar' timestamp='1321919853' post='2848382']
Tell me, if you were fighting two nations, each with effective strength triple your own, how would you go about fighting back? Keeping in mind the extra expense of fighting with a WRC. If you haven't had the pleasure of actually fighting with one yet in TE, I'll let you know that I went into the war with Anon/TFK with 65 million. And I fought conservatively, so I could splurge in the last week. My casualty numbers should be more than enough proof that I know how to manage a war. Do you?

You're making the mistake of assuming I'm an idiot. You're assuming that all my posts are only because you attacked [i]me[/i]. I assure you, I'm not thinking about my nation. My alliance comes first. That's true now in the Empire, and it was true in the past when I was a member of Pork Shrimp.

So no, you don't get to hit another Roman. Maybe I wasn't meant to be your original target. All I know is I really hope you [s]!@#$ yourself[/s] evacuated your bowels when dock (I'm assuming him, since he's got the CIA) spied my warchest an hour and twenty minutes after the declaration, and realized that I am nowhere close to bill lock. And then immediately tried to destroy cash reserves (and failed). You're stuck with me now.

--edit: lolwordfilter.
[/quote]

right, I'm frightened of my precious infra. That's why I declared on 3 nuclear nations and a guy with a WRC. Ask anyone in TE how concerned with my nation I am. I'm one of the worst builders on planets bob or steve, so I fully expect to be in bad shape at the end of each round

[ADude]

[quote name='Cellardoor' timestamp='1321921918' post='2848396']
I'm one of the worst builders on planets bob or steve, so I fully expect to be in bad shape at the end of each round
[/quote]

Is that why it took more then 30 days for PS to declare a war? See the trend you started OP??

[Clash]

So, basically you didn't even talk to LE you just up decided to give them a flag.
Even though:

1. They have never wanted one before - and probably don't want one now, either.
2. I doubt they wanted one GIVEN to them. Doesn't that take all the fun out of it?
3. Given the choice, I'd bet LE would have rather fought you then be given a flag by you.

Do me a favor and don't ever do this for us, either. I don't want the stupid flag, and I sure as hell don't want one given to me. If anyone did that, I'd change our flag out of spite. Just have the balls to fight us straight up in an alliance war next time, don't pull this sad rogue crap. I'd rather that down-declare than this one. Please don't try to frame this as alliance war either, ok? It's not. Most of my alliance can't fight in it. It's just you guys going rogue on everyone except the people who probably wanted you to war against them.

[Lehran]

That WarFan guy should probably get some more wars. No offensive, one defensive.

[dockingscheduled]

he's our flag runner

[Lehran]

[quote name='dockingscheduled' timestamp='1321924717' post='2848413']
he's our flag runner
[/quote]

Oh. My bad then

[bcortell]

4 pages of multiquotes, here goes... and these are only to posts that are remotely intelligent (some more than others).

[quote name='NeoGandalf' timestamp='1321890166' post='2848129']
Hi Sammy I just came back to TE this round, but my choice to join Anonymous resulted in an undue amount of dislike emanating from other alliances. It's not too bad overall though, but this war irritates me a bit that they would attack people still in NA from another war where we just beat each other to a pulp. I'm just disappointed that I'm too broke to fight.[/quote]
Can't help you about Anon. Lots of tensions carry over from round to round. The unfortunate thing is definitely some still being in NA, but, we expect this war to last the rest of the round, with people fighting back from all the AA's. I posted all the wars we had declared on, with the number of people from each AA. I'd say almost all of PS's offensive slots are full at this point. That means there is a whole boatload of people that will escape NA in a couple days from those AA's and be looking for blood. We welcome it. It's what we expected. It's what we want. The wars we have declared are not the only wars decs we are looking for.


[quote name='Polarbear' timestamp='1321890865' post='2848132']
there is a big difference between recent wars and wars that are still going on. Attacking while basically the whole alliance is in na and cannot counter is the whole problem and was a dick move[/quote]
There's less than two weeks left in the round. That means there is a lot of time for some AA's to have guys recoup and counter us.

[quote name='NeoGandalf' timestamp='1321891704' post='2848141']
Again... we're here to fight, and a lot of us are [i]already fighting[/i]. Now you just hit us while we're down. PS attacked everyone that was already at war, and left out the one alliance that isn't fighting. Check your logic there...

