White Chocolate
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Posts posted by White Chocolate
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On 10/22/2020 at 11:32 AM, Jazzy95 said:
For those complaining about the terms Lucius accepted, I fail to see why. He made the terms acceptable when he... accepted the terms. If other alliance leaders find those terms unacceptable when presented with them, they'll be free to negotiate or continue fighting in hopes of a different offer. Lucius did neither because, and this is the important part, he found them acceptable.
This is the best point of the entire thread. Liked.
To Lucius - good show.
Also @Banned - Thank you for providing the intelligence you have provided to CLAWS. I realize that as the leader for the "S" (SLAP) in CLAWS, it was your duty. However I do not think that any of us adequately accounted for the vast amount of drivel that would be flung in your direction as a result.
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1 hour ago, General Kanabis said:
Please elaborate.
I am not one to shove conspiracy down the throats of those with minds of their own.
KNB
This is an old guard established for the sole purpose of fighting COBRA and our allies.
I know their ranks well because I fought among them against MU.
And I know where they come from.
To LH, this is Monsters 2020
But that is not the case.
propagate propaganda < provide proof
I decided to sit on the KNB AA, where there is no one in my range either in the alliance or allied to the alliance. That being the case, I think it is only fair to warn potential raiders (or other potential enemies) that I have close personal ties to others who will defend me if asked. One can never be too careful.
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FTW has always been good to their allies. Congrats CCC.
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Hail CRAP!
Hail KNB!
Even though I've known Chuck Normis from CRAP most of my CN career, I do not recall ever being formally allied until now - while in KNB of all places. Maybe we were while I was in UUS? I can't remember but I think we just traded tech. If that is the case, it is about time.
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Hail King Neptune's Bar!
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On 7/29/2020 at 11:49 PM, Kapleo said:
CLAWS, (spoiler alert) the leaders of our alliances share a chat and I can give you my word that we are NOT trying to start a war. As GK said, if we wanted a war we would just go for it, just like we did last time, and I can tell you this time we are way better prepared for one, so we legit just don't want to fight over this, however; I do believe your guy IS in the wrong and deserves to have some sort of punishment just like our guy was punished by you all when our guy was in the wrong. You all did not ask us "permission" to counter Korlath, you just went ahead and did it and THEN negotiated his punishment and that's okay, you had EVERY right to do so. Back then you considered punishment fair when we were in your position and we allowed the punishment to take place, so it is only fair that as we took responsibility back then, you take responsibility for your member's actions now.
Now I will go back to DEFCON 5 and advise my peers to do the same as I believe this will get solved fairly and without sacrificing nations that had nothing to do with Veracity's actions.
You're point about Korlath is fair and impressed me. It actually made me think and in that regard it is an effective OWF post. If there is a next time, asking permission would be appreciated. This is especially true if you actually do not want war.
I do not buy the "if we wanted a war we would just go for it" argument, however. If it were just this one incident where Cobra and friends got on the OWF complaining about CLAWS, then okay, I might accept that Cobra is really interested in peace. I understand the need for propaganda and spin before and during a war. However, even though I'm retired, I'm not dead. Cobra and friends have been badmouthing CLAW and FTW on a regular basis on the OWF before this happened and long after our previous conflict. It's just baiting, in my opinion. Your members and government have the perfect right to say what you want, but do not be too surprised when the result is that the people in alliance(s) you are saying it about are skeptical regarding your intentions when there is an incident.
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4 hours ago, Tevron said:
However, I can make light of COBRA using OOC attacks as some kind of banner of righteousness as they seem to care about them for the very first time in their history. They have systematically promoted OOC and personal attacks outside of this scenario and never condemned anyone who have partaken in them.
Bingo! /me upvotes
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5 minutes ago, CrinkledStraw said:
You're the one who brought up if the tables were turned how things would go down.
What a weird way to address a CLAWS member attacking a CLEARLY protected individual. If we said that about someone under your protection you'd froth at the mouth. No comments on how it's a CLAWS member that messed up over and over again, so that it's CLAWS responsibility to solve it, eh? No comments on much.
I am not going to comment on something I am not all that familiar about. I do not froth at the mouth either. I am more of the take my ball and leave and not talk to you again anytime soon type. My example about things being turned around and how it would go down was just about the issue with someone making an insulting comment in the general discussion. That's it. To be clear, I am not saying I support Cobra's position regarding Lex either. I just can not e-lawyer some issue I know little about. Now in the spirit of deciding to take my ball and leave, I think I have said all that I care to at this point. :Salute:
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30 minutes ago, General Kanabis said:
Yeah because we are the ones full of treaties and compromising political arrangements that leave us carefully maneuvering and systematically plotting easy wars where we can justify more curbstomps, right?
LOL
When COBRA wants to war you, we do it.
