Vol Navy
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Posts posted by Vol Navy
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He stated he wants to make Mj's influence "nominal"
Nominal means "in name only" or "being trifling in comparison to actual value".
Not that he wants to keep NoR from becoming a power. Although that looks just as bad since NoR just signed a treaty with you guys.
And my goodness, this is a clearly laid out set of plans/expectations on what MK would like to see unfold on the planet, likely from the highest or second highest active Gov member in the entire alliance. -
[quote name='Banksy' timestamp='1313052728' post='2777444']
Makes crackpot claims about MK's supposed future treatment of allies --> MK refutes claims --> "you responding to me proves that i'm correct."
Hmmm.
[/quote]
MK Prince lays out plans to ally about rolling, reducing, diminishing several blocs.
Plans leak.
MK denies plans.
Hmmmmmm.
I mean it's kinda hard to refute that. Sure you can claim Ardus didn't really mean it but why on Bob should anyone believe it when you say it? -
[quote name='Banksy' timestamp='1313051356' post='2777436']
You're trying way too hard.
Or it could be what I said it was; convincing FOK that we aren't going to be changing our FA direction to suit NoR and that we still value our core allies (who are in PB and C&G).
The irony of you claiming we're spinning when you've mentioned "assure their power," "pacifica politics," "tC" and then directly compared us to the NPO in one post. It's like a competition to see how many buzzwords you can drop.
The amount of effort you're putting in for what is rather an inconsequential post is ridiculous. MK's FA goals are entirely transparent. We support our core, hope to expand it, while reaching out to those in Mj who aren't our traditional allies. Big !@#$@#$ shock.
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The post is hardly inconsequential. You MKers are trying to play it that way. But the sheer response it's getting show that it isn't at all.
It's hard to take words from your very high Gov about plans for several blocs as inconsequential. -
[quote name='Muddog' timestamp='1313044033' post='2777373']
What is the single most important aspect of preparing an alliance for war?
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Technology is tied with money. But nations that have a lot of one tend to have a lot of the other as they've likely never faced significant war losses.
If you are severely out-teched you are doomed in war. No level of activity will help you. For instance 1 nation with 11 thousand tech and a WRC can in a single attack dish out the close to the same amount of standard battle damage it takes two nations with 5500 tech to dish out. Throw in that they only take one less powerful nuke from a 5500 tech guy and can throw back 3 monster nukes and you see why it's almost impossible to overcome certain alliances in war.
I can see why XX is under the gun. Their top tier is the only one left that can take on the UMB/MK top tier from a sheer technology perspective. -
[quote name='Azaghul' timestamp='1313049847' post='2777429']
I'm sure our FA objectives could accommodate a more influential and powerful MJ just fine. You're acting like we actively want to keep them isolated after the war which is not the case. It's more prophetic than anything.
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You say that here, your Prince seems to indicate differently when he thought it was private.
As for me acting like you are actively wanting to keep them isolated after the war...I don't think it's me acting that way. I can't imagine any other meaning out of that statement. Your Prince wants 3 blocs and the non-bloc bloc DH to secure power. SF destroyed, XX reduced and Mj with less influence.
He literally stated that as one of your FA goals. Not that he wanted a more influential and powerful Mj. Sure you could accommodate that but Ardus' seems to have a plan that doesn't include you accommodating it.
What you could do and what you plan on doing seem to branch. You could do a lot of different things, but seem to plan on the course of action Ardus laid out for FOK.
It seems to have convinced FOK to drop their Fark treaty. So good work on that front. -
[quote name='Banksy' timestamp='1313041297' post='2777335']
In the context of the thread, it means assuring FOK that we think they are a valuable ally and that we are not going to be suddenly following a pro-Mj agenda. This post was in a thread that had a lot of FA discussions and was a response to queries regarding our new treaty with Mj. I can assume that Mj know this, FOK certainly knows this.
Even without the context of the rest of the thread, you really have to work to spin it as us attempting to subjugate Mj. It says he wants a world that isn't dominated by any single party (like it was with Xiph and SF during the last war). If things occur like they appear to be (they won't, but w/e) Mj will come out on top. We want to work with our allies in NoR, and friends in the rest of the bloc alongside our traditional allies in FOK and C&G. To say we are actively trying to subjugate a bloc is comically ridiculous, especially when you consider how much support we have for them within the alliance.