@above, You're talking about one specific case. Most of us have less than 10m
[/quote]
The first part comes down to who we'd like to see get the flag, or rather who we wouldn't like to see get the flag. It's pretty funny that the AA with the best chance at the flag now is the AA who probably wants it the least.

I think I got up to 2K infra with $3M earlier in the round (don't quote me though). If guys are at or near $10M, they're looking at at least that and a good amount of tech, or they're looking at another 500 infra. They should be well within range of all of PS in two days after some nukes fly.

[quote name='NeoGandalf' timestamp='1321892174' post='2848146']
More than 4 of the AAs that PS attacked are still in nuclear anarchy [/quote]
Again, and many of the guys in those AA's weren't attacked. Once they clear NA and get a solid collection in, they should be looking for blood.


[quote name='NeoGandalf' timestamp='1321892353' post='2848151']
There are, of course, people who are not. But they don't make up the majority. Take a look at this:[/quote]
Back to who we didn't want to get the flag. I know people keep coming back to the whole why didn't you hit LE thing. I hope I've explained it enough.

Someone (might have been you) said it's about having a fair chance at the flag. Well, that's only if you're actually worried about the flag. We don't care what others want or if they think they should get their chance at a flag or not, which makes it even more entertaining that the AA with the best chance has had historically the least desire for it.


[quote name='paul711' timestamp='1321893293' post='2848157']
I agree with this as well, why should PS do what flag runners expected them to do?[/quote]
Good point. Just because they think they are entitled to chance at the flag doesn't make it so.


[quote name='SoADarthCyfe6' timestamp='1321893710' post='2848160']
Glad to know all of PS's moral preaching has lead them to [url="http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=99589&st=0"]this[/url].

Anyways, congratulations on winning Round 19 LE. No wonders why people wait over 30 days to not go to war anymore, they win flags that way!
[/quote]
The big difference with that is the time. Right now there is 11 days of the round left not counting today. When that happened, there was around 40 days of the round left (in a 60 day round) right after PS just got done with a roughly 10 day war against GR. That was actually a fun round though. I think I rerolled 3 times that round.

To the latter part of your comment. It's always a discussion on here about guys 'expecting' others to go to war in a certain time frame. I've been on both sides of the argument. PS, when we were small many rounds ago, used to just mind our business until someone came knocking. Then we'd take it to them. It adds an interesting dynamic to the game when you want to war but are worried other AA's won't war and then hit you later in a much stronger position.

[bcortell]

[quote name='NeoGandalf' timestamp='1321895643' post='2848183']
I'll take that as an admission of guilt, then.

Again... this was my first and last round in Anonymous. However, I have known PS as an honorable alliance for quite some while and it saddens me to see that they had to resort to something like this (where everybody in an alliance is automatically regarded as a moral enemy).[/quote]
There's 11-12 days left in the round. Consider this all hell breaking loose on you guys.


[quote name='arcticllama' timestamp='1321896254' post='2848192']
Well, I guess we got the lion's share... all you had to do was ask and we would have told you we already ate the bacon cake so don't come looking for it:)

and my last count was 16 return decs from RD:) we're going to have a good fight:)

of course we've already had 3 full out alliance wars.. this is pretty close to a fourth.. not much left for this fight but we'll try:)[/quote]
Glad RD is taking in this in good spirits. That's all were asking for is everyone else in the AA's to counter us. Maybe not today or tomorrow, but once everyone starts getting out of NA, this war will be extremely interesting.


[quote name='Cellardoor' timestamp='1321898022' post='2848210']
Understandable.

Also, the guy whining about having 6k NS and that hasn't hit dock or I back yet with his 33m...my bad. I misread the target list. I guess that's the problem with having joint threads without having identical targets. (I'm looking at you BC. And Hoop) I've actually offered him peace so I can declare on someone else. His call now.[/quote]
I imagine it's hard for some to locate your name and then see the guys directly under it labeled "Targets."

I'm sorry and will do better next time. How do you suggest I handle it? Arrows pointing to the guys you should have hit?


[quote name='dealmaster13' timestamp='1321899266' post='2848217']
Well, what are the chances that it's actually a Pork Shrimp member that wins the round, and we're all just looking at it in the wrong perspective with regards to LE's laxness?