I was thinking more along the lines that you are the ones that like war and drama and are bored with the current politics of CN.
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16 minutes ago, CrinkledStraw said:
Weird, I did just that.
I took a look at the at the conversation in general again. Tehol responded once you @ him under 5 minutes regarding the inappropriate comment and said it was inappropriate but he had to consult other government members. Jazzy commented within the hour that the comment was not something CLAWS condoned, he was sorry for the comment and that he would talk to the member once he responds. Lyanna thanked him for the response. It was made very clear that CLAWS was in the process of getting it worked out.
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Again - I am not responding to the situation regarding Lex because I have not been following that particular drama. I am not government and am happily retired.
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6 hours ago, CrinkledStraw said:
What a sorry response considering the comment was left SEEN and unresponded to for nearly 8 hours. And there was, what 12+ hours after it was seen before anyone attacked.
I do not even look at the general area on our discord for days and I am considered active by many people's standards. Unless someone actually @White Chocolate me, even if I do look it is just a casual glance. Although I can not speak for other government members, as I have said before, nation leaders are busy busy people. I do not think I have ever seen any issue resolved in less than 24 hours, which is why I am surprised that you attacked that night.
You know very well that there are hold ups due to people being busy. Twelve hours is not a lot of time by CN standards to work out a government to government issue even in the most active of times. If Cobra could not wait at least 24 hours before 3 people do a coordinated attack on our member (which I assume was government approved) the way I personally see it (again, I am not government so this is my opinion and not anything more) is that you all want a war and are just looking for an excuse.
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2 hours ago, CrinkledStraw said:
Perhaps he did act with individual intention.Now CLAWS is supporting that intention by aiding him while at war and not admitting that he messed up.
Super stoked to watch them flail about supporting someone who is garbage.
You all attacked him without our permission. If COBRA had worked something out with CLAWS BEFORE attacking him as some type of deal that would have been one thing. That didn't happen. And I've already covered that Cobra knows where to find claude. Next time wait until there is some type of agreement before you go attacking a member of our alliance. Like I said, I expected you all to be talking about our member's offensive comment within 24 hours of pointing it out to us but I have to admit, the fact that you attacked too I was not expecting. Congrats - that pissed me off enough to give him aid. Alliance mates are supposed to support their members who are attacked.
All of you would be screaming bloody murder if this situation were reversed. If I or someone at CLAWS said we were offend about a comment made in the general membership area of your discord channel , started demanding an answer in it before your government even had time to talk about it between themselves and we badmouthed Cobra in your public channel because no one said something until someone made a comment, you might have kicked us off.
We do not make a habit of monitoring what every member says all time (OCC: and most of us still have jobs that > than CN drama - plus CN is basically dead.)
If three of us then attacked your member that night without working out some type of deal with Cobra, there would probably be at least aid flying to him or her in a few hours time and more screaming on the OWF about it If the situation were reversed, your membership would probably be attacking the ones who attacked your guy without your permission already and you might have DOW'ed too and your government would be claiming it is justifiable self-defense.
Alliance are supposed to defend their members - that is one of the primary basis for joining an alliance in the first place - mutual protection. The least I could have done is provided aid.
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Also, I like Lex. However that is not what was discussed in any talks I paid attention too.
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7 minutes ago, Johnny Apocalypse said:
You seem to be only addressing veracity's OOC comments, which as you have said an apology has been made. That is their business to deal with and should have no bearing on the political nature of the sequence of events. Apology made, whether or not it is accepted or whatever is their business because of the nature of the comment itself not being IC.
However that being said; my interest is solely focussed on the actions of Veracity with regards to his attack on a Kashmir nation (their former leader no-less) and his attempt to feign ignorance that he "didn't know" - both you and I know this is not at all true. Let us also add the incident where he tried to coerce us into plotting against your ally NPO and we see a correlation of aggressive and malicious behaviour toward us and our direct allies. Whether or not that is supported by CLAWS as a whole or if Veracity is acting on his own is irrelevant; he flies your banner and his actions are your responsibility. Stop trying to deflect and accept responsiblity.
I have spoken with Claude in private and detailed what our expectations are from CLAWS in order to resolve this. A simple "we're sorry" and "we told him to stop doing that" is not sufficient. Veracity knew exactly what he was doing, he is not some inactive nation who is oblivious to the politics of this world. If he were then chances are we'd be more open to dealing with this privately, but given continued aggressive behaviour from your alliance I am now inclined to draw a line in the sand and declare that this ends here and now. We do not believe for a second that he did not know what he was doing, as has been made pretty clear by one of the leaders of your own bloc-mate earlier in this thread.