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Honestly what you say here might have been more credible if it wasn't prefaced by this statement.
[quote]I hope for a future cemented on the interests of those I've been most concerned for since I started working FA for the Kingdom: C&G-DH-PB. To add the developing Pillowfort to that perspective would only make me happier.[/quote]
It seems to be saying that MK is going to attempt to assure C&G-DH-PB power and hopefully bring PF into the fold but keep Mj in a less influential state.
It's hard to spin it any other way than that. MK's FA goals seem to be to assure their power, assure PB-DH and PF power but to eliminate SF, reduce XX and make Mj nominal.
There is nothing wrong with that, it's old fashion Pacifica politics that allowed them to run the joint for 1-2 years. It makes sense upon your side finally springing leaks like tC/NPO sprung that you guys play it pretty much the same way.
And honestly, I have very little love for SF, and less for XX. Mj is okay because I always liked Valhalla, DT seems pretty good, NoR has made major strides and became someone to respect and I don't really know the rest of the bloc members so I have no dislike for them. -
[quote name='Believland' timestamp='1313013166' post='2776944']
Really? Seems like you're fairly upset about it.
I love you NoR. PC is pretty bad though. Zoom, Twisted and Jgat are like the three stooges of CN.
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This treaty really shocks me. Back in the day Twisted really had high hate levels for NoV/NoR. -
[quote name='Banksy' timestamp='1313040367' post='2777319']
Yawn, it didn't say that.
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What exactly does "keeping their influence nominal" mean then in a post about world politics. -
I am still thinking the bombshell out of all this is MK's plan to keep Mj subjugated after Mj fights a war for them.
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If it is true it does crack me up that after 2.5 years of using SF to further their goals MK has suddenly decided they are hurting their friends and won't sit for it any more!
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[quote name='ShouAS' timestamp='1313008435' post='2776873']
Wasn't a snippet of it posted somewhere else, where he confirmed it was legit?
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He confirmed saying that he wanted to reduce XX as was quoted above. He didn't mention wanting to keep Mj in a diminished capacity too. -
Looks like MK/PB/CnG/PF is having the same problems that NPO/tC faced. Not surprising since they are acting in very similar fashion.
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To any in SF, especially CSN.
Do you find it odd that the same people who decry you as evil etc about charging reps have themselves been guilty of charging reps and giving terms that were far more harsh than those you gave DT? -
[quote name='Bob Janova' timestamp='1312928763' post='2776168']
A clear choice of sides considering everyone seems to be fairly sure that SF is going to be one of the sides in the next major action.
Edit: At the risk of agreeing with Alterego, while I'm not sure Fark should have immediately jumped to rolling tanks over the NG incident and Ardus's comments are certainly not a CB, they [i]really[/i] need to marshal a credible power sphere and stop themselves from being gradually isolated. If they let themselves get manoeuvred into an isolated political position and permit the war to be fought on their enemies' terms, they will be utterly crushed.
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I disagree that Ardus' comments aren't a valid CB. Someone is working with your MD partner to get them to drop treaties so they can more easily roll you and weaken your bloc? That's a great reason to go to war. Far better than most things that cause war here.
Especially given the context of the situation and the way the wolves have been circling XX members lately.
I strongly agree that they need to get their act together quickly, they should have already went to war over the NG thing. The alliances gunning for them and SF aren't going to be talked out of it like Fark was once they get them isolated.
This honestly reminds of NPO leading up to Karma. We in TPF were certain that was coming as much as 5 months before it happened when we were told to start preparing to be on the losing side of a long war. NPO didn't want to believe it and allowed themselves to be isolated. 2.5 years later they've never recovered. Fark/XX should learn from that. -
With the open hostility for the Polar upgrade, the NG gov spying issue and now Ardus, Prince of MK confirming that he is trying to undermine XX, do you think XX should just go ahead and get the war started before MK diplomatic corps further isolates them?
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[quote name='Muddog' timestamp='1312786363' post='2774714']
Why are NPO or MK given so much reverence in terms of their ability to fight?
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MK was good during Karma when we fought them.