Or alternatively, like many of the past 50 rounds, one of confusion's flagrunners can always pop out of no where.
[/quote]
Odds for PS? Extremely slim. Almost all of our nations are at war right now, and should be (if people hit us.. otherwise we'll keep hitting others) for the rest of the round. One guys, Charlie (KillJoy from OMFG) is free to get hit for anyone. He's busy in RL, so I didn't assign him any targets, but he's very much a part of PS and fair game to hit.

Always a chance for the latter. Just like there's a good chance you'll rebuy back into the top 5 nations on Dec 2nd, and go for the flag.


[quote name='Stelios' timestamp='1321904532' post='2848260']
The Empire (RE), Had already fought PS AND LE, We dont feel like fighting the same people, and cant help if you and LE keep hugging. You took the easy way out, not us.[/quote]
There's 11 days left in the round Stelios. This is a weak reason for not wanting to fight us.


[quote name='sir pwnage' timestamp='1321905528' post='2848267']
Because I don't have a choice? I was busy rebuilding after the war that ended 5 days ago, had a small WC, and suddenly I get attacked by a nation larger than me. I THOUGHT that every alliance left in TE was classy enough not to hit people that just got out of a war, but apparently not.

The navy thing isn't a complaint about how you're fighting. I'm just saying, it inflates my NS by 3k while not really effecting the war effort, making your attack more of a down declare. The same is true of my nukes since I probably won't get to launch them; due either to bill lock or the other people nuking you.[/quote]
You haven't been nuked yet, this entire round. I'm not sure why you are complaining. And since I was the nation that declared on you, here were the stats from Saturday (when I did the target list):

Macto: 18830 NS
Land o K: 19545 NS

Even after the blitz, I'm only 1100 NS ahead of you. (And that's after bulking up and getting 30+ tech from my targets so far).

The nation that won the flag last round was in nuke anarchy something like 25 of the last 26 days of the round.

I didn't force you to buy the navy. That NS can be valuable in a war, but it can also be a hindrance.


[quote name='NeoGandalf' timestamp='1321913567' post='2848335']
I never said I was recreating tF. With zero knowledge of politics, I looked for tF at the beginning of this round and saw nobody there. It didn't go any further than that.

Also, I haven't taken back anything - just apologized for excessive complaining. I'm not sure you got my point about being declared on, but I just got out of war less than 24 hours before I got hit. And I'm not the only one that that has happened to. Not 10 days, 2 weeks, or whatever you wrote earlier. I don't need "respect" from somebody like you, Confusion.[/quote]
Nah, you're comments have been some of the best in this thread. No need to apologize, IMO.

It's had to foresee things, but look at an AA like TPC who has 8 FSS's. If you're not nuked one day, you're out of NA. Just something to think about.

[quote name='jraenar' timestamp='1321919853' post='2848382']
Tell me, if you were fighting two nations, each with effective strength triple your own, how would you go about fighting back? Keeping in mind the extra expense of fighting with a WRC. If you haven't had the pleasure of actually fighting with one yet in TE, I'll let you know that I went into the war with Anon/TFK with 65 million. And I fought conservatively, so I could splurge in the last week. My casualty numbers should be more than enough proof that I know how to manage a war. Do you?

You're making the mistake of assuming I'm an idiot. You're assuming that all my posts are only because you attacked [i]me[/i]. I assure you, I'm not thinking about my nation. My alliance comes first. That's true now in the Empire, and it was true in the past when I was a member of Pork Shrimp.

So no, you don't get to hit another Roman. Maybe I wasn't meant to be your original target. All I know is I really hope you [s]!@#$ yourself[/s] evacuated your bowels when dock (I'm assuming him, since he's got the CIA) spied my warchest an hour and twenty minutes after the declaration, and realized that I am nowhere close to bill lock. And then immediately tried to destroy cash reserves (and failed). You're stuck with me now.

--edit: lolwordfilter.
[/quote]
That's the spirit. Please keep fighting hard. It also sounds like you have more than enough money to fight this war. Sounds good to us.