You have our requirements for de-escalation, the choice is yours whether or not you choose to acknowledge wrong-doing on your part or try and fob it off with more behind-the-scene unrepentant and insincere promises that it won't happen again. We are not the party in the wrong, you are the aggressor against our ally that we publicly stated our protection for (if our long-standing treaty wasn't enough to give you a hint that it was not okay to hit Lex)
Again, we responded publicly because your government shut down your channel for our members, you also left our own channel at the same time. Now I don't know about you but that doesn't exactly scream "We're open to diplomacy why didn't you contact us?" it says quite the opposite.
Either you approve/don't care about Veracity's IC actions or you condemn them. We request clarity of your intentions in the form of a public statement.
Considering the alternative? I think I know which is the more sensible choice.
I am not a member of NPO in this wonderful world of ours called Planet Bob, but I have been around long enough to know they care zero for what some nobody member of some alliance (ally or not) thinks. To talk about rolling NPO is all but a meme around here. If I am wrong, NPO is perfectly able to let CLAWS know they are offended by our member expressing his own opinion in a private conversation and I am 100% sure we would work it out with them.
Our member has learned a VERY valuable lesson here though in addition to the need to treat a young woman with respect.
Do not say anything to a member of Cobra in private and expect for a second that it will not be used against you and/or your alliance if they think it suits their needs. THAT is a valuable lesson and I hope others are learning it from this example if it was not perfectly clear to them before.
If CLAWS accepts your peace offer, then in my opinion that is the lesson he will probably learn.
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5 hours ago, General Kanabis said:
Would you look at that.
It's almost like this is what you wanted.
Well have at it, defend the sexual predator.
We have put up with some creepy stuff from the stalkers in your AA.
That includes Claude tracking Lyanna's OWF activity and sending her screens of pages she has been viewing.
Enough is enough.
It's almost like you humiliated her in public and tried to make amends hours later in private.
Imagine that.
Not gonna mention how you wanted to attack NPO or are you currently drafting an apology letter for that too?
4 hours ago, CrinkledStraw said:
Why did no one in CLAWS say something where it was posted? In public.Sick that you’re aiding it.
Look - when someone has an issue with a member of an alliance there are a few steps that are generally followed. First the issues is brought to the attention of a government member in the alliance. This is often done in private, not in public and if it is done in public, okay - but do not be surprised that CLAWS government does not regularly pay much attention to what is said in our general discord channel. Busy nation leaders have busy schedules. (OOC: real life is > than CN)
Once a government member becomes aware of the issue, then that member can bring it back to the entire government and discuss the issue. This can take time too as everyone has different schedules. (OOC: again - real life > than CN).
It was talked about by government, Jazzy DID make a statement in public about it and that statement was recognized by Lyanna in public. Then Jazzy shut down the public area, which was something I advised against BECAUSE Admin knows it will be brought up by you all in public on the OWF, but he didn't care much and, frankly, I understand his pain.
I suggested Jazzy open up the Cobra embassy which, when he is done dealing with the busy schedule of a leader of a nation (OOC: isn't busy WORKING in RL) he might do...or maybe not - regardless, it can wait a couple hours.
Back to what happened. Government had a chance to talk to the member you all had an issue with - i.e. veracity. He explained the situation from his end. Giving a chance to one's members to explain their actions before taking an action is part of being alliance government. It ALSO takes time as the member has other things to deal with to and may log in when he or she has time. (OOC: real life is > than CN) He agreed it was not a good comment and apologized to Lyanna in private. If that was not enough, she could have told him so in private and it could be discussed further. Also, you all certainly know how to reach claude directly on discord if needed.
Then Cobra members attacked veracity that night.
Speaking for only myself as I am NOT government and I do not control CLAWS, in my opinion, Cobra lost any "moral high-ground" you might have had by attacking. No one from CLAWS said that was okay - it was not an agreed to solution.
Did you have the "right" to respond that way? Sure. In my opinion though, you really did not give much time for anything on a non-military level to be worked out any step of the way.
(OOC: what you did do is annoy me enough to actually feel like I needed to respond when I should be dealing with real life work right now. Congrats on that. I'm going to have to work later hours now. /me sigh )
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7 hours ago, General Kanabis said:
COBRA DECLARES WAR ON VERACITY of Drunkenville, a member of CLAWS.
For more than just attacks on A dear friend of ours who we specifically stated was under our protection, active or not, this includes;
Attempts to agitate COBRA into attacking NPO last month-
Which is the CN equivalent of placing pallets of bricks near our peaceful protests.
And more importantly, a blatant disregard for civility by posting something as asinine as the following-
This behavior against one of our own, and specifically, a minor, will not be tolerated.
I told our government that this would be posted on the OWF in less than 24 hours. Thanks for proving me right.
The person apologized in private. I guess if you all can not accept that, that is your choice.