Now, not at all. Any nation below about 90k NS there that I faced was an inactive turtle. Even people with huge war chests wouldn't bother with fighting back for the most part. I fought a few with billion dollar+ war chests who wouldn't even bother with buying back to 1000 infra to nuke. -
[quote name='Crymson' timestamp='1312848992' post='2775317']
And you're too dense to discern the very obvious basis of the post, namely that Xiphosis ran insensibly roughshod for two years and was supported by his fellow signatories all the way.
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And by MK/CnG/VE/PB/XX members too. They propped up and supported everything Xiph has done post Karma through their treaty ties. -
[quote name='Krack' timestamp='1312867248' post='2775590']
What is it about XX that you feel implies a threat to you?
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Probably FARK/MHA/Sparta having an upper tier that has the size to roll MK's and match Umbrella's.
Honestly Ardus confirming that he is trying to hurt/bring down XX and NG dropping the CB in their lap, it's crazy not to roll tanks right now and hope you can get the war started on your terms while you still have treaty ties.
The NG thing was a lock solid CB, this statement from Ardus is a pretty good one too.
Not that you need a CB if you feel someone is a threat to you. -
Finally someone actually cancelling a conflicting treaty! Only about 200 more to go.
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With XX being threatened I have to imagine Sparta is looking to join up with DH at this point.
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Let the good times roll Warriors. You guys always kick ass at war and it's gonna be a great few days.
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[quote name='Omniscient1' timestamp='1312599126' post='2773079']
I honestly don't think they'll get to resign with SF after the next war. So I hope they trust Valhalla, TORN, and IRON to have their backs post-war. I wouldn't want to trust them to constantly protect me after I spent 2 years post-Karma trying to keep them down and make them look bad.
So in the long run it'd be more politically sound for PB and DH to stick with SF, but I will admit it'd be much more boring that way.
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IRON is a fine ally to have, so is Valhalla. I just don't have any idea why they actually trust people who've rolled them in the past and have generally expressed lots of dislike or outright hatred towards them. I guess they feel the need to do this to get their ultimate revenge vs Polaris. I am continually amazed at how MK always comes out smelling like a rose in that deal but they do. -
[quote name='Omniscient1' timestamp='1312595192' post='2773047']
The people up top always have to have a target so that they can rally their forces. SF annoyed the people on top so they became the next target. RIA just got caught up in all of that.
It's pretty funny how we all called that SF would be next after Polar. Then Roq came out with his "PB-SF MADP 4ever" comment to tell us all that we were wrong. I guess now that he's not here no one is even trying to hide the fact that they want SF dead.
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They got what they wanted from SF at a time when they needed it. Now that separate power has been secured, you are no longer needed. Time to pay for your role in WoTC, as pretty much everyone left who sided against MK/CnG/Polaris from that era save SF/XX members have been rolled.
On the positive side, when they tire of their current allies they will probably resign with y'all so you can get revenge against the people lined up against you now. -
[quote name='Delta1212' timestamp='1312585007' post='2772912']
[URL=http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=103806]You should read this thread.[/URL]
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Oh I've read the thread, it just seems amazing to me that an ODP with Polaris would cause probably more than half a dozen treaties to be ignored in favor of the person who actually provoked the war through a stupidly aggressive action.
That's why I wish alliances would just go ahead and drop treaties. Certain ones literally have a major MDP+ level foot print in just about every major bloc.
Is This Legit?
in World Affairs (IC)
Posted
[quote name='MaGneT' timestamp='1313124533' post='2778380']
You have a point. I'd just hope that the other power centers out there see us for what we are - a bunch of friends who just want to look out for each other. We're not looking to shake up relations in PB to bring ourselves more influence. We have no intention of being major power players. We just want to be there to help one another and settle injustices.
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I admire your optimism about it at least. But PB/DH has already shown they will roll an alliance they think is growing too large even if you aren't making any kind of aggressive political moves.
Right now the only upper tier that can take on an Umbrella/MK combination resides in the SF/XX sphere. Who, after two years of being closely allied to, and rolling others with MK/PB is suddenly immoral and not to be trusted?? Why SF and Fark of course, the very upper tier that could threaten them.
If your nations grow to a potentially threatening size, look out. You will find yourself on the short end of the MK/PB stick.