[quote name='ADude' timestamp='1321922434' post='2848398']
Is that why it took more then 30 days for PS to declare a war? See the trend you started OP??[/quote]
That's my fault about not getting PS into a war sooner. Been busy lately (as many have seen by my lessened posts on the OWF the last couple of weeks). This war was planned in all of two days since we had already missed when we wanted to go to war again.

[quote name='Clash' timestamp='1321922775' post='2848402']
So, basically you didn't even talk to LE you just up decided to give them a flag.
Even though:

1. They have never wanted one before - and probably don't want one now, either.
2. I doubt they wanted one GIVEN to them. Doesn't that take all the fun out of it?
3. Given the choice, I'd bet LE would have rather fought you then be given a flag by you.

Do me a favor and don't ever do this for us, either. I don't want the stupid flag, and I sure as hell don't want one given to me. If anyone did that, I'd change our flag out of spite. Just have the balls to fight us straight up in an alliance war next time, don't pull this sad rogue crap. I'd rather that down-declare than this one. Please don't try to frame this as alliance war either, ok? It's not. Most of my alliance can't fight in it. It's just you guys going rogue on everyone except the people who probably wanted you to war against them.
[/quote]
First, whew, I think I made it through everyone's posts.

Alright to you, Clash. Yes, they probably don't want the flag. Maybe they'll DoW PS to really add to our targets or to take some nukes themselves. But, we didn't talk to them about the flag. It was about our preference on who we wanted to give the best chance of the flag to. Anon came to us asking if we wanted to hit everyone but their runners. We didn't want to help them. We didn't want to help RE. We didn't want to help TPC or anyone. But, any DoW by us would have flag implications by the guys that weren't hit. So, we chose LE to give those implications to. Now, it's up to them what they do with it.

I think we should backtrack from "giving" them the flag. I much prefer "taking away" the flag from whomever we could. And in this case, we chose everyone we hit.

It's entirely possible they do want that. They are still free to hit us. They could have also gone in on us before we went in on everyone else. I kind of expected your top 7 or so to be able to fight in this war, but it looks like nearly double that are already fighting in this war. I'd say that's probably indicative of an AA war. But, like I said in other responses, we're declaring on a number of nations and a number of AA's. It's the end of the round, and it's our time to ruin a whole lot of people's chances at a flag.

[White Chocolate]

[quote name='ADude' timestamp='1321922434' post='2848398']
Is that why it took more then 30 days for PS to declare a war? See the trend you started OP??
[/quote]

Anyone could have declared war on us at any time. It's not like we have some alliance wide SDI that stops any other alliance from doing so.

[quote name='Clash' timestamp='1321922775' post='2848402']
So, basically you didn't even talk to LE you just up decided to give them a flag.[/quote]

You're in the "PS should have declared war on LE club" I take it.

Assuming someone in LE gets the flag, they earned it. PS leadership just decided NOT to get in their way. The reasoning on that has already been explained by them.

Now, if I were a member of LE, I'd be annoyed with PS for not including us in the declaration or just giving all our love to them, but I like war - that's why I play TE. Up to them if they want to attack us over it. Like everyone else, they could have declared at any time. On the other hand, no one else declared war on LE recently either - so it's not like we're any worse than anyone else for not doing so.
----------------------

People (in general) are getting WAY to use to expecting other alliances to act in X or Y way. Even a good way of doing things can get old once it becomes the "expected" way to act.

How many different alliances do we have members attacking? 21 or so. Agree with the action or not, at least it's stepping outside the box.

[paul711]

I personally like this war, why should PS and LE be pigeon holed into fighting because TE in general and flag runners in particular deem it so. It is the end of round which is the time for chaos. Once I am able I will declare on adude but I will still get some TPC. If any LE or PS or anyone for that matter we won't care, we can't take it with us.

On,a personal note... Stop crying like a !@#$%* Adufe.

[Lehran]

bcortell, thanks for the reply to many of the points I brought up I think the only fault that I can find with what you said is that nobody in Anon, RE, TPC, or Synergy is going to be able to get out of NA in time to collect. Myself, I was nuked the day before the war with RE ended (as did most other warring participants) and I will not be able to get a collection in before J Bibbs nukes me again. This applies to the rest of the people in the aforementioned four alliances.

[ADude]

[quote name='bcortell' timestamp='1321925653' post='2848419']
That's my fault about not getting PS into a war sooner. Been busy lately (as many have seen by my lessened posts on the OWF the last couple of weeks). This war was planned in all of two days since we had already missed when we wanted to go to war again.
[/quote]

We did, remember?

[bcortell]

[quote name='NeoGandalf' timestamp='1321926790' post='2848428']
bcortell, thanks for the reply to many of the points I brought up I think the only fault that I can find with what you said is that nobody in Anon, RE, TPC, or Synergy is going to be able to get out of NA in time to collect. Myself, I was nuked the day before the war with RE ended (as did most other warring participants) and I will not be able to get a collection in before J Bibbs nukes me again. This applies to the rest of the people in the aforementioned four alliances.[/quote]
Yes, but we only hit 7 people in RE and 5 people in Anon. I'm sure there will be at least that many more in each AA in the next 3 days that have the ability to war anyone in our AA. People are acting like the wars declared are the only wars that will be happening involving PS (either offensive or defensive) the rest of the round. I'm trying to say, there is 11 days left in the round. That's plenty of time for people to get out of NA (many tomorrow, and nearly everyone tomorrow if they switch up TC's if they're supposed to get out later) that we haven't hit in those AA's.

It does get rough on some people like yourself, but we had to start somewhere. The 'other' side has more than double the number of SDI's as PS, though, so it's possible we run through our nukes rather quickly.

[quote name='ADude' timestamp='1321926901' post='2848429']
We did, remember?
[/quote]
We did what? The thing you quoted was about me being inactive the last couple of weeks and getting this war together over the weekend. Misquote, maybe? I don't understand your reply.

[Stelios]

Bcortell that isnt the only reason i didnt want to fight you. Well I just didnt want to fight you at this time. Considering i had that runner and that rogue who were both bigger than me to deal with, which you knew

[bcortell]

[quote name='Stelios' timestamp='1321927702' post='2848440']
Bcortell that isnt the only reason i didnt want to fight you. Well I just didnt want to fight you at this time. Considering i had that runner and that rogue who were both bigger than me to deal with, which you knew
[/quote]
Take solace in the fact that we hit both of them too. Where the hell is EOA with his war dec's! Yell at him Stelios, he's holding up some damage that could be done to your opponent.

[sir pwnage]

[quote name='bcortell' timestamp='1321925653' post='2848419']
You haven't been nuked yet, this entire round. I'm not sure why you are complaining. And since I was the nation that declared on you, here were the stats from Saturday (when I did the target list):

Macto: 18830 NS
Land o K: 19545 NS

Even after the blitz, I'm only 1100 NS ahead of you. (And that's after bulking up and getting 30+ tech from my targets so far).

The nation that won the flag last round was in nuke anarchy something like 25 of the last 26 days of the round.

I didn't force you to buy the navy. That NS can be valuable in a war, but it can also be a hindrance.
[/quote]

The point I'm making is that the navy is useless NS. Counting it in deciding whether this is an even or uneven fight is stupid. You have 800 more infra and 200 more tech than me. That, along with the warchest I'm sure you have, is what makes this a down declare. The NS is far from the whole story. I don't care what the situation of the flag winner last round was, because contrary to what you all allegedly think, I'm not flag runner. See my alliance title? That means I haven't shied away from a fight in 4 rounds. The only reason I escaped being nuked so far this round is my SDI is stacked, and blocked 7 nukes in a row. Believe me, I was trying

Anyway, I'm looking forward to next round. I'll be seeing you after your first war

[ADude]

[quote name='paul711' timestamp='1321926723' post='2848427']
I personally like this war, why should PS and LE be pigeon holed into fighting because TE in general and flag runners in particular deem it so. It is the end of round which is the time for chaos. Once I am able I will declare on adude but I will still get some TPC. If any LE or PS or anyone for that matter we won't care, we can't take it with us.

On,a personal note... Stop crying like a !@#$%* Adufe.
[/quote]

You like this war because PS isn't hitting you, I wonder why that is?

[ADude]

[quote name='bcortell' timestamp='1321927977' post='2848441']
Take solace in the fact that we hit both of them too. Where the hell is EOA with his war dec's! Yell at him Stelios, he's holding up some damage that could be done to your opponent.
[/quote]

Sorry bcortell, lost concentration for a moment I guess.