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1 hour ago, Johnny Apocalypse said:
So when should we expect to see CLAWS cancel a treaty? You've signed a few lately, shouldn't you balance it out a bit? 😛
Congratulations to both ODN and FTW on steps toward a more coherent FA policy!
CLAWS hereby cancels our treaty with ODN too. Satisfied?
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Nice to see.
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Looks great.
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On 3/31/2020 at 7:06 PM, AlmightyGrub said:
So am I comrade. So far it isn't looking great for me, only 1/2 fighting back, nukes only. How can my soldiers give their lives for the greater good if no one will kill them.
I have always respected you @AlmightyGrub Lets hope your soldiers find the glory they deserve n the long run.
if not, it is not from your lack of trying.
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15 minutes ago, General Kanabis said:
My mistake, I meant to say, if it becomes a bandwagon. So far it looks like a fair(ish) fight.
Polar is double the size of KoRT in nations. On a personal level I am rooting for KoRT.
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On 3/29/2020 at 3:33 PM, General Kanabis said:
Especially since there are more deserving recipients...
Either way, enjoy your war.
I just hope CLAWS and company don't come rushing in to join the bandwagon like they always do.
Last I checked (and it has been 8 months since leaving government so I could be wrong) CLAWS is allied to a friend of KoRT. So probably not.
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On 11/21/2019 at 11:53 PM, MinesomeMC said:
Hello players of CN, my name is MinesomeMC I'm a well known player on the game Politics and War. I have a question regarding GOONS, an alliance that migrated from here to PnW recently. Their presence is unwelcomed as they've harrassed several of us and recently have been involved with a large scandal regarding costing someones job by claiming they are a pedophile. Currently they are the most disliked alliance in the game,
The solution is simple, leave Politics and War entirely and come over to Cybernations. Bring your entire group and encourage allies to do the same.
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What is the perfect length of a war?
1. None, I just do not want war.
2. Until someone gives up. It is not about the time period but about winning however that is defined.
3. One or two rounds
4. One month
5 Two months
6. Three months
7. Over 3 months
What of the below, are acceptable peace terms for ending a war? You can mark as many or few as you like.
1. Officially say the alliance surrenders.
2. Payment of reparations as long as they are small.
3 . Paymebt of reparations regardless of amount.
4. writing essay or review.
5. Decommission of weapons.
6. Changing Team color.
7. Demanding votes for particular people in senate race.
8. Demanding that certain people leave an alliance (but not disbanding alliance as a whole)
9. Demanding the alliance disband.
10. Other (list)
what of the above are not acceptable and you would speak badly of any group doing it?
what of the above are not acceptable and you would war against any alliance/ coalition or plot until your side would win) that did it?
Do you love, hate or feel neutral if your nation is raided?
Do you love, hate or feel neutral in terms of raiding yourself?
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On 8/9/2019 at 10:44 AM, jerdge said:
1. When was the first year you played CN?(list years in answers)
2. How did you find out about CN?
a) friend
b) advertisement
c) just looking myself
d) Other: (explain)
3. If you ever left CN, what made you decide to leave? (Pick all that apply)
a) alliance war
b) destruction of my alliance
c) raiding
d) too busy in real life
e) found games I like more and limited time
f) I disliked the players here
g) I disliked the politics here
h) i did not like the game mechanics
i) Too much war
j) too little war
k) Other: Explain
4) After you left, what brought you back? ( pick all that apply)
a) I missed interacting with the other players
b) got invited back by friends
c) to help in war
d) lack of war so more time to grow
e) missed paying the game for the drama
f) missed playing the game for the machainics
e) damn good question, I have no idea
5) If you have never left, why have you stuck with the game? ( check all that apply and rank your top 2)
a) Easy to play - does not take much time
b) Loyalty to friends
c) Loyalty to alliance
d) Love the war
e) love nation building
f) I like the other players
g) the drama
h) the politics
i. Because my nation has been here this long might as well stay
I might think of some more questions later and maybe possible answers.
is that the type of answers you are looking for? @jerdge
Our Surrender- KNB
in Alliance Announcements (IC)
Posted · Edited by White Chocolate
I was there the entire discussion, starting on October 14. I have been in plenty of other peace talks and *I* had a hard time figuring out exactly what JA wanted. I still do not really know, frankly.
First it was that he wanted LH to show that he was "sincere" without giving any indication of exactly (in a actionable and specific way) what LH could do to show that and no promises of whatever LH did to attempt to show that working.
When it was made clear that LH was not going to just do something and hope it worked, the discussions turned to Banned "admitting" to both "plotting" and then "failing" to get Cobrasphere rolled. Banned did a "joke" version of that which I warned JA about. It could have been accepted but was not.
To be clear, I had no idea that @Lord Hitchcockwas going to post this without first getting it agreed to officially, however @Johnny Apocalypsewas anything but clear most of the